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Well the FAAA has done such an excellent job at QF and JQ...:}, sorry but I wouldn't want them representing me for quids. They approved the last EBA which the crew unanimously decided was total rubbish and voted down. They continue to tell QF crew that all the changes at QF are for the their own good and protection in "hard times" etc...what a load of absolute spin. :ugh::rolleyes:
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I heard that people were rallying to get cabin cleaners? At Q we call them cabin dressers. |
My argument would be, its essentially a low cost airline. Its turned itself into a "new world airline" (same same just different word)... so why would you need them? I find half the cabin dressers do a fantastic job and others can barley cross a seat belt, than collect headsets...
I find it a joke when on stafftravel site it comments us to "collect newspapers at the end of Cityflyer services so they can be recycled"... isn't that what cabin dressers are for? Lets just hope the next uniform refreshment won't be a tinge of that revolting orange. |
I've got to admit that its great to see that DJ doesn't have multiple entities that employs cabin crew, they do need to be applauded for that....
but imagine that DJ casuals... TeamDJ... DJ Domestic... what next? e-Jet DJ? Who knows what's around the corner, oops or did I just spill the beans.... :eek: uh oh! |
they do have multiple entities employing cabin crew already set up.
no one can legally stop the big corporates from setting up multiple entities. the only thing thats left once they set it up is to rally together and to improve things from the start or soon after its operating. we can lay blame about the other options companies use to cheapen workrules or allowances or we can be strong willed about how to fix things. management read these threads to find out what we know and what we dont. we could use this forum to work out how we are going to save what we have. anyone? |
I would say that the current EBA prohibts VB from using other entities. In the current document "5.b - applies to all cabin crew operating on Virgin Blue aircraft."
Over the years QF have probably had agreements amended slightly to include the recruitment of part timers and casuals which would erode conditions for all. The latest LH agreement allowing the hiring of QCCA whilst giving short term pay increases for part a employees will eventually lead to many more QCCA or part b employees being hired by QF and thus the cheaper workforce will have taken over the more expensive workforce and will vote in anything that gives them a better deal at the expense of the senior crew. I think that we are better off sticking with just two pay levels, no casuals, a few more part time positions especially for those coming back from mat leave and exclusivity on the operation of the VB fleet. The more pay levels there are the less likely you will be called out as senior crew. The new ones will get called out all the time saving the company money whilst the senior crew get stuck with short day trips or whatever works out to be cheapest. You may think that you are only going to be here for another six months but most of you will still be flying in 10 years time. Think about that when you sign off on a new EBA. |
Maurice Alexander appears to be on the way out of the QF-SH contract, funny if DJ recruited him.
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Goodluck everyone at Virgin Blue for your new EBA, I hope the new one is fair and gets you what you deserve for all your hard work. I really hope it doesn't go down the Jetstar road. We have so many different contracts for cabin crew that I'd hate to be in crewing, they must pull their hair out! We have:
* Jetstar Domestic EBA * Jetstar International AWA * Team Jetstar (Domestic and International) * Bangkok Base crew * Singapore Base crew (new) The Bangkok base crew operate a lot of flights including the ones to Hawaii. I have heard, don't know how true it is, that a lot of the Americans started complaining that there were no Australian CC on their flight! Also on the new Perth-Singapore flights the CC are all Thai Crew. Bangkok and Singapore crew are cheap to overnight too, as they all have to share rooms. :yuk: The Jetstar Domestic EBA currently has the best conditions. But our EBA runs out this year too, so who knows what they have in store for us. Its anyones guess! So fight for your rights VB CC!!! :ok: |
What about Qantas?
QAL Short Haul QAL Long Haul Qantas Domestic Pty. Ltd. M.A.M. Q.C.C.A. Pty. Ltd. Bangkok Base London Base Jetconnect N.Z. Short Haul Jetconnect N.Z. Long Haul Qantaslink NJS Qantaslink Sunstate Qantaslink Eastern Is there any other airline out there who has so many divisions like this? Sorry for the thread drift, but really curious! Its also our understanding (for now) that: Virgin will not hire external flight attendants domestically like MAM... otherwise they simply would have already! In the next eba, its our understanding they want to hire new flight attendants on a lesser, cheaper base pay. But, after a couple years of pay increases annually, will be on par with existing crew. So cheaper labour yes, but after a 2 odd years will be the same base as existing crew. So not outsourced and not forever stuck on a new contract. Similar to qantas' pay ladder increase pre 2002 for full time employees. Its a better way to go than MAM or the like, considering you will (these days) always have a junior workforce hence cheaper labour but they have the option, if they stay for at least 2 years, to then achieve normal pay. Also heard recently VB just allowed the union to become involved with the negotiations. Is this fact? You may think that you are only going to be here for another six months but most of you will still be flying in 10 years time. Think about that when you sign off on a new EBA. |
Attention: All Virgin Blue Cabin Crew EBA UPDATE Late last year the Company invited your FAAA Workplace Delegates to attend a meeting, not to negotiate, but instead, to be briefed on the Company’s presentation for their upcoming EBA roadshows. Your FAAA Workplace Delegates declined the invitation as it was the same presentation which all cabin crew would be rostered to attend and clearly not an opportunity to negotiate on behalf of our members. Our members have told us: we want the right to be represented at EBA negotiations by our Association. We appreciate your strength on this point. It is our united stance regarding this fundamental right which makes it very clear that we will not support or endorse a process which does not include good faith bargaining. We have continued to press the company for proper enterprise bargaining negotiations. The Company has now agreed to meet with your FAAA Workplace Delegates and Industrial Staff in early February for EBA discussions. As we approach the EBA meeting scheduled for 10 February, we give you our commitment as your representatives to provide you with up-to-date accurate information as we move forward. We have also pressed the company for a further 3% pay increase to be backpaid to 1 September 2008 as a good faith interim arrangement, pending a replacement agreement being reached this year. Although the company has not responded specifically to this request, we anticipate discussion on this point in February. The first of the EBA management roadshows commenced this week. We note that the roadshows are a presentation of what management proposes for the next EBA, ahead of any proper negotiations taking place. Thank you to all those members who have called with various issues and concerns. Your Association has taken your concerns seriously and will deal with them appropriately. Although FAAA Members are aware, it is timely to point out the FAAA is not a body external to Virgin Blue, it is our collective numbers of Cabin Crew within our workplace who represent a proportion of Flight Attendants in Australia. If there are crew members on line who are not aware of the most recent up-to-date information, please pass on copies of newsletters or refer them to our website FAAA Domestic - Flight Attendants Association of Australia Domestic Regional Division where all EBA updates are available to access. It is important that we have one strong united knowledge base throughout the entire EBA process. We will keep you updated as proceedings progress. Written by Stacey Hogan, FAAA Virgin Blue Team Coordinator and Carolyn Tutty, Industrial Officer and authorised by Jo Ann Davidson, Divisional Secretary |
... so a chicken told me that DJ are opting for DTA as opposed to the flatrate overnight allowance which is currently =$95. DTA would be $3 flat.
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They've been saying for years that they're not ATO compliant with the overnight allowance, and that they should be paying for the meal windows we pass through when away. However, they have been doing it the same way for 9 years now, and if they were not compliant with the tax office, they would of been made to change it a long time ago surely.
They're proposing, if they get confirmation that they are not compliant, a DTA of between $3 - $3.30. If they are told that they do not have to change, then that have given us their word it would remain the same. With the overnight allowance currently $98, some have worked out to be thousands down over the course of a year if this new DTA is introduced. |
A $3 DTA is absurdly low, would like to know the source of this information. They can hardly expect crew to vote themselves into a paycut. "Love of a job" doesn't pay my rent or phone bills. This is the real world here, people need $ to live.
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Pitty its not a true airline.
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people need $ to live. This information is what management are presenting to all crew over this month and next, in their EBA ''Roadshows'' which all crew are rostered to attend. Must be costing them to be taking crew offline for this, but they're desperate to get it through. They are also planning to increase our daily rostered duty to between 10.15 - 11 hours. Amongst other things. There is no real benefit to us crew in this EBA, which is a shame. The only benefit is to the company and the money they will be saving. Why should we have to give up our current conditions, for lesser conditions? They have refused to give us our annual pay increase until we vote yes on an agreement. Hmmm blackmail much? They have also threatened that if we vote no, they will simply seek to have the current agreement terminated and will impose what they want anyway, which they claim they have every right to do under the IR laws. All of this is what management are directly saying to crew in these meetings and is not galley FM. :* |
they will simply seek to have the current agreement terminated and will impose what they want anyway, which they claim they have every right to do under the IR laws simply? no it wont be that ezy a right to seek does not automatically mean they are entitled to it := Im not convinced there is no hope the IR law makers wont agree with them if we dont want higher hours for less |
I agree, "we want to pay our employees less money and they don't like it" is not exactly a strong argument for government intervention on an EBA. I for one would rather vote no and have something imposed than to say "oh yes, please reduce my pay and increase my hours". I'm not a charity or an idiot! :oh:
I'm not worried for myself because I can always quit and go and get a job with real pay, I have skills worth $$ to rely on. But I do feel for naieve crew who feel they have no choice because someone is beating them with a stick. In times like these I like to remember this simple truth.... It takes 5 weeks to train new crew, another 2 to check them to line. God knows how long it will take to recruit. So if a significant number of people walk, that's going to be some tough times for the company. There isn't a heap of surplus crew sitting around on reserve anywhere. The company need their trained crew, and they cannot pretend they don't. Know your worth, know that the company has already invested around $30,000 just getting you online. It would be stupid of them to lose all that over a few $ in wages. Remember your training and how much a disrupted flight costs the company. Then vote on your EBA, not out of fear but from a knowing that they need you. :ok: It also wouldn't hurt to make a list of all the money wasting activities you observe in your daily job. There are at least 20 things I know of I want to see go before they take a cent out of my paypacket. :* Such a list would give the FAAA something to negotiate with. |
Pitty its not a true airline. Anyway, with the company now involving the union, they now understand the EBA presented will be unsuccessful and need further hands to help get a new EBA across. Heard one of the roadshows was cancelled, crew put on re-assignable, and future presentations changed. Over 95% of crew already voted NO to touching hours as well as DTA in the EBA surveys, so they know what the crew are wanting... Will be interesting to see what's offered. |
crew already voted NO to touching hours as well as DTA in the EBA surveys me thinks they want a no vote not very clever :rolleyes: the IR law makers will look at what VB has done to get a new agreement or should i say what they havent done termination of current agreement wont be ezy |
And until we vote yes, they wont give us our 3% increase which we normally have already received...So is the rumour true that the annual 3% increase we have been getting not a right they can pick and choose if they want to give it or not?
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