Qantas agrees to Same-Work Same-Pay

[1A_Please]

As well as announcing its financial results today, QAN has announced it will not contest Same-Work Same-Pay claim by short-haul cabin crew. Estimated cost in FY25 is $60M.
ASX Announcement

[dragon man]

WOW,WOW,WOW. Will it apply to pilots that’s the big question? Well done to the FAs.

[gordonfvckingramsay]

Yes, well done to the cabin crew, good to see! It seems to be an admission by QF that the law was going to be applied that way in due course, otherwise they would have spent more time and money trying to have it shot down.

The precedent will have wide ranging effects to the SH agreement and those who follow I think.

[Ollie Onion]

This is a major admission by Qantas, they often fight cases with a dubious defence and spend millions upon millions before settling at the 11th hour.

[BinChook]

This will have a major impact on some QantasLink Jet subsidiaries as well. I believe Network Aviation only have 1 group of Cabin Crew operating on their aircraft but NJS have 3 groups all on different pay structures.

Other then perhaps Business Continuity what’s the point of having multiple subsidiaries if they are not cheaper then Mainline.

[nomess]

New Chair incoming. C Suite are playing the cards carefully.

[Ollie Onion]

Originally Posted by dr dre

With the C/Crew you have the same F/As working on the same aircraft under the same AOC in the same employee structures with multiple permanent (QAL and QD) and casual (MAM and Altara) contracts.

With pilots there is more separation, so SJSP doesn’t apply. A EFA A321 pilot wouldn’t be classified as “same job” as a mainline 321 pilot for example. If there was a situation where a labour hire entity was working alongside a permanent employee getting paid less then it would but the separation within the group is enough for that not to apply,

I believe this has already been looked at by the union lawyers and confirmed to not apply to pilots.

What about Jetstar NZ, same AOC, same Aircraft, same Check and Training and the ability to fly together with Jetstar Australia pilots? Jetstar NZ pilots are employed by a contracting company registered in NZ with the sole purpose of cutting costs out of the Employed by Jetstar EBA pilots.

[LostontheLOC]

Originally Posted by Ollie Onion

What about Jetstar NZ, same AOC, same Aircraft, same Check and Training and the ability to fly together with Jetstar Australia pilots? Jetstar NZ pilots are employed by a contracting company registered in NZ with the sole purpose of cutting costs out of the Employed by Jetstar EBA pilots.

That's where it gets really interesting! the FAA and TWU also applied for Jetstar cabin crew on the same ballot which will condense the 5 contracts into 1 (EBA being the default), this is going to be an interesting turn of events specifically with international crew, operating on a Australian ABN in Australian Aircraft into Australia, its going to be a very interesting run.

Then Aus pilots in NZ, then the difference between NA and Jetstar and everyone else and Mainline - Whatever happens it's going to be interesting and hopefully transparent.

On the bright side, that $500 travel voucher is "MUCH" appreciated.

[JamieMaree]

Originally Posted by dragon man

WOW,WOW,WOW. Will it apply to pilots that’s the big question? Well done to the FAs.

Where exactly do you think it would apply to pilots?

[Global Aviator]

Now watch them try and play a Jetstar International.

Why am I such a cynic?

[grangebackstabber]

Originally Posted by JamieMaree

Where exactly do you think it would apply to pilots?

and this clown turns up again 🙄.
Go post on an engineering forum.
pilots in a very strong position industrially, they just don’t seem to understand that.
IT’S TIME.
Schedule all the management stooges now to down ramp this and sow doubt.

[dragon man]

Originally Posted by JamieMaree

Where exactly do you think it would apply to pilots?

If I knew that answer I wouldn’t have asked the question.

[framer]

Where exactly do you think it would apply to pilots?

I feel like you and I might have had this discussion before
I think that there is uncertainty as to whether or not this would apply to some groups of pilots.
If Commissioners believe the legislation is indeed about ‘closing loopholes’ then their individual interpretations of what constitutes ‘the same job’ and what is or isn’t a labour hire company could go either way.
When determining what is ‘the same job’ they might well ask if QF121 on Friday and QF121 on Saturday are part of the same ‘bundle of work’ ?
If pilot B is expected to deliver the exact same ‘bundle of rights’ on Saturday as pilot A delivered on Friday, in the same machine, to the same exacting standards, after receiving the same training, in the same building, delivered by the same instructor, is pilot B not doing the same job as pilot A?
It will come down to the judicious contemplation of several humans and who knows how that unfolds? Did the commissioner have a satisfying breakfast in the Chairman’s Lounge? or were they delayed 24 hours on their last skiing trip to Queenstown? Are they concerned for the future prospects of their grandchild? or are they disgusted by the lack of moral fibre in todays youth?
Nobody knows just yet, but it sure is interesting.

[grangebackstabber]

Simple. It applies to EVERY subsidiary that has been setup to actively reduce our pay/conditions and divide and conquer.
The legislation was enacted to fight this EXACT behaviour.
Time for AIPA/AFAP to lodge some claims.
JOYCE directly used this **** to threaten us on multiple EBAs, then denied ever doing it.
Directly threatened our careers.
Joyce in a dress proved today nothing has changed.
Time to fix this mess.

[brokenagain]

Joyce in a dress proved today nothing has changed.

Aren’t you ever so thankful towards our esteemed leaders and their generosity in giving us all $500 of staff travel credits though? Such wonderful leadership.

[nomess]

Further proves that the sky high margin targets that Joyce put on each business in 22/23 was only going to be achieved by screwing its employee base over, again and again. Now that is somewhat being unwound, those targets won’t be met, and so they shouldn’t be.

VH dodged questions today and carefully worded those from analysts when asked about those margin targets that so much emphasis was put on in the last two FYs. The reality is, only Jetstar has hit those targets, and you could say that business is still somewhat underinvested in, with sub par wage agreements also in place.

I think it also leans into the point, that Joyce’s whole financial strategy was somewhat unrealistic. It was all about squeeze squeeze squeeze. Hudson is now stuck dealing with the aftermath, not that anyone has any sympathy for her. The margin forecasts he placed on the business might be achievable in loyalty, but the rest was a fantasy, and was only going to be possible with Joyce at the helm doing what he did best, negotiating bottom dollar contracts with suppliers and employees. Zero financial discipline in this business.

[Mr Proach]

Originally Posted by grangebackstabber

Simple. It applies to EVERY subsidiary that has been setup to actively reduce our pay/conditions and divide and conquer.
The legislation was enacted to fight this EXACT behaviour.
Time for AIPA/AFAP to lodge some claims.
JOYCE directly used this **** to threaten us on multiple EBAs, then denied ever doing it.
Directly threatened our careers.
Joyce in a dress proved today nothing has changed.
Time to fix this mess.

Are you a member of AIPA or AFAP?

[ScepticalOptomist]

Originally Posted by Mr Proach

Are you a member of AIPA or AFAP?

AIPA for me, and I agree with grange- time to fix this.

[MikeHatter732]

Originally Posted by dr dre

Errr they have just announced today they will not oppose the C/C union’s SJSP applications instead of opposing it as before. A massive change.

Wow, I guess next week they will announce that they are getting rid of the ridiculous wage policy too hey....

/s

[JamieMaree]

Originally Posted by grangebackstabber

and this clown turns up again 🙄.
Go post on an engineering forum.
pilots in a very strong position industrially, they just don’t seem to understand that.
IT’S TIME.
Schedule all the management stooges now to down ramp this and sow doubt.

Positive comment not.
I think you are GasChamber in drag