MERGED: Alan's still not happy......
Routes within or connected to China will experience the single greatest overall passenger growth,
So AJ:
- will you replace the daily Shanghai A330 flights with an A380 to get into this growth?
- or will you simply give the route to JQ?
So AJ:
- will you replace the daily Shanghai A330 flights with an A380 to get into this growth?
- or will you simply give the route to JQ?
The United States will remain the largest single market for domestic travellers
So AJ:
- If the JQ franchise/methodology is so great, have you spoken to your North American partner AA about introducing the same into that market?
- Or have they just and got on with running their airline?
So AJ:
- If the JQ franchise/methodology is so great, have you spoken to your North American partner AA about introducing the same into that market?
- Or have they just and got on with running their airline?
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Australia
Posts: 222
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Routes within or connected to China will experience the single greatest overall passenger growth,
So AJ:
- will you replace the daily Shanghai A330 flights with an A380 to get into this growth?
- or will you simply give the route to JQ?
So AJ:
- will you replace the daily Shanghai A330 flights with an A380 to get into this growth?
- or will you simply give the route to JQ?
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: ...second left, past the lights.
Posts: 1,101
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
...just quietly...
I sense another edition of
maybe in order... plenty of fodder.
So let me ask a devils advocate question to you all.
And I'm not trolling you - I'm dead serious.
For a sec - forget Joyce and co.
If pilots, flighties, LAMES and the rest of the whole workforce were all put on JQ Ts and Cs tomorrow - what would happen to the airline's cost base and operations?
And I'm not trolling you - I'm dead serious.
For a sec - forget Joyce and co.
If pilots, flighties, LAMES and the rest of the whole workforce were all put on JQ Ts and Cs tomorrow - what would happen to the airline's cost base and operations?
.....HK, JP, AU aircraft lease, set-up costs
The list goes on
And this list will become evident if the receivers are brought in that's for sure. Then there will be a lot of explaining to do
The list goes on
And this list will become evident if the receivers are brought in that's for sure. Then there will be a lot of explaining to do
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: here and there
Posts: 82
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
For the 4 millionth time, QF's current predicament has ZERO to do with the pay and conditions of the pilots, Engineers, CC etc!!!!
Comments like yours tartare show why management can feed such crap to the Press and get Johnny Public to believe it.
Comments like yours tartare show why management can feed such crap to the Press and get Johnny Public to believe it.
Almost a billon dollars down the jetstar ego driven black hole.
Mainline shrunk to non existence
Frequency/timing of remaining routes cut such as to almost guarantee failure
Lockout
Treating staff like dirt
No investment in fuel saving aircraft for longhaul
ABSOLUTELY ZERO TO DO WITH STAFF COSTS
Mainline shrunk to non existence
Frequency/timing of remaining routes cut such as to almost guarantee failure
Lockout
Treating staff like dirt
No investment in fuel saving aircraft for longhaul
ABSOLUTELY ZERO TO DO WITH STAFF COSTS
For the 4 millionth time, QF's current predicament has ZERO to do with the pay and conditions of the pilots, Engineers, CC etc!!!!
Comments like yours tartare show why management can feed such crap to the Press and get Johnny Public to believe it.
Comments like yours tartare show why management can feed such crap to the Press and get Johnny Public to believe it.
GM is overhauling its international businesses, with the company announcing last week that it will ditch Chevy to focus on Opel and Vauxhall vehicles in Europe, reversing a decade-old strategy. In August, the company separated its China operations and is currently assessing its options for its Holden Australian unit.
“GM has been struggling to find out the best way to improve productivity and profitability of its units in Europe, namely Opel and Vauxhall,” said Shin Chung Kwan, an auto analyst at KB Investment & Securities in Seoul. “The next logical thing for GM would be to transfer the Chevys produced in South Korea to other markets like Australia if it decides to shut its Holden unit down.”
GM Korea’s labor union opposed GM’s decision, saying the company “deceived” workers by announcing the pull out plans without negotiations, the union said on its website. The guild pledged to gain support from Korea Development Bank, GM Korea’s second largest shareholder, and the Korean government to maintain job security at GM Korea, according to the statement.
GM doesn’t currently have plans to cut jobs in relation to the production cuts, Park said.
The Wall Street Journal earlier reported that GM plans to close its 2 Australian plants. George Svigos, a spokesman for GM’s Holden unit in Australia, declined to comment. Park at GM Korea declined to comment whether a closure in Australia could lead to more exports to the country from South Korea.
GM Korea’s labor union opposed GM’s decision, saying the company “deceived” workers by announcing the pull out plans without negotiations, the union said on its website. The guild pledged to gain support from Korea Development Bank, GM Korea’s second largest shareholder, and the Korean government to maintain job security at GM Korea, according to the statement.
GM doesn’t currently have plans to cut jobs in relation to the production cuts, Park said.
The Wall Street Journal earlier reported that GM plans to close its 2 Australian plants. George Svigos, a spokesman for GM’s Holden unit in Australia, declined to comment. Park at GM Korea declined to comment whether a closure in Australia could lead to more exports to the country from South Korea.
We can't ever forget that what QANTAS love to do is support 'experts' like the WA guru who, supports QANTAS in return. Just like the ABC News business reporter who you can hear on 'Talking Business' on Ch 3 or 11 inflight. Like who provides the Inflight News Channel? That would be Ch 9 and you won't hear Ross Greenwood or 60 Minutes ever being critical of QANTAS.
It comes back to what ramius315 said.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 186
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tool time.....
So let me ask a devils advocate question to you all.
And I'm not trolling you - I'm dead serious.
And I'm not trolling you - I'm dead serious.
What sort of a lead in is that, even if you really wanted to know.....
Last edited by Acute Instinct; 12th Dec 2013 at 05:31.
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Brisbane
Age: 77
Posts: 1,406
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I feel it is just a sign of the times, cannot watch the horse racing without seeing the Emirates Melbourne Cup, turn over and watch the golf, get the Emirates Australian Open, with so much money behind them it is only a matter of time before we have the Emirates Australian Airline, the Flying Kangaroo.
Man you Guys are rough.
Tartare asked a legitimate question. For all you know he was hoping that the answer would highlight the fact that terms and conditions of employees are not a major factor. Changing to Jetstar conditions would reduce the operating costs, the question was by how much? No matter what the answer it doesn't offset the lousy decisions made at top level, and no matter what the answer it doesn't't warrant typically Occa responses like
We're our own worst enemy sometimes.
Tartare asked a legitimate question. For all you know he was hoping that the answer would highlight the fact that terms and conditions of employees are not a major factor. Changing to Jetstar conditions would reduce the operating costs, the question was by how much? No matter what the answer it doesn't offset the lousy decisions made at top level, and no matter what the answer it doesn't't warrant typically Occa responses like
Allow me to be dead serious.....you sound like a complete tool,
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: south pacific vagrant
Posts: 1,334
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
operating costs
had the jq cp in the jumpseat once, about 18 months ago
he said they ran the qf and jq pilots contracts in to the computer once to find the difference for the jq 330 schedule as it was then
the qf contract was about a 1/3rd dearer. not necessarily on salary, but mostly because of all the conditions.
for what its worth.
he said they ran the qf and jq pilots contracts in to the computer once to find the difference for the jq 330 schedule as it was then
the qf contract was about a 1/3rd dearer. not necessarily on salary, but mostly because of all the conditions.
for what its worth.
Tks Waren9
Framer, you get told something that is a complete lie by everyone from the CEO to idiot journo's who lecture about being 'competitive' with no understanding of the issues, over 15+ years and yes, you do take it very personally.
Framer, you get told something that is a complete lie by everyone from the CEO to idiot journo's who lecture about being 'competitive' with no understanding of the issues, over 15+ years and yes, you do take it very personally.
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: I prefer to remain north of a direct line BNE-ADL
Age: 49
Posts: 1,286
Likes: 0
Received 33 Likes
on
10 Posts
The problem is in the myriad of behind the scenes office staff and middle managers, that is QF's achilles heel when it comes to costs. I am not saying you dont need them at all but the number per airframe at QF is horrendous compared to nearly every other Airline Globally.. Operational staff per aircraft is relatively efficient globally. I have seen the numbers a while back but cant find a source atm.
Thank you Framer.
Acute instinct... shaking my head... have you been breathing in too much beryllium dust in the machine shop mate?
Warren - this is what I suspect.
I did a lot of modelling of pilots T's and C's at TE - and some big picture stuff - looking at common rating across different jets and what it might mean in future.
They are thinking really radical stuff - and poor old QF can't get past union squabbles.
Angle - I suspect you're right too.
And yes, I think there have been some lousy decisions made at the top.
One of the most gob-smackingly stupid ones was cancelling the 787 order.
Acute instinct... shaking my head... have you been breathing in too much beryllium dust in the machine shop mate?
Warren - this is what I suspect.
I did a lot of modelling of pilots T's and C's at TE - and some big picture stuff - looking at common rating across different jets and what it might mean in future.
They are thinking really radical stuff - and poor old QF can't get past union squabbles.
Angle - I suspect you're right too.
And yes, I think there have been some lousy decisions made at the top.
One of the most gob-smackingly stupid ones was cancelling the 787 order.
Tartare, I was reading with interest to see the answer to your question.
Why QANTAS is in this predicament at all is a completely different question and there are plenty of opinions on here about that already. Personally I believe that Joyce took a 90 m head start in a 100m race and still appears to be losing by about 20m.
Asking about which would be cheaper is not a statement or suggestion that you have an opinion either way. It is a question with a factual answer. In my experience people only respond so aggressively (without addressing the question at hand) if the answer makes them uncomfortable.
I have also got a growing perception that what helps the company keep labour costs down is much less about the basic pay figure as it is about how much flexibility they retain to manage the roster as they see fit.
Why QANTAS is in this predicament at all is a completely different question and there are plenty of opinions on here about that already. Personally I believe that Joyce took a 90 m head start in a 100m race and still appears to be losing by about 20m.
Asking about which would be cheaper is not a statement or suggestion that you have an opinion either way. It is a question with a factual answer. In my experience people only respond so aggressively (without addressing the question at hand) if the answer makes them uncomfortable.
I have also got a growing perception that what helps the company keep labour costs down is much less about the basic pay figure as it is about how much flexibility they retain to manage the roster as they see fit.
Framer, you get told something that is a complete lie by everyone from the CEO to idiot journo's who lecture about being 'competitive' with no understanding of the issues, over 15+ years and yes, you do take it very personally.
This whole fan dangled inter web forum thing is just a bar room conversation to me and if Accute Instinct called Tartare a tool while we were all standing around having a beer when Tartare had asked a legit question I would pull him up on it, so I do the same here. That's all.
Have fun, Framer
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Next to Bay 8
Posts: 247
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Would cutting QF staff salaries down to JQ levels make a difference? Yes.
Would it save the Qantas Group? No.
I can't recall where i've read the data but the industry average for PILOT wages at legacy carriers is around 3% of airline operating costs (I'm sure someone will have the hard figures). The data I saw showed that Qantas was within 1% of this. One must remember that Qantas pilot salaries look high partly due to the Aussie dollar and Aussie income tax rates. As i understand it, Qantas pilot take-home pay when compared to other European, Asian and Middle Eastern carriers (not to mention contract work) is fairly comparable.
Obviously the company would save money by reducing these wages, but at least from a pilots standpoint, it'd make very little difference to overall operating costs, especially when compared to the cost of having a handful of Jetstar HK A320s sitting around in Toulouse not flying. Or the money wasted on RedQ. Or the money wasted starting up and running JQ Intl/Asia/Pacific/HK Or the cost of board/exec/manager bonuses and payouts for idiotic business decisions.
Qantas is still a GIANT beurocratic wheel... nobody wants to make a decision for fear of reprisal. It's like any other big former gov't organisation... people just want an easy sucure job to go to and do as little work as possible and keep their heads down.
Would it save the Qantas Group? No.
I can't recall where i've read the data but the industry average for PILOT wages at legacy carriers is around 3% of airline operating costs (I'm sure someone will have the hard figures). The data I saw showed that Qantas was within 1% of this. One must remember that Qantas pilot salaries look high partly due to the Aussie dollar and Aussie income tax rates. As i understand it, Qantas pilot take-home pay when compared to other European, Asian and Middle Eastern carriers (not to mention contract work) is fairly comparable.
Obviously the company would save money by reducing these wages, but at least from a pilots standpoint, it'd make very little difference to overall operating costs, especially when compared to the cost of having a handful of Jetstar HK A320s sitting around in Toulouse not flying. Or the money wasted on RedQ. Or the money wasted starting up and running JQ Intl/Asia/Pacific/HK Or the cost of board/exec/manager bonuses and payouts for idiotic business decisions.
Qantas is still a GIANT beurocratic wheel... nobody wants to make a decision for fear of reprisal. It's like any other big former gov't organisation... people just want an easy sucure job to go to and do as little work as possible and keep their heads down.