Concorde (merged)
So, on 24 Oct 2003, Britain will cease to be 'Great' any longer. The only asset which raised ba above the rest will no longer fly in revenue service.
Rising costs? Not the sole reason - and one that could probably have been addressed, had they had sufficient interest. Instead, it was used as an excuse, no doubt much to the convenience of Air France. The real cause? Spineless managers with no vision, pride or any idea of what is meant by an 'intangible asset' and accountants with no interest in life other than in their bottom line. The Sunday Times estimates that ba (sorry, no longer BA) will make £250 000 from each of Concorde's last flights. Perhaps if ba had got off its overstuffed corporate backside and marketed the aircraft's uniqueness more positively, she would have flown on to her real end-of-lifetime date.
Sadly, on 24 Oct ba will kill off the only thing which anyone could ever admire them for. They now have nothing to mark them out from any other airline - apart from the lingering stink of the King/Marshall 'Dirty Tricks' era.....
I'm glad that 'Trubby' never knew what the spineless bean counters at ba finally did to his magnificent aeroplane.
Rising costs? Not the sole reason - and one that could probably have been addressed, had they had sufficient interest. Instead, it was used as an excuse, no doubt much to the convenience of Air France. The real cause? Spineless managers with no vision, pride or any idea of what is meant by an 'intangible asset' and accountants with no interest in life other than in their bottom line. The Sunday Times estimates that ba (sorry, no longer BA) will make £250 000 from each of Concorde's last flights. Perhaps if ba had got off its overstuffed corporate backside and marketed the aircraft's uniqueness more positively, she would have flown on to her real end-of-lifetime date.
Sadly, on 24 Oct ba will kill off the only thing which anyone could ever admire them for. They now have nothing to mark them out from any other airline - apart from the lingering stink of the King/Marshall 'Dirty Tricks' era.....
I'm glad that 'Trubby' never knew what the spineless bean counters at ba finally did to his magnificent aeroplane.
aceatco, retired
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I think this has been aired before . . . Even if (a big IF) BA wanted to keep Concorde flying wouldn't the lack of support from Airbus (the design authority) have scuppered it anyway?
A crying shame.
VA
A crying shame.
VA
After the totally avoidable AF Concorde accident, AF really wanted rid of Concorde. As last week's Discovery documentary identified, AF's practices never were fully exposed in a report which conveniently bruhed them aside.... Hence the 'lack of support' from AI for Concorde was extremely convenient for the French - allowing them an excuse to kill off the Concorde with undignified haste.
Had the French had sufficient interest in continuing to fly Concorde, do you really think that Airbus wouldn't have had to rethink their level of support?
This whole affair is utterly shameful.
Had the French had sufficient interest in continuing to fly Concorde, do you really think that Airbus wouldn't have had to rethink their level of support?
This whole affair is utterly shameful.
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More speculation about the final day. This is one of a number of similar stories apparently based on a PA release. The numbers sound a bit wild - the lower end of the prediction is about 10,000 spectators.
http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_828126.html
http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_828126.html
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Agree with most about the pathetic handling of the demise of the great lady.
Lets not forget that Concorde is a national treasure - an institution almost, funded by hard earned tax payers' money from the first scribble in a BAC design office to the timeless majestic beauty of the skies that she is now and could be for at least another decade!In my book if you part pay for something you part own it ! Ba and baa deserve all the criticism they get for not laying on a "bit of a do" for the final landings. Sod the disruption - this is a national day of mourning!!If well wishers who have contributed so much to the whole programme want to see this spectacle then they (we) deserve to be able to and welcomed with open arms. Its just so British - forget the well wishers and enthusiasts but lay out the red carpet for a pathetic bunch of fat cats and "celebrities" with no interest except to be "part of the scene"
And as for the final destinations!?Good Grief! As I said in a previous thread America dos'nt deserve one at all but 3!!?? Seattle for God's sake why?, Barbados - OK a connection but who will get to see it? NY - the only place that accepted Conc daily and there gonna put her on an old aircraft carrier! Manchester -sorry guys but we all know that preserved aircraft on airports soon get forgotten about 'cos no-one can see them and they soon hamper expansion plans (Trident at LHR ring any bells?) - Should prove to be an interesting fire trainer for the local crews.
Absolutely Damien B - Cosford definitely deserves one with its unique ba line up and at least it will get looked after properly.Also thousands of its BRITISH (sometimes unwilling?) financial supporters can see it and admire it for years to come.How about one at Fairford?? - Years of research flying done from here, plus hundreds of thousands of enthusiasts would get to see it at the annual Air Tattoo! (How about keeping it airworthy from here for "pleasure flights" to support the RAF Benevolent fund!!)
The whole sorry mess stinks - another colossal cock up by a bunch of pin headed beurocrats too interested in their own self preservation. Give 'em to Branson! God knows they and the country deserve it!!
Lets not forget that Concorde is a national treasure - an institution almost, funded by hard earned tax payers' money from the first scribble in a BAC design office to the timeless majestic beauty of the skies that she is now and could be for at least another decade!In my book if you part pay for something you part own it ! Ba and baa deserve all the criticism they get for not laying on a "bit of a do" for the final landings. Sod the disruption - this is a national day of mourning!!If well wishers who have contributed so much to the whole programme want to see this spectacle then they (we) deserve to be able to and welcomed with open arms. Its just so British - forget the well wishers and enthusiasts but lay out the red carpet for a pathetic bunch of fat cats and "celebrities" with no interest except to be "part of the scene"
And as for the final destinations!?Good Grief! As I said in a previous thread America dos'nt deserve one at all but 3!!?? Seattle for God's sake why?, Barbados - OK a connection but who will get to see it? NY - the only place that accepted Conc daily and there gonna put her on an old aircraft carrier! Manchester -sorry guys but we all know that preserved aircraft on airports soon get forgotten about 'cos no-one can see them and they soon hamper expansion plans (Trident at LHR ring any bells?) - Should prove to be an interesting fire trainer for the local crews.
Absolutely Damien B - Cosford definitely deserves one with its unique ba line up and at least it will get looked after properly.Also thousands of its BRITISH (sometimes unwilling?) financial supporters can see it and admire it for years to come.How about one at Fairford?? - Years of research flying done from here, plus hundreds of thousands of enthusiasts would get to see it at the annual Air Tattoo! (How about keeping it airworthy from here for "pleasure flights" to support the RAF Benevolent fund!!)
The whole sorry mess stinks - another colossal cock up by a bunch of pin headed beurocrats too interested in their own self preservation. Give 'em to Branson! God knows they and the country deserve it!!
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As an employee of the great company many of us here will be glad to see the back of it and then we can concentrate on getting on with geting back to high level profitability without the albatross.RIP
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The way BRITISH AIRWAYS are handling this is disgraceful. Even their "Farewell Tour" is simply an exercise to pander to the show-biz and political nobs - while the REAL fans are shut-out as if an unwanted nuisance.
Have looked into the FAREWELL TOUR visit to Birmingham on the 20th - the aircraft will land, and taxi directly to a hospitality suite in a far corner of the airport, where the public cannot even see her!
When I asked about the possibility of entry to the hospitality suite, BA told me that "sorry - it's by invite only, and only VIP's are invited"!!!
As a result, I, and my family, have vowed never to fly with BA again. (and that will cost them around 30 return business flights to Europe a year)
And as for those useless lazy good for nothing managers at Cosford Museum - they have made it quite clear that they don't WANT a Concorde there because "we haven't got room".
I give in...
Have looked into the FAREWELL TOUR visit to Birmingham on the 20th - the aircraft will land, and taxi directly to a hospitality suite in a far corner of the airport, where the public cannot even see her!
When I asked about the possibility of entry to the hospitality suite, BA told me that "sorry - it's by invite only, and only VIP's are invited"!!!
As a result, I, and my family, have vowed never to fly with BA again. (and that will cost them around 30 return business flights to Europe a year)
And as for those useless lazy good for nothing managers at Cosford Museum - they have made it quite clear that they don't WANT a Concorde there because "we haven't got room".
I give in...
"As a result, I, and my family, have vowed never to fly with BA again. (and that will cost them around 30 return business flights to Europe a year)"
- nor will I ever fly ba. In fact I instruct the people who book my flights "Never book me on ba". It was bad enough when Marshall and King and others tried to kill Virgin, then there was that idiot who painted graffiti on the tails. Ailing Bob. But ba's behaviour over Concorde is the last straw.
ba, already you're no longer the national flag carrier; soon you'll have nothing special to offer and will have to compete with others for our custom. If you go down the pan as a result, few will shed many tears.
- nor will I ever fly ba. In fact I instruct the people who book my flights "Never book me on ba". It was bad enough when Marshall and King and others tried to kill Virgin, then there was that idiot who painted graffiti on the tails. Ailing Bob. But ba's behaviour over Concorde is the last straw.
ba, already you're no longer the national flag carrier; soon you'll have nothing special to offer and will have to compete with others for our custom. If you go down the pan as a result, few will shed many tears.
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"Concorde's Number One Fan"
BBC1 (London Area): 7:30 PM tonight.
"Jetinder Sira first saw concorde take off when he was 7 years old - 27 years later he is crestfallen that the old girl is to be scrapped. Inside Out went with him on one of his last visits to see her."
"Jetinder Sira first saw concorde take off when he was 7 years old - 27 years later he is crestfallen that the old girl is to be scrapped. Inside Out went with him on one of his last visits to see her."
I'm still very surprised that the BBC haven't dragged out the old documentary about Concorde with Noel Edmunds presenting. It was a very unique and enlightening program with fantastic internal and external video shots. Now that would be worth seeing again.
BA
BAA
Fifty year LHR anniversary, and a huge flypast, several aircraft past and present, 30 minute area disruption, bloody good show. BAA can't be seen to disrupt LHR again, especially seeing as though it's not them who'll get the publicity.
Why are we giving our national pride to the USA, no, firmly and bloody well no again. Keep all the aircraft here where they will be appreciated and kept pristine, instead of rotting in some lost backwater museum. Giving one to seattle, seems to kick back to Boeings SST, here guys have one of ours and see if you can do it right this time. Barbados, can't fathom that one out. USS whatsitsname, some where no one goes anymore, can't figure that one out either.
Rant over
Sorry if I offended anyone, but then a piece of history is being written on the 24th. The history of british aviation once again goes stateside. (Whittle + jet engine) for example.
BA
BAA
Fifty year LHR anniversary, and a huge flypast, several aircraft past and present, 30 minute area disruption, bloody good show. BAA can't be seen to disrupt LHR again, especially seeing as though it's not them who'll get the publicity.
Why are we giving our national pride to the USA, no, firmly and bloody well no again. Keep all the aircraft here where they will be appreciated and kept pristine, instead of rotting in some lost backwater museum. Giving one to seattle, seems to kick back to Boeings SST, here guys have one of ours and see if you can do it right this time. Barbados, can't fathom that one out. USS whatsitsname, some where no one goes anymore, can't figure that one out either.
Rant over
Sorry if I offended anyone, but then a piece of history is being written on the 24th. The history of british aviation once again goes stateside. (Whittle + jet engine) for example.
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You can't hang onto the good times. Enjoy them, savour them, then let them go gracefully. If it hadn't stopped now, it would have stopped in a few years. It was never going to be around forever and it's had a good innings, so what's the difference?
I'm sure they wept the same kind of tears about the Zeppelins, but the reality is that even before the Lakenhurst disaster the cost of a passenger seat mile meant their days were severely numbered and if Concorde didn't suffer from the same sort of problem we wouldn't be having this discussion now. Blame whoever you like -- the French, the Americans -- but it's a hard capitalist world out there and Concorde doesn't cut it.
Sad, but self-evident.
QDM
I'm sure they wept the same kind of tears about the Zeppelins, but the reality is that even before the Lakenhurst disaster the cost of a passenger seat mile meant their days were severely numbered and if Concorde didn't suffer from the same sort of problem we wouldn't be having this discussion now. Blame whoever you like -- the French, the Americans -- but it's a hard capitalist world out there and Concorde doesn't cut it.
Sad, but self-evident.
QDM
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In all the farewells we should not overlook the enthusiastic support given to BA and Concorde by the Ruler and State of Bahrein when the USA first banned it. With nowhere to go (AF had RIO), Bahrein ( and later of course Singapore) welcomed it with open arms and made BAs simultaneous introduction with AF possible.
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Whilst everyone on this post has voiced their national pride in the brilliant piece of 1950’s inspiration and 1960’s technology that Concorde represents, can we just stop and put our emotions to one side.
If, in 1969 you went out and purchased an e-type Jag to drive, say, 5 days a week, flat out, London – Manchester return and, say every weekend that car spent its time in the garage being serviced you would probably have a very nice e-type, but you might be wondering what’s lurking in those unseen places after all these years and have reached the conclusion that it was time you bought something a bit younger.
With cars, you can buy the equivalent, with Concorde you can’t, but some engineers with experience of the aircraft would probably say it’s time for the old lady to retire.
I myself, am a little surprised that one is not going to either Farnborough, Cranfield or NASA, to be stripped down completely to see if there’s anything we’ve missed about the effect of supersonic flight on airframes after its many years in service.
Sad to see her go and sadder that we will not see another to replace her for 30 years.
If, in 1969 you went out and purchased an e-type Jag to drive, say, 5 days a week, flat out, London – Manchester return and, say every weekend that car spent its time in the garage being serviced you would probably have a very nice e-type, but you might be wondering what’s lurking in those unseen places after all these years and have reached the conclusion that it was time you bought something a bit younger.
With cars, you can buy the equivalent, with Concorde you can’t, but some engineers with experience of the aircraft would probably say it’s time for the old lady to retire.
I myself, am a little surprised that one is not going to either Farnborough, Cranfield or NASA, to be stripped down completely to see if there’s anything we’ve missed about the effect of supersonic flight on airframes after its many years in service.
Sad to see her go and sadder that we will not see another to replace her for 30 years.
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So only 2 of the fleet will retire in UK? What in heck is happening? Only 2/5 of the fleet staying here.
And Barbados? - that's absurd. It may have been a destination, but how many people will bother to see it there? Wouldn't it have been better to give it to Duxford or Cosford?
My beloved AD will rot on an old aircraft carrier in New York. But at lest there will be one at Manch only a few miles form where I live.
SSD
And Barbados? - that's absurd. It may have been a destination, but how many people will bother to see it there? Wouldn't it have been better to give it to Duxford or Cosford?
My beloved AD will rot on an old aircraft carrier in New York. But at lest there will be one at Manch only a few miles form where I live.
SSD
Don't forget the withdrawn G-BOAA and G-BOAB stored at Heathrow. They'll have to be retired to a UK Museum as they won't fly again. Unless of course, they await the cutters torch?