What happened to the NJS BN & CB base closure post?
What happened to the NJS BN & CB base closure post?
Seems strangely absent...
either:
1. the author had an attack of the guilts at posting a commercially in confidence letter (specified as such) .
2. More likely...NJS threatened some sort of legal action and the Woomera team deleted it to prevent anything going further.
CS
either:
1. the author had an attack of the guilts at posting a commercially in confidence letter (specified as such) .
2. More likely...NJS threatened some sort of legal action and the Woomera team deleted it to prevent anything going further.
CS
Join Date: Mar 2001
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As a former moderator of the fora, I'd hazard the following guess.
Someone from NJS contacted the esteemed Woomera(s) and pointed out that the communication reproduced on the thread was Commercial in Confidence until Qantas had made the appropriate changes and announcements and requested that as such, the thread be removed/suspended.
Whilst PPRuNe is a rumour network, I believe that the posting of the message only disadvantages NJS employees, as most likely management will be reluctant to inform their staff, knowing that some can't be trusted to respect the caveat that comes with the information.
Someone from NJS contacted the esteemed Woomera(s) and pointed out that the communication reproduced on the thread was Commercial in Confidence until Qantas had made the appropriate changes and announcements and requested that as such, the thread be removed/suspended.
Whilst PPRuNe is a rumour network, I believe that the posting of the message only disadvantages NJS employees, as most likely management will be reluctant to inform their staff, knowing that some can't be trusted to respect the caveat that comes with the information.
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Can you please explain how posting the message hurts NJS employees.
Its quite clear the base is closing, either move to another part of Australia or resign.
The verbal rumour network works just fine, posting the actual message just backs up the rumour and delivers the facts. Nothing anyone does can save the BNE base or its members QANTAS has spoken. Just as they have spoken to Southern and just as they have spoken to other NJS bases CBR, MKY & ROK. When they are finished with you, you are dumped.
All Australian Aviation Members are interested in this, and for once you get the facts instead of stupid rumours.
Its quite clear the base is closing, either move to another part of Australia or resign.
The verbal rumour network works just fine, posting the actual message just backs up the rumour and delivers the facts. Nothing anyone does can save the BNE base or its members QANTAS has spoken. Just as they have spoken to Southern and just as they have spoken to other NJS bases CBR, MKY & ROK. When they are finished with you, you are dumped.
All Australian Aviation Members are interested in this, and for once you get the facts instead of stupid rumours.
Some people who post on PPRuNe do not seem to understand the legal, ethical or moral implications of their anonymous posts and the repercussions on the site owner(s)/publisher.
I've been around this forum since the beginning and have never hid my identity behind an anonymous name. In all that time I have never seen censorship for censorship sake - despite ludicrous bleatings to the contrary. Indeed, Chief Pilot Danny and the various moderators of the Dunnunda Forum have been remarkably tolerant. However, there are legal, ethical and moral bounds to what may be published.
I am not a Woomeri or Moderator - never have and never will be - however it is always clearly obvious why certain posts or threads are, correctly, edited or removed.
Perhaps before you post a thread, consider whether you are prepared to publicly post under your own name, rather than an anonymous name. If the answer is "no" - don't post, as the legal responsibility for - and consequences of - your post passes to the site owner/publisher and possibly the moderator.
I posted the following response to a question from "Life on Mars" on another thread, which should be self explanatory:
I guess living on Mars one could get out of touch, however I would think every PPRuNer that lives on this Planet knows exactly why the threads are no longer visible.
In one instance there is the presumption of innocence and the consequences of media speculation on a matter which may be sub judicia, and in the other, the very least may be an infringement of copyright and more likely, the potential for a very lucrative retirement plan for an entire firm of inventive lawyers.
Indeed, I am utterly amazed the threads lasted as long as they did! I've been around this Forum long enough to remember when the Chief Pilot (who incidentally, owns 100% of the shares in this bit of cyberspace) would dummyspit and close the entire Dunnunda Forum for far, far less.
And his lectures to us colonials often contained words one would not normally expect to hear from a very British Captain or learn on a CRM course!
I would suggest the Chief Pilot, Woomeri, et al took a totally appropriate and responsible action, for which he/they/them/it would have almost total support from PPRuNers Dunnunda!
Oh ... and in answer to your first question, go look at the home page where the Chief Pilot's name is clearly evident. Makes it easy for law firms to serve the Summonses.
If you are not prepared to attach your own name to a post, think twice before you post!
Have a great day!
Cheers
Bob Fulton
I've been around this forum since the beginning and have never hid my identity behind an anonymous name. In all that time I have never seen censorship for censorship sake - despite ludicrous bleatings to the contrary. Indeed, Chief Pilot Danny and the various moderators of the Dunnunda Forum have been remarkably tolerant. However, there are legal, ethical and moral bounds to what may be published.
I am not a Woomeri or Moderator - never have and never will be - however it is always clearly obvious why certain posts or threads are, correctly, edited or removed.
Perhaps before you post a thread, consider whether you are prepared to publicly post under your own name, rather than an anonymous name. If the answer is "no" - don't post, as the legal responsibility for - and consequences of - your post passes to the site owner/publisher and possibly the moderator.
I posted the following response to a question from "Life on Mars" on another thread, which should be self explanatory:
I guess living on Mars one could get out of touch, however I would think every PPRuNer that lives on this Planet knows exactly why the threads are no longer visible.
In one instance there is the presumption of innocence and the consequences of media speculation on a matter which may be sub judicia, and in the other, the very least may be an infringement of copyright and more likely, the potential for a very lucrative retirement plan for an entire firm of inventive lawyers.
Indeed, I am utterly amazed the threads lasted as long as they did! I've been around this Forum long enough to remember when the Chief Pilot (who incidentally, owns 100% of the shares in this bit of cyberspace) would dummyspit and close the entire Dunnunda Forum for far, far less.
And his lectures to us colonials often contained words one would not normally expect to hear from a very British Captain or learn on a CRM course!
I would suggest the Chief Pilot, Woomeri, et al took a totally appropriate and responsible action, for which he/they/them/it would have almost total support from PPRuNers Dunnunda!
Oh ... and in answer to your first question, go look at the home page where the Chief Pilot's name is clearly evident. Makes it easy for law firms to serve the Summonses.
If you are not prepared to attach your own name to a post, think twice before you post!
Have a great day!
Cheers
Bob Fulton
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Capt 146 - It will hurt NJS employees because management will think twice about taking employees into confidence and sharing commercially sensitive information. The whole memo read to me - we trust you and want you to know exactly what's happening so that you don't find out third hand. It seems that posting the memo is a fantastic way to break that trust. Guess who loses out of that.
As an ex NJS employee from one of the earlier base closures, I would like to pass comment. One of NJS's former strengths was that the pilots, flighties and engineers had a real "can do" co-operative spirit. Unfortunately, in the last few years, instead of respecting this, some sectors of management regarded this as a divine right rather than a privelage. For whatever reason communication has always been a fundamental weakness at NJS.
When my base closed, senior management had been denying the closure for months, even though the caterers and ground staff at Brisbane had been showing us printed schedules showing another aircraft type doing our flying. This occurred right up until the actual announcement.
Looking back at it now, I can imagine them justifying it by using the phrase, "commercial in confidence". It makes perfectly good business sense not to tell your people so that you retain them in position up until stumps. After all, "it's just a contract and we're all expendable, right?"
The question they have to ask themselves when they look in the mirror each day is whether they have dealt with their staff in a humane and moral way. Walk a mile in another mans shoes.
When my base closed, senior management had been denying the closure for months, even though the caterers and ground staff at Brisbane had been showing us printed schedules showing another aircraft type doing our flying. This occurred right up until the actual announcement.
Looking back at it now, I can imagine them justifying it by using the phrase, "commercial in confidence". It makes perfectly good business sense not to tell your people so that you retain them in position up until stumps. After all, "it's just a contract and we're all expendable, right?"
The question they have to ask themselves when they look in the mirror each day is whether they have dealt with their staff in a humane and moral way. Walk a mile in another mans shoes.
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Always a difficult one for us and we've faced it many times over the years.
We'll help out if we think managers are genuinely and honestly trying to keep people in the loop. We know reality though and that infamous refueler is busy spreading the word anyway
Conversely if we smell smoke and mirrors it stays on the forum - we've developed a pretty good nose over the years.
As usual - it's one of those damned if we do, damned if we don't situations. If it makes you feel better be sure to blast off a snotogram to me at the usual address so I can tell you the story of a UK airline that stopped operations inside 24 hours following a posting about a single aircraft being impounded.
Regards
Rob
We'll help out if we think managers are genuinely and honestly trying to keep people in the loop. We know reality though and that infamous refueler is busy spreading the word anyway
Conversely if we smell smoke and mirrors it stays on the forum - we've developed a pretty good nose over the years.
As usual - it's one of those damned if we do, damned if we don't situations. If it makes you feel better be sure to blast off a snotogram to me at the usual address so I can tell you the story of a UK airline that stopped operations inside 24 hours following a posting about a single aircraft being impounded.
Regards
Rob
Join Date: Jun 1999
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The Baron,
I don't think that the "walk a mile" philosophy is lost on anyone.
However, you might consider how much freedom a contractor's management has to make announcements about their major client's business decisions, particularly if the client is prepared to change its mind up to, if not soon after, major announcements.
Moreover, given your need for conspiracy theories, retaining people right up to the end would probably end up costing a lot more in company funded transfers, redundancies, etc than if the folks had moved on through resignation. Were NJS so thinly populated that they could not have covered the flights with temporary transfers and overtime?
All of these situations present people with lots of "damned if you and damned if you don't" type scenarios - I suggest that the management performance will best be gauged by what happens after the announcement.
Stay Alive
I don't think that the "walk a mile" philosophy is lost on anyone.
However, you might consider how much freedom a contractor's management has to make announcements about their major client's business decisions, particularly if the client is prepared to change its mind up to, if not soon after, major announcements.
Moreover, given your need for conspiracy theories, retaining people right up to the end would probably end up costing a lot more in company funded transfers, redundancies, etc than if the folks had moved on through resignation. Were NJS so thinly populated that they could not have covered the flights with temporary transfers and overtime?
All of these situations present people with lots of "damned if you and damned if you don't" type scenarios - I suggest that the management performance will best be gauged by what happens after the announcement.
Stay Alive
Well now I’ve seen everything
Torres pontificating on the evils of defamatory, anonymous posts!
Past sinners always make the most enthusiastic of converts.
Have you also converted your friend Air Ace, Torres?
Past sinners always make the most enthusiastic of converts.
Have you also converted your friend Air Ace, Torres?
