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Qantas mainline brings 717ís in house

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Qantas mainline brings 717ís in house

Old 20th May 2020, 20:25
  #41 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 126
My guess is there will be quite a few redundancies from multiple fleets and ranks within the group. This includes 717/f100/320/380/747. How that is done remains to be seen. Alternatively, expect an indefinite period of stand down....much cheaper.

as far as the 717 being in house, it doesnít really change anything. Your Tís & Cís wonít change, there is no magic path to mainline if thatís what you desire, and itís no more of a threat to sunrise/320 etc than it was or wasnít before. If anything, the company will use the 717 pilots as a threat to network and vice versa.

and as someone said...the bottom of any seniority list at the moment is not somewhere you want to be! Although I fear we may soon find out that in this particular covid world, your position on the seniority list matters not...all that matters is what fleet youíre on.

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Old 20th May 2020, 21:24
  #42 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Australia
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The Question in my mind is who actually owned the 717's and were the lease payments being made or were they out of pocket.
With Qantas taking direct control, payments are now OK and the back room owner is happy again?
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Old 20th May 2020, 22:22
  #43 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by cloudsurfng View Post
My guess is there will be quite a few redundancies from multiple fleets and ranks within the group. This includes 717/f100/320/380/747. How that is done remains to be seen. Alternatively, expect an indefinite period of stand down....much cheaper.

as far as the 717 being in house, it doesnít really change anything. Your Tís & Cís wonít change, there is no magic path to mainline if thatís what you desire, and itís no more of a threat to sunrise/320 etc than it was or wasnít before. If anything, the company will use the 717 pilots as a threat to network and vice versa.

and as someone said...the bottom of any seniority list at the moment is not somewhere you want to be! Although I fear we may soon find out that in this particular covid world, your position on the seniority list matters not...all that matters is what fleet youíre on.
Redundancy off what 320? if you're talking about JQ I very much doubt it, JQ will come back strong over the next 12 months and QF need them to keep any competitor at bay in the leisure market. As for the 717s they have business class? seems like a very good strategic move by AJ as demand for QF seat could be low due to higher cost with the much much cheaper Cobham crew they can still compete in the same market with a 100 seat jet and still offer business class.
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Old 20th May 2020, 22:37
  #44 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Queensland
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Cloudsurfing:
there is no magic path to mainline if thatís what you desire
I doubt that anyone involved on the 717 at Cobham see this as opening a ďmagic pathĒ to mainline. I dare say that there would be a fair percentage of crew on the 717 that actually have no desire to move into mainline as they are happy with the type of flying they are currently doing. Iíd say the majority of crew on the 717 would be more pleased with the fact that they will no longer be working for a contract company and that their future employment appears to now be more secure than being subject to the fear of losing the contract when it comes due.

Mud skipper:
The Question in my mind is who actually owned the 717's and were the lease payments being made or were they out of pocket.
With Qantas taking direct control, payments are now OK and the back room owner is happy again?
Qantas are the owners / lessors of the 717 (about 50% are owned), not Cobham. Cobham handles the crewing of the aircraft, not the ownership or leasing of the aircraft.
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Old 20th May 2020, 22:47
  #45 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Australia
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Good for the QJet Boys and Girls as they won’t be thrown onto the scrap heap.
But seriously everyone, this changes nothing, to anybody. Some 717 drivers can sleep a bit easier but that’s about it. There will be no sudden expansion of the fleet and they aren’t going to use them to fly Sunrise, JQ, project Abracadabra or anything else. Seriously. I would doubt any money was even involved.

Last edited by Chad Gates; 20th May 2020 at 23:06.
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Old 20th May 2020, 23:02
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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Quite a fan of the 717, the 2/3 pax config, quietness especially up front etc.

BUT, my biggest concern is how unreliable they have been during 2018/2019. The cancellations on the east coast were ridiculous, bags always being left behind and the blow back from p*#@ed of punters made it known too. What will be done to ensure better reliability going forward? Itís all well and good these gooses saying ďright route right planeĒ.... but no good when it gets cancelled and everyone get chucked on a 737 6 hours later on a recovery flight.
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Old 20th May 2020, 23:35
  #47 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
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BUT, my biggest concern is how unreliable they have been during 2018/2019. The cancellations on the east coast were ridiculous
Any machine shown enough neglect will fail. Hopefully the 717 passengers will
be shown some respect and these airframes will be maintained as opposed to kept flying, a very big difference.
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Old 21st May 2020, 00:01
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Flava Saver View Post
Quite a fan of the 717, the 2/3 pax config, quietness especially up front etc.

BUT, my biggest concern is how unreliable they have been during 2018/2019. The cancellations on the east coast were ridiculous, bags always being left behind and the blow back from p*#@ed of punters made it known too. What will be done to ensure better reliability going forward? Itís all well and good these gooses saying ďright route right planeĒ.... but no good when it gets cancelled and everyone get chucked on a 737 6 hours later on a recovery flight.
bags being left behind? If that happens, itís due to baggage handling issues not weight restrictions.

as for unreliable, QF werenít providing adequate engineering/spare parts. If that doesnít change then I expect reliability wonít change.
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Old 21st May 2020, 00:17
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Capt Fathom View Post
Maybe theyíll call it Impulse Airlines!
Impulse purchase, more like!
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Old 21st May 2020, 00:27
  #50 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 1998
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Alliance next? Nothing like a Qantas monopoly for Virgin Mk II to compete with.
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Old 21st May 2020, 00:31
  #51 (permalink)  
 
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Ex 'neville...':
'Any idea what the big picture is here??'
Broadening the base, tooling up to go after the feed-in/thinner end of the market/traffic.....??? as mentioned by 'B772'.

Extract here (my bolding):
The B717s provide us with [the] flexibility to service many segments of the domestic market, including regional routes, fly in fly out operations or more frequencies to capital cities. These are the kind of routes where travel demand is likely to recover first [from the COVID-19 pandemic]," he said.
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Old 21st May 2020, 00:36
  #52 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
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Expect more mainline routes for the 717 until the pax numbers get back to some sort of normality
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Old 21st May 2020, 00:40
  #53 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by RENURPP View Post
bags being left behind? If that happens, itís due to baggage handling issues not weight restrictions.
Well Qantas ground staff must be lying to the public then. AND to the staff travellers that get bumped off on flight close out when thereís been in excess of 15 spare seats. Happened on multiple multiple occasions with friends and family I know of. I assume thereís plenty more that have been affected as well.
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Old 21st May 2020, 00:52
  #54 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Chad Gates View Post
Seriously. I would doubt any money was even involved.
It would be interesting to know who instigated the deal - was it a case of the new Cobham management (the old CEO departed very soon after Advent's takeover) saying to QF "we want out of this" and QF taking the opportunity?
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Old 21st May 2020, 00:57
  #55 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
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Originally Posted by Asturias56 View Post
It's good news for the drivers but it really is a pretty grim aircraft - the design is well over 50 years old and so there's only a couple of Operators left - I don't think they have much passenger appeal TBH
I think you will surprised. The 3/2 setup is popular with pax and offers a wider seat. The reality is no one want to sit in the middle seat.... no one!

Strategically smart to bring the operation in house. With Delta disposing of their 717s now would be the time to buy say 50 dirt cheap frames. Expand with another 20 and park the other 30 in the desert, now you have cheap spares for the next 15 years.
Make network all 320 and retire the F100 as the 717 can now do the work. Divest in alliance as the accc was never going to let them take control anyway.
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Old 21st May 2020, 01:19
  #56 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
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Originally Posted by Flava Saver View Post
Well Qantas ground staff must be lying to the public then. AND to the staff travellers that get bumped off on flight close out when thereís been in excess of 15 spare seats. Happened on multiple multiple occasions with friends and family I know of. I assume thereís plenty more that have been affected as well.
Which locations did this occur at? Canberra in summer is about the only place where this is likely to happen but not as often as you suggest. I can attest to the fact that the 717 crews have been very accommodating to QF staff travellers with jumpseat travel always being available when the cabin is full.
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Old 21st May 2020, 01:29
  #57 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
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Not trying to detail the thread here, but what aircraft has a better business case between the F100 and 717? I'm curious because I have no idea were people are getting the idea the 717 will replace the network F100s from.
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Old 21st May 2020, 01:36
  #58 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
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When the 71 was introduced at NJS, at some of the North WA strips in summer it was basically an 80 seater, but I wouldn't have thought that would be the case on the east coast (pretty rare)
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Old 21st May 2020, 01:54
  #59 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
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Originally Posted by Flava Saver View Post
Well Qantas ground staff must be lying to the public then. AND to the staff travellers that get bumped off on flight close out when thereís been in excess of 15 spare seats. Happened on multiple multiple occasions with friends and family I know of. I assume thereís plenty more that have been affected as well.
all I can say is that some one is stretching the truth.
All 717s on the east coast have the engines converted (chip changed basically) every summer which means no significant restrictions on weight. Maybe they bulk out on occasions, but gee that would be rare and I canít imagine it happening on Canberra Brisbane sectors. The pax mainly carry briefcases.
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Old 21st May 2020, 02:25
  #60 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by f1yhigh View Post
Not trying to detail the thread here, but what aircraft has a better business case between the F100 and 717? I'm curious because I have no idea were people are getting the idea the 717 will replace the network F100s from.
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