New Qantas Check-in and Bag Drop - Sydney
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front-of-house staffing with new bagdrop
I passed through syd domestic after a BA cockup forced me landside overnight.
there was a terribly nice Q chappie fielding a bunch of grumps (like me) queueing up at the platinum counter, none of us dead chuffed with the robot entry devices, and all of us feeling like the lack of counter staff was not an incentive.
If you have to stand a man there to try and feed people to your digiboxes, it is a message about customer satisfaction which the high-heidyins need to think about.
Secondly, there are a bunch of Qs about those bloody robots I need to understand before I try and use them. Like, can I use one to bump myself into an earlier flight, or does it simply book me into a seat on the 'bus that I signed up to? Because people have this amazing skill: its called thinking and I value being able to use it.
If I know the bloody pole-with-a-printer can actually get me where I want (onto an earlier flight: re-routed via another path. accept a downgrade to make the deadline. deal with my oversize bags...) I'm more likely to go there.
But when the thing just barks at me "Ven Did you lazt Zee your LUGGAGE!" its not encouraging.
there was a terribly nice Q chappie fielding a bunch of grumps (like me) queueing up at the platinum counter, none of us dead chuffed with the robot entry devices, and all of us feeling like the lack of counter staff was not an incentive.
If you have to stand a man there to try and feed people to your digiboxes, it is a message about customer satisfaction which the high-heidyins need to think about.
Secondly, there are a bunch of Qs about those bloody robots I need to understand before I try and use them. Like, can I use one to bump myself into an earlier flight, or does it simply book me into a seat on the 'bus that I signed up to? Because people have this amazing skill: its called thinking and I value being able to use it.
If I know the bloody pole-with-a-printer can actually get me where I want (onto an earlier flight: re-routed via another path. accept a downgrade to make the deadline. deal with my oversize bags...) I'm more likely to go there.
But when the thing just barks at me "Ven Did you lazt Zee your LUGGAGE!" its not encouraging.
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Thanks 28, post was tongue in cheek. Always amazed me how you had to show ID if you checked in under the old system but not this new less staff (less cost) deal. Re the Trent 900 thanks but I'll stick with a GE mate. Cheers Nunc
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Personally I thought it was a good idea to require an ID check before flying (even if you did it at the gate) but at the end of the day, anyone who deals with teenagers will know how easy it is to fake a drivers license. Fortunately most of the fakes in circulation are used for nothing more sinister than sneaking into pubs, but you can't rely on them for anything more than keeping honest people honest.
Passports aren't impossible to forge by a long shot, but it takes a lot more effort to replicate the security features.
It will be interesting to see just how much labour reduction there is. A friend works for one of the big parking consortiums and reckons that the pay before leaving machines don't actually reduce your staff requirements when you factor in all the people to help customers use them, the dude to fix them when they break down and the security to prevent enterprising people taking them away with backhoes.
Also as GOGGO said, they don't present the best customer service image for a full service carrier.
Passports aren't impossible to forge by a long shot, but it takes a lot more effort to replicate the security features.
It will be interesting to see just how much labour reduction there is. A friend works for one of the big parking consortiums and reckons that the pay before leaving machines don't actually reduce your staff requirements when you factor in all the people to help customers use them, the dude to fix them when they break down and the security to prevent enterprising people taking them away with backhoes.
Also as GOGGO said, they don't present the best customer service image for a full service carrier.
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Yes/No worries Nunc- was very much being facetious as well....
Do agree and have thought the same over the years. Have fronted the counter twice this week and photo ID required- yes, one could still hand on the boarding-pass....
But why still bother???.........., the only way to verify is (to dig detective like) in retrospect & after an 'event' with the self-serve electronic/online systems...., as opposed to an actual physical verification prior to boarding....
Rgds
28- BE
had to show ID if you checked in under the old system
But why still bother???.........., the only way to verify is (to dig detective like) in retrospect & after an 'event' with the self-serve electronic/online systems...., as opposed to an actual physical verification prior to boarding....
Rgds
28- BE
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Used it recently in Sydney. No waiting, simple to use, bag drop worked fine. Saved about 20 mins over my usual experience of Qantas check-in at Sydney. There was plenty of humans around if I needed them.
If you have an aversion to technology then it may take some time to get used to them, but if you've ever used an ATM then you have no excuse not to be able to use these. You might need a hand the first time but after that you should be fine.
If you have an aversion to technology then it may take some time to get used to them, but if you've ever used an ATM then you have no excuse not to be able to use these. You might need a hand the first time but after that you should be fine.
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Pera
Don't think you've quite grasped the point- tis not a technology interface issue, but a safety/risk case issue................
Renew your ASIC- then have a look and I reckon you will then have/& understand the definition of an 'Oxymoron'..............
Rgds
28
Don't think you've quite grasped the point- tis not a technology interface issue, but a safety/risk case issue................
Renew your ASIC- then have a look and I reckon you will then have/& understand the definition of an 'Oxymoron'..............
Rgds
28
A good point - it's also worth noting that the technology unveiled recently by QF in SYD and PER will probably never make it's way into a regional or major airport terminal not owned by the airline.
Worrals:
Just a small point, but "Faking A Drivers Licence" or other ID, even as a teenager, is a criminal offence and will result in a criminal conviction for fraud if you are caught and prosecuted.
That means you won't ever get a pilots licence let alone an ASIC since you have committed a crime involving dishonesty. You won't be travelling to Canada or America either.
Kids don't understand this.
Personally I thought it was a good idea to require an ID check before flying (even if you did it at the gate) but at the end of the day, anyone who deals with teenagers will know how easy it is to fake a drivers license.
That means you won't ever get a pilots licence let alone an ASIC since you have committed a crime involving dishonesty. You won't be travelling to Canada or America either.
Kids don't understand this.
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Agreed, kids don't understand a lot of things!
There are also relatively few people charged for it (in this state, anyway) and the sentences tend to be low, so I don't think the risk is apparent to the average dork.
I'm not condoning the practice, but just wanted to illustrate that DLs are far from fraud proof as a form of ID.
There are also relatively few people charged for it (in this state, anyway) and the sentences tend to be low, so I don't think the risk is apparent to the average dork.
I'm not condoning the practice, but just wanted to illustrate that DLs are far from fraud proof as a form of ID.
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@ geeohgeegeeoh: You'll find that the process is designed for the majority of travellers, who regularly pass point to point. Clearly something like this cannot anticipate the style of situation you experienced, and I highly doubt they will build that into the process.
Airport ID risk prompts electronic tickets and automatic baggage check-in rethink
from Sunday Herald / Sun 09 Jan 2011
Strict new security measures coming
Domestic passenger ID checks
Fears criminals using "lax" security
ELECTRONIC tickets and automatic baggage check-ins could be banned and non-passengers barred from entering terminals under an airport security crackdown.
A raft of strict new security measures are being thrashed out by federal authorities worried about the ease at which criminal gangs and drug smugglers move through airports undetected, reported the Sunday Herald Sun.
Among the changes being considered for domestic airports are compulsory passenger identity checks, and even a national ID card.
Police told a federal parliamentary committee that drug-runners are exploiting lax airport security, using fake IDs to buy air tickets and smuggle drugs from Sydney to Melbourne
Authorities believe criminals are slipping under the radar because airlines do not conduct compulsory identification checks.
Committee chairman Senator Steve Hutchins said there was concern over the growth of e-ticketing and the lack of scrutiny once tickets were issued. "We were surprised at the rapid development of this innovation in air travel and the misuse of it by organised crime figures," Senator Hutchins said.
On the issue of introducing a national ID card, Senator Hutchins said it was important to know the identity of each passenger - which currently was largely not happening.
"There will be no national identity system without the full support of the Coalition, and on every occasion when that has been presented to them they have refused to co-operate," he said.
"We are talking about identification of the passenger who purchased the ticket being the bum on the seat and that is what the police force, law-enforcement agencies and other bodies have highlighted as a gap in our domestic airport security."
Any opportunity that may close that loophole must be investigated by any federal agency that has the power to do so."
Electronic check-in machines allow passengers to bypass scrutiny as it is possible to check in from a computer or smartphone, print your own boarding pass and check-in your baggage without being asked for official identification.
The Australian Federal Police Association is critical of electronic check-in and recommends the Federal Government close this security loophole immediately.
I find it rather strange that the AFP would be piping up about airport security given their response to a bunch of bikies belting **** out of each other at Sydney Airport.
Strict new security measures coming
Domestic passenger ID checks
Fears criminals using "lax" security
ELECTRONIC tickets and automatic baggage check-ins could be banned and non-passengers barred from entering terminals under an airport security crackdown.
A raft of strict new security measures are being thrashed out by federal authorities worried about the ease at which criminal gangs and drug smugglers move through airports undetected, reported the Sunday Herald Sun.
Among the changes being considered for domestic airports are compulsory passenger identity checks, and even a national ID card.
Police told a federal parliamentary committee that drug-runners are exploiting lax airport security, using fake IDs to buy air tickets and smuggle drugs from Sydney to Melbourne
Authorities believe criminals are slipping under the radar because airlines do not conduct compulsory identification checks.
Committee chairman Senator Steve Hutchins said there was concern over the growth of e-ticketing and the lack of scrutiny once tickets were issued. "We were surprised at the rapid development of this innovation in air travel and the misuse of it by organised crime figures," Senator Hutchins said.
On the issue of introducing a national ID card, Senator Hutchins said it was important to know the identity of each passenger - which currently was largely not happening.
"There will be no national identity system without the full support of the Coalition, and on every occasion when that has been presented to them they have refused to co-operate," he said.
"We are talking about identification of the passenger who purchased the ticket being the bum on the seat and that is what the police force, law-enforcement agencies and other bodies have highlighted as a gap in our domestic airport security."
Any opportunity that may close that loophole must be investigated by any federal agency that has the power to do so."
Electronic check-in machines allow passengers to bypass scrutiny as it is possible to check in from a computer or smartphone, print your own boarding pass and check-in your baggage without being asked for official identification.
The Australian Federal Police Association is critical of electronic check-in and recommends the Federal Government close this security loophole immediately.
I find it rather strange that the AFP would be piping up about airport security given their response to a bunch of bikies belting **** out of each other at Sydney Airport.
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We are talking about identification of the passenger who purchased the ticket being the bum on the seat and that is what the police force, law-enforcement agencies and other bodies have highlighted as a gap in our domestic airport security."
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Just a Thought ....
If all security screening is being carried out on everyone properly - than it shouldn't matter what the passengers name is - hence no need for ID check.
If all security screening is being carried out on everyone properly - than it shouldn't matter what the passengers name is - hence no need for ID check.
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Why are Crims even being mentioned. What type of Crims. There has never been a law in Australia that says a person buying or travelling on a ticket must be that person.
There cannot be! We are not a Stasi state. Airline staff have been indoctrinated to believe this is the case but it is not.
Airlines are common carriers, If I have lived in the bush all my life and am known by the nom de plume of Sunfish for example, am I not allowed on an Australian Airline because I have no Birth Certificate.
Free trade between borders seems to ring a bell. Don't all knee jerk off on the latest headline.
There cannot be! We are not a Stasi state. Airline staff have been indoctrinated to believe this is the case but it is not.
Airlines are common carriers, If I have lived in the bush all my life and am known by the nom de plume of Sunfish for example, am I not allowed on an Australian Airline because I have no Birth Certificate.
Free trade between borders seems to ring a bell. Don't all knee jerk off on the latest headline.
Tiger01,
Exactly and I believe many in the OTS feel the same way. Seems like just one senator is on a personal crusade and the police want the airlines to do their jobs for them as well.
If all security screening is being carried out on everyone properly - than it shouldn't matter what the passengers name is - hence no need for ID check.
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Apologies but just to get back on topic...
Back from New Zealand following a wedding over the weekend. Auto checkin worked like a dream, no mucking about trying to get tokens/ID discs read by scanners just a simple bar scan and bag tag printed followed by putting luggage on a conveyor (located less than 5 metres away from checking machine) and away you go.
I still don't like the lack of a human face at check in, I would have argued that was the very last thing Qantas or any other airline would outsource/ get rid of - control of the customer interface or user experience (depending on which bit of consultant speak you want). But they have and they've done it less effectively than the Kiwis.
Back from New Zealand following a wedding over the weekend. Auto checkin worked like a dream, no mucking about trying to get tokens/ID discs read by scanners just a simple bar scan and bag tag printed followed by putting luggage on a conveyor (located less than 5 metres away from checking machine) and away you go.
I still don't like the lack of a human face at check in, I would have argued that was the very last thing Qantas or any other airline would outsource/ get rid of - control of the customer interface or user experience (depending on which bit of consultant speak you want). But they have and they've done it less effectively than the Kiwis.
I think we have to be rather careful here, there are some very severe human rights issues involved and this is the thin end of the wedge. What is at stake here is ultimately your freedom of movement throughout Australia.
The first point is that aircraft passenger security checks were put in place to provide aircraft security. Nothing more, nothing less.
What the police are saying is that an aircraft security check should be used to detect crime or potential crime. That is what "drug smugglers are flying between Sydney and Melbourne" is code for.
What is being proposed, is that identity will be screened against a database before flight and security checks. If you are regarded as a potential "drug smuggler", then you and your bags will be searched for drugs, or denied the right to board, or both.
The Orwellian overtones should be clear. Once you make it onto the database for whatever reason, you will receive special attention, if you are even allowed to fly at all.
This practise, searching without reasonable cause, is already being used in Victoria by the Police. "Random" breath and drug tests aren't "random" any more. Police use a number plate recognition camera and software connected to a laptop containing a database. Traffic is scanned about a kilometer ahead of a "Random" breath testing station. If you are the registered owner of a vehicle, and you have priors for 0.05, drug use, driving unregistered, crime, whatever, the laptop beeps and the police radio your details ahead to the supposedly "Random" testing station and you get pulled over for special attention. I predict doubts over the legality of this practice will make it to the Supreme court one day.
It is blindingly obvious that this capability will be misused. It already is in the USA. All sorts of political activists have found themselves singled out for special attention every time they fly. The "security checks" are now basically a check on your activity and reason for flying; as can be seen in this recording of a political operative being interrogated about the $7000 in cash he is carrying:
YouTube - Secret recording of TSA threatening passenger Part 1 of 3
The first point is that aircraft passenger security checks were put in place to provide aircraft security. Nothing more, nothing less.
What the police are saying is that an aircraft security check should be used to detect crime or potential crime. That is what "drug smugglers are flying between Sydney and Melbourne" is code for.
What is being proposed, is that identity will be screened against a database before flight and security checks. If you are regarded as a potential "drug smuggler", then you and your bags will be searched for drugs, or denied the right to board, or both.
The Orwellian overtones should be clear. Once you make it onto the database for whatever reason, you will receive special attention, if you are even allowed to fly at all.
This practise, searching without reasonable cause, is already being used in Victoria by the Police. "Random" breath and drug tests aren't "random" any more. Police use a number plate recognition camera and software connected to a laptop containing a database. Traffic is scanned about a kilometer ahead of a "Random" breath testing station. If you are the registered owner of a vehicle, and you have priors for 0.05, drug use, driving unregistered, crime, whatever, the laptop beeps and the police radio your details ahead to the supposedly "Random" testing station and you get pulled over for special attention. I predict doubts over the legality of this practice will make it to the Supreme court one day.
It is blindingly obvious that this capability will be misused. It already is in the USA. All sorts of political activists have found themselves singled out for special attention every time they fly. The "security checks" are now basically a check on your activity and reason for flying; as can be seen in this recording of a political operative being interrogated about the $7000 in cash he is carrying:
YouTube - Secret recording of TSA threatening passenger Part 1 of 3