BAC 1-11
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The BEA version was the -510 - Smiths Flight System as per the Trident and all the switches went the other way from the rest. Hence you flew either the 510 (18 built) or any other variant. BEA also took out the forward airstairs to save weight and replaced them with the equivalent weight to keep the aircraft in trim. 
Latterly I believe the CAA relaxed this and crews flew both.
Latterly I believe the CAA relaxed this and crews flew both.
Isn't that called the F-100 ?
I seem to recall Dee Howard had an idea for an executive version of the 1-11 with Tays, but rumour had it he couldn't get it certified for various reasons.
Thread Starter
thanks to you all for the great replies, the thread has obviously stirred alot of
nostalgia and also the 50th bash is at brooklands tomorrow 20/8
if any 1-11 drivers or anyone involved in the 1-11 then contact
BAC1-11 : The BAC 1-11 Forum is the right place for all one-eleven fans
cheers rog,
keep the stories coming especially about the IT routes,
i came back one night from Athens to LGW on Dan's Romanian leased -500 and we took off well before their 2 x 727's which both then overtook us and landed 30 mins before us lol.
i was due to go on holiday to Dubrovnik summer 1972 on a BCAL 1-11 500 but G-AWYS ran off the end at Corfu during a RTO, so their capacity was tight...
we flew out to DBV on a Northeast Trident and back 2 weeks later on the famous Wardair 727! fantastic machine
nostalgia and also the 50th bash is at brooklands tomorrow 20/8
if any 1-11 drivers or anyone involved in the 1-11 then contact
BAC1-11 : The BAC 1-11 Forum is the right place for all one-eleven fans
cheers rog,
keep the stories coming especially about the IT routes,
i came back one night from Athens to LGW on Dan's Romanian leased -500 and we took off well before their 2 x 727's which both then overtook us and landed 30 mins before us lol.
i was due to go on holiday to Dubrovnik summer 1972 on a BCAL 1-11 500 but G-AWYS ran off the end at Corfu during a RTO, so their capacity was tight...
we flew out to DBV on a Northeast Trident and back 2 weeks later on the famous Wardair 727! fantastic machine
Last edited by rog747; 19th Aug 2013 at 07:08.
the famous Wardair 727! fantastic machine
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Around 1968 I flew on my first commercial passenger flight(Previously enjoyed an Auster "Jolly" from Clacton Airstrip)
Flew Heathrow- Glasgow on a BEA Viscount...was directed to the right, IIRC,as I'd been bumped of the previous flight.....as a naive 21/22 y.o. I didn't appreciate the significance
the rest of the weeks' itinerary was a bit of a comedown....hebrides,Wick via Vanguard ...the return involved a BEA Limousine from Dundee to Edinburgh Turnhouse, where the flight was cancelled due Wx. Coach to Glasgow Abbotsinch and a BUA 1-11 awaited us to teleport to Gatwick.
What a starship! my overriding memories....the push in the back after lining up. the super smart, quiet cabin, and a meal served on an hour's flight!
Upon landing, the massive deceleration...(Thrust-reversers?)
This was an amazing aeroplane compared to what I referred to as the Vickers Vimy, that BEA operated. I wondered how long they could continue to trade on the convenience of thiefrow, with the archaic ,vibrating, noisy Turboprop.
(hate to think how noisy cattle-class was, though I seem to remember the Hostie saying that the cheap seats were actually quieter?
Of course, the BAC left the noise behind!
Ahh, nostalgia isn't like it used to be!
Flew Heathrow- Glasgow on a BEA Viscount...was directed to the right, IIRC,as I'd been bumped of the previous flight.....as a naive 21/22 y.o. I didn't appreciate the significance
the rest of the weeks' itinerary was a bit of a comedown....hebrides,Wick via Vanguard ...the return involved a BEA Limousine from Dundee to Edinburgh Turnhouse, where the flight was cancelled due Wx. Coach to Glasgow Abbotsinch and a BUA 1-11 awaited us to teleport to Gatwick.
What a starship! my overriding memories....the push in the back after lining up. the super smart, quiet cabin, and a meal served on an hour's flight!
Upon landing, the massive deceleration...(Thrust-reversers?)
This was an amazing aeroplane compared to what I referred to as the Vickers Vimy, that BEA operated. I wondered how long they could continue to trade on the convenience of thiefrow, with the archaic ,vibrating, noisy Turboprop.
(hate to think how noisy cattle-class was, though I seem to remember the Hostie saying that the cheap seats were actually quieter?
Of course, the BAC left the noise behind!
Ahh, nostalgia isn't like it used to be!
Somebody mentioned bus stop routes. Quebecair ran the BAC on some notoriously short ones, CYWK - CYKL, 125 sm, and CYBC - CYYY, 35 sm.
Agreed, although in his defence Max was royally scrod at every turn by the @#$% in Ottawa. 
It's a shame Max Ward became too ambitious and eventually had to sell out to Canadian Airlines.
Heathrow Director
Wonder what happened to Captain French of BEA? He used to fly 1-11s into Heathrow and he was the nicest bloke you could ever meet.
Capt Lawrence CJ French Senior Captain 92 03-May-75 28
There was another French, "Alf" based in Manchester he was probably a bit younger so if the MR incident was after '75 it was probably him. He was a large but soft spoken man who never had a bad word to say about anyone. His thing was oompah bands and he would frequent the Berlin venues where they played, buying the band drinks to be allowed to play a song or two with them, He lived just up the road from Ringway in Hale Barns and was the only pilot I ever met who regularly cycled to work. He was certainly the type who wouldn't have complained about being "forgotten" downwind on approach,
Sadly, if I remember correctly he left us a few years ago but I might be wrong, maybe someone else can confirm.
It's a pleasure to see the obvious affection crews have for the 1-11.
From the other end of the aircraft, my views are a bit different! As self-loading freight going on holiday, my first three round trips abroad were all on 1-11s but apparently ones very different to those in scheduled service. They appeared to be fitted with several more rows of seats than the aircraft was designed for and at 6'1" I didn't fit so my knees were firmly embedded in the seat back. The discomfort has stuck in my mind for nearly 40 years.
I can't argue about the performance. With a go-around at Luton for whatever reason it went up like a rocket ship.
From the other end of the aircraft, my views are a bit different! As self-loading freight going on holiday, my first three round trips abroad were all on 1-11s but apparently ones very different to those in scheduled service. They appeared to be fitted with several more rows of seats than the aircraft was designed for and at 6'1" I didn't fit so my knees were firmly embedded in the seat back. The discomfort has stuck in my mind for nearly 40 years.
I can't argue about the performance. With a go-around at Luton for whatever reason it went up like a rocket ship.
Thread Starter
court line squidged 119 pax into their -500's with the lovely seat back dining options
whereas most other charter companies it was 109 and comfort was fairly ok...
Channel Airways in 1967 ordered their -400's with an extra pair of o/wing exits to enable 99 pax (89 usually)
and they also got 139 pax into their Tridents with the forward cabin in a 7 abreasts 3-4 config, cosy for families!
whereas most other charter companies it was 109 and comfort was fairly ok...
Channel Airways in 1967 ordered their -400's with an extra pair of o/wing exits to enable 99 pax (89 usually)
and they also got 139 pax into their Tridents with the forward cabin in a 7 abreasts 3-4 config, cosy for families!
If I recall correctly, Y119 was the standard config for all the UK operated B15s on the IT market (British Midland, Court, Dan Air, British World, EAF) - have I missed any?
I think I'm right in saying that Bavaria Flug. Germanair and Pan Internation of Germany also configured Y119 on the 500 series.
I think I'm right in saying that Bavaria Flug. Germanair and Pan Internation of Germany also configured Y119 on the 500 series.
I've no idea now which airline(s) they were apart from not Court Line - I'd have noticed! Britannia or Monarch from Luton in 1973 I guess. The next time was 1985 from Gatwick to Nice and not a clue...
Thread Starter
1-11 500 seating
British United and Caledonian (think of G-AWYS G-AWWX G-AXYD etc) had their 1-11's in 109 or 114 definitely at first...
i went to Palma in 1970 on WX and it was def not 119 lol!
i then went onto work for an IT operator 4S holidays and we fully chartered both BUA and Cale (which became Cale//Bua lol) and Court 1-11's (Court then bought us out with Horizon holidays)
it was Court Line that started the 119 fit because they fitted the seat back catering and making the galley smaller...
The Dan Air Comet 4b/c's Clarkson's had on charter by then had 119 seats (106 in the Comet 4) which matched that.
RE the German IT 1-11 500 operators sorry i cannot confirm what fit they started out with...
the likes of when the 1-11 500 was operated by Monarch Dan Air EAF BIA and BWA all had 119 with the inheritance of much but not all of the old Court fleet, but the seat back catering was removed eventually.
not forgetting British Midland also operated 3 x 1-11 523 from new,
i went onto to work for BMA in 1977 but the 1-11's had gone...
i seem to recall they were 114? perhaps someone will tell us lol
BEA's a/c were 510 series with no water injection on lower rated Speys
99 seaters...and did operate many IT sectors from Berlin as well as UK.
i went to Palma in 1970 on WX and it was def not 119 lol!
i then went onto work for an IT operator 4S holidays and we fully chartered both BUA and Cale (which became Cale//Bua lol) and Court 1-11's (Court then bought us out with Horizon holidays)
it was Court Line that started the 119 fit because they fitted the seat back catering and making the galley smaller...
The Dan Air Comet 4b/c's Clarkson's had on charter by then had 119 seats (106 in the Comet 4) which matched that.
RE the German IT 1-11 500 operators sorry i cannot confirm what fit they started out with...
the likes of when the 1-11 500 was operated by Monarch Dan Air EAF BIA and BWA all had 119 with the inheritance of much but not all of the old Court fleet, but the seat back catering was removed eventually.
not forgetting British Midland also operated 3 x 1-11 523 from new,
i went onto to work for BMA in 1977 but the 1-11's had gone...
i seem to recall they were 114? perhaps someone will tell us lol
BEA's a/c were 510 series with no water injection on lower rated Speys
99 seaters...and did operate many IT sectors from Berlin as well as UK.
Last edited by rog747; 19th Aug 2013 at 17:55.
Britannia never had a One-Eleven. Monarch had a small number after 1975, starting with some of the redundant Court Line fleet after their August 1974 bankruptcy; I don't know if they kept the Seatback catering like Dan-Air did on the ones passed to them - there were reports of DA still using this in the 1980s, although it was only a couple of aircraft in their fleet.
Among other One-Eleven stories are the ex-Tarom ones which started Ryanair off into trunk routes like Dublin to Liverpool and Luton. They came from Romania with pilots but not cabin crew, at a time when the Romanian economy was hitting rock bottom. Apparently top of the tree to volunteer for this duty were the test pilots from the RomBac plant that had assembled a few of the aircraft. Their English language skills were such that the cabin crew were required to make all normal passenger PAs - pity ATC then.
Do I recall their strapline correctly ? Sun, Sea, Sand, and ....... Superjet. I presume the last was replaced by another word from time to time.
Among other One-Eleven stories are the ex-Tarom ones which started Ryanair off into trunk routes like Dublin to Liverpool and Luton. They came from Romania with pilots but not cabin crew, at a time when the Romanian economy was hitting rock bottom. Apparently top of the tree to volunteer for this duty were the test pilots from the RomBac plant that had assembled a few of the aircraft. Their English language skills were such that the cabin crew were required to make all normal passenger PAs - pity ATC then.
IT operator 4S holidays
Last edited by WHBM; 19th Aug 2013 at 18:06.
Thread Starter
whbm
yes of course 4S
sun sea sand by superjet and whatever else you did in the swinging seventies on your sunshine hols lol
the MD was Sid Silver, quite a character !
so 6S really!!
our parent before Clarksons/Court Line bought us all was Horizon Hols whose chairman was a pioneer of IT hols Vladimir Riatz
Horizon survived and re-birthed and formed Orion Airways later on.
the tag line Super Jet was initiated by many 1-11 operators started by British Eagle with their Super Jet One - Eleven title in 1966
yes of course 4S
sun sea sand by superjet and whatever else you did in the swinging seventies on your sunshine hols lol
the MD was Sid Silver, quite a character !
so 6S really!!
our parent before Clarksons/Court Line bought us all was Horizon Hols whose chairman was a pioneer of IT hols Vladimir Riatz
Horizon survived and re-birthed and formed Orion Airways later on.
the tag line Super Jet was initiated by many 1-11 operators started by British Eagle with their Super Jet One - Eleven title in 1966
Last edited by rog747; 19th Aug 2013 at 18:20.
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any BAC1-11 still flying?
Is the ROMBAC plant still producing the 1-11 or totally stopped?
Is the 1-11 still flying in Europe?Africa?
Where can I get cheap 1-11 lessors?
Where can one get access to a cheap BAC1-11 sim for amateur?Where is most BAC1-11 sim training done?
Thanks
Is the 1-11 still flying in Europe?Africa?
Where can I get cheap 1-11 lessors?
Where can one get access to a cheap BAC1-11 sim for amateur?Where is most BAC1-11 sim training done?
Thanks
Thread Starter
no
no
no
no
there is one or 2 private ones around plus a few heaps in Africa
this one was for sale
http://www.classicjettours.com/BAC111/Pages/49.html
no
no
no
there is one or 2 private ones around plus a few heaps in Africa
this one was for sale
http://www.classicjettours.com/BAC111/Pages/49.html
Thread Starter
could be
dan air had -400's based there then i recall
Yes, Dan-Air had based One-Elevens at Luton from the 1969 season onwards. When British Eagle failed in Autumn 1968 their principal IT tour client, Lunn-Poly, turned to Dan-Air for their programme for the following summer, and they picked up a couple of American Airlines One-Eleven 400s, some of the few on the market at the time, and operated them out of Luton rather than the established Dan-Air Comet base at Gatwick.
I notice nobody so far has mentioned the Aer Lingus fleet. The bought four of the early aircraft in 1965 and operated them right through to the early 1990s, generally to Continental Europe rather than the UK, although a number of these Aer Lingus European flights stopped at Manchester on the way. It seemed to be a low-key but successful and long-lived fleet for a quarter of a century.
No, not even Sqn. Ldr. Jones at Channel was that mad. They did do 7-across Tridents in part of the aircraft, but I believe that didn't last. They had also previously done a packed DC4.
I notice nobody so far has mentioned the Aer Lingus fleet. The bought four of the early aircraft in 1965 and operated them right through to the early 1990s, generally to Continental Europe rather than the UK, although a number of these Aer Lingus European flights stopped at Manchester on the way. It seemed to be a low-key but successful and long-lived fleet for a quarter of a century.
Did anyone (Channel?) have 6-abreast in the One-Eleven?
Last edited by WHBM; 19th Aug 2013 at 20:09.
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although a number of these Aer Lingus European flights stopped at Manchester on the way.
The EI flight was my favourite if only for the smoked salmon brunch.