Linux Corner

[AnthonyGA]

The venom displayed in this thread is odd.

For some people, computers are a way to get things done. For others, they are a religion.

Still out by an order of magnitude.

It was "several orders of magnitude" a few posts earlier. What will it be next?

[MG23]

Originally Posted by AnthonyGA

Given that Linux represents less than 0.1% of desktops, my own assessment is clearly congruent with mainstream opinion. Linux has made no significant inroads on the desktop in the two decades of its existence.

Nobody even knows how many Linux desktops exist, because there are no sales figures to count. I have multiple Linux desktop machines at work and we have a Linux desktop at home, a Linux laptop, a Linux server and a Linux netbook... I doubt any of them are reporting statistics to anyone. Occasionally I boot the laptop into Windows to edit video or play a game that doesn't run on Linux, but otherwise I don't miss it.

And the desktop market itself has peaked; there'll be desktop computers for a long time to come, but the big growth is likely to be in various kinds of mobile hardware. Linux has a substantial presence in the mobile market while Windows has hardly any; I've seen iPhones and Android phones but I've never ever seen a Windows phone.

[Saab Dastard]

but I've never ever seen a Windows phone.

Lucky you!

I had the misfortune to have been given a work phone with Windows mobile or CE (I honestly can't remember which) that was so bad that I quietly took the SIM card out and back into the Nokia 6310 that I had "forgotten" to hand back!

SD

[Mike-Bracknell]

Originally Posted by MG23

And the desktop market itself has peaked; there'll be desktop computers for a long time to come, but the big growth is likely to be in various kinds of mobile hardware. Linux has a substantial presence in the mobile market while Windows has hardly any; I've seen iPhones and Android phones but I've never ever seen a Windows phone.

fyi...

File:Smartphone share current.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

and whilst early WinCE and WM devices were dire, devices later than WM5 were generally "ok" and Windows Phone 7 is comparable* to an iPhone.

(*as in the same ball park)

[Booglebox]

Originally Posted by MG23

Nobody even knows how many Linux desktops exist, because there are no sales figures to count. I have multiple Linux desktop machines at work and we have a Linux desktop at home, a Linux laptop, a Linux server and a Linux netbook... I doubt any of them are reporting statistics to anyone. Occasionally I boot the laptop into Windows to edit video or play a game that doesn't run on Linux, but otherwise I don't miss it.

And the desktop market itself has peaked; there'll be desktop computers for a long time to come, but the big growth is likely to be in various kinds of mobile hardware. Linux has a substantial presence in the mobile market while Windows has hardly any; I've seen iPhones and Android phones but I've never ever seen a Windows phone.

Figures given for PC OS marketshare are usually based on useragent data from people visiting the Akamai top 500 or something like that, I think.

Must call you out on your phone statement - looking at the diagram linked to by Mike Bracknell, only Android is linux-based. Symbian uses a proprietary kernel and iOS uses the Darwin kernel, which as you probably well know is a derivative of a derivative of Unix, but not Linux.

[mad_jock]

Kindles are linux and there are millions of them out there.

I agree that the number of pc with linux installed on them and for that matter windows is miss leading.

The fatc that virtually ever shop machine is supplied with windows screws up the figures. How many these days get wiped and linux put on them as the first job who knows.

[AnthonyGA]

Nobody even knows how many Linux desktops exist, because there are no sales figures to count.

Sales figures do not equate to operating desktops, as anyone who has wiped a pre-installed OS to install something else knows.

Since many desktops have Internet access, the number of operating Linux desktops can be inferred from user agent information provided to Web sites. On my own site, with about 1.6 million unique visitors per year, Linux was reported as the OS of exactly 0.9% of visitors in 2010. Windows represented 84.62% of visitors, and Mac (all versions) represented 11.2% of visitors. About 0.000334% of visitors were still running OS/2, which was a favored underdog OS until its fans (if they were old enough to remember OS/2) switched largely to Linux.

I have multiple Linux desktop machines at work and we have a Linux desktop at home, a Linux laptop, a Linux server and a Linux netbook... I doubt any of them are reporting statistics to anyone.

And I doubt that your arrangement is even remotely representative of the norm. Most people have just one computer, if they have any computer at all, and it typically runs under Windows. People running Linux are often running multiple machines. People running Windows typically have just one machine. I have the impression that Mac users may be slightly more likely than Windows users to have multiple computers (all Apple products), because Mac users are more likely to be fans rather than simple users.

And the desktop market itself has peaked; there'll be desktop computers for a long time to come, but the big growth is likely to be in various kinds of mobile hardware.

I agree. One of the unspoken realities of personal computing is that PCs are designed to assist with intellectual tasks … and there are a great many people who never engage in intellectual tasks. Desktop computers appeal to people who are somewhat more intelligent than average, just as home gym equipment appeals to people who are in somewhat better physical condition than average. This is why computers are gradually converging towards entertainment devices (have you noticed that almost all monitors sold today have aspect ratios that are useless for anything other than watching TV and movies?).

Most people don't even need an application like Word—because they never write anything. Indeed, in the U.S., about 30% of the population is functionally illiterate and can barely do anything with a computer at all.

[mad_jock]

I wonder how many computers are used just purely for looking at porn.

[sea oxen]

On my own site, with about 1.6 million unique visitors per year, Linux was reported as the OS of exactly 0.9% of visitors in 2010

Let's face it, billgatesisgod.com or howdoifixmybluescreen.net could skew the results a bit

Several years ago, I was asked whether we should switch our desktop environment of about 15,000 machines to Linux. Although I was in favour, my advice was that it would be courageous - in simpler terms, lunacy (or should that be linuxy?)

In an infrastructure role, our Windows machines represent a significant overhead in terms of manpower. The Unix crew know more about the MS side of things than they'll let on, but they won't cooperate out of pride and petulance (a good title for a novel), and playfully point out the deficiencies in Uncle Bill's OS - the MS machines have more patches than a Scotsman's condom. I get to manage both tribes. That sucks like a failed actress on crack in a bus station.

When Mrs SO bought her latest laptop, it came with Windows 7. She expected me to wave the Fedora wand it at, as I've done in the past - but as this was not just a hand-me-down from me, as it's been in the past, I insisted that she keep it in its original state.

Dumb.

The afternoon Mrs SO was leaving for a four-week trip, she called me, quite distraught. Her profile was buggered, and she couldn't get in. There is a registry key you can unbugger to repair this, but you need safe mode or the admin uid to do it. This wasn't really feasible over the telephone from the office.

At work, I can afford a team of thirty people to run around picking up the dog's eggs that MS OSes produce. I can sustain the mandatory weekly reboot of our MS desktops, because I am being paid for it. No such luxury at home, and that's why I am in high demand amongst my friends because 'SO works with computers'.

I put MS OSes on desktops at work in the same category as minorities recruitment and H&S. A pile of crap, but a sandwich with some sh!t in it has more nutrition than without. Adopting Linux on corporate desktops is dropping the soap in the shower, because with Windows you just blame Bill. With Linux, it's you who'll be Mr Sh!tty Operating System.

SO

[Cheerio]

Originally Posted by mad_jock

The fatc that virtually ever shop machine is supplied with windows screws up the figures. How many these days get wiped and linux put on them as the first job who knows.

Well there is one here - I've just bought last week a new Ideapad pre-installed with W7 Starter. Due to timing it has had a a short reprieve. I must admit that it looks pretty slick, but its on borrowed time. In 3 more days Opensuse 11.4 is released and that's what is going on. No dual boot nonsense, a clean install. I've been Suse since 9.3 on all my PC's, desk and lap.

[hellsbrink]

Linux Time

Ok peeps, need our resident Linux bods now.

I got bored and turned the desktop machine into a dual boot Win 7/Ubuntu 10.10 (Maverick Meerkat) system. Everything is pretty much ok, on both sides, as far as bootup, etc, goes, BUT the wireless connection on Ubuntu is a bit erratic at times.

I'm using one of these Sitecom USB Wireless N dongles (Yeah, I know, these USB dongles ain't the best but it's what I have and since the router is in the same room I am not just dropping a signal due to walls, etc) which uses a Ralink chipset and, on bootup, it runs fine then drops the connection. After a few minutes faffing around it sometimes comes back but other times I have to do a full restart to get a reliable connection.

I've done the obvious things like look at the settings, and all seems ok there, the dongle has no issues on Win 7 and will happily stay connected for as long as the puter is on so that leads me to think the issue is something to do with Ubuntu. Any suggestions?

PS. Chose Ubuntu because I got a corrupt download of OpenSuse from their site and am too close to my "traffic limit" to pull down another 4.8Gb to get a working version.

[Mike-Bracknell]

Sounds like a driver issue, rather than a Linux one.

[hellsbrink]

That was what I thought, but since I'm a noob at Linux I don't know which way to turn. Followed the instructions to install a windows driver through ndisgtk package thingie and now I have NO wireless at all and can't "undo" what I did (back on win7 now).

Ho hum, time to hit some other forums and get what they say.

[Mac the Knife]

Looks like support for this chip has been included in the kernel since Linux 2.6.18. You shouldn't need an external driver or Ndiswrapper.

See Linux Kernel Driver Database: CONFIG_RT2X00: Ralink driver support

Ask around the Ubuntu forums rather than here!



Mac (Mepis Linux - MEPIS | A Linux operating system based on Debian Stable)

[hellsbrink]

Yeah, Mac, the driver is built in to Meerkat BUT it doesn't explain the random "dropout" of the connection.

That's the bit that confuses me, but after a hunt around I MIGHT have found a solution......

Oh well, gives me something to do!!

[Mike-Bracknell]

First thing to try - upgrade the wireless AP (or router)'s firmware.

[Saab Dastard]

Linux and wireless does seem to be quite hit and miss, especially with old(er) kit.

There's a lot of problems with chipset manufacturers not releasing Linux drivers (why???) and being the opposite of helpful in allowing the Linux community to access their code to develop their own (again, why????).

In many cases, the answer has been to use the windows NDIS driver with a Linux wrapper, but this is not entirely satisfactory.

I've tried and failed several times to get various Linuces working with wifi cards on desktop and laptop PCs - OK, not recent kit, about 8-9 years old (but that's all I've got to play with right now).

On the bright side, you will immeasurably increase your understanding of Linux and networking if you persevere (and hopefully succeed), but that may not actually be your objective!

Good luck!

SD

[Mac the Knife]

From Slashdot...

"I have 3 different Ralink based USB NIC's, with a 2500, a 2571, and a 2870 based chipset.

The drivers included in every kernel in every distro I have ever hopped to are pardon my language, total crap.
Anyone who has used one of these NIC's for more than an hour knows what I'm talking about (A quick google search can be enlightening). Low signal levels, and frequent disconnects requiring the module being unloaded and reloaded. Being the cheap ass I am buying a Atheros based NIC isn't in my agenda so my solution has been to obtain the driver source from Ralink themselves (http://www.ralinktech.com), these drivers are rock solid and why they are not included in the kernel I don't know, maybe someone else can enlighten me."

Go to - Ralink corp.

Keep us informed.

[hellsbrink]

Well, had no help from linux forums and am now too peed off with the random connection drops so the Meerkat is gone.

Will be getting another distro soon, already have PCLinuxOS so might try that but methinks I'll be looking at something like Open Suse because the last thing you want is to be farting around like this when you ain't sure about what you are doing, the learning can come after a basic WORKING setup is operational and it don't look like that is possible easily with Ubuntu.

You would think these issues would be fixed by now, the Realtek chipset problems are not exactly new.....

[hellsbrink]

Ok, have the PCLinuxOS live CD running so i'll see how the connection stays with that. So far it's been up for 3 mins and that's more than the average for Ubuntu