Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Worldwide > Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific
Reload this Page >

Clifford gone/ Goyder Next Chairman

Wikiposts
Search
Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific Airline and RPT Rumours & News in Australia, enZed and the Pacific

Clifford gone/ Goyder Next Chairman

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 25th Oct 2018, 10:23
  #101 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 642
Received 19 Likes on 5 Posts
I think Keg was referring to the junior 744 SOs.

Anyway, it’s going to be an interesting process.
ruprecht is offline  
Old 25th Oct 2018, 13:10
  #102 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: australia
Posts: 70
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Can you displace another from an aircraft already declared to be in surplus?
almostthere! is offline  
Old 25th Oct 2018, 14:03
  #103 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 617
Received 153 Likes on 48 Posts
bullcrap! Most of the long time s/o’s Are highly experienced and would be offended by your concerns! I am. Pull your head in.
goose1, rather than being offended why don’t you articulate what part of my post was “bullcrap”?

Are we to assume that you were such a good pilot when you joined that a 15 year break from takeoffs and landings will not in anyway have dulled your skills? Well good for you. I wish I could say the same but my extended stay in the back seat made my promotional training harder than it otherwise would have been and I have been glad for the many sectors since then to get back up to speed.
Beer Baron is offline  
Old 25th Oct 2018, 14:24
  #104 (permalink)  
Keg

Nunc est bibendum
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 5,583
Received 11 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally Posted by almostthere!
Can you displace another from an aircraft already declared to be in surplus?
Yes. RM 18.1.12.e.(iii). The EA makes no distinction as to where you can displace to or whether the category you’re displacing has been declared surplus.

You may be thinking of the return from LWOP provision (Scedule 1,Part C) which talks about not coming back to a category in surplus. So a pilot returning from LWOP is unable to go to (say) F/O 744 even if their seniority would permit it if it creates a surplus.
Keg is offline  
Old 25th Oct 2018, 19:42
  #105 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: sydney
Posts: 19
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by Beer Baron

goose1, rather than being offended why don’t you articulate what part of my post was “bullcrap”?

Are we to assume that you were such a good pilot when you joined that a 15 year break from takeoffs and landings will not in anyway have dulled your skills? Well good for you. I wish I could say the same but my extended stay in the back seat made my promotional training harder than it otherwise would have been and I have been glad for the many sectors since then to get back up to speed.
ok, your reference to take off and landing! And, that vertical promotion is a threat!
the main area that diminishes is in flight management ( if you allow yourself to get a bit lazy)!
a focused mindset and normal training (which has improved immensely in QF) is all you need for a successful transition!

In my opinion it would be a good thing to once again allow vertical promotion as there are a lot of highly experienced people who have been Rinned or held back due to their own circumstances, and would find it a refreshing change to be able to move to their desired position without arbitrary obstacles in the way.
goose1 is offline  
Old 25th Oct 2018, 20:39
  #106 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Beer Baron

goose1, rather than being offended why don’t you articulate what part of my post was “bullcrap”?

Are we to assume that you were such a good pilot when you joined that a 15 year break from takeoffs and landings will not in anyway have dulled your skills? Well good for you. I wish I could say the same but my extended stay in the back seat made my promotional training harder than it otherwise would have been and I have been glad for the many sectors since then to get back up to speed.
How is it possible that the words ‘pilot’ and ‘15 year break from takeoffs and landings’ are even in the same sentence? Rediculous!
jetlikespeeds is offline  
Old 25th Oct 2018, 21:06
  #107 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 642
Received 19 Likes on 5 Posts
Originally Posted by jetlikespeeds


How is it possible that the words ‘pilot’ and ‘15 year break from takeoffs and landings’ are even in the same sentence? Rediculous!






You managed it.

In short, the answer is:
  • Nil recruiting for a long while.
  • Seniority, which leads to:
  • Lifestyle, and
  • Money


ruprecht is offline  
Old 25th Oct 2018, 21:41
  #108 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 273
Received 39 Likes on 9 Posts
The mere existence of the position of SO in modern airlines is to me just another mechanism for the airline to not to have to pay one other experienced aviator on the flight deck a decent salary. What a crock.
ramble on is offline  
Old 26th Oct 2018, 01:04
  #109 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Sydney
Age: 60
Posts: 1,542
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by yy16
With all the talk of RIN, what if Qantas puts all the new 787s in Sydney, turn around and say no reduction in numbers, here are the redeployment vacancies you can bid for, what happens then? Cause that seems a lot cheaper than doing all these extra training courses.
I hear what you say, and Qantas would love that - but what if nobody bids for that redeployment? 😛
Tankengine is offline  
Old 26th Oct 2018, 01:16
  #110 (permalink)  
Keg

Nunc est bibendum
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 5,583
Received 11 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally Posted by yy16
With all the talk of RIN, what if Qantas puts all the new 787s in Sydney, turn around and say no reduction in numbers, here are the redeployment vacancies you can bid for, what happens then? Cause that seems a lot cheaper than doing all these extra training courses.
You can only offer redeployment positions as part of a RIN.

If what youre saying is that Qantas simply advertises the 787 slots and says nothing to the 744 drivers then they’ll still need to eventually do a RIN. The 744 drivers are under no compulsion to bid for those slots- and why would they given they’d go to year 1 pay when they can wait for the RIN and go to year 4 pay.

The real question is how do you keep flying 4-6 744s until the end of 2020 whilst simultaneously taking delivery of the last of the 787s? One way is to run divisors on the 787 and A380 close to maximum in the lead up to the 744 retirement so that RIN’d 744 drivers then retraining to those types don’t create too much of a surplus. I suspect more likely is additional 787 orders for arrival from late 2020 through 2021 on which the now surplus 744 drivers can go to. Some will obviously still exercise their right to displace to the A380.
Keg is offline  
Old 26th Oct 2018, 03:00
  #111 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Europe
Posts: 1,674
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Back on topic.

Has the AGM seen off the toxic dinosaur?
Were there marching bands, balloons and white doves?
Rated De is offline  
Old 26th Oct 2018, 05:43
  #112 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 356
Received 115 Likes on 46 Posts
Wink

Were there marching bands, balloons and white doves?
There was a protest crowd out the back of the Hilton but that was a group opposed to Qantas carrying passengers to and from detention centres or back from whence they came (I think), not celebrating or lamenting Leigh's departure.
There was a small gathering of shareholders (many in dual roles as interested employees) at the AGM. Alan thanked Leigh for his service to which not all those present responded with a rousing ovation.
C441 is offline  
Old 26th Oct 2018, 07:52
  #113 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Europe
Posts: 1,674
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
There was a small gathering of shareholders (many in dual roles as interested employees) at the AGM. Alan thanked Leigh for his service to which not all those present responded with a rousing ovation.
Good riddance.

For a business that requires a lot of people all working together to deliver customers safely, the choice of Mr Clifford was odd.
Paradoxically, if the intent were to deceive the wider populous with the erroneous narrative of 'terminal decline' whilst simultaneously running a divisive and destructive anti employee model, then he was the perfect relic.

Perhaps, long suffering Qantas staff can dare hope for something better.
What is for certain, is Mr Clifford is just another footnote in the dustbin of history.
Rated De is offline  
Old 26th Oct 2018, 11:47
  #114 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 617
Received 153 Likes on 48 Posts
a focused mindset and normal training (which has improved immensely in QF) is all you need for a successful transition!

In my opinion it would be a good thing to once again allow vertical promotion as there are a lot of highly experienced people who have been Rinned
Well given the current high rate of SO->A330 FO training failures it would appear that the normal training is not quite cutting it.

On the subject of rinned pilots, they are not effected by vertical promotion restrictions. The TCAM states; To be​ eligible​ for the​ rank​ of​ A380,​ B747​ or B787​ First​ Officer, the​ pilot​ must​ have​ operated as​ a ​First​ Officer on another Company​ aircraft​ e.g. B737​ or​ A330.​ ​
So if they have been demoted from FO previously then they will not be prevented from promoting to the 787,747 or 380.
Beer Baron is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.