QF Flight Attendants Strike?
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Kaptin-M - I'll not discuss 89 with you but it appears to me that your comments of 23/2 demonstrate that you are one of the few on prune that actually understands what is going on. I would like to know what the solution is though. Why do airline management always go after crew?I have worked for An and QF and QF has more fat by miles on the ground side.
Evacu8/Ditzyboy. I think pay is really the issue here. The other day I had a junior CSM moaning to me about this and that and when I was informed that this person had a base of 65k and grossing 95k my sympathy was less than aroused. I was too polite to mention that even though I am technically the CSM's superior I actually earn less. Also, I never hear the end of it from F/a's about what pilots earn.
Evacu8/Ditzyboy. I think pay is really the issue here. The other day I had a junior CSM moaning to me about this and that and when I was informed that this person had a base of 65k and grossing 95k my sympathy was less than aroused. I was too polite to mention that even though I am technically the CSM's superior I actually earn less. Also, I never hear the end of it from F/a's about what pilots earn.
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I have only skimmed whats been said so apologies if repeating - but my understanding was that the QF cabin crew already took a wage rise as a trade off for 1 less cabin crew.
The service on most QF internationals is appalling. There are exceptions to this rule of course and those people usually get praised by pax when leaving the a/c - unfortunately these crews are rare - except for the Perth based crews - although as the senior sydney and melbourne people come across the service will no doubt fall). Personally I think if QF cabin crew can negotiate a pay rise then good on them. What i would rather see though is a pay rise and a drastic improvement in service too - after all the pax pay for both service and safety.
What would be nice to see is all of the cabin crew taking pride in their work not just the odd one or two. Its a shame because it is a great job, not exactly hard, and can be fairly rewarding.
The service on most QF internationals is appalling. There are exceptions to this rule of course and those people usually get praised by pax when leaving the a/c - unfortunately these crews are rare - except for the Perth based crews - although as the senior sydney and melbourne people come across the service will no doubt fall). Personally I think if QF cabin crew can negotiate a pay rise then good on them. What i would rather see though is a pay rise and a drastic improvement in service too - after all the pax pay for both service and safety.
What would be nice to see is all of the cabin crew taking pride in their work not just the odd one or two. Its a shame because it is a great job, not exactly hard, and can be fairly rewarding.
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Here we go again now the Cabin Crew are revolting........
If the over paid and under worked want to go on strike well good on them.
They have already had a 3% bonus + an offer of 6% increase and receive a share in employee dividends (3%) whats that 12% , but it isn't enough.
Maybe they will all resign together and let all the unemployed have a job... yep there are a lot of foreigners as well as Aussies out there looking...
Just like the AFAP perfect timing, perfect strategy, perfectly greedy and stupid..
I can see the head lines now ..............
If the over paid and under worked want to go on strike well good on them.
They have already had a 3% bonus + an offer of 6% increase and receive a share in employee dividends (3%) whats that 12% , but it isn't enough.
Maybe they will all resign together and let all the unemployed have a job... yep there are a lot of foreigners as well as Aussies out there looking...
Just like the AFAP perfect timing, perfect strategy, perfectly greedy and stupid..
I can see the head lines now ..............
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To quote Apollo 4 . "Here we go again now the cabin crew are revolting". I could take this somewhere but...... What about flying United on the BOILER RUNS over the pond!!!
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Apollo 4,
I agree with your comments. I have never met, anywhere else in society, a group of people that is paid so far outside their skillset. In a few short weeks, you can transform from a waitress into a cabin crew member who is checked to line (and all without costing you a $). The tragedy is that decisions about industrial action etc are being made by union figures and I am sure that there are many in the cabin crew ranks who did not vote for this (was there a vote at all?). The motives for this action need to be seriously questioned. I am aware of the reasons being stated on this thread but there are other more sensible ways to address them.
LH
I agree with your comments. I have never met, anywhere else in society, a group of people that is paid so far outside their skillset. In a few short weeks, you can transform from a waitress into a cabin crew member who is checked to line (and all without costing you a $). The tragedy is that decisions about industrial action etc are being made by union figures and I am sure that there are many in the cabin crew ranks who did not vote for this (was there a vote at all?). The motives for this action need to be seriously questioned. I am aware of the reasons being stated on this thread but there are other more sensible ways to address them.
LH
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Could not agree more Long Hauler. The Proffesional Skills, cost to own self and wages paid scales do not weigh up at all. There are countless differing professions that require years of training only to be paid less. Is the FAAA is just the dominent lemming leading its mates over the cliff?
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(and all without costing you a $)
But not a patch on the tens of thousands for a seat up the front or the many thousands for the LAME downstairs.
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Perhaps one way of improving service on QF flights and reducing F.A workload is to negotiate a wage decrease so management can hire and therefore allocate more staff per flight.
Two choices here, work your butt of for a fistful of extra dollars or have a more stress free day with a slightly reduced package.
I know what I would rather.
Two choices here, work your butt of for a fistful of extra dollars or have a more stress free day with a slightly reduced package.
I know what I would rather.
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If the vast majority of the Australian public were aware that these F.As were earning roughly 70 - 90K for their declining level of service, don't care attitude and above all, arrogance, they would not have one iota of support. The officials at the FAAA have alot to answer. They should take a good, hard look at themselves and realise that 'glamourous and glorified' days of aviation have gone. It's a business.............................. not a lifestyle provider. My advice .......Wake up and get off your pedistalls otherwise you will be knocked off sooner than you think.
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Eeeeeeeeeeeerm
There is another side to all of this chaps, a private message from a fellow PPRuNer FA, for your information.
There is another side to all of this chaps, a private message from a fellow PPRuNer FA, for your information.
QF FAs Strike Thread
Hello!
Please stop the "QF FAs Strike" thread. It has become a slagging ground for pilots to whinge about FAs.
As an Impulse FA I work VERY hard for my pay and I will not have some two-bit dickless wannabe pilots slagging my colleauges!
QF Long Haul FAs have had years to perfect their conditions and why would they stand back and see them being eroded?! The views of the 'pilots' are not constuctive and at very best poorly informed and narrow minded!
Qantas Long Haul flight attendants have not always had such rosey conditions. None of the posters has stopped to think about the 30 hour duty limits and two days home veryt two months with very little pay (and no trip allowances) that the first Qantas Lomg Haul FAs (stewards) under!
It is disgusting that this thread has been allowed to continue!
Please make the 'pilots' aware that what they have done is not only pathetic but only serves to further the "us and them" attitudes that airline companies have fought so hard to get rid of.
On a final note I'd just like to mention that the FAs on PPRUNE should be commended by not stooping to such low a level by responding to this nonsense! my bolding W
Thank you very much for your time!
Hello!
Please stop the "QF FAs Strike" thread. It has become a slagging ground for pilots to whinge about FAs.
As an Impulse FA I work VERY hard for my pay and I will not have some two-bit dickless wannabe pilots slagging my colleauges!
QF Long Haul FAs have had years to perfect their conditions and why would they stand back and see them being eroded?! The views of the 'pilots' are not constuctive and at very best poorly informed and narrow minded!
Qantas Long Haul flight attendants have not always had such rosey conditions. None of the posters has stopped to think about the 30 hour duty limits and two days home veryt two months with very little pay (and no trip allowances) that the first Qantas Lomg Haul FAs (stewards) under!
It is disgusting that this thread has been allowed to continue!
Please make the 'pilots' aware that what they have done is not only pathetic but only serves to further the "us and them" attitudes that airline companies have fought so hard to get rid of.
On a final note I'd just like to mention that the FAs on PPRUNE should be commended by not stooping to such low a level by responding to this nonsense! my bolding W
Thank you very much for your time!
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Well if the attitude of long haul flight attendants is as it was 20 years or so ago (which I suppose it is considering many are still around) I dont think a terribly large number of long haul flight attendants would call an Impulse FA a colleague, such is their attitude to 'domestic' 'short haul' FAs.
I have seen many times recently where the long haulers just consider themselves to be so superior to 'the rest.'
Then you wonder why it takes them 3-4 times as long to get the cabin ready on the ground....And why it takes up to 21/2hrs to serve a meal to 25 pax....
I have no doubt that short haul FAs work very hard. Multi-sector days on your feet all the time, time pressures etc. I think the long haul operation might just be a tad more relaxed though....There isn't much to do for 8hrs when everyone is sleeping.
I have seen many times recently where the long haulers just consider themselves to be so superior to 'the rest.'
Then you wonder why it takes them 3-4 times as long to get the cabin ready on the ground....And why it takes up to 21/2hrs to serve a meal to 25 pax....
I have no doubt that short haul FAs work very hard. Multi-sector days on your feet all the time, time pressures etc. I think the long haul operation might just be a tad more relaxed though....There isn't much to do for 8hrs when everyone is sleeping.
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The only reason we have not heard from the flight attendants on pprune is because they haven't worked out where it is yet.
Try sorting out a bitch flight between two male flight attendants and a female attendant over who cut whoms grass the night before. Yes these blues do occur, really great for the passengers NOT and enhances harmony and efficiency in the tube NOT....
The irony is that with these interactions the service declines and the pay is expected increase.
I feel very sorry for the minority of great FA's (this means you Vikki, Emma) as I know that you guys are not apart of this obscene grab for cash and run excellent and dedicated crews.
Try sorting out a bitch flight between two male flight attendants and a female attendant over who cut whoms grass the night before. Yes these blues do occur, really great for the passengers NOT and enhances harmony and efficiency in the tube NOT....
The irony is that with these interactions the service declines and the pay is expected increase.
I feel very sorry for the minority of great FA's (this means you Vikki, Emma) as I know that you guys are not apart of this obscene grab for cash and run excellent and dedicated crews.
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Said it before and I'll say it again. Plenty of ex compass, ansett etc cabin crew out there who'd do the job bloody well for a little less dough. They'd never take their job for granted. As one who thought he had a " job for life " , who is now working a lot harder for less bucks , I can assure you that many of the Q.F Cabin Crew I know are well aware of their great conditions and aren't in favour of industrial action. There are others, however, who wouldn't last 5 minutes in a real job and they are the ones that seem to be crying loudest about how bad they have it!
Q.F can go broke , just like any airline in the world. Big profits can turn to big losses very quickly. With the threat of other market entrants with lower cost structures making a move on the aussie market ,and dj slowly but steadily capturing market share the feed trough is no longer guaranteed to be consantly refilled.
Beware and take care, better cop it sweet and give the hand that feeds you a gentle nip instead of biting the whole bloody arm off !
Q.F can go broke , just like any airline in the world. Big profits can turn to big losses very quickly. With the threat of other market entrants with lower cost structures making a move on the aussie market ,and dj slowly but steadily capturing market share the feed trough is no longer guaranteed to be consantly refilled.
Beware and take care, better cop it sweet and give the hand that feeds you a gentle nip instead of biting the whole bloody arm off !
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Sat ABC News Online
Posted: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 17:04 AEDT
Qantas trains strike breakers instead of staff: union
Qantas has confirmed it is training people to work as flight attendants if there is more industrial action by international flight crews.
About 2,000 attendants staged a 14-hour strike last month as part of a 7 per cent pay claim. The Flight Attendants Association hopes to resolve the issue during talks with the airline on Monday.
Johanna Brem from the association says Qantas is wasting money training strike breakers when some of its own staff cannot work because they are unable to update their safety credentials.
"They're training people they actually haven't got a job for and it's particularly vulnerable people - ex-Ansett flight attendants who haven't worked for 14 months," she said.
"Qantas is basically training them up in case they need strike breakers. And our members are at home having no work to do at the moment - and Qantas has to keep paying them, of course."
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Posted: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 17:04 AEDT
Qantas trains strike breakers instead of staff: union
Qantas has confirmed it is training people to work as flight attendants if there is more industrial action by international flight crews.
About 2,000 attendants staged a 14-hour strike last month as part of a 7 per cent pay claim. The Flight Attendants Association hopes to resolve the issue during talks with the airline on Monday.
Johanna Brem from the association says Qantas is wasting money training strike breakers when some of its own staff cannot work because they are unable to update their safety credentials.
"They're training people they actually haven't got a job for and it's particularly vulnerable people - ex-Ansett flight attendants who haven't worked for 14 months," she said.
"Qantas is basically training them up in case they need strike breakers. And our members are at home having no work to do at the moment - and Qantas has to keep paying them, of course."
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O do not pretend to know the in and outs and rights or wrongs of this dispute, I would only ask that you keep it professional and support your fellowaviation professionals when and where it is appropriate without resorting to slagging off or perceived entrenched stereotypes.
They are not the enemy.
If you wish to be respected as pilots then you must respect the other professionals who share the responsibility of delivering your passengers to the other end in one piece and hopefully raring to do it again with your airline.
They are not the enemy.
If you wish to be respected as pilots then you must respect the other professionals who share the responsibility of delivering your passengers to the other end in one piece and hopefully raring to do it again with your airline.
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A lot of people missing the point here.
QF are reneging on an AGREEMENT (seems to be a popular management style lately). An employee group is trying to defend a set of conditions. They deserve support, not denigration.
As an aside- would YOU want to deal with the public? Ever tried it? Smiling and being polite to drunken idiots who deserve a good clip over the ear etc etc. How would you feel if QF reneges on a pilot pay deal? Or brings in strike breakers when the talks break down- oh, that's happened before, hasn't it?
And as for who is worth what; guess what? There are loads of young guys in GA who would climb into a jet for a lot less than the current going rate. Does that make you over paid?
People in glass houses............
QF are reneging on an AGREEMENT (seems to be a popular management style lately). An employee group is trying to defend a set of conditions. They deserve support, not denigration.
As an aside- would YOU want to deal with the public? Ever tried it? Smiling and being polite to drunken idiots who deserve a good clip over the ear etc etc. How would you feel if QF reneges on a pilot pay deal? Or brings in strike breakers when the talks break down- oh, that's happened before, hasn't it?
And as for who is worth what; guess what? There are loads of young guys in GA who would climb into a jet for a lot less than the current going rate. Does that make you over paid?
People in glass houses............