Am I dreaming or have I seen all this before ?
Thumpa,
According to one of the other threads, 89 steps was actually the controller involved.
TL
According to one of the other threads, 89 steps was actually the controller involved.
TL
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From memory the 89 737 had conducted a DME arrival from the south and was circling on rwy 14. The EFIS MAP had shifted and showed the rwy in the wrong place. The wrong place lined up with a prominent road in MK. Come in spinner.
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Ullo Ullo Ullo Binos can I see your PPRuNing license then please, we don't want any trouble then do we sir?
Carrying on posting without displaying the correct Post Count is a serious offence, now you wouldn't want to set a bad example to the kiddies sir would we?
Carrying on posting without displaying the correct Post Count is a serious offence, now you wouldn't want to set a bad example to the kiddies sir would we?
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
"The EFIS MAP had shifted and showed the rwy in the wrong place." Was that in fact part of the finding, ccy sam? If so, I am surprised, as map ship usually occurs when outside effective update distance from nav aids - any map shift would have been corrected once the aircraft was close to the MKY VOR DME.
Would it be possible for Binos, or 89 steps to let us know what the ATI was at the time of this alleged incident, please? It would be interesting to know the wind direction and velocity as well as cloud and vis. An aircraft making a VOR-DME approach, with a final inbound offset (to the R/W) course, and additionally laying off drift, in low vis conditions at night, are all factors worth considering by those who can't see how THEY could ever do the same.
This is at least the third time (we know of) that an airline transport aircraft has done this - aircraft with "state of the art" equipment at the time, crewed by two experienced pilots.
It's time to analyse what factors are involved, so that a FIX suggestion can be proposed to the authorities.
Hey thumpa, "Immediately you bloody all choose pilot error.." - that is what the decision eventually WILL be - has to be, however, fortunately at least ONE critical link in a chain of events leading up to a possible accident, was broken.
That link being the communication from the MKY Tower upon which the crew took positive action in the form of a go around.
Well done all round chaps!!
Now about that 45 degree descent angle, that world traveller Mrs MacDonald mentioned.....
Would it be possible for Binos, or 89 steps to let us know what the ATI was at the time of this alleged incident, please? It would be interesting to know the wind direction and velocity as well as cloud and vis. An aircraft making a VOR-DME approach, with a final inbound offset (to the R/W) course, and additionally laying off drift, in low vis conditions at night, are all factors worth considering by those who can't see how THEY could ever do the same.
This is at least the third time (we know of) that an airline transport aircraft has done this - aircraft with "state of the art" equipment at the time, crewed by two experienced pilots.
It's time to analyse what factors are involved, so that a FIX suggestion can be proposed to the authorities.
Hey thumpa, "Immediately you bloody all choose pilot error.." - that is what the decision eventually WILL be - has to be, however, fortunately at least ONE critical link in a chain of events leading up to a possible accident, was broken.
That link being the communication from the MKY Tower upon which the crew took positive action in the form of a go around.
Well done all round chaps!!
Now about that 45 degree descent angle, that world traveller Mrs MacDonald mentioned.....
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Old MacDonald had a farm ei ei oh
Time Mr & Mrs Mac went back to feeding the chooks!
By the way I thought the previous incident 14 years ago was a DC9 - not that a/c type would've made a lot of difference.
By the way I thought the previous incident 14 years ago was a DC9 - not that a/c type would've made a lot of difference.
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Hows about I liven this subject up a bit.
MIss Behaviour. Why on earth would you remember the 89 Mackay go-round as a 9.
Amos, Kap M et al well remember this incident. It did not help the cause. The crew, at the time quite rightly took the advice of the AFAP to, as Binoculars said 'take the 5th'.
Unfortunately when the pilot group tried to expose the lack of experience and, dare I say it professionalism of the scabs, the bloody media were pointed immediately back to the Mackay go-round and how the piots were being protected by the AFAP.
On Mackay, I don't know. I've gone in there at night at least 30 times. The main worry being the fog that rolls in at about 5am in winter. Obviously, after the original ****-up I I have looked for things that might throw me!
MIss Behaviour. Why on earth would you remember the 89 Mackay go-round as a 9.
Amos, Kap M et al well remember this incident. It did not help the cause. The crew, at the time quite rightly took the advice of the AFAP to, as Binoculars said 'take the 5th'.
Unfortunately when the pilot group tried to expose the lack of experience and, dare I say it professionalism of the scabs, the bloody media were pointed immediately back to the Mackay go-round and how the piots were being protected by the AFAP.
On Mackay, I don't know. I've gone in there at night at least 30 times. The main worry being the fog that rolls in at about 5am in winter. Obviously, after the original ****-up I I have looked for things that might throw me!
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Just for my own interest.........
How bad could this get? Could the aircraft impact light poles or some such thing, before the crew realised (they were lined up on the road)? Or would you get, say, 50' above the poles, then realise, then try and go round? I recognise answers will be speculation, but it appears there may be people qualified to speculate here..............
edited to remove ambiguity
How bad could this get? Could the aircraft impact light poles or some such thing, before the crew realised (they were lined up on the road)? Or would you get, say, 50' above the poles, then realise, then try and go round? I recognise answers will be speculation, but it appears there may be people qualified to speculate here..............
edited to remove ambiguity
Last edited by ferris; 15th Jun 2003 at 18:38.
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Kaptian M, you may remember back in 89 Australia still had its own DME system. The only places that had international DME were international airports. So the last upate for the FMC would have been departing Brisbane.