Aviation History and Nostalgia Whether working in aviation, retired, wannabee or just plain fascinated this forum welcomes all with a love of flight.

BAC 1-11 Holiday Jets

Old 9th Jun 2021, 12:16
  #101 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: britain
Posts: 374
No the 1-11s were not timetabled in 1980. The f28s were replaced by additional f27 purchase
4 of them.
I am prepared to concede that the 1-11s may have been wey leased, but they operated for four years which seems like a long time without crews being trained
bean is offline  
Old 9th Jun 2021, 12:32
  #102 (permalink)  
PV1
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Shoreham-by-Sea
Posts: 26
Originally Posted by bean View Post
No the 1-11s were not timetabled in 1980. The f28s were replaced by additional f27 purchase
4 of them.
I am prepared to concede that the 1-11s may have been wey leased, but they operated for four years which seems like a long time without crews being trained
I did not say they were timetabled but they operated to the F28 timetable and what about Air Ecosse?
You may be right about the wet/dry lease in mid 80ís I canít remember all the details.
PV1 is offline  
Old 9th Jun 2021, 13:01
  #103 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: britain
Posts: 374
why operate unprofitable jets on a route displacing other unprofitable jets at a time of declining loads caused ny a recession.
I reiterate the F28s were replaced ny additional f27s brought into the fleet
bean is offline  
Old 9th Jun 2021, 13:06
  #104 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: britain
Posts: 374
Sorry for the underlining on previous post unintentional.
So, you"re saying 50 per cent of the remaining available jet fleet were pulled off bread and butter IT work to service unpofitable schedules?


Last edited by bean; 9th Jun 2021 at 13:49.
bean is offline  
Old 9th Jun 2021, 13:51
  #105 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 6,731
The only reference I have for Air Ecosse and a One-Eleven is indeed G-AXMU, leased from BIA from 23 Jan 84 to 6 Feb 84 - just a couple of weeks. Probably just covering an unserviceability.

It then went off to Airways International Cymru in their first year for the summer, running from Cardiff for Red Dragon Travel, when it was more likely to be a "Holiday Jet".
WHBM is offline  
Old 9th Jun 2021, 15:46
  #106 (permalink)  
PV1
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Shoreham-by-Sea
Posts: 26
Originally Posted by bean View Post
Sorry for the underlining on previous post unintentional.
So, you"re saying 50 per cent of the remaining available jet fleet were pulled off bread and butter IT work to service unpofitable schedules?
The passengers had been sold a jet with jet timings, it was particularly important as it was a totally new brand to keep faith with the customer. I know this is an unusual concept these days.
PV1 is offline  
Old 9th Jun 2021, 16:08
  #107 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: britain
Posts: 374
What few passengers there were on the route.
I"m sure the passengers who had been sold jet timings on the IT routes would have been equally peeved. What about penalty clauses on cancelled IT contracts in order to redeploy two aircraft?
bean is offline  
Old 9th Jun 2021, 16:17
  #108 (permalink)  
PV1
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Shoreham-by-Sea
Posts: 26
Originally Posted by bean View Post
What few passengers there were on the route.
I"m sure the passengers who had been sold jet timings on the IT routes would have been equally peeved. What about penalty clauses on cancelled IT contracts in order to redeploy two aircraft?
I understand why itís not worth posting on social media
PV1 is offline  
Old 9th Jun 2021, 19:48
  #109 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Dorset UK
Age: 67
Posts: 1,307
My eldest sister booked a holiday to Spain in 1968, the carrier was Autair and much was made in the brochure of the new BAC 1-11s for that year.
Just before she left for her holiday my father (flight shed inspector at Hurn), told her that the first 1-11 had not been delivered yet so the flight would be on something older.
She flew out on a Constellation. The return was on the newly delivered 1-11.
How much would you pay to do that today?
dixi188 is online now  
Old 9th Jun 2021, 22:24
  #110 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Herts
Posts: 7
[QUOTE=WHBM;11059349]The only reference I have for Air Ecosse and a One-Eleven is indeed G-AXMU, leased from BIA from 23 Jan 84 to 6 Feb 84 - just a couple of weeks. Probably just covering an unserviceability.

From bac1-11jet.co.uk........

Air …cosse, Ltd. - (SM/ECS)

Aberdeen-Dyce

This company wet leased a Series 432FD from 23rd January to 6th February 1984 for a proposed new route from Aberdeen to Heathrow. The license was not granted and the aircraft was returned to British Island Airways Ltd.
Wee Clink is offline  
Old 10th Jun 2021, 08:46
  #111 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: britain
Posts: 374
Originally Posted by dixi188 View Post
My eldest sister booked a holiday to Spain in 1968, the carrier was Autair and much was made in the brochure of the new BAC 1-11s for that year.
Just before she left for her holiday my father (flight shed inspector at Hurn), told her that the first 1-11 had not been delivered yet so the flight would be on something older.
She flew out on a Constellation. The return was on the newly delivered 1-11.
How much would you pay to do that today?
Dixi. It must have been an ambassador
Autair had some
bean is offline  
Old 10th Jun 2021, 10:29
  #112 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Luton
Posts: 427
I did something similar in 1969. Flew to Luxembourg from Birmingham on a 1-11, diverted there from Luton the previous night and then back on the Ambassador!
Level bust is offline  
Old 10th Jun 2021, 12:17
  #113 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Crawley
Posts: 233
A blast down memory lane there. I definitely remember seein ghr Loganair -400 series. First flights as a kid on charters were MAN-MAH and return on the inside of a W from LGW. Out on I think G-BJYL and back on G-BEKA in 1987
LGWAlan is offline  
Old 10th Jun 2021, 18:50
  #114 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Dorset UK
Age: 67
Posts: 1,307
Originally Posted by bean View Post
Dixi. It must have been an ambassador
Autair had some
It could have been an Ambassador that my sister flew on, although I remember some mention of a Connie, but that may have been one of her earlier holidays.
Unfortunately she died 2 years ago so I can't ask her. She was 8 years older than me.
dixi188 is online now  
Old 10th Jun 2021, 20:07
  #115 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 6,731
Originally Posted by Level bust View Post
I did something similar in 1969. Flew to Luxembourg from Birmingham on a 1-11, diverted there from Luton the previous night and then back on the Ambassador!
Autair's last Ambassador flight was 30 June 1968 (four days before the BKS accident at Heathrow which also ended it for the type there as well).
WHBM is offline  
Old 11th Jun 2021, 05:35
  #116 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: There and here
Posts: 2,250
Was the Ambassador that languished at LGW for some years one of the Autair examples ? It seemed to be parked on that apron beyond where the North Terminal is now situated.
SpringHeeledJack is online now  
Old 11th Jun 2021, 06:50
  #117 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 6,731
Originally Posted by SpringHeeledJack View Post
Was the Ambassador that languished at LGW for some years one of the Autair examples ? It seemed to be parked on that apron beyond where the North Terminal is now situated.
I think that was another BKS landing accident one, nosewheel collapse at Gatwick; the damaged airframe was bought by Dan-Air for spares. Dan-Air became, inevitably, the last users.
WHBM is offline  
Old 11th Jun 2021, 09:57
  #118 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Luton
Posts: 427
Autair's last Ambassador flight was 30 June 1968

It was later than that, I flew back from Luxembourg on G-ALZZ on the 19th September 1968!

I believe that was the last flight as my Dad, who worked for Autair at the time, said after we got off they towed it into the hangar and found cracks in the undercarriage.
Level bust is offline  
Old 11th Jun 2021, 10:39
  #119 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 6,731
Hmmm ... it may be (though not stated as such) that it was just their last scheduled flight then, when they were replaced by secondhand Handley Page Heralds. Autair had two distinctly different operating regimes, one was somewhat oddball domestic scheduled flights, originally centred on Luton but latterly at Heathrow, and separately their holiday charters, principally from Luton, and mainly for the Clarksons tour operator. There was some crossover in the fleets between these, even (desperately trying to get us back on topic) occasionally using the One-Elevens to Jersey when the weekend scheduled propeller flights there had been disrupted by fog.
WHBM is offline  
Old 11th Jun 2021, 11:03
  #120 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: There and here
Posts: 2,250
I think that was another BKS landing accident one, nosewheel collapse at Gatwick; the damaged airframe was bought by Dan-Air for spares. Dan-Air became, inevitably, the last users.
Thanks, I just couldn't picture it's decals in my mind, although I'm sure there's a photo on the net somewhere!


Autair's last Ambassador flight was 30 June 1968

It was later than that, I flew back from Luxembourg on G-ALZZ on the 19th September 1968!

I believe that was the last flight as my Dad, who worked for Autair at the time, said after we got off they towed it into the hangar and found cracks in the undercarriage.
Not wanting to divert too much from the 1-11 theme, may I ask what was it like to fly on the Ambassador ? How did it compare to the Viscount and Vanguard and similar Douglas variants ?
SpringHeeledJack is online now  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.