Qantas Pilots, You Are Losing The Battle.
Wanting a different industrial model does not necessarily equate to wanting a fight to achieve it. Blind Freddie can see they want a different model, hence the action by QF pilots. They will be closer to achieving it if there is a 'no' vote rather than a fight.
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Sorry guys,as smart as you think you are,QF Management want this fight and that should set off warning bell's(Head Master).
Any way, he insisted and and I ended up punching the sh!t out of him. He was wearing white shorts under his school clothes because he had sport on that day. I gained a reputation that day when everybody saw the blood on his shorts. The usual suspects at school left me alone from that day.
There's a moral in that story:
Somebody picking a fight that they thought they could win.
A reluctant dood standing up for himself.
A win where it wasn't expected.
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If you have a doctor's certificate you are UNTOUCHABLE. FACT.
There are a whole range of options that can be applied, normally it's just not worth the trouble.
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To Every Complicated Problem There Is A Simple Solution , Sadly That Is Often The Wrong Solution ! AIPA are not Stupid ! This campaign has been carefully constructed over more than 12 months . No One is advocating any rouge or unreasonable action . There is no correlation between PIA and the 89 pilots dispute . Anyone who thinks there is has absolutely no understanding of the current Australian industrial landscape. To date .. pilots 6 claims on the table of which all are negotiable ... company 64 claims . To this date only one of the pilots claims have even been discussed ( loss of licence ) . At the latest pilots forum The Qantas Chief "Pilot" claimed he believed AIPA was looking for an arbitrated position . An arbitrated position is one that is handed down in FWA ( Fair Work Australia ) . It is what is considered fair and reasonable under current Australian law. So he believes the pilots are after a fair and reasonable outcome . Obviously he is unable to personally negotiate that position because of the brief given to him by his puppet masters . Upper management of Qantas need to go .. for the sake of the airlines future.
As a reasonably long term QF driver I can only reiterate what others have said. Hopefully we have the right strategies in place. If we don't then we will find out. I do not see that win lose or draw we have anything much to really lose. Management is appalling - incompetent and appalling.
If we don't do anything and just give in it will be a matter of time before the place is destroyed in an epic struggle to give AJ a bigger collection of personal toys than Geoff Dixon's extremely impressive one. In fairness to AJ, he faces a massive task - he is not a large man and the high jump bar is VERY high.
Interestingly it appears that Qf's negotiating team did not have a goal they had to achieve in our EBA discussions. If I heard (from a couple of third hand sources) correctly, then this fact flies in the face of all I have learnt about QF management style. The answer to the AIPA question 'What do you want from us?' was met with blank stares. When PIA was mentioned the response was (again third hand) very benign.
I simply cannot believe a politically very important negotiation was left to the sanctioned and very formal group of Qf negotiators without any bonuses involved for successful outcomes.
I have heard mention that Qf travel agents were notified last year that industrial action may commence this Sept.
AJ in the meantime has been making extremely inflammatory and downright incorrect comments about his staff to all and sundry.
Qf is apparently outsourcing staff through companies financed (if not part owned) by previous CEO's.
Lets not forget that these previous CEO's were very nearly personally responsible for the destruction of Qantas through the APA bid. In politics, does that type of deal not lead to the term 'treason' with revolution and guillotines a likely outcome?
The Senate committee has unearthed some simply staggering goings on at QF/JQ management and regulatory fines have been levied by various bodies in the recent past.
Artificially shifting money from QF to JQ and back again to 'prove' some sort of viability is unbelievable. Either someone did it to boost a share price/local portfolio in order to get a bonus or it was to prove a point - with management knowledge. Either way, doesn't that type of behaviour represent corporate fraud/stock manipulation of a major Australian listed company?
There is clear evidence of operational 'issues' that even 10 years ago just did not happen. 15 years ago these would have been inconceivable.
Though not on the same scale this type of behaviour is almost carbon copy Enron stuff. You know - the power company where the directors got sent to jail for little things like 'allowing' their outsourced traders to 'close' power stations down at peak periods so they could artificially boost power prices and make profits and bonuses?
I might be wrong but it seems AJ et al are moving towards some form of Air-Enron.
What surprises me most is that the unions are immediately boxed into a discussion about paltry dollars and allocations of unsold empty seats rather than the big corporate governance questions that seem to be stumbled upon but not given the time of day.
Is this dispute using pilots/engineers/long term staff as a sideline while the real game is being played? Are the 'kamikaze' unionists performing the role of ASIC (the SEC in the US)?
Surely there is a journalist with clout out there who understands these issues and can follow up on this trail of increasing numbers of very serious allegations. From where I am sitting, there are plenty of places to start looking...
If we don't do anything and just give in it will be a matter of time before the place is destroyed in an epic struggle to give AJ a bigger collection of personal toys than Geoff Dixon's extremely impressive one. In fairness to AJ, he faces a massive task - he is not a large man and the high jump bar is VERY high.
Interestingly it appears that Qf's negotiating team did not have a goal they had to achieve in our EBA discussions. If I heard (from a couple of third hand sources) correctly, then this fact flies in the face of all I have learnt about QF management style. The answer to the AIPA question 'What do you want from us?' was met with blank stares. When PIA was mentioned the response was (again third hand) very benign.
I simply cannot believe a politically very important negotiation was left to the sanctioned and very formal group of Qf negotiators without any bonuses involved for successful outcomes.
I have heard mention that Qf travel agents were notified last year that industrial action may commence this Sept.
AJ in the meantime has been making extremely inflammatory and downright incorrect comments about his staff to all and sundry.
Qf is apparently outsourcing staff through companies financed (if not part owned) by previous CEO's.
Lets not forget that these previous CEO's were very nearly personally responsible for the destruction of Qantas through the APA bid. In politics, does that type of deal not lead to the term 'treason' with revolution and guillotines a likely outcome?
The Senate committee has unearthed some simply staggering goings on at QF/JQ management and regulatory fines have been levied by various bodies in the recent past.
Artificially shifting money from QF to JQ and back again to 'prove' some sort of viability is unbelievable. Either someone did it to boost a share price/local portfolio in order to get a bonus or it was to prove a point - with management knowledge. Either way, doesn't that type of behaviour represent corporate fraud/stock manipulation of a major Australian listed company?
There is clear evidence of operational 'issues' that even 10 years ago just did not happen. 15 years ago these would have been inconceivable.
Though not on the same scale this type of behaviour is almost carbon copy Enron stuff. You know - the power company where the directors got sent to jail for little things like 'allowing' their outsourced traders to 'close' power stations down at peak periods so they could artificially boost power prices and make profits and bonuses?
I might be wrong but it seems AJ et al are moving towards some form of Air-Enron.
What surprises me most is that the unions are immediately boxed into a discussion about paltry dollars and allocations of unsold empty seats rather than the big corporate governance questions that seem to be stumbled upon but not given the time of day.
Is this dispute using pilots/engineers/long term staff as a sideline while the real game is being played? Are the 'kamikaze' unionists performing the role of ASIC (the SEC in the US)?
Surely there is a journalist with clout out there who understands these issues and can follow up on this trail of increasing numbers of very serious allegations. From where I am sitting, there are plenty of places to start looking...
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back the fu$ken truck up
hey you guys is it me drinking a bit or have you all lost the plot.....the ALAEA and the AIPA are running with this and you guys are on here running around like chooks with their heads cut off....carm down boys and girls let it happen and the message that the company is getting from here is that we are not as ONE lets keep it tight close ranks look forward and SMILE ...the rim
Just watched Ms Wirth on the TV news explaining why Qantas charge $7.70 per passenger for using their credit cards to book flights.
Its to re cover bank charges she said.
The next guy on was the BOSS of Mastercard saying if you paid more than 1-2% you are getting ripped off.
It was a beautiful thing to behold.
The unions might like to bring that accounting gem up the next time the "Bunker Crew" say the pilots are after 26% pay rises.
It would be a good way to get the public to understand how management works these days.
Its to re cover bank charges she said.
The next guy on was the BOSS of Mastercard saying if you paid more than 1-2% you are getting ripped off.
It was a beautiful thing to behold.
The unions might like to bring that accounting gem up the next time the "Bunker Crew" say the pilots are after 26% pay rises.
It would be a good way to get the public to understand how management works these days.
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If it hasn't been said before you should get a copy of 'The 49ers The True Story'. You can read a few pages with the following link.
Some of the things in the book are very pertinent in regard to management & union tactics.
The Australian law firm freehills gets a good mention too, being the one CX chooses to use.
Some of the things in the book are very pertinent in regard to management & union tactics.
The Australian law firm freehills gets a good mention too, being the one CX chooses to use.
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Dear oh dear, reading all these posts (including mine) from earlier in the year, shows most of us were half right, but none of us even considered that Joyce would close the airline down, if only we had had insight, we could have played him at his own game.
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hobartairport.com.au/flightinfo/
Readers would note the number of Qantas codeshare flights on Jetstar and this is out of just Hobart alone.
If the Qantas pilot/ Qantas flight claim were to be satisfied in the current battle, the Jetstar pilots on these flights would need to be employed on terms (pay and conditions) no less favourable than the Qantas pilots longhaul EBA. That is why Qantas is fighting so hard. So you see that it is just not about ensuring that there is a Qantas pilot on aircraft which have white fuselages, red tails and Skippy on the tail.
Keen observers would also note that there are some BA and AA codeshare flights on the Qantas flights (aircraft).
Interestingly, VA codeshares on VB (and VB codeshares on VA), obviously for similar commercial reasons. Do the VB pilots have a claim on Virgin WRT VA which is similar to the Qantas pilot claim?