Jetstar Chief Pilot gets the Axe
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Australia
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There are many, many airlines in China, so tarring them all with the same brush is ridiculous. You wouldn't claim that every airline in Australia is the same, would you?
It is also interesting to see the CAAC at work, compared to CASA. They are far more proactive. They hand out massive penalties to airlines, not just in the millions of $, but also restrict expansion for x years or put other limits on a company in response to safety issues. I get the impression that the airline management have a real fear of the CAAC and do everything they can to make sure the operation is safe and by the book.
The amount of flying in China is extraordinary, the sheer number of people is amazing. It's a fascinating place to live and work.
No thanks, I think I've got a better understanding than you do. Your attempt to derail an interesting discussion is not really helpful.
Some posters here indicate the recent CP was attempting to change/improve the culture at JQ. If so, I applaud her efforts. I wish everyone at JQ the best and I hope things improve.
It's very hard to change a company's culture. Look at EK, probably the same or a little worse than 20 years ago. Or CX, same comment. I don't know what JQ is like today, maybe it's exceptional.
Everyone has their limits. I reached mine and left.
Last edited by FlareArmed2; 29th Sep 2017 at 00:41. Reason: Added some more info on working in China
Didn't say it was better than Australia, I said it was better than JQ
It is not just the airline you need to look at but the country you live and work in, which makes up the overall package.
I sense you have deep resentment towards JQ. (as per your original post)
JQ is nothing as bad as some of those stories in the book "Flying Upside down".
Keep on dreaming mate.
Last edited by John Citizen; 29th Sep 2017 at 00:45.
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Southern Sun
Posts: 417
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
JC; you really do need to get out and explore the `Real' world a great deal more.
You will find, to start with,progressive countries actually building things, many modern things not a country stagnating with old, very old, inadequate, crumbling infrastructure,
Countries when, where they build a freeway it is 6, 8 0r 10 lanes designed for the future not taking 50/60 years to build it as did the link Melbourne to Sydney to Brisbane with each other. Not talking about building a second airport for Sydney for 50 years that I am aware of. (have they actually started yet? HKG demolished a mountain, built a magnificent suspension bridge with freeway and a very good new airport in what 6 years?).
China has rebuilt many, many modern cities over the last 10- 15 years. The Emirates have rebuilt and built many modern cities with full infrastructure over the last 20 years.
Many, many countries have modern high speed railways over long distance Russia; Moscow- Leningrad 400 miles - 2 hours. The last rail project of note here under PM John Howard was Alice Springs Darwin furthermore under time, under budget.
Nuclear, low emission coal fired power stations supplying reliable, high quality electricity for progress, new modern industries whilst we blow ours up.
Australian lifestyle - under very, very serious attack deteriorating at an alarming pace; competent English speaking with an increasing number of interpreters available, increasing number of different language shop signs and attendants; `competent English speaking Australian ATC' - good reason to suggest the competency is questionable and not necessarily better than many, many overseas countries.
The competency of CASA, Airservices and ATSB, particularly CASA is highly questionable.
Yes, great weather and it was a great place to live however, should not get of our tails and protect it, correct the path we are headed on, the overall package is not looking that great.
You will find, to start with,progressive countries actually building things, many modern things not a country stagnating with old, very old, inadequate, crumbling infrastructure,
Countries when, where they build a freeway it is 6, 8 0r 10 lanes designed for the future not taking 50/60 years to build it as did the link Melbourne to Sydney to Brisbane with each other. Not talking about building a second airport for Sydney for 50 years that I am aware of. (have they actually started yet? HKG demolished a mountain, built a magnificent suspension bridge with freeway and a very good new airport in what 6 years?).
China has rebuilt many, many modern cities over the last 10- 15 years. The Emirates have rebuilt and built many modern cities with full infrastructure over the last 20 years.
Many, many countries have modern high speed railways over long distance Russia; Moscow- Leningrad 400 miles - 2 hours. The last rail project of note here under PM John Howard was Alice Springs Darwin furthermore under time, under budget.
Nuclear, low emission coal fired power stations supplying reliable, high quality electricity for progress, new modern industries whilst we blow ours up.
Australian lifestyle - under very, very serious attack deteriorating at an alarming pace; competent English speaking with an increasing number of interpreters available, increasing number of different language shop signs and attendants; `competent English speaking Australian ATC' - good reason to suggest the competency is questionable and not necessarily better than many, many overseas countries.
The competency of CASA, Airservices and ATSB, particularly CASA is highly questionable.
and everything else
I've flown Airbus for over 20 years. The aircraft procedures were in constant evolution. We were taught at the early stages to fly the aircraft as you would say a Boeing 727. So coming around the corner, high on slope, guess what? There was no "Airbus" procedure for intercept from above. You actually had a number of intuitive options or common sense procedural options.
Easiest option being, turn off the FD's, fly the aircraft onto the ILS and reinstate the automatics. If I did that today I'd be labelled a cowboy but that said, I do have the skills to swing from different modes of automation without the confusion plaguing the children of the magenta line ( which can actually be an old Boeing guy on an Airbus ).
In this instance, a decade later Airbus, came up with a cumbersome intercept from above procedure that sadly, many pilots are still making a mess off- set the alt above current, pannickly pull ALT thinking they'll idle onto the G/S but vrrrooom up comes the power and away we go. Funnily enough Sunfish, I can recover that situation within 2s from a disorientated PF but I guess that's a non-standard SOP or non- approved Airbus technique! Now I'm potentially in the situation of a high energy GA, which again has no SOP nor Airbus approved technique and just for emphasis, Airbus has had three + hull losses in high energy Go Arounds. I could go on about this but let's just say, even Airbus has decided that the old Ansett techniques of training from basic jet ( we started on Links ) and building automation through the course delivers a pilot product who is less vulnerable to mode confusions that you can not write a procedure for.
Procedures evolved from crashes or near crashes, all the while new software turns up without explanation.
People ( like you in you ) want a procedure written for everything. Because its a lot easier than producing rounded and experienced aviators. Then these same people who bureaucratize flying to the extent elemental skills and airmanship are second fiddle to cumbersome manuals, have big opinions on disasters such as AF.
Last edited by Gnadenburg; 30th Sep 2017 at 05:05.
There were a couple of good blokes that suffered as a consequence but it had to happen,
I’m sorry but anybody, good bloke or not who gets a management position to bypass where seniority would dictate they can be knows the risks associated with it. All management positions are transitory and the seniority position will dictate where you end up in the end.
Look left, sadly that is the risk you run when you enter a seniority based airline and take a Management job or Checking Position which affords a base and rank out of seniority. When the wheels stop then you may find yourself having to slot back in where your number allows you, I didn't mean that safety was 'better' as such but that we had made good progress from MM going nuts at every incident and summoning crew to head office for a bollocking followed by 2 sims, 10 sectors line training and a check to line even if the event was something along the lines of not having the right document on the aircraft. I think Georgina has started us off done a good path and as you say there are some top and obvious candidates for the job, whether any of them get it remains to be seen. I think that as the Cheif Pilot is meant to be the 'pilots' rep at management level the Company should produce a short list of 3 or 4 candidates and then the pilot group should be balloted to select the person who gets the job :-)
Last edited by Ollie Onion; 29th Sep 2017 at 06:57. Reason: Ss
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: deutschland
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The A320 training and culture is a throwback to Ansett 1980 - lots of little 'local' SOPs and procedures that aren't actually applicable to the current variant of the aircraft operated by the carrier......
It's bullsh!t
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think it's a given (well to most in here anyway) that the orange cancer airline is a basket case with an unhealthy core, probably the same could be said for another LCC in Oz who go from one disaster to another! Welcome to Australia !
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: aus
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I will give GS a little empathy. She had ideas and was willing to challenge the status quo. However, there is a big difference between having the ideas and the ability to drive a team in executing them successfully. I hope she has realised, a little too late, that you need the people around you. Those that challenge your own ideas and preconceptions can create extremely positive outcomes, and to do that you need to be a communicator. That, too be frank, was the downfall. It needed to be more than lip service.
Last edited by Bula; 30th Sep 2017 at 05:50.
