World's best airline named as Qantas plummets in rankings
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Originally Posted by Fliegenmong
I refuse to patronise Jokestar, the last time I had to back about 2006?? There was Domino Pizza advertising on the overhead lockersis it still like that? Cos I have not been back since that BS!!!
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Ahem. JetStar only beat AirAsiaX and Tiger Australia in Australia/Pacific. BUT AirAsia and AirAsiaX both beat JetStar Asia, in the Asia section. Therefore JetStar really only beat Tiger Australia and the AirAsiaX services to and from Oz. They must be so proud.
B F D.
B F D.
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Well, as billyt suggests, in so far as "business accumen" is concerned, it is the passengers opinion that counts. So here are the results of a recent mini - survey (which isn't as corrupt as the Skytrax one):
Which airline do you prefer?:
Qantas 12%
Virgin Aust 9%
Tiger 2%
Jetcancer 0%
World's best airlines 2012 | Skytrax awards | Qantas plummets
Now given that this is not a scientific poll, perhaps we should allow a 50% error rate. 50% of 0% is, wait for it, 0%!!!!!
The public speak! Jetcancer is so seriously detested that 0% voted for them. How do you feel, Jetstar? Onya! Bwahahaha....
Which airline do you prefer?:
Qantas 12%
Virgin Aust 9%
Tiger 2%
Jetcancer 0%
World's best airlines 2012 | Skytrax awards | Qantas plummets
Now given that this is not a scientific poll, perhaps we should allow a 50% error rate. 50% of 0% is, wait for it, 0%!!!!!
The public speak! Jetcancer is so seriously detested that 0% voted for them. How do you feel, Jetstar? Onya! Bwahahaha....
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I may have (or may not have) demonstrated a limited business acumen, but I have also demonstrated my choice as a customer. 
In August Mrs Fliegs and I will head up to Vietnam......now through Singas, I can get a full service connection with VN 3 hrs after arrival as opposed to waiting until next day (Think accomm, transfers meals etc) to fly with J* to save 100 bucks, and to likely be bombarded with advertising...and supposedly buy a muffin or two
(but I won't save a hundred bucks, I still need accomm, transfers meals etc.)
Tell ya something about advertising, aside from the sublime or very funny.....I hate it.....I cannot tell you how much I hate it, and when it is plastered to the lids of the overhead bins....I ain't coming back, by choice!
Oh and my J* research was done after I'd already booked VN! Much to my merriment & mirth it turned out financially I was better off doing as I did and not even entertaining J*
So you can take your overhead bin advertising....just as I do mostly with commercial TV and get.....over it! Channel 9, The Australian Newspaper editorial, Dominos Pizza Advertising on J* Overhead Bins, this broadcast bought to you by....etc etc ...........You've lost me for good, years ago...
In August Mrs Fliegs and I will head up to Vietnam......now through Singas, I can get a full service connection with VN 3 hrs after arrival as opposed to waiting until next day (Think accomm, transfers meals etc) to fly with J* to save 100 bucks, and to likely be bombarded with advertising...and supposedly buy a muffin or two
(but I won't save a hundred bucks, I still need accomm, transfers meals etc.) Tell ya something about advertising, aside from the sublime or very funny.....I hate it.....I cannot tell you how much I hate it, and when it is plastered to the lids of the overhead bins....I ain't coming back, by choice!
Oh and my J* research was done after I'd already booked VN! Much to my merriment & mirth it turned out financially I was better off doing as I did and not even entertaining J*
So you can take your overhead bin advertising....just as I do mostly with commercial TV and get.....over it! Channel 9, The Australian Newspaper editorial, Dominos Pizza Advertising on J* Overhead Bins, this broadcast bought to you by....etc etc ...........You've lost me for good, years ago...
Last edited by Fliegenmong; 15th Jul 2012 at 10:39.
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These results are shameful.
What's taken 70 odd years to elevate one of the world's most recognised brands has now been savagely mauled. Bar very few, if you've been senior management or on the boards in the last 20 years you have a lot to be ashamed about.
Personal power plays and vested interests have infected this company. No rational, corporate mind could ever be convinced that a total shutdown of operations would be the start of a turn around in industrial relations.
Here we are, months later, with a collapsing share price, continued massive ill feeling within staff, appalling marketing strategies and a barely retained BBB credit rating. And there's more failure to come. The next rating review will decimate the credit watch.
Really, how & where would you start with a serious Qantas recovery?
For mine, clear out this board. From there, backed with an intelligent board of business minds who live for the challenge of winning in business AND do not need the glory of a board position (ala Herb Keleher/ Gordon Bethune et al) replace the current CEO with someone who builds winning, competitive cultures. The current guy - not a prayer of doing that.
Next, accept airlines ARE NOT cash cows. They're not in the league of super funds, iron ore mines or pharmaceutical giants. They can't consistently make huge profits. They can & should, however be profitable. At the same time, forget the 'return on assets' metric - it doesn't fit in aviation. Even the banks only wheel it out when they need to defend record profits and consumer criticism.
It would be fair to argue aviation is closer to farming than those industries mentioned above. In such instances, you look back over 10+ years to really assess if you've made money, all the while never spending the takings of a good season in one go!
This is such a hugely infected, flailing monstrosity & it will take enormous will by shareholders, a new board and a new management team/ CEO to turn it around. What's for sure is the current team will lead the on going failure no matter what strategy they choose to employ. Pay them off, see them to the door & start again.
What's taken 70 odd years to elevate one of the world's most recognised brands has now been savagely mauled. Bar very few, if you've been senior management or on the boards in the last 20 years you have a lot to be ashamed about.
Personal power plays and vested interests have infected this company. No rational, corporate mind could ever be convinced that a total shutdown of operations would be the start of a turn around in industrial relations.
Here we are, months later, with a collapsing share price, continued massive ill feeling within staff, appalling marketing strategies and a barely retained BBB credit rating. And there's more failure to come. The next rating review will decimate the credit watch.
Really, how & where would you start with a serious Qantas recovery?
For mine, clear out this board. From there, backed with an intelligent board of business minds who live for the challenge of winning in business AND do not need the glory of a board position (ala Herb Keleher/ Gordon Bethune et al) replace the current CEO with someone who builds winning, competitive cultures. The current guy - not a prayer of doing that.
Next, accept airlines ARE NOT cash cows. They're not in the league of super funds, iron ore mines or pharmaceutical giants. They can't consistently make huge profits. They can & should, however be profitable. At the same time, forget the 'return on assets' metric - it doesn't fit in aviation. Even the banks only wheel it out when they need to defend record profits and consumer criticism.
It would be fair to argue aviation is closer to farming than those industries mentioned above. In such instances, you look back over 10+ years to really assess if you've made money, all the while never spending the takings of a good season in one go!
This is such a hugely infected, flailing monstrosity & it will take enormous will by shareholders, a new board and a new management team/ CEO to turn it around. What's for sure is the current team will lead the on going failure no matter what strategy they choose to employ. Pay them off, see them to the door & start again.
short flights long nights
Perfect post null. Defcon, my vote is on agenda
. Defcon, my vote is on agenda
The state of Qantas lays firmly at the feet of one useless man, namely the CEO. He is doing his best to run it down and break it as he wants JetStar to do well as JetStar was his project and being his project, he still wants to see it do well at the cost of seeing Qantas run into the ground.
I fly Qantas an awful lot and have no problem with them ,the staff are helpful and try there best with what they have. Shame on you Mr Joyce, if yo don't want the job, give it to someone who cares
ITI
I fly Qantas an awful lot and have no problem with them ,the staff are helpful and try there best with what they have. Shame on you Mr Joyce, if yo don't want the job, give it to someone who cares
ITI
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That external advertising generates pure revenue straight to the bottom line.
Considerably critical since yield alone does not deliver sufficient returns.
For it is only ancillary revenue that keeps most LCC's out of the red.
The consumer drives this result by demanding low fares. It is a virtuous circle.
Jetstar are not the first nor the last to capture this revenue stream.
And really - the consumer could not care less what the exterior of the aircraft looks like.
12M pax forecast for FY13 certainly proves this...
Regardless of what the "haters" on this board say - the consumer has voted through their patronage on-board.
It is that simple...
Considerably critical since yield alone does not deliver sufficient returns.
For it is only ancillary revenue that keeps most LCC's out of the red.
The consumer drives this result by demanding low fares. It is a virtuous circle.
Jetstar are not the first nor the last to capture this revenue stream.
And really - the consumer could not care less what the exterior of the aircraft looks like.
12M pax forecast for FY13 certainly proves this...
Regardless of what the "haters" on this board say - the consumer has voted through their patronage on-board.
It is that simple...
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Broad Statement T_Vasis
Regardless of what the "haters" on this board say - the consumer has voted through their patronage on-board.
Thats a very broad statement...you need to qualify the deomographic of the Jestar traveller...many have bought a mainline ticket and been shunted onto the subsidiary and yet are counted in the Jestar figures.Many prefer the full service of a legacy carrier and are prepared to pay for it.Why else would Virgin Australia be in the ascendancy.Yes it is not strictly a legacy carrier but since it has gone up market the high yield traveller has followed it.Many pax may use Jestar once but won't back up for a second journey
Thats a very broad statement...you need to qualify the deomographic of the Jestar traveller...many have bought a mainline ticket and been shunted onto the subsidiary and yet are counted in the Jestar figures.Many prefer the full service of a legacy carrier and are prepared to pay for it.Why else would Virgin Australia be in the ascendancy.Yes it is not strictly a legacy carrier but since it has gone up market the high yield traveller has followed it.Many pax may use Jestar once but won't back up for a second journey
Last edited by surfside6; 16th Jul 2012 at 09:08.
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Very easy Surfside 6 - the demographic is predominately leisure.
In addition - the price sensitive consumer.
I disagree with your "shunted" comments. You can't book Jetstar domestic flights on Qantas.com - you're directed to Jetstar's website.
The consumer is specifically seeking out travel on Jetstar - why - because they are price sensitive. That's the primary driver.
The airline continues to see exponential growth.
Jetstar is a market leader in RPK's against any LCC in the Asia | Pacific region - yet commenced operations some 3 or 4 years after the likes of Air Asia | Tiger Airways etc.
If consumers are not returning - that's not reflective of traffic stats.
I don't disagree Virgin is improving its market position - it damn well should. The company has invested heavily in product.
Your comment that customers use Jetstar once and never again, is simply fantasy. If that was the case - they'd be a decline, not incline in growth.
Tiger is an excellent example of how the dollar drives the decision.
The airline was grounded by our regulator - Tiger received damaging press - yet, continues to be able to sell tickets and fill planes. You would think on the basis go your thinking that no one would fly Tiger again out of a simple fear of safety... Yet, that is just not the case.
The consumer does not care, for if they did - Tiger would not be operating today...
In addition - the price sensitive consumer.
I disagree with your "shunted" comments. You can't book Jetstar domestic flights on Qantas.com - you're directed to Jetstar's website.
The consumer is specifically seeking out travel on Jetstar - why - because they are price sensitive. That's the primary driver.
The airline continues to see exponential growth.
Jetstar is a market leader in RPK's against any LCC in the Asia | Pacific region - yet commenced operations some 3 or 4 years after the likes of Air Asia | Tiger Airways etc.
If consumers are not returning - that's not reflective of traffic stats.
I don't disagree Virgin is improving its market position - it damn well should. The company has invested heavily in product.
Your comment that customers use Jetstar once and never again, is simply fantasy. If that was the case - they'd be a decline, not incline in growth.
Tiger is an excellent example of how the dollar drives the decision.
The airline was grounded by our regulator - Tiger received damaging press - yet, continues to be able to sell tickets and fill planes. You would think on the basis go your thinking that no one would fly Tiger again out of a simple fear of safety... Yet, that is just not the case.
The consumer does not care, for if they did - Tiger would not be operating today...
Last edited by PPRuNeUser0198; 16th Jul 2012 at 10:59.
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Many pax may use Jestar once but won't back up for a second journey
Which is what I was saying......and what I do, despite my apparent lack of business acumen...
Your comment that customers use Jetstar once and never again, is simply fantasy. If that was the case - they'd be a decline, not incline in growth.
I used them once, and never again, and as already outlined I am better off on a full service carrier, I may even be so fanciful to entertain 'Red Q' for intra Asia travel....if that little folly ever comes to pass.....
Meanwhile..... I'll enjoy full service carriers at competitive prices to the Orange star.......
Which is what I was saying......and what I do, despite my apparent lack of business acumen...
Your comment that customers use Jetstar once and never again, is simply fantasy. If that was the case - they'd be a decline, not incline in growth.
I used them once, and never again, and as already outlined I am better off on a full service carrier, I may even be so fanciful to entertain 'Red Q' for intra Asia travel....if that little folly ever comes to pass.....
Meanwhile..... I'll enjoy full service carriers at competitive prices to the Orange star.......
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What on earth are you rabbiting on about Fliegenmong, I fly JQ at least twice a month, I have never seen a ad of any description, and the star class on the A330 leaves QF for dead. Hating them mate ain't going to make them go away, they serve a purpose, its time QF blokes realise they are here to stay, they are popular with the public, the staff on the domestic runs do a good job, ditto the international, and life goes on. I hated QF knocking of TAA and now its QF's turn to feel the screws. Nobody wants QF to go least of all me, but unless someone can turn it around its heading for the knackery.
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There is not a single aircraft in Jetstar's fleet today with an overhead advert. The only advertising is in the magazine and they promote a charity on the PA. They do have a few logo jets though (quicksilver, nrl team etc..)
Qantas really need to do something about replacing those old B767s. I flew business SYD MEL recently and I'd say it was a waste of someone else's money. I guess the crew were good, but should one really pay $1K for a big seat (that doesn't really recline), a projection screen with about 3 pixels, and someone else choosing the channel? I'd rather have flown economy on an A330.