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Vulcan tried to escape from Wellesbourne, 16th Sept 2022

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Vulcan tried to escape from Wellesbourne, 16th Sept 2022

Old 17th Sep 2022, 14:29
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These thing are always fraught with uncertainty. Landing at a given speed with a known amount of runway left is calculable. Realising the ASI isn’t working, an “oh gawd” moment before the brakes come on and you can see the results. Thank goodness for a long hot summer. I remember a Canberra went off the end of St Mawgan after running up to EMBS for TV cameras, forgetting the premise on which that is based, namely the brakes will be kaput. Glad nobody hurt and I am sure more care will be taken next time to have a reliable speed source. A light airframe and 4 Olympus is a rocket ship.
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 15:28
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ASDA
ASDA
ASDA
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 15:59
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Was James May at the controls?

(see Grand Tour S5).
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 16:12
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Originally Posted by spekesoftly
Any news on how the recovery operation is progressing?
They may possibly be searching for Tracjacks and Trolley Salvage carriers.....and towing bridles
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 16:14
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Originally Posted by Krystal n chips
They may possibly be searching for Tracjacks and Trolley Salvage carriers.....and towing bridles
Doubtful; a couple of strops should do it. Nice and simple.
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 16:19
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Originally Posted by Cuillin Hills
No Vulcan expert but dont the spoilers get extended on landing (or RTOs) for additional weight on wheels (and increased braking efficiency)?
The Vulcan has airbrakes (2 position - medium and high drag), they have no spoiler effect. They are manually selected and the approach is flown with High Drag airbrake. The SOP for a RTO was to extend the airbrakes after closing the throttles (thrust levers in modern speak). PNF would stream the TBC if speed <75 and >145.

ciderman

These thing are always fraught with uncertainty. Landing at a given speed with a known amount of runway left is calculable. Realising the ASI isnt working, an oh gawd moment before the brakes come on and you can see the results.
I could not agree more! An accelerate stop manoeuvre requires very careful planning, it's not in the ODM or Performance Manual and you need to go back to first principles to work it out and and ensure that you have sufficient safety margins. Just trying to compute it using a LDR calculation on an assumed reduced runway length isn't adequate. The 2 second delay quoted by the operator in their statement would seem indicate that no margin existed.

Just for reference, you would plan to use less that maximum braking for an accelerate/stop demonstration whilst for a full blooded high speed RTO you apply the brakes fully and at once. If you've ever experienced a RTO in modern aircraft fitted with autobrake you will know that the RTO Brake setting is fierce to say tthe least.

Finally, someone asked about the Vulcan anti-skid system? It was a Maxaret system and worked quite well.

YS

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Old 17th Sep 2022, 16:43
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I recall the saga of 'Roadrunner 1' in around 1978....

A Waddington squadron's aircraft had been snagged for excessive nosewheel shimmy, which the engineers then repaired. However, it was necessary to check that the problem had been fixed by conducting a fast run on the RW, to around 90KIAS.

"Any one free to do a taxy check please?" asked the engineers. Whereupon a recent ICC graduate co-pilot said that he was, grabbed an unsuspecting AEO and went to the jet. All went OK during start up, but realising that they didn't have a call-sign, he announced that he was 'Roadrunner 1' for a taxy check. ATC cleared him; there was no Duty Pilot in the tower as no Waddo aircraft were within 100nm, so off our hero went....

Roaring down the into wind RW, all was well - the engineers had indeed fixed the snag. "Better do another run just to be sure", announced the pilot and thundered off downwind. Again all went well - until he tried to stop! The brakes had more or less had enough as they were so hot, so 'Roadrunner 1' trundled off the end of the RW and onto the grass just short of the A15.
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 16:44
  #48 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Pypard
Doubtful; a couple of strops should do it. Nice and simple.
No sense of humour then...
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 17:01
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Lots of negativity on here but I hope they can keep doing their fast taxis. Gives a few more people the experience of a live Vulcan even if not a flying one.
Maybe change the fast taxi to several engine run ups and some slow taxis would be a better experience for the enthusiast.
The part of these events spectators want is the noise. If you can have the noise without the risk everyone is happy.
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 17:17
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Originally Posted by dixi188
If it is MaxArret type
In all the years since my first introduction to Maxarets, and being shown how to check them on a PDC, the derivation of the name had never dawned on me, until now.
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 18:08
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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK
In all the years since my first introduction to Maxarets, and being shown how to check them on a PDC, the derivation of the name had never dawned on me, until now.
Took me a long time to realise after I first heard of the system and followed a difficult dive into the admittedly shallow depths of my schoolboy French! Think I was reading someone's autobiography when the bulb lit...
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 18:20
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Originally Posted by Krystal n chips
No sense of humour then...
Oh I'm sure you must.
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 20:09
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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK
In all the years since my first introduction to Maxarets, and being shown how to check them on a PDC, the derivation of the name had never dawned on me, until now.
I had forgotten the spelling so went for the origin in french. Was it a French invention?
Only a/c I worked with them was the Viscount.
I recall if maximum braking was used there would be a series of tyre marks on the runway as the wheel started to skid and then the brake released. I wondered why there are no marks on the runway behind the Vulcan. Did the pilot not use max braking even when they were near the end of the runway?
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 20:19
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Tis a shame...was hoping to see the Vulcan flying again doing displays!

Hope it all turns out for the better as I know it was heartbreaking for those trying to get it back into the air.

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Old 17th Sep 2022, 20:54
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Originally Posted by Krystal n chips
No sense of humour then...
They got it out with kit borrowed from VTTS (tow bridal) a firm with diggers and other companies with the vehicles and hardware to do an off runway recovery. And a lot of hard work. They admit that they would not have been able to do it without help. I would sack the driver and get a proper regime in place s I do with my jet car.. Reminds me of the Victor last flight. I was working on a project today with its team leader and mentioned the person involved with that. Bill said he had met the guy and was so unimpressed with the actual professionalism of him. Bill wasn't the first with the same opinion mentioned to me.
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 21:48
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Originally Posted by SASless
Tis a shame...was hoping to see the Vulcan flying again doing displays!

Hope it all turns out for the better as I know it was heartbreaking for those trying to get it back into the air.
No Vulcan will never take to the air again.

The one that's the subject of this thread last flew nearly 40 years ago.
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Old 17th Sep 2022, 22:13
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Originally Posted by 45989
Amazing to see the boring "health and safties" wade in as usual. GET A LIFE!!
These boring people are the professionals!!!! To do this sort of thing, the Aircraft has to be insured (I'm in a team that does this exact type of activity).Anything that drives that insurance cost up is not good, especially when a bunch of what can only be described as cowboys fail to account for the fact that the aircraft is not serviced at the same level that it was while in service and fail to have a back up method of ensuring that the "Jet Car" safely stays on the runway. In the video below, the Driver had both a motile phone on the HUD and had placed ground markers along the runway!!

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Old 18th Sep 2022, 00:35
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Originally Posted by BEagle
I recall the saga of 'Roadrunner 1' in around 1978....

A Waddington squadron's aircraft had been snagged for excessive nosewheel shimmy, which the engineers then repaired. However, it was necessary to check that the problem had been fixed by conducting a fast run on the RW, to around 90KIAS.

"Any one free to do a taxy check please?" asked the engineers. Whereupon a recent ICC graduate co-pilot said that he was, grabbed an unsuspecting AEO and went to the jet. All went OK during start up, but realising that they didn't have a call-sign, he announced that he was 'Roadrunner 1' for a taxy check. ATC cleared him; there was no Duty Pilot in the tower as no Waddo aircraft were within 100nm, so off our hero went....

Roaring down the into wind RW, all was well - the engineers had indeed fixed the snag. "Better do another run just to be sure", announced the pilot and thundered off downwind. Again all went well - until he tried to stop! The brakes had more or less had enough as they were so hot, so 'Roadrunner 1' trundled off the end of the RW and onto the grass just short of the A15.
Spookily I was just recounting this very story to my ex USAF brother in law after he pointed the story out on t’internet! Whatever happened to Frank?🤣

Last edited by Specaircrew; 18th Sep 2022 at 00:47.
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Old 18th Sep 2022, 07:45
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Reported on another site as to having been already winched out, and is on hard standing.
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Old 18th Sep 2022, 07:59
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Originally Posted by dixi188
I had forgotten the spelling so went for the origin in french. Was it a French invention?
No - the maxaret system was developed by Dunlop in Britain AFAIK - I have always assumed the name was just a clever play on words
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