Any advice for ICAO english test?
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Any advice for ICAO english test?
Hello Folks,
I'm about to take the ICAO english test 2 weeks from now in São Paulo, does anyone have any advice for me?
I'm a Heli pilot, and I know the test is more geared towards the fixed wing world, just wondering if that will be a problem for me?
Having lived abroad for 7 years, I hope to get that level 6. We'll see.
I'm about to take the ICAO english test 2 weeks from now in São Paulo, does anyone have any advice for me?
I'm a Heli pilot, and I know the test is more geared towards the fixed wing world, just wondering if that will be a problem for me?
Having lived abroad for 7 years, I hope to get that level 6. We'll see.
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Should not be too difficult for you
As far as I know it is sort of an interview where they ask scenarios about you flying as pilot in command responding to ATC or a ground operations handler. For example "Say you are on approach to land and the tower says there has been an accident on the runway 12 and ATC asked you to go around. What would be your response?" ..........Ans. N123AB in the missed approach. Remember they only want to see if you understand the language.
Good luck with the exam it is fairly easy
Good luck with the exam it is fairly easy
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Just a few things to consider...
Listen carefully and respond to the question being asked.
Keep your answers concise and relevant, rambling on is as bad as not answering.
Pay attention to verb tenses, you don't need to use obscure compound tenses for a 6, but you need to get the ones you do use right.
If you don't understand something, ask for a repeat. One repeat shouldn't be penalised.
When describing the picture, only state for a fact what you know to be correct, if you can't tell a 747 from a 380
call it a four engined aircraft.
Don't argue with the examiner.
You're correct in that it is mainly based on fixed wing operations, but there shouldn't be anything there that would cause problems for any competent pilot. Remember that it's a test of your Aviation English not your technical knowledge.
If you didn't take a specialist course I would suggest doing a mock test at one of the aviation schools. It's relatively cheap and will give you an idea of what's in store on the day.
I used to teach at a specialist aviation English school, and unless things have changed drastically in the last 18 months I know three of the examiners in SP. Contrary to popular belief they are not out to trap you and they don't have a quota.
Good luck
Listen carefully and respond to the question being asked.
Keep your answers concise and relevant, rambling on is as bad as not answering.
Pay attention to verb tenses, you don't need to use obscure compound tenses for a 6, but you need to get the ones you do use right.
If you don't understand something, ask for a repeat. One repeat shouldn't be penalised.
When describing the picture, only state for a fact what you know to be correct, if you can't tell a 747 from a 380
call it a four engined aircraft. Don't argue with the examiner.
You're correct in that it is mainly based on fixed wing operations, but there shouldn't be anything there that would cause problems for any competent pilot. Remember that it's a test of your Aviation English not your technical knowledge.
If you didn't take a specialist course I would suggest doing a mock test at one of the aviation schools. It's relatively cheap and will give you an idea of what's in store on the day.
I used to teach at a specialist aviation English school, and unless things have changed drastically in the last 18 months I know three of the examiners in SP. Contrary to popular belief they are not out to trap you and they don't have a quota.
Good luck
The Cooler King
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No quotas. Nothing to be afraid of.
Assuming that it is just an Oral Proficiency Interview, the questions will be general to an extent but will also cover areas like your working environment, met, human factors and abnormal / emergency situations.
Relax and enjoy it - be yourself.
Farrell
Assuming that it is just an Oral Proficiency Interview, the questions will be general to an extent but will also cover areas like your working environment, met, human factors and abnormal / emergency situations.
Relax and enjoy it - be yourself.
Farrell
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The lady that gave me the test at ANAC in SP, asked me personal informations, we made a PILOT-ATC simulation, she made me simulate a call to the passengers and that was about it.
The test is a joke, and it does not meet ICAO standards. The worst part is that it's really subjective....
The test is a joke, and it does not meet ICAO standards. The worst part is that it's really subjective....
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The test is a joke, and it does not meet ICAO standards.
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The test is a joke, and it does not meet ICAO standards. The worst part is that it's really subjective....
The ANAC test was not developed in isolation and is very similar to tests carried out in many other parts of the world, all of which should meet the requirements of ICAO. While it may be subjective, the grading is based on the ICAO guidelines provided to all national aviation authorities.
The requirements for each level can be found here www.aviationmanagement.aero/.../ICAOLanguageProficiencyScale.pdf
There is also the implementation manual available at www.icea.gov.br/ead/epli/docs/Doc9835.pdf
The idea of asking about personal subjects is to relax the candidate and have them talk about a subject that they know well, themselves. Some people suffer from stress during tests, particularly when failure could have a severe impact on their career.
TTFN
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Im not sure, but it seems to me those test are being caried out on different manners and levels of competece here in Brazil. For what i can say, as I did the test it was exactly in the way discribed by the document refering to it. But i have heard, especially when it comes to tests done by the companies there might be some discreptancies of the normal. One former check person from Variglog is supposed to get caught "selling" the tests (~2 years ago). From what I heard now, people have to pay to take the test, so its getting a business and in order to keep that people get a 4 even with just broken knowledge, then are expected to repeat the test periodically like a medical...
I know guys with ICAO 4 and 5 whose English is miserable, on the other hand tam seems to hv problems to find enough skippers proficient enough to get the birds over the pond. I just hope ANAC get this into its gripp by time before we all get discredited.
Funny, on my license it states that i have ICAO Portuguese 6 although i have never taken a test for that...
I know guys with ICAO 4 and 5 whose English is miserable, on the other hand tam seems to hv problems to find enough skippers proficient enough to get the birds over the pond. I just hope ANAC get this into its gripp by time before we all get discredited.
Funny, on my license it states that i have ICAO Portuguese 6 although i have never taken a test for that...
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Toffair
There were, and probably still are, people selling grades. I have seen students that didn't deserve a 2 go away for a little while and come back with a 4
This was happening with individuals and training centres authorised to carry out the tests, not within ANAC itself. How they obtained that authorisation is another question, to which you and I probably know the answer. ANAC does take action against these practices, and more quickly than you might think, but it's a nice little earner so there is always someone else ready to take over.
It's been 18 months since I was involved in teaching for the ICAO test so things might have changed, but, the last I knew, you could only take the test in São Paulo at the TAM academy or ANAC, a measure taken in response to the grades being sold elsewhere. All tests are recorded and stored for review by ICAO should they ever feel the need to review anything, so irregularities will come to light eventually.
Weird, I just defended ANAC
TTFN
There were, and probably still are, people selling grades. I have seen students that didn't deserve a 2 go away for a little while and come back with a 4
This was happening with individuals and training centres authorised to carry out the tests, not within ANAC itself. How they obtained that authorisation is another question, to which you and I probably know the answer. ANAC does take action against these practices, and more quickly than you might think, but it's a nice little earner so there is always someone else ready to take over.
It's been 18 months since I was involved in teaching for the ICAO test so things might have changed, but, the last I knew, you could only take the test in São Paulo at the TAM academy or ANAC, a measure taken in response to the grades being sold elsewhere. All tests are recorded and stored for review by ICAO should they ever feel the need to review anything, so irregularities will come to light eventually.
Weird, I just defended ANAC
TTFN
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Got a 6, and it was free.
I did the English test also in Europe, btw ANAC did not Accept It. I also had to do it when I applied for an airline job, and there was a pretty hard written part. I also have it on my FAA license, which according to the peoples I spoke to should grant me a level 4 during a license conversion, in fact none of my students that went back to Europe from the US had to take the test, as long as you are happy with a 4?!?!
The test in Europe it's a total different story, much harder. It's computer based you have to listen to a ton of ATC comm, they use Indian pilots!!! go figure.
I did the English test also in Europe, btw ANAC did not Accept It. I also had to do it when I applied for an airline job, and there was a pretty hard written part. I also have it on my FAA license, which according to the peoples I spoke to should grant me a level 4 during a license conversion, in fact none of my students that went back to Europe from the US had to take the test, as long as you are happy with a 4?!?!
The test in Europe it's a total different story, much harder. It's computer based you have to listen to a ton of ATC comm, they use Indian pilots!!! go figure.
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The test in Europe it's a total different story, much harder.
TTFN
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then...
you show up for training at an 'english speaking' Training Center outside your home country for your type rating.
Your documentation, submitted before that training begins, says you have Level 4 English proficiency. (Never mind level 6)
The English speaking instructor starts your training (remember English is his/her 1st language) and it becomes very obvious during briefings, training and debriefings that your English level is less than at least level 4.
What happens?
Well, you stop training, report it to the candidates licensing authority and wait for instructions as to what to do with the trainee and who gets the refund.
Personally? I'd make sure I had the appropriate level of English proficiency unless you train in your home country where most authority figures and examiners could care less about the english language and you intend to spend the majority of your time flying in your home country where English is an unnecessary inconvenience.
Why do I say that?
Because most countries where the primary language isn't English allow their pilots to communicate over VHF comms in their mother tongue and/or English. Backseat english has now been elevated to at least level 4.
Good luck, and safe flying...
Willie
you show up for training at an 'english speaking' Training Center outside your home country for your type rating.
Your documentation, submitted before that training begins, says you have Level 4 English proficiency. (Never mind level 6)
The English speaking instructor starts your training (remember English is his/her 1st language) and it becomes very obvious during briefings, training and debriefings that your English level is less than at least level 4.
What happens?
Well, you stop training, report it to the candidates licensing authority and wait for instructions as to what to do with the trainee and who gets the refund.
Personally? I'd make sure I had the appropriate level of English proficiency unless you train in your home country where most authority figures and examiners could care less about the english language and you intend to spend the majority of your time flying in your home country where English is an unnecessary inconvenience.
Why do I say that?
Because most countries where the primary language isn't English allow their pilots to communicate over VHF comms in their mother tongue and/or English. Backseat english has now been elevated to at least level 4.
Good luck, and safe flying...
Willie
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The Result
Just got infomed today that I got rated as level 5, I kinda got irritated about that... since I speak english fluently, (makes me wonder now, uh?) even better than the person who tested me.
What I've heard is that they don't have a consistent way to evaluate candidates, some pilots who never lived abroad have gotten level 6 sometimes.
What I've heard is that they don't have a consistent way to evaluate candidates, some pilots who never lived abroad have gotten level 6 sometimes.
Last edited by Soave_Pilot; 2nd Dec 2010 at 13:43. Reason: Level 5 english
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I think there is a tendency of now keeping the "business", those who test will be happy to charge you again in 2 years and keep you as a customer...
Wouldnt be surprised to see it getting to be introduced as a regular exercise just as the medical (CCF) where they check you everytime for colourblindness (ever heard sm1 changed? exept in China
)
Wouldnt be surprised to see it getting to be introduced as a regular exercise just as the medical (CCF) where they check you everytime for colourblindness (ever heard sm1 changed? exept in China
)