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PAE

Old 12th Jun 2021, 04:05
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NSW
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Originally Posted by mates rates View Post
You donít need EDTO for freighter operations
The ETOPS requirement is pretty much the same for all aircraft irrespective of usage as long as its under parts 121 or 135, as noted in the FAA InFO 07004, New ETOPS Regulations:
The new ETOPS rules are now applicable to:

Part 121

ē All two-engine airplanes more than 60 minutes flying time from an adequate airport (at a one-engine-inoperative cruise speed under standard conditions in still air).


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Old 12th Jun 2021, 04:21
  #22 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: australia
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EDTO routes often offer a time advantage, PER-MEL v.v. springs to mind. PAE was doing this for a time for QF but non-EDTO. Was this a possible factor in them losing that work?

I think you’ll find the QF freighters are EDTO as are many other freighters operating in Australia. I can’t see the operators going to that expense if
you don’t need EDTO for freighter operations
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 13:14
  #23 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NSW
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Originally Posted by down3gr33ns View Post
EDTO routes often offer a time advantage, PER-MEL v.v. springs to mind. PAE was doing this for a time for QF but non-EDTO. Was this a possible factor in them losing that work?

I think youíll find the QF freighters are EDTO as are many other freighters operating in Australia. I canít see the operators going to that expense if
A321PF taking over and only three months left to run on contract and out of cash. Airwork took a big look and walked after two weeks
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 13:49
  #24 (permalink)  
 
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The QF A321 isnít doing so great either right now. Not fit for purpose I think. Too fragile an aircraft for a freighter. QF are working their 737-400FíS pretty hard still and Airwork are rumoured to be looking to add more aircraft too.
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Old 13th Jun 2021, 00:15
  #25 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Australia
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Originally Posted by zanthrus View Post
The QF A321 isnít doing so great either right now. Not fit for purpose I think. Too fragile an aircraft for a freighter. QF are working their 737-400FíS pretty hard still and Airwork are rumoured to be looking to add more aircraft too.
Genuine question- What's the difference between freight vs PAX with regards to a "fragile" aircraft? It seems to do less sectors as a Freighter.
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Old 13th Jun 2021, 01:54
  #26 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Originally Posted by 717tech View Post
Genuine question- What's the difference between freight vs PAX with regards to a "fragile" aircraft? It seems to do less sectors as a Freighter.
Well, for starters, there's that big hole cut in the side- This effects the torsional strength of the aircraft and freight conversions often end up with cracking in unexpected places. The lighter the original build, the more susceptible to this. 737 -800 are actually showing fatigue problems the venerable -400 isn't.

Then there's the floor- takes an absolute pounding, so the tougher the original, the less wear and tear on the P2F.

THEN there's the fact they tend to be old airframes. Low utilisation, so using an older, cheaper aircraft makes sense even if it uses more fuel- complex aircraft like A321s have a lot mor gizmos to age and fail at inconvenient times.
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Old 13th Jun 2021, 03:56
  #27 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: brisbane
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Originally Posted by Wizofoz View Post
Well, for starters, there's that big hole cut in the side- This effects the torsional strength of the aircraft and freight conversions often end up with cracking in unexpected places. The lighter the original build, the more susceptible to this. 737 -800 are actually showing fatigue problems the venerable -400 isn't.

Then there's the floor- takes an absolute pounding, so the tougher the original, the less wear and tear on the P2F.

THEN there's the fact they tend to be old airframes. Low utilisation, so using an older, cheaper aircraft makes sense even if it uses more fuel- complex aircraft like A321s have a lot mor gizmos to age and fail at inconvenient times.
The issues encountered with the A321p2f have mainly been standard airbus problems that are encountered weather itís a pax or freighter.
In regards to claims of torsional loads and lighter build compared to others, well those problems manifest after many thousands of hours not just a few months, so time will tell.

I can say that the build quality of the conversion is exceptional as airbus is a risk sharing partner with ST aerospace and wouldnít allow anything less.
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Old 15th Jun 2021, 03:53
  #28 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
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How many people lost their jobs. How many were pilots.
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Old 15th Jun 2021, 07:34
  #29 (permalink)  
ebt
 
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Seems that there is a rush on to replace the previous capacity they had to PNG, Vanuatu and and Solomons using a French-registered A321P2F - https://www.iasc.gov.au/sites/defaul...ds-vanuatu.pdf
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Old 15th Jun 2021, 09:54
  #30 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NSW
Posts: 79
So they want to start in July 2022 and be fully "utilised" by 1 October 2020???

PAE weren't operating a schedule like this at all....
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Old 15th Jun 2021, 10:21
  #31 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NSW
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Same mob: https://seafarersrights.org/wp-conte...S_2002_ENG.pdf
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Old 15th Jun 2021, 21:23
  #32 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: melbourne
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Originally Posted by ebt View Post
Seems that there is a rush on to replace the previous capacity they had to PNG, Vanuatu and and Solomons using a French-registered A321P2F - https://www.iasc.gov.au/sites/defaul...ds-vanuatu.pdf
Is there another 321p2f currently flying?
I was under the impression the qf freight 1 was the 1st 1 to be converted but guessing a few more have been done by now.
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Old 16th Jun 2021, 01:53
  #33 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
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Originally Posted by blubak View Post
Is there another 321p2f currently flying?
I was under the impression the qf freight 1 was the 1st 1 to be converted but guessing a few more have been done by now.
There are currently two companies offering conversions of the A321. ST aerospace in Singapore and also Precision Aircraft in the US, with their recently certified A321pcf.

Both have a number currently in conversion, including an ex JQ aircraft. ST have converted a handful so far that are flying in the US and Europe.
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Old 29th Jun 2021, 04:04
  #34 (permalink)  
ebt
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Perth
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And now Pionair are throwing their hat into the ring, seeking allocations to fly BAe146 freighters to Vanuatu, New Cal, PNG and Solomon Islands: https://www.iasc.gov.au/sites/defaul...-june-2021.pdf.
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