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Sorry WP but you have got to be kidding, those who are dinosaurs know it and play the game to their own advantage so there are NO innocents.
I am not a rat employee but even I would contribute to a fund to try and hold some accountability in this because no-one else is going to do it from Board, ASIC and media and it is such an important issue. |
Doesn't look good no matter how you look it.
The whole engineering work-face will become cheaper in the near future since they are going to flood the place with Cat A's, MOD etc. The $200k gravy slurping dinosaurs will ultimately become extinct by natural attrition since they are in their twilight years anyway, if not sooner. All that will be left is half baked Cat A's who will ultimately be on contracts, which will be undercutting each other as they race to the bottom. |
Is "transmission of business" likely/possible for engineering?
If they sell off the whole CAMO, employees included, do we still get a VR option? |
200k Dinosaurs?
You are selling yourself short or you just don't get the game! I would have liked to have used the term 'cretin' but that would only apply if you understood the game. Give me the joint to run and I would keep every single one of those $200k dinosaurs you speak of. I would get rid of all the $1m+pa ones that have authorised the $1m+ per MONTH storage costs - that we know of. I'm an old fashioned chap but I reckon a $200kpa cost to advise against a $1m per month cost is a smart investment. I may have misread you. I'm seriously ****** off. Unless you live in the exalted levels of QF management I mean no offence. |
This makes me feel sick...
The thought of 2800 odd ADDITIONAL Qantas staff being shown the door despite the fact that we're in this hideous predicament because of the inept business practices of management and the board, not the employees... it's just so wrong. Joyce will make the staff walk the plank whilst he continues busily sinking the ship. :( |
Yep!, all whilst Joyce's:rolleyes: Chairman donates his own cash to the Liberal Party!
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Landed at KVCV yesterday, and counted nineteen-19 red tailed aircraft in mothballs with the Roo removed. A very sad sight and not a good look.......
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Originally Posted by silverado
Are you sure about that Romulus?
Redundancy ONLY applies if nobody else will fill the job. i.e. the job must not be refilled or it is not a redundancy. The law is very clear on this. Thus a 737 pilot who joined after a 767 pilot might not be made redundant whilst the 767 person is because QANTAS can probably demonstrate there is a need for the 73 type whereas there is not for the 76. That's the simple version of it, the lawyers might try to spin something else but unless they are extraordinarily lucky that is the way it is. |
You all have such little faith in the Board and to be honest, I felt the same myself. But alas, today's announcement will turn that all around.
Qantas will be launching their restaurant booking service at Rockpool Restaurant. That'll surely save the airline. |
"Would someone pls get rid of this little Irish ****"
Sounds like a line from the Scottish play.:) |
All these value added booking services that Alan is rolling out reminds me of when Ansett was dying and Toomey is on the telly spruiking how Ansett is sponsoring the AFL and the cricket and every other sport, but whilst doing so forgot to run the airline.
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"however Dallas I think will go to American Airlines. "
Except that AA have some agreement with their jet jockeys over max flight times that precludes them operating to the SWP. |
Public row over Qantas's flagging fortunes FORMER Qantas chief economist Tony Webber and chief financial officer Gareth Evans have become embroiled in an increasingly public feud about the airline's flagging fortunes. Mr Evans hit out in a newspaper column last month at "armchair experts" with theories on how the airline should be run and defended the airline's strategy of maintaining its 65 per cent domestic market share. He singled out Mr Webber, whom he described as a retrenched former Qantas finance employee, and attacked his comments as coming from "a one-dimensional view of supply and demand that ignores how a multifaceted market actually works". He said a recommendation by Mr Webber to shrink regional operations so prices and profits would rise ignored the carrier's role in the community and "rolled out the red carpet for our competitors to fill the space". Mr Webber struck back over the weekend with claims on online blog Plane Talking that Mr Evans's comments demonstrated a weak understanding of aviation strategy and risk management. He accused the CFO of downplaying his role as chief economist at Qantas and disputed that he had been retrenched. He pointed to a fall in the Qantas share price from $2.64 to $1.09 and lower profits during Mr Evans's tenure, noting the airline hadn't paid a dividend since the first half of fiscal 2009. "By most conservative markers, under Evans's watch the group's earnings and shareholder return performance have been a dismal failure," Mr Webber said. In his defence of the Qantas strategy, Mr Evans noted the airline had reduced unit costs by almost 20 per cent over the past five years, renewed its fleet with 130 new aircraft and used technological innovations to boost customer satisfaction to record levels. The 65 per cent strategy was about giving customers a market-leading choice of destinations and stepping back from it "would effectively be waving a white flag, not to mention abandoning our role in regional Australia and betraying the loyalty of our frequent flyers. Anyone who advocates this kind of approach does not understand the way the business works," Mr Evans said. But Mr Webber argued Australia's economic performance, the price of fuel and the Australian dollar had been favourable for the airline and there was little evidence to suggest Qantas could blame extraordinarily high capacity growth for its woes. He described Mr Evans's commentary on the 65 per cent market share as "completely flawed", arguing that targeting market share led to a loss of control over capacity decisions because the airline doing so had to grow its capacity at the same pace of competitors. "The problems with the 65 per cent market share is not the 65 per cent per se," he said. "The problem is that market capacity is above that which maximises profit for the market. If both Qantas and Virgin were to reduce capacity by 20 per cent, and so Qantas were to preserve its 65 per cent market share, then they would both be making an extraordinary amount of money." The former Qantas economist also denied he had recommended a reduction in regional capacity. He said he had constructed a model that targeted underperforming routes. . Cookies must be enabled. | The Australian Former Qantas Chief Economist replies to CFO article | Plane Talking . |
If you follow Webbers logic of increasing profits by reducing capacity then both carriers should get rid of all the aeroplanes and they will make a squillion!
The issue is bigger than just capacity, or seat mile costs, or any other single item. Neither operator (VA or QF) is profitable, they would make more money liquidating all the assets and having two blokes sitting in a room investing the money in an online savings account. In my opinion, one of the big issues is competing KPi's Each area of the respective businesses has management with KPi's upon which their performance is judged and bonuses (for some senior management) paid. This has the effect of focusing managerial attention on meeting the KPI's in order to retain their own jobs and maximise their income. It is a only happy coincidence if the decisions made in order to achieve those KPI's actually benefits the company as a whole. This is because most business areas have competing priorities. Let's look at crewing/ops and flight ops. Crewing want to optimise the things they want to minimise (drafts, overtime, open time, sick leave etc). Flight ops might want to reduce leave liability, head count, fuel burn, etc. commercial want to maximise revenue per seat. So commercial shift a flight 3 days before it is operated from a 767 to a 737 (insert applicable big aeroplane to applicable smaller aeroplane). This might maximise the revenue per seat but effectively wastes a big aeroplane crew and calls out a small aeroplane crew - all increasing drafts/overtime etc. This means crewing need to carry reserve (if that is how it is managed in that business) or pay someone overtime or a day off payment to crew the flight on the smaller aircraft. This means that flight ops can't reduce head count because they need the heads to cover the reserve coverage. They can't give out leave because they need the crews available to cover the potential flying. In the meantime the big aeroplane crews are no longer operating so their time is lost unless something else can be found for them. It might have cost 500k to save 150k. A false economy in anyone's book. All of these things come from competing KPI's. This isn't unique to Australian airlines or businesses, but it is a direct result of accountants running businesses who focus on small areas rather than the big picture. I long for the day when boards recognise that they need leaders who know their business and who are rewarded for how the business as a whole performs, not just their little patch. I fear I will be waiting a loooong time. :ugh: |
Snakecharma - all these "dis-economies of scale" was well know and was documented in Parkinson's Law (original economist article) - the short book is highly recommended) (wikipedia blurb on the law & corollaries) in the mid 1950's who documented the growth of bureaucracies (between 5.17% to 6.56% pa) as well as corporate governance. He was a historian who went back to the 1300's and studied organisations and board sizes from that time forward. His basic thesis has stood the test of time. It even gets a mention in Yes Minister.
They precisely what they are doing, and they also understand quite well the fact that it won't work in the long run. Quite frankly, they don't care. As long as they can keep the gravy train going for as long as possible to allow themselves & the consultants to rip the guts out of it, they don't give a sh!t. The trick is to con everyone that they do in fact know what they are doing, so as to go along with their scam. New buzz words, new thinking to baffle with bullsh!t, same old scam. Its not going to end badly, that implies sometime in the future, its already here. |
Ampclamp,
Disagree, recently read an article in Aviation Week and Space Technology, january 13 issue, were they named Tim Clark of Emirates as their person of the year. Interesting read about his knowledge of the Industry, and his hands on approach with major issues like Aircraft specifications,route developement and cabin interior. |
The Flying Kangaroo may have its share of critics these days, but you won't find many in the north-west NSW town of Moree.
Whilst QF International shrinks, there is hope for you yet, Moree might save the airline. The Flying Kangaroo may have its share of critics these days, but you won't find many in the north-west NSW town of Moree. The town of 10,000 is so keen to express its appreciation for Qantas that about 300 residents gathered for a rally on Tuesday, handing baskets filled with local produce to pilots and flight attendants as gifts. Then there is local farmer Stuart Gall, who last week painted the roof of his shed under the Moree airport flight path, with ''Thanks Qantas. Please Stay'' in giant letters. The goal? To convince QantasLink to apply for a five-year NSW licence for regional air services to Sydney airport, in a tender process set to open on Thursday. The licence is a monopoly that keeps competitors off routes to make them financially viable. An application by QantasLink won't mean it is a guaranteed winner. The airline learnt that lesson in 2012 when it was beaten in a tender by tiny Canberra-based carrier Brindabella Airlines. QantasLink had served Moree for more than 20 years until it was forced to halt flights last March in a decision that shocked local residents. By December, QantasLink had returned to Moree on a temporary basis after Brindabella went into receivership. The collapse was prompted by the grounding of several of its planes by the Civil Aviation Safety Authority due to lapsed maintenance. Transport for NSW has promised there will be more opportunity for community input about preferences surrounding services, the size of aircraft and affordability than in the past, but it won't take into account support for any particular airline. Moree residents say Brindabella offered an inconsistent service, cancelling flights or often offloading passengers and bags for weight reasons. The towns of Narrabri, Mudgee, Cobar and Cooma were also without air services after Brindabella's collapse. Michael Campion, a Sydney gynaecologist who was raised in Moree and still flies in monthly to assist at an Aboriginal women's clinic, said Brindabella's poor service had proven disastrous for the region's economy. ''I'm performing eight surgeries which have been delayed now for [about] five months,'' he said. ''[The patients] weren't in situations where they could easily travel to Sydney for treatment.'' Moree may not be core to QantasLink business, but QantasLink is certainly core to the broader airline group. The regional arm has traditionally been a highly profitable operation for Qantas, which has been under pressure from competition from rival Virgin Australia on several fronts. Qantas has warned of a pre-tax loss of up to $300 million in the first half and has unveiled plans to cut 1000 jobs and $2 billion of spending. It is seeking the government's help to level the playing field against Virgin and has also launched a strategic review which might result in a partial sale of its frequent flyer program or Jetstar. In the regional market, Virgin Australia Regional Airlines (VARA) has been entering unregulated monopoly routes, in a move that has placed pressure on QantasLink's pricing. However, the Moree route represents an opportunity for QantasLink to snare a monopoly route not open to VARA. Virgin last week revealed it had placed any regional expansions on hold until it could get proper compliance systems in place. But worryingly for the town's residents, QantasLink has not yet decided it will lodge an application with the NSW government. If not, services to Moree will cease in March. ''No decisions have been made about seeking to operate the route beyond this date, but we acknowledge and appreciate the sentiments expressed and thank the people of Moree,'' a Qantas spokeswoman said. QantasLink was supported as the favourite option by 95 per cent of the 1100 residents that completed an online survey, with Regional Express (Rex) a distant second place with 3 per cent support. Yet Rex appears less hesitant about making an application. It is using the collapse of Brindabella as an expansion opportunity and hired 14 captains from the group. Rex has called for expressions of interest from regional cities in NSW interested in regular air services. It wants new routes to cities within 600 kilometres of Sydney interested in three return flights on weekdays. Only cities that can sustain more than 30,000 annual passengers will be considered. Rex chief operating officer Garry Filmer said his airline was interested in Moree, but was waiting for support from the local council. ''They really have to want us for us to go there,'' he said. ''The ball is back in their court.'' For Qantas, there isn't a huge financial incentive to relaunch flights to Moree on a permanent basis. It is thought the route had been marginally profitable. But at a time when the airline is seeking government support, backing a town so eager for its services could help build goodwill with politicians. Read more: 'Thanks': town gathers over love for Qantas |
How stupid do they think the public are?
And this incredibly courageous women would know........
This is the end game, the box and dice, the be all and end all.......its work choices......... It sounds like a carnival fair in Canberra. "Roll up, roll up, if your profits are not bulging, come on down and put your hand up, cause we are going to squeeze the nuts of this country" Everything that happens now will be blamed on the workers of this country supposedly having their snouts in the trough. If history is anything to go by, its sounding like a single term PM every day, greed can be so blind. One can only hope....... From Yahoo7News, Liberal MP Sharman Stone accuses Prime Minister Tony Abbott and Treasurer Joe Hockey of lying over SPC - Yahoo!7 "A Liberal backbencher has accused Prime Minister Tony Abbott and Treasurer Joe Hockey of lying about union conditions at SPC Ardmona. Sharman Stone, the federal Member for the Victorian seat of Murray, says her senior colleagues are using excuses that are "wrong" to justify the decision to reject a bid for $25 million in government assistance from the food processor - which is based in her electorate. Union-negotiated conditions for workers have come under fire from the Government for being too extravagant, with pay well above the award. In an extraordinary outburst, Dr Stone says the leaders of her party are deceiving the public debate. "It's not the truth. That's right, it's lying," she said. "The independent panel, their own independent panel, I understand recommended that this industry be supported." This morning on AM, Dr Stone was pressed on her use of the word "lying", and whether she believed Employment Minister Eric Abetz's statement that workers' allowances were "over-generous" also represented a lie. "Well, you could use that word if you like," she said. She later added that "it is a complete furphy what is being said about the troubles of this last fruit-preserving industry." The Prime Minister’s office has declined an ABC request for comment and Mr Hockey’s office has not yet responded. Hasn't responded??????? Give the guy some time to cook up another interview meltdown. So tell us when you first found out about this one Joe...... |
Things to do today, or soon, at least...
Alan out. Leigh out. Tony out. Joe - back to school. Malcolm - promote to head prefect Sharman - promote and listen to what she says |
The 2010 words of Sue Bussell (Executive Manager, Industrial Relations, Qantas)come flooding back: 'Turbulent Times - a practitioner's perspective of Industrial Relations in Aviation'
Page 7 (formatted for easier reading) These developments raise a number of issues for practitioners. First, it has introduced a degree of complexity in reconciling legislative minimum standards with some long standing entitlements in enterprise agreements, as well as in effect removing from the scope of bargaining a number of core employment conditions. Whereas in the past the industrial parties had full discretion on how they structured benefits such as annual leave and personal leave in enterprise agreements, since WorkChoices, and similarly under the FairWork Act, this is no longer the case. Second, having accessed the Corporations power for the direct federal regulation of employment conditions there is the pot ential to further blur and expand entitlements based on social and employment policy such as paid maternity leave. Third, despite having expanded the safety net there is not yet a settled consensus on whether this safety net is indeed an acceptable set of minimum conditions to apply to the workforce, though the modern award process in Fair Work Australia has certainly advanced this understanding. Finally, in effect this expanded safety net has changed the territory in which the debate over the respective role of individual and collective agreements under Work Choices occurred – that is the expanded safety net has reduced –or arguably removed - the vulnerability of the individual when bargaining directly with an employer. The recent review of Modern awards was an opportunity for the distinction between a safety net and conditions bargained in individual enterprises to be tested. The Qantas group played a significant role in the review of the aviation industry awards. Although it might appear that an easy approach for Qantas would have been to stand back from the process because raising the industry standard would impact on our ‘low cost’ competitors more than on Qantas mainline, our view was that the long term competitiveness of the industry in Australia required that aviation industry awards remained as true Industry minima. Otherwise, we would have become potentially less competitive with international carriers operating to Australia, and we also needed to protect our subsidiaries Jetstar and QantasLink – QantasLink provides services to regional Australia and has some community service obligations. The challenge was significant with some unions taking a very different approach to the concept of a safety net being a minimum standard. We had to provide comprehensive data and the initial decisions of the Tribunal were then subject to a Ministerial request for review. However in the end, under very difficult circumstances the Tribunal got it right for this industry. There was no evidence of any individual being worse off and the awards provide for a fair minimum standard safety net that is a foundation – not a replacement - for collective bargaining The game is simple. Send the enterprise to the wall, cry poor and implement by force the base award with the assistance of the Federal Government, one industry at a time, using the previous case as a justification. This would appear to be the agenda behind the SPC media spin. |
And this...
Cookies must be enabled. | The Australian "We are doing our best to reduce all costs across the business, however the serious problems that have beset SPCA have not been because of labour costs and certainly not from the allowances, a fact borne out by the Productivity Commission's recent analysis,'' No see I remember Umm Ahh TA saying any IR decisions would be based on outcomes found by the Productivity Commission. Hmm, that's gospel truth TA for you, thankfully (for him) a largely compliant media play along....but lies and dishonesty....well they're not an exclusive domain of the left are they? |
Alans Not Happy
Who the hell cares if this W****R is not happy, what goes around comes around hope the hell this saying is really CORRECT.
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Posted elsewhere but ...
Not a fan of Paul Howes, but just listened to him on the ABC's NPC and he delivered a fantastic speech, with quite a bit of eloquence, on the IR debate. I might have even changed my view on him but that tie up with Livvy is just a bit too cosy. I haven't got the link, but do try and listen to it on the ABC website. |
Paul's speech makes me think he's realised there's more money and power in a management job and a cushy few board seats somewhere than there is in a tilt at Federal Parliament, even via a safe seat.
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Richard Branson's Virgin Atlantic will ditch daily flights between Sydney and Hong Kong in May, blaming increasing costs and a challenging economic environment. The decision to end flying to Australia after almost 10 years will be a fillip for Virgin's rivals on the route, Qantas and Hong Kong flag carrier Cathay Pacific. Read more: Virgin Atlantic axes flights between Sydney and Hong Kong How will QF react? Guarantee not as quickly at CX. |
Cathay the only airline now flying between Sydney & London.
Kissed on the dick by a fairy?? |
Cathay the only airline now flying between Sydney & London. |
I suspect by pushing prices up... and would expect CX to do the same (they aren't exactly making much money either)
Same demand, less supply = higher fares Probably the best news QFi has had on any route in a long time. A duopoly route with no LCCs flying direct. |
QFs presence on SYD/MEL to HKG is a joke compared to CXs - as it is with most routes on which it competes. VS pulling out will make 2/5 of 5/8th of sweet FA difference to the competitive dynamics on these routes. It's a few hundred seats a day when CX has several thousand between SYD and MEL and HKG.
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Hopes fading on government assistance for Qantas
lies and dishonesty....well they're not an exclusive domain of the left are they? both are the same, just pays lawyers and look what that did for the Qantas staff who lost their gigs after Joyce shut down the airline, he just continued on his merry way cutting & slashing even with a new Liberal government installed... I doubt nothing will change much on that front... as both sides of government in Canberra simply lack talent to understand the ramifications of the course set by Clifford & Joyce for the future of Qantas. I expressed my concerns about importance of preserving what's left of our industry to Mr Truss via email a few times in December as I was concerned about QFI pilots jobs, sadly after a lot of effort I got this standard reply. https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-W...uss-letter.jpg I still believe strongly in Qantas International and I think most Australians do, they simply haven't the time to think about it. QI have been great ambassadors for Australia and aviation in general, now sadly being downsized to suit the wallets of a few at the top of the management tree. This same tree of managers (and their predecessors) simply forgot to order the right equipment, because they became consumed with their ego's conquering Asia, now in 2014 we have new Jet* equipment parked all over the place whilst QFI awaits its next course of management cutback announcements later this month. Brilliant stuff... but still the management try to complicate this simple mistake with blogs like this gem which is still rumbling along Former Qantas Chief Economist replies to CFO article | Plane Talking the comments says it all.. https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-e...ring-Large.jpg I guess a new round of proceedings in Canberra will start soon (again) so in the photo above just paste the head of your favourite Q manager or politician on either side of the political fence, none of them will own up, they will all just continue to cover their spots. Qantas will renew its lobbying in Canberra next week when chief executive Alan Joyce meets senior politicians. But analysts and sources within the Coalition believe it has become less likely that Qantas will be granted its wish of a financial guarantee in the form of a standby debt facility. |
Typical really........
PM says,
‘‘Penalty rates are very important to people - very, very important to people. If you are a low-paid worker one of the things that you often love to do is work late-nights, weekends, because it does substantially increase your income.’’ Have you ever heard such rubbish?????? Late nights, shift work, and working weekends has been proven to have toxic and detrimental effects upon workers family units, social lives, relationships, and health. Penalty rates are a compensation for that. And soon enough, with the removal of such compensation, that's all the workers of this country will be doing it for, just to feel the love...... Read more: Paul Howes: Excessive wages growth is 'pricing some sectors out of the market' |
CX not making money on SYD HKG route??????? Who says?????:rolleyes:
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It's a little different when CX is operating in/out of their hub, versus VX operates via someone else's hub.
VX is only carrying traffic to either HKG or LHR. CX is carrying traffic to either HKG or the planet… |
It would appear that Mr Howes is perhaps a little........? How should I put it? c@#+struck.
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It's a little different when CX is operating in/out of their hub, versus VX operates via someone else's hub The Q idea is pay for a big billboard in HK (somewhere on the above ground part of Lou Wu - Central MTR) which says "fly Q on the A380 three times a WEEK to Sydney". That was in 2012, CX were doing 3 flights per DAY to SYD. Like that notorious PX ad 25? years ago which had a photoshop of number of kangas "Why stuff around with Q, try the PX alternative" Edited to add As SLF Garuda is more pleasant |
Just let me get that straight. In 2012, Qantas had 3 flights a day out of Hong Kong?
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Yes SOPS and for one who flew on a regular basis for business they provided 'choice' (where have I heard that?)
The QF 30 would get in from LHR so those pax had 'choice' stay on if heading to MEL or connect to the 747 service down to SYD which was the same departure time as the current flight to SYD. The other 'choice' was the early morning departure to SYD on an A330 getting in at 9 pm ish. Would it be correct to say that the only true departure point that offers 'choice' now is LAX? Good work AJ. |
No more shift penalties. Yippee no more working christmas or public holidays. Meanwhile the genius' will be trying to figure out why everyone is off sick.
Paul Howes' speech is symbolic of the ideoligy of these people. Talk it up about how overpaid the workers are, then leave the room hand in hand with his girlfriend on a million + salary. America here we come. |
The Monkey Pilot?
Comedy clubs and the big office. He reminds me of somebody, at the 2m20sec mark. How's she do that? He's not the only one throwing up in the end..... |
America here we come. There is a middle road you know. |
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