just found this porky when having a quick look at new jetgo website


"Our ERJs are so quiet that they are the only commercial jet aircraft permitted to operate into Sydney Airport during the curfew period."


For a start all BAE146's can land at SYD during curfew & plenty of them still in Australia.


Think also a Dornier 328 jet can land at SYD during curfew.


There are probably other commercial jets that can also.

"just found this porky when having a quick look at new jetgo website


"Our ERJs are so quiet that they are the only commercial jet aircraft permitted to operate into Sydney Airport during the curfew period."


For a start all BAE146's can land at SYD during curfew & plenty of them still in Australia.


Think also a Dornier 328 jet can land at SYD during curfew.


There are probably other commercial jets that can also."




Sorry XPT but I just looked up the groups of aircraft that are allowed to operate at YSSY during the curfew as I didn't recall either of your nominated types as being on the list and neither the 146 or 328 are included.

You might want to refer to either the AIP DAP or Jeps about the aircraft types permitted to operate during curfew.

The former National Jet B737-300QC was approved for SYD during curfew hours.

I dont think you can really call the BAe146 or Doriner 328 a jet they are more like good impersonators.

B772,

I'd be interested to know how they got that approval, as I'd made some enquires about another type that isn't listed and was told "No way", as it isn't on the list and it wouldn't be allowed. That was only 18 months ago.

The 146 is most definitely approved for Sydney curfew operations, having done a kazillion night freighters into their in the dead of night!

Snakecharma,

Well I stand corrected.

Is the 146 freighter covered by the paragraph in DAP regarding the curfew provisions saying, some operations have concessions against the curfew?

Was the approval only for freight ops or did it include pax ops?

"The 146 is most definitely approved for Sydney curfew operations"


With 4 APU's and a hair dryer, hardly makes much noise!!!! Would've made a good jet option for Entebbe.

Just wondering how the recent recruitment drive went - did any one get a call, and if so, what's the deal? Or are they already in the USA doing endorsements?

I have a mate of a mate whom was doing Indoc in BNE with a class of others recently.. 2 more in St Louis Flight Safety now and more going next month. Mate says they will hire another 15 to 20 this year mostly Sydney based

Bagthrower is on the money. The company has deep pockets and also a well structured plan. They will service a number of regions and service them well....no prehistoric dinosaur aircraft with this mob :ok:

I guess Fitztroy Aviation and Tamair didn't have deep enough pockets.

Well played BPA!
History you exciteable lot - due diligence anyone??

Or lessons learnt...;)

Hopefully they won't be doing V1 cuts at night in the aeroplane, either....

A bit of a stretch Hugh!

As far as I know Jetgo has only one ex Tamair person and he is not involved in flight operations. Hmmmm! Last I looked Virgin and Qantas had heaps of ex Tamair people in flight operational roles...... would you make the same comment about them?

As for JR & PB, there has been an awful lot of water under the bridge since Fitzroy & Tamair.

That's low Jarse. You should delete that comment. Very poor form.

D :hmm:

I heard that too.

Is there a "smiley" that goes "nyah nyah nya nyahhh nyahhhhhhh!!!" to Spike and his mates?:ok::ok::ok:

SACL apron procedures were updated earlier in the week, parking for Jetgo on DOM6...

Jetgo
 

Hear they are doing hub busting routes GLA/BUD/ROK/ROM/EML/Wellcamp to SYD in their ERJ's.. noted their proving run yesterday they did ROMA SYD in under an hour and twenty minutes... the dirty old dash would still be going round the holding pattern getting into BNE when these guys are on short final at SYD, That would have to save a Shirtload of time transiting through that 'holding megaplace' they call an airport at Brisbane.. Smart move, hope they bring there machines into NSW and give REX a hurry up, Dubbo Melbourne maybe or Dubbo Brisbane all for the taking

Do you mean ROM / SY in 1 hour 20 rather than ROM / BN

An interesting response.
 

The smiley ngarr ngarr crap is indicative of the level of maturity of the poster. My posts regarding Jet Go are only targeted at the ill informed that blather on about them being an airline or RPT when they were a charter organization an the unethical "consultant" that revealed how much he has overcharged the operator. In another area I have congratulated the operator on their achievements because they should be congratulated. I continue to wish them every success. No, I don't have a job application in with them. I don't need to. Thank you.

Agree. The Embraer is a nice clean machine, especially compared to some of QLink's Dash's (the ageing ones) and particularly when compared to Skytrans 30 year old clunkers, not to mention their not so stellar levels of reliability and OTP.
As has been said before JetGo have been methodical in their set up, have good financial backing and the right aircraft type for their business model. It's going to be great watching them shake things up when they hit full swing :ok:

The problem with their business model is their future completion. If Qantas and Virgin notice they are carrying full loads on the SYD -ROM, SYD-BUD etc, Qantas will put a Q400 on the route and Virgin will put a Ejet or F100 on the route. If you think back about 8 years, Alliance was operating RPT on the TVL-BNE route, however once Jetstar and Virgin ramped up there services, Allisnce couldn't compete and reverted back to charter and they currently only operate one RPT route.

Remember the US regionals tried to use the E135/140/145 etc on bypass routes in the states and look how well it turned out. Within 10 years most of the aircraft have been retired from service, hence Jetgo has been able to pick them up at a good price.

So yes it good to see another operate gve it a go, but in the last 10 years there have been far two many airlines who stepped up from charter to RPT and failed.

If Quaintarse or Virgin had any brains (yes, I know there is an irishman at the helm of one of the biggest loss-making airlines), they would quietly hop into bed with Jetgo on a codeshare basis, or just buy some capacity off them. Both Q and V know they haven't got the right aircraft for those routes, and rather than watch Jetgo take their potential customers, they should at least get a bite out of the business.

From the outside in:

Looks like a great product. The struggle will be when QLink dump seats on any and all routes. And they will. They definitely will. If Jetgo can achieve hosting in the VA system they'll go well.

Maybe they'll be the first operator in the world to make a stand alone buck using E135/140 in RPT..........

Being hosted in the VA or QF res systems is not a guarantee of financial success. Just ask Brindabella. Hosting is not a code share. I doubt if VA/QF will publish through fares with them which would help given the proposed routes.

The ERJ/CRJ aircraft types need high yielding fares to survive. In the USA the airlines that flew them mostly had a deal to provide the aircraft on an ACMI basis to the majors. Cobham do that here for QFLink...

Reckon you're a bit off the mark there TBM. I think you'll find the leases Jetgo has make it the most affordable jet in the marketplace.

I'm aware of that however the DOC's are not low..

Recent news:
http://aviationweek.com/awin/erj-ope...ll-excess-14bn

Thats Why operators have Rolls Royce MSP plans, as JG do....

This guy did a trip report on a test RPT flight that Jetgo did.

http://cqplanespotting.********.com....rom-jetgo.html

Edit: Ok I don't know how to insert links in this Vbulletin board from the 90s. So just copy and paste the link.
Edit 2: So for some reason the link just won't work so I have posted the shortened version. If you think its dodgy then follow this tweet. That's where I got it from. https://twitter.com/cqplanespotting/...05157691084800

http://t.co/ztdZXYLQkV

It seems from the US, at least anecdotally, that ERJ operations have shown to be vulnerable. The right airframe, whilst a very important component to success in aviation, is only part of the recipe. What can these guys do that will safeguard them from the majors' potentially aggressive counter attack? After all, when you want a piece of the on carriage action via a new-start hub bust operation, expect more than just a little heat!

The founder of one of Australia's most successful and significant regional airlines told me some years ago, you can't start a regional these days - the majors just won't let you! This guy was shrewd, he was influential and he grew his fleet to what I recall was 28 aircraft prior to sale.

They can be a success for sure, but as a long term independent operation they had better have a plan which keeps the majors at bay or, be prepared to grow quickly (beyond just 5 airframes!) to the point where it is simply not economical for the majors to try to shut you down/ contain your growth. If they can expand existing markets instead of poaching, they may just be left alone. For how long is a whole other question.

The timing could not be better as both majors reportedly retreat from dumping capacity into the market but I still don't see their point of difference. What will Jetgo do which the majors can't?

For mine, they need to form an alliance very fast with whomever they can.

NS makes good points. A network affiliation is critical for a long term success. Point to point route pickings is fine however the support beyond a point like Sydney is essential. Pax from other parts of Australia do not like changing carriers therefore some form of through fare structure becomes necessary. The other issue is the fact that 80% of the population live around the Golden Triangle.

QLINK gave the GLA-SY route a go for quite some time and that is not working out and will end in the near future. Why would routes such as ROMA-SY etc be any different? I am not aware of the demand but is there a large number of passengers that currently transit through BN from SY for regional QLD?

you seem to have forgotten about FIFO's. FIFO's can go on RPT services, which can be underwritten by mining companies, just as charters are.


Being RPT allows the public access to these flights as well.


Maybe mining companies guarantee a certain % of seats & the rest Jetgo can sell to public.

My view remains, what business are they in? Trying to be everything to everyone doesn't work. Mining is reportedly on the decline and so the last few years for Jetgo's FIFO/ charter ops have been a great foundation for what's about to be their transition to RPT.

But if there's talk of a 'hybrid' RPT where the miners say cover the base operating cost and the public delivers the bonus/ profit - dud model! Getting creative in any industry to circumvent the true realities of the ruthless, unforgiving market forces is simply death.

Just do the basics really well, identify your point of difference and market and sell like no other and you'll have a chance. But number one, know what business you should be in, and what you should not.

From experience saying no in business is vastly more challenging than saying yes.

RPT operators don't make charter their core business. To win a marathon you don't concentrate on sprint training. Point is, with all the operational experience built up from charter & FIFO the flying bit will be easy. The hard part as always in aviation is getting enough seats 'bummed' (if I may use a little poetic licence) to make a profit.

From the website, every key person is an operations person. Not a head of sales and marketing to be seen. That's a key position to omit in a multi-million dollar venture. Granted, the person may in fact exist, but for mine it is a significant ommission and one they would be wise to promote.

Although it would appear nearly all successful regionals started in charter. Rex, Eastern, Air North.....

REX was formed from the ashes of Hazelton and Kendell airlines. And yes they did start out as charter companies, but that was 40 plus years ago. Some with Eastern and Air North. The cost of doing business back then was cheaper and they started with piston aircraft, not jets.

Also for them to survive and grow they required help from the two domestic airlines (Ansett and TAA/Australian). Has the two domestic airlines withdrew their F27s they were replaced with the smaller (mostly piston aircraft initially) from Hazo's Kendell and Eastern/Sunstate/Southern.

In the case of Airnorth they have been hosted in the QF system for years and their recent expansion of routes has come about due to QF withdrawing from the routes and handing them over to Airnorth.

So history has shown that in order for a regional airline to survive and grow (in Australia, the USA and Europe) they need the backing/assistance of a larger domestic airline.

This is what happens when you aren't connected with one of the majors.

Skytrans cancels Toowoomba-Sydney route following Qantas announcement