Heard that there seems to be an email going around stating that pilots on hold file can expediate their employ with Jetstar by taking a position in NZ!

I would hope that pilots at this level will be smart and not do this, as I believe that this would pave the way for erroding of the EBA........

Can anyone an shed some further light on this?

Have to agree with jibba jabba...

Given the insulting T&C's regarding a position in SIN on the A330, its unlikely any local crew will take up the offer, consequently no temp positions will come up in OZ, until more A320's arrive in the coming months. (Heard JQ Asia A320 pilots have looked at the A330 offer and said its less than what they're on!). Its JQ NZ offer all over again, raise it a little more next month and see who takes the bait...

Heard in NZ recently, quite a few flights have been cancelled due to lack of crew, so apparently there has been a requirement for upgrades for JQ NZ pilots. With these upgrades, availability for JQ NZ F/O's are now available. For those interested on these below average conditions beware, you cannot transfer from JQ NZ to JZ OZ onto better conditions, as average as they are. Find out from the local guys exactly what the flying rosters provide on the NZ contracts conditions before even thinking about applying.

Not only lack of crew but lack of recency!

JQ had to delay a departure ex NZ for AUS pre dawn till after morning twilight due crew not night recent!!

Sounds like an exceptional operation !!

mggpf,

Quote:
Within this group the modus operandi was to undercut and oversee the demise of one regional airline followed by the undermining of another airline.

Which regional airlines demise was that ?

I suggest you do a tad more research there digger, actually here's a hint for you.

There was a certain QF Regional airline that operated a small fleet of Dash8's and BAe 146's. It was very lean/efficient and profitable. The turnover of crews, both Tech and Cabin was nigh on zero because there was job progression, people were treated decently and respected, and the lifestyle was second to none. Still haven't figured it out??

Southern Australia Airlines!! RIP.

jibba_jabba

"I would hope that pilots at this level will be smart and not do this, as I believe that this would pave the way for erroding of the EBA........"

Sadly there will always be those who'll take the poor contract (NZ IEA). Either to get a start, return to their homeland or get Command.

The EBA FOs taking LWOP, get a command and return back to Oz when they can, probably do more to erode the EBA than any one else.

I don't work for an airline at present but I am trying to understand why guys on the current EBA are willing to sacrifice long term pay for a quicker command? Can you really not wait the extra year or whatever it is?

The short term benefits of a quicker command can't possibly outweigh the long term benefits of better remuneration can they? I can understand if you want to live out your days in NZ (actually no I can't) but apart from that it just doesn't seem to make long term financial sense.

Doesn't make sense to me, but like I said, I'm from the outside looking in.

Some guys will take the quick command because they are planning to move to greener pastures (good luck with that :uhoh:) & it is smarter (some would say essential) to do that as a captain, rather than as an F/O.

Unfortunately some guys will not get a command for more like 5-7 years , and some will never live in their homes with their families to get a reasonable basing.
These things cannot wait and unfortunately the company can use this to generate larger profits. Rejecting a command to wait for unity is long gone. AIPA was too slow off the mark and busy wasting money attacking things that really were irrelevent.(deliberately I feel) AIPA is only in Jetstar to get QF pilots a job if they all of a sudden need one, this will again be at the expense of JQ f/os upgrades, yet they follow like lost sheep.:ok:
Good luck........

Looks like workchoices all around. Save your money boys dump the union, the only payrises now will be the saving in fees...

well, i guess that means we can thank the liberals for that... i know who i wont be voting for......

but on a lighter note.........anyone been called up for a Jetstar Oz ground school??

Jetstar ground school.
 

The people on hold might be a little disappointed when they find out they are going to be offered an employment agreement outside the EBA.

PP
Don't know how that's possible?

Have any F/Os been offered commands in JQ Australia recently .... fingers crossed this may trigger some recruitment????????

That's what I'm wondering too. Have tried to find out what Australian legislation there is to stop it but can't find any. It's not really individual agreements, just another group agreement??

I heard that their FAs were in the same boat. ie they had an EBA with Jetstar but in an effort to drive down the $$, the company then started employing them outside on a separate agreement (on lesser conditions).

Sounds sadly like any new pilots will be facing a simillar situation.

Heard the new F/O contract has no endorsement costs . No day off payments. Overtime at 80 hours. base pay 50 k till 1 year from check to line. increasing 5 k per year until reaching 100k upper limit.
super at 9% of base pay only. No bonuses.leave 6 weeks .

Thanks , needed some facts to see how unreasonable it is!
my god, i could earn better money being a P.A , labourer, bank teller..... pffff

Alloyboobtube
A mate's friend's mother's cousin's distant relative's cat told me blah blah blah. They can't do it. Even if they start a new entity the bottom line is called the MODERN AWARD. If they try to go below that ... well they'll be in deep doo doo with the workplace ombudsman. Ignorance is not bliss ... its slavery in this instance. Wake up pilots!

They are not changing the Award, that is the sneaky bit they are starting a new "Company" and you work for that entity on the conditions of that Company. Dixon stated when Jetstar was started that no Mainline pilot will be required to take a paycut or a reduction in conditions BUT the fine print was if you want that command then you have to sign on to the "new" conditions.

If the Court Case regarding Jetconnect does not succeed then it will be the new Workchoices. The only way to change it will be through legislation which will be a long slow process and more than likely not retrospective.

It would be naive to think that they won't get anyone to sign up to the "new" award.

Lookleft, I think you may misunderstand what bo777 is saying. Any entity employing pilots must have as minimum the Air Pilots Award 2010 [pdf]. If another entity employs pilots, yes the Jetstar EBA is dead, but the Air Pilots award will still be the minimum. The race to the bottom is over.

Lookleft
Sorry mate you're talking crap. The bottom line minimum wage, T&C's are outlined in the Air Pilots Modern Award 2010(feel free to look it up sometime). Current J* pilots are on a specific industry award atm. Any pilot based on less than the conditions outlined in the Air pilots award needs to contact the union and workplace ombudsman ASAP. Sorry was still writing when BB posted. What BB said.:ok:

Bruce Buchanan rejects pilots union 'scaremongering'
 

Interesting quote:

The AFAP are quite comfortable with it, however the JPC which was set up to represent the interests of the Jetstar Pilot group has been part of it.

I just hope that the overseas members of the AFAP have not been able to have any input into the "comfort" factor felt by the AFAP.

Help yourselves lads, the enemy lies within.

Good luck.

Source: Bruce Buchanan rejects pilots union 'scaremongering' | The Australian

BB thanks for the link and yes I did misunderstand 777s post (thanks for the crisp precis 777). To clear up further misunderstanding who negotiated that? Why are helicopter weights still in pounds? And I don't get what the 760% IFR allowance is all about.

What I find odd about Jetstars assertion that it is good for the pilots to be given opportunities to fly overseas with Jetstar, is that they were able to recruit plenty of expats who were overseas who did not want to be overseas any longer. Why do they think that pilots from here are going to rush o/s for less money than they are on now?

Becha' some will! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

The AFAP are certainly not comfortable with it.

The JPC was definitely NOT a part of it.

While I do agree that the enemy lies within, this enemy is NOT any of the representative bodies of Jetstar pilots.

Don't fall for executive spin.

slightly off topic
 

so does that mean everyone flying aust reg planes under casa rules for aust company are covered by the Air Pilots Modern Award 2010?

ie Jetstar nz

Jetstar needs a union to cover all its operations under one umbrella to provide collective bargaining power. No more part time pilots part time negotiators (no disrespect to previous union representatives :D) Union negotiators with Law degrees and experience in dealing with quality of life slashing bonus banking managers.

Atleast start with Australian and New Zealand unionisation.

Jetstar NZ pilots, I believe, work for a NZ registered company. They pay income tax to the NZ IRD. They work under a contract that complies (I presume) with NZ labour laws. Australian unions get very little say in what goes on in other countries.

Why do you think they started JQNZ in the first place?:ugh:

And yes, it is no secret that AIPA is on the phone to NZALPA.

With news such as this I can imagine that the entire pilot body at Jetstar are combining together to discuss the potential ramifications to not only their own positions, but just as importantly the scenario presented to new hires?

After such discussion it is then reasonable to expect that your concerns would then be presented to management, backed by the solidarity of a professional workforce that are determined not to let the current conditions slip!

Its great to see a united front of pilots, concerned at the pay and conditions of new hires!

Good luck guys, I'm sure your concern and solidarity will prevail and this attempt at lowering the standards of tech crew in Australia will be cut off :ok:



(By the way my niece is about to graduate from high school and is keen on the Jetstar cadetship, if anyone has any pointers on the selection process any info would be much appreciated! PM me if you like. Any info much appreciated :ok:)

I once heard of an Indian airline who was treating their pilots quite badly. Apparently there was a very bad flu that went through the entire pilot group one day and all the aircraft were grounded. Terrible, I hope the pilots all recovered.

I suggest everyone have a look at the 'pilots unite' thread. Its time to pull some industrial 'g' and get this eba saga out of nose dive :ok:

Hey, maybe I could score a clever boy bonus if I suggest to the Qantas Board that they outsource Jetstar management to Manila or Pune.

EBA is a dead duck...

Don't worry....Pay freeze and a reduced hours base with the Golden Carrot of extra flying hours pay and the one off, sign-off bonus will get the troops signing up. :rolleyes:


FFRATS

I'd be happy with tiger dollars and keep everything as it is on a 12 month interum agreement.... currently 35K (FO) behind based on 787hrs per year....

With a few factors coming into play recently (Aus/NZ exchange rate, stalled EBA),

The kiwi JQ A320 contract is not looking so bad (relatively speaking):

New base salary now one year after ratification:

$180k + 4.5% super = $188,100 plus overtime at >65hrs of $172/hr (AUD)

$188,100 x 0.93 = 174,900k AUD (plus about $3500AUD in ZQN allowance)

EBA:

163,418 + 9.25% super = 178,500K AUD plus overtime >75 of $208/hr

Thats it!!!

Arm Bands and Red (Orange?) Ties at fifty paces!!

Watch out for those nasty (polite) P.A's also…

That'll show em. :ugh::ugh::ugh:

Any news on the EBA....

September to remember? - Winter of our discontent?

Ides of March???

I reckon Jane's breathing a sigh of relief. After "cleverly" telling the JPC they should model their claims on the Tiger EA, the Tiger boys and girls then successfully negotiate a superior deal, putting serious egg on the face of the Jetstar CEO. Oops!

Then Joyce comes along shooting from the hip in all directions, and with the group wide pay freeze, provides a convenient out for her!

I mean fair dinkum! The only thing missing is the lion tamer!

Well Krusty,
I guess that's what happens when the business is run by clowns,
it becomes a circus!