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I don't have a dog in the race but:
What were the alternatives?
Question no one has offered an answer to here. What would have happened if a baby had been discovered in a bathroom at Sydney Airport next to aircraft departing for Doha with mainly Arab passengers? (Or given the world's taboos about offending Muslims, Australian passengers.)
What were the alternatives?
Question no one has offered an answer to here. What would have happened if a baby had been discovered in a bathroom at Sydney Airport next to aircraft departing for Doha with mainly Arab passengers? (Or given the world's taboos about offending Muslims, Australian passengers.)
Sure, you (and anyone else) are free to agree or disagree, that is the nature of debate. However I would take issue with the claim that I "dismiss the whole incident as a trivial matter". I most certainly do not. You will see that primarily I have called for more evidence before reaching a conclusion; but also have sought to consider a balance between the rights of the women in question, versus the rights of the local authorities to investigate a potentially serious crime, which has as its victim one of the most vulnerable people one could care to imagine. Most previous posters seemed to dismiss the latter - I don't.
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I think most men - certainly those in the civilised world would fundamentally disagree with you. I for one would find it utterly repugnant at being forced into such a situation. The fact that you seem to dismiss the whole incident as a trival matter is somewhat concerning.
In an investigation of a serious offence in "Western" countries (of which, one supposes, most of us here are citizens), it is common for people to be arrested, detained for several days, repeatedly questioned, released on bail (with significant restrictions on their liberty), even if they are ultimately not charged with any crime. Do we think the treatment of some passengers on this flight was significantly worse than this?
Common for people to be arrested, detained and questioned for days because a crime happened in their vicinity? Not sure where you live but people being arrested and detained for days on mass in Australia because they were in the vicinity of a crime is not something I’ve seen.
100% agree it’s their country and therefore their laws and customs apply, doesn’t mean we need to accept it.
You will see that primarily I have called for more evidence before reaching a conclusion; but also have sought to consider a balance between the rights of the women in question, versus the rights of the local authorities to investigate a potentially serious crime, which has as its victim one of the most vulnerable people one could care to imagine.
I have read this article, and I don't find anything therein to be particularly shocking.
If there were only 9 female pax on the flight (out of a total of 34 - wow that's a low load factor) and the location of the toilet was such that the person who committed the offence of abandoning the baby almost certainly had to be one of them, then examining them to determine which it was seems reasonable to me.
The fact they did not even tell the women why they were being examined says it all. I guess they considered the 'balance...(of) the rights of the women in question" and decided they had none so it wasn't a consideration.
to diagnose recent childbirth, a visual examination of the external genitalia by a physician should almost certainly be sufficient.
Last edited by Chronic Snoozer; 27th Oct 2020 at 01:45.
I am genuinely shocked at the amount of people who seem to think that being bundled into a locked ambulance and digitally raped is trivial. One woman it happened to said they had their cervixes examined. A pap smear is a painful enough procedure even when you have given your doctor consent, so they would very likely have been restrained with some force..
Personally I never flew Emirates again after my metal implant beeped going into Dubai (having gone through a body scanner prior to the flight I'd just disembarked) and I was taken into a room and strip searched by someone silent covered from head to toe in black while a man with a gun looked on. All they needed to do was a wand and a pat down but they chose to frighten and humiliate me instead.
Presumably due to the current travel restrictions, all the women on the flight would have been Australian?
Personally I never flew Emirates again after my metal implant beeped going into Dubai (having gone through a body scanner prior to the flight I'd just disembarked) and I was taken into a room and strip searched by someone silent covered from head to toe in black while a man with a gun looked on. All they needed to do was a wand and a pat down but they chose to frighten and humiliate me instead.
Presumably due to the current travel restrictions, all the women on the flight would have been Australian?
Last edited by Clare Prop; 27th Oct 2020 at 01:44.
If you've been waiting months to get back to Australia and finally get on a flight, how much choice do you really have?
Oh if course, silly me, by getting on that flight they were obviously asking for it, it’s their fault.
It's their fault for going on a jolly jaunt around the middle east during a pandemic.
Anything else the victims should be blamed for?
It's their fault for going on a jolly jaunt around the middle east during a pandemic.
Anything else the victims should be blamed for?
Last edited by Clare Prop; 27th Oct 2020 at 04:19.
Last time I booked a flight overseas, I never planned to get digitally raped in a locked ambulance on a stopover in a middle eastern country, I planned an few boring hours in an airport terminal, then to board a flight without having my lady bits messed with.
May I ask, how many of you have daughters and wives? Would you be happy for this treatment to them if they had no other choice to get home in the middle of a pandemic?
How dare you victim blame when these women were quite simply trying to get home. You should be ashamed!
May I ask, how many of you have daughters and wives? Would you be happy for this treatment to them if they had no other choice to get home in the middle of a pandemic?
How dare you victim blame when these women were quite simply trying to get home. You should be ashamed!
Last edited by CharlotteAnderson; 27th Oct 2020 at 04:43.
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Last time I booked a flight overseas, I never planned to get digitally raped in a locked ambulance on a stopover in a middle eastern country, I planned an few boring hours in an airport terminal, then to board a flight without having my lady bits messed with.
May I ask, how many of you have daughters and wives? Would you be happy for this treatment to them if they made they had no other choice to get home in the middle of a pandemic?
How dare you victim blame when these women were quite simply trying to get home. You should be ashamed!
May I ask, how many of you have daughters and wives? Would you be happy for this treatment to them if they made they had no other choice to get home in the middle of a pandemic?
How dare you victim blame when these women were quite simply trying to get home. You should be ashamed!
Yes indeed, well said.
How many of you guys would happliy bend over to be digitally raped with no explanation because of the actions of some complete stranger in an airport toilet?
How many of you guys would happliy bend over to be digitally raped with no explanation because of the actions of some complete stranger in an airport toilet?
short flights long nights
Last time I booked a flight overseas, I never planned to get digitally raped in a locked ambulance on a stopover in a middle eastern country, I planned an few boring hours in an airport terminal, then to board a flight without having my lady bits messed with.
May I ask, how many of you have daughters and wives? Would you be happy for this treatment to them if they made they had no other choice to get home in the middle of a pandemic?
How dare you victim blame when these women were quite simply trying to get home. You should be ashamed!
May I ask, how many of you have daughters and wives? Would you be happy for this treatment to them if they made they had no other choice to get home in the middle of a pandemic?
How dare you victim blame when these women were quite simply trying to get home. You should be ashamed!
Very well said.
Also, if these women are passing through a hub and not entering the country, are they still subject to whatever stone age local law says that it is OK to sexually assault women?
Like doing similar searches on young girls at music festivals? No uproar there.
A debate about whether or not it is OK to sexually assault women is pretty unlikely to be polite.
This is comment is plainly factually incorrect. A sexual assault is a crime, an intimate examination carried out (presumably) lawfully for law enforcement reasons, is not.
Sadly, your comment rather proves mine!
Sadly, your comment rather proves mine!