Pac Blue operating Oz Domestic
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Will Virgin Australia pilots be making the following PA:
Ladies and gentlemen, this is (insert rank and name), together with (all participating crew) may I briefly have your attention.
On behalf of all Virgin Australia pilots we would like to thank you for choosing to fly with Virgin Australia. We are proud of our profession and our airline and trust you will support us in keeping Virgin Australia pilots in Virgin Australia aircraft and ensuring our great iconic airline remains uniquely Australian.
For more information and to register your support, please make your next destination virginaustraliapilots.com.au
Thank you.
The red ties probably aren't a great idea as everyone would mistake them for a flight attendant.
Ladies and gentlemen, this is (insert rank and name), together with (all participating crew) may I briefly have your attention.
On behalf of all Virgin Australia pilots we would like to thank you for choosing to fly with Virgin Australia. We are proud of our profession and our airline and trust you will support us in keeping Virgin Australia pilots in Virgin Australia aircraft and ensuring our great iconic airline remains uniquely Australian.
For more information and to register your support, please make your next destination virginaustraliapilots.com.au
Thank you.
The red ties probably aren't a great idea as everyone would mistake them for a flight attendant.
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I do not work for VB but observe:
1. QF is in industrial turmoil that will continue for many months. eg A look at the kangaroo route for today 28th shows over 200 empty seats on all sectors via Singapore.
2. VB has a golden opportunity with its rebranding and #1 above to make substantial inroads into:
a. market share (nick pax off QF)
b. improve yield management
by increasing frequency on key routes
3. JB has a reputation as a manager etc that those of Irish stock can but dream of.
How about ya let the bloke do his job (manage the f#$king company) while you do your job (fly the f#king pax safely from A to B).
The ability or otherwise of Virgin in the short term (at one of the busiest times of the year) to capture disgruntled QF customers will pay dividends for a LONG, LONG time and will invariably lead to MANY. MANY progression opportunities for all staff in the new year and beyond. Right seat to left seat, little plane to big plane etc
Run the figures on a 5 or 10 percent increase in market share. You will experience it if you allow a tactical strike for a longer term strategic advantage
Not too long ago VB could have laid off about 60-70 pilots. They chose to keep them on and bear the cost. Now is the time for the pilot group to return the favour and cut the man some slack.
1. QF is in industrial turmoil that will continue for many months. eg A look at the kangaroo route for today 28th shows over 200 empty seats on all sectors via Singapore.
2. VB has a golden opportunity with its rebranding and #1 above to make substantial inroads into:
a. market share (nick pax off QF)
b. improve yield management
by increasing frequency on key routes
3. JB has a reputation as a manager etc that those of Irish stock can but dream of.
How about ya let the bloke do his job (manage the f#$king company) while you do your job (fly the f#king pax safely from A to B).
The ability or otherwise of Virgin in the short term (at one of the busiest times of the year) to capture disgruntled QF customers will pay dividends for a LONG, LONG time and will invariably lead to MANY. MANY progression opportunities for all staff in the new year and beyond. Right seat to left seat, little plane to big plane etc
Run the figures on a 5 or 10 percent increase in market share. You will experience it if you allow a tactical strike for a longer term strategic advantage
Not too long ago VB could have laid off about 60-70 pilots. They chose to keep them on and bear the cost. Now is the time for the pilot group to return the favour and cut the man some slack.
Last edited by drop bear ten; 28th Oct 2011 at 23:12.
Many years ago Ansett ordered 6 x B737-500's for Ansett NZ as a replacement for the B737-100's. The intention was to operate the B737-500's domestically in NZ, Trans Tasman and some domestic services in Aust. This was to obtain sufficient round the clock utilisation to make the aircraft viable.
When it became obvious the (AFAP) pilots were not going to agree to the proposal the B737-500 order was cancelled and BAe146's were ordered instead with the a/c going into service in July 1989.
History can repeat itself.
When it became obvious the (AFAP) pilots were not going to agree to the proposal the B737-500 order was cancelled and BAe146's were ordered instead with the a/c going into service in July 1989.
History can repeat itself.
How about the employees of a company support their employer for once. Recognise that this a Golden opportunity for the airlines to grown and expand, ultimately make more profits and secure your job.
DJ 737,
Fundamentally, quite correct, under the TTMR Treaty.
In addition, it would be quite possible to bring in other aircraft, foreign registered and crewed, and operate on the Virgin AOC, as QF did (Canadian, as I recall) during the Ansett end game..
It seems to me that, industrially, Virgin management have done everything right, in contrast to the QF approach.
Tootle pip!!
Fundamentally, quite correct, under the TTMR Treaty.
In addition, it would be quite possible to bring in other aircraft, foreign registered and crewed, and operate on the Virgin AOC, as QF did (Canadian, as I recall) during the Ansett end game..
It seems to me that, industrially, Virgin management have done everything right, in contrast to the QF approach.
Tootle pip!!
While I don't have an opinion either way about JB. I think he's probably a good bloke, but he was in Qantas during the implementation of a lot of the businesses that are causing the mainline pilots so many sleepless nights now.
Be very careful guys. Thats what we did. And look at us now.
How about ya let the bloke do his job (manage the f#$king company) while you do your job (fly the f#king pax safely from A to B).
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Clearly Virgin need another aircraft here. It makes sense to pick one out of another part of the "network" rather than lease from overseas, especially if it's a short term lease.
The question I have (I don't know the answer but maybe someone in the know will) is can the Aus crews legally fly a ZK registered aircraft if they don't hold a NZ licence? I don't believe they can. (Even if you are to convert under the TTMRA it takes a few weeks for the licence to come through... they need aircraft and crew now, not in a few weeks)
I know there are a lot of NZ licence holders flying for Virgin but if they are already allocated in crewing, perhaps the only way to make it work in the short term is to use a NZ rego'd aircraft and NZ crews.
I'd give it a few weeks before crying foul on this one!
EDIT: Now that QF has pulled the pin from Monday might I suggest that there wll be more than one PB aircraft flying around...
The question I have (I don't know the answer but maybe someone in the know will) is can the Aus crews legally fly a ZK registered aircraft if they don't hold a NZ licence? I don't believe they can. (Even if you are to convert under the TTMRA it takes a few weeks for the licence to come through... they need aircraft and crew now, not in a few weeks)
I know there are a lot of NZ licence holders flying for Virgin but if they are already allocated in crewing, perhaps the only way to make it work in the short term is to use a NZ rego'd aircraft and NZ crews.
I'd give it a few weeks before crying foul on this one!
EDIT: Now that QF has pulled the pin from Monday might I suggest that there wll be more than one PB aircraft flying around...
Last edited by Nose wheel first; 29th Oct 2011 at 07:00.
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It does not seem that long ago that VB pilots where weathing out the GFC flying for PB. I was lucky enough to fly with some of those guys in NZ and found them to be humble, professional and down right good blokes (can only remember flying with one ********). No one at PB seemed to care because it was helping secure their company’s future. The same is true of the current Qantas situation. It is a once in a life time opportunity for JB. While on a personal level I feel for all those involved at Qantas. Clinically there is a short but definite window of opportunity for Virgin Australia to increase its market share.
Please comment on the following.
1-As I understand the PB pilots will be given additional cash over and above their nz money so they are not undercutting us in Australia. In fact if you factor in accommodation and travel they probably cost the company more than Australian labour.
2-The PB pilots are being instructed by their union that its ok to apply for the short term Australian domestic work.
3-The PB pilots are being told the Australian unions are aware and understanding of the limited Oz domestic flying
4-As nose wheel first has mentioned the need for additional aircraft is now, and the paperwork required to allow Australian crew to operate ZK aircraft will take a while. Waiting for this will cause the company to miss the window of opportunity.
5-Some of the whining on this tread is being written by people who do not appreciate the magnitude of what is going on in the marketplace, or do no care about anything other than when their command is coming up. Some of you have been flying red jets for less time than PB crew.
I’ve had many a beer with PB/VB/Voz pilots on overnights. One thing that seems to set us apart from our institutionalised mates from other airlines is that we generally get on.. Yep sometimes the gap in pay, conditions, lifestyles and promotions can cause interesting discussions, but I’ve never seen an argument. Generally we respect each other, and acknowledge we work for the same group. What is good for the group is good for us under our current management. Provided there is no undercutting and this PB domestic thing is short term and good for the broader company I don’t see a problem.
Please comment on the following.
1-As I understand the PB pilots will be given additional cash over and above their nz money so they are not undercutting us in Australia. In fact if you factor in accommodation and travel they probably cost the company more than Australian labour.
2-The PB pilots are being instructed by their union that its ok to apply for the short term Australian domestic work.
3-The PB pilots are being told the Australian unions are aware and understanding of the limited Oz domestic flying
4-As nose wheel first has mentioned the need for additional aircraft is now, and the paperwork required to allow Australian crew to operate ZK aircraft will take a while. Waiting for this will cause the company to miss the window of opportunity.
5-Some of the whining on this tread is being written by people who do not appreciate the magnitude of what is going on in the marketplace, or do no care about anything other than when their command is coming up. Some of you have been flying red jets for less time than PB crew.
I’ve had many a beer with PB/VB/Voz pilots on overnights. One thing that seems to set us apart from our institutionalised mates from other airlines is that we generally get on.. Yep sometimes the gap in pay, conditions, lifestyles and promotions can cause interesting discussions, but I’ve never seen an argument. Generally we respect each other, and acknowledge we work for the same group. What is good for the group is good for us under our current management. Provided there is no undercutting and this PB domestic thing is short term and good for the broader company I don’t see a problem.
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Even if the QF thing were to be resolved today, the forward bookings that will flow to VB will be a boost for months to come. Other than cost, the other reason people choose a particular carrier is certainty of schedule.
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Other than cost, the other reason people choose a particular carrier is certainty of schedule.
Suggest also that they also choose a carrier because of bad experiences with another. In this case abandoning loyal business, families and high frequency travellers offshore will not be forgotten in a hurry.
Would not also underestimate the anger of the politicians on this one.
The only thing that may save the Brand damage is the collective heads of the Chairman and the CEO both publicly on display on regulatory poles.
Suggest also that they also choose a carrier because of bad experiences with another. In this case abandoning loyal business, families and high frequency travellers offshore will not be forgotten in a hurry.
Would not also underestimate the anger of the politicians on this one.
The only thing that may save the Brand damage is the collective heads of the Chairman and the CEO both publicly on display on regulatory poles.
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I had also herd that the pb crew were told that the aust unions were ok with the flying.
You must also remember that pb operated the bali flights and dempasar flights...Now the vb crew do them, did the pb crew moan that aussies were taking their flying ? Also havent the honiara flights been taken from pb and given to the vb crews, do you hear the moaning ? no...
The problem is, that some idiots on here hide behind the mask of a private identity and slag everyone. Aussies are very pro australia( and that is a very good thing) but they are also really great at pointing the finger at "scabs" but rember that the 89ers also went and flooded the market in other countries and took jobs from locals, as they did in nz at the start of the pb days...
pb now has alot of ausies flying for them I hear but apparently they get along well with each other, as should you guys. The greater good of Virgin as a company should be the number one priority. JB has done an excellent job thus far and taking advantage of qantas screw-ups will increase their market share dramaticly.
I guess if you work for virgin and you have an issue with the arrangement then take it up with the man who sent the email out, dont hide behind the mask. Or stand up and say F#$k Yeah, virgin is an awesome company and we are going to be the national carrier of australia, I guess the intergration of the co's is eventually on the cards but I hope that if I get the chance to work for V that the crews on both sides of the tasman are able to get along not back stab and bitch like little girls.
Maybe those on here that are doing the pointing are small minded "gen y's" that stand there with their hand out or think they work for a great company by right.
Standing by, but Always Inverted.
You must also remember that pb operated the bali flights and dempasar flights...Now the vb crew do them, did the pb crew moan that aussies were taking their flying ? Also havent the honiara flights been taken from pb and given to the vb crews, do you hear the moaning ? no...
The problem is, that some idiots on here hide behind the mask of a private identity and slag everyone. Aussies are very pro australia( and that is a very good thing) but they are also really great at pointing the finger at "scabs" but rember that the 89ers also went and flooded the market in other countries and took jobs from locals, as they did in nz at the start of the pb days...
pb now has alot of ausies flying for them I hear but apparently they get along well with each other, as should you guys. The greater good of Virgin as a company should be the number one priority. JB has done an excellent job thus far and taking advantage of qantas screw-ups will increase their market share dramaticly.
I guess if you work for virgin and you have an issue with the arrangement then take it up with the man who sent the email out, dont hide behind the mask. Or stand up and say F#$k Yeah, virgin is an awesome company and we are going to be the national carrier of australia, I guess the intergration of the co's is eventually on the cards but I hope that if I get the chance to work for V that the crews on both sides of the tasman are able to get along not back stab and bitch like little girls.
Maybe those on here that are doing the pointing are small minded "gen y's" that stand there with their hand out or think they work for a great company by right.
Standing by, but Always Inverted.
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Who cares, it's going to contribute to the bottom line, period... Pax don't care what the plane has painted on it, they buy a Virgin ticket, it is Virgin. I'm all up for the temp messure JB has put in place, PB guys are welcome if the T&C are topped up to DOM-EBA. This is all about bums on seats, simple. That why a VA B777 will operate SYD-MEL-SYD in the morning to assist in getting people to the Melbourne cup. First 777 to operate domestically in Australia
First 777 to operate domestically in Australia
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Careful Voz1, you just stated that it is alright for foreign crews to operate each others sectors as long as it helps the companies bottom line and is done on local terms and conditions. I have heard that line many times from my boss who goes by the name BRUCE. Allowing the kiwis to operate in Australia 'could' be the start of a slippery slope.