Merged: Qantas 747 Engine failure. Returns to SFO
Join Date: Feb 1999
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Yes, in the case of an LP turbine failure, it would take a lot to gum up the works enough to stop the fan in its tracks. I had assumed for the purpose it was a failure in the gas turbine HP core...but interesting that it wasn't contained nevertheless. Yes, I did forget about El Al, too. Was that non-shear bolt added to just the 747 or did it go across 76 etc as well...
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N1 Vibes
Yep you are correct, I made the misstake by looking at the colour of the cowl......the RB211's are grey not like CF's white.
Lousy colour in the photo, I guess I should have looked further back at the exhaust!
Yep you are correct, I made the misstake by looking at the colour of the cowl......the RB211's are grey not like CF's white.
Lousy colour in the photo, I guess I should have looked further back at the exhaust!
Join Date: Jan 2008
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I think more importantly some boys from Sydney Base will get a few days in SFO to repair this aircraft.
Nice to do something different to keep the job interesting. Just hope the boss gives them a day or 2 RnR before returning home.
But make sure the @sshole managers in Sydney don't make you sign a contract for the away from home conditions.
Is it just me or since QF shut down their engine overhaul shop these type of dramas seem to be a bit more common.
Nice to do something different to keep the job interesting. Just hope the boss gives them a day or 2 RnR before returning home.
But make sure the @sshole managers in Sydney don't make you sign a contract for the away from home conditions.
Is it just me or since QF shut down their engine overhaul shop these type of dramas seem to be a bit more common.
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Just caught the news on channel 9. It would appear that the engine blew a large hole in the casing, was on fire for at least half a hour,???? and the PAX thought they were all going to die. QFs safety record is now in tatters (please note dear folk, I am repeating it word for word) and it has never happened to any other aircraft or any other airline (Dear God) so there you go, learn something every day. It finished off with how wonderful the pilot was and the cabin crew, so I suppose there is some praise there, the rest is pure crap. Yes it happened, the turbine obviously shat itself, shame about the cowling, still three donks. NEXT!
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Originally Posted by SMOC
Lucky it wasn't a fan blade.
Fan-blade-off looks spectacular, but is less dangerous than a failure of IP of HP parts, which rotate at much higher rpm. Energy rises with the square of rpm, but only linearly with radius.
Bernd
Bottums Up
Originally Posted by blueloo
So flames that appear to be flames are not actually flames?
Join Date: Nov 2007
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Totally agree that uncontained engine failures are definately not a "non event". Anyone who saw the damage caused by the American Airlines 767 that let go of it's HPT, or the N1 failure of BAW in Sydney a few years back would agree (both uncontained).
As with OJK recently, luck has played an incredible part again in this incident.
As with OJK recently, luck has played an incredible part again in this incident.
Last edited by Ngineer; 1st Sep 2010 at 11:47.
skol
bsieker,
You obviously didn't graduate in physics.
bsieker,
You obviously didn't graduate in physics.
However, I understand that turbine disc failure is impossible to contain due to the extremely high energy involved without crippling weight penalties, so the disc is designed so it can't fail.
A turbine disc failure is a monumental event in airline operations.
So I rather think that bsieker is spot on with his comment...
Join Date: May 2004
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Interesting recording from KSFO ATC courtesy LIVE ATC here. Everybody seems to handle the whole affair very calmly. Love the dangerous goods discussion - "Fuhgeddaboudit!"
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If the cockpit was as calm and professional as it sounded on the radio then job well done. I suspect it was.
Interesting to listen to an event such as this from somewhere other than the hot seat. Several transmissions were interpereted incorrectly including the mix up over pan/emergency.
Interesting to listen to an event such as this from somewhere other than the hot seat. Several transmissions were interpereted incorrectly including the mix up over pan/emergency.
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If the cockpit was as calm and professional as it sounded on the radio then job well done. I suspect it was.
Interesting to listen to an event such as this from somewhere other than the hot seat. Several transmissions were interpereted incorrectly including the mix up over pan/emergency.
Interesting to listen to an event such as this from somewhere other than the hot seat. Several transmissions were interpereted incorrectly including the mix up over pan/emergency.
You might want to look into the FAA procedure in regards to PAN/EMERGENCY! Maybe take a look at the FAR/AIM document as to what their procedures are.
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skol is right.
Assuming the rpm is constant (maybe a big assumption), blade velocity increases linearly with radius. Energy is proportional to velocity-squared, so longer blades (fans) have energy increasing more than linearly with radius increasing.
Of course, this is oversimplified, longer blades (fans) often have much lower rpm than shorter ones (turbine blades)....
Assuming the rpm is constant (maybe a big assumption), blade velocity increases linearly with radius. Energy is proportional to velocity-squared, so longer blades (fans) have energy increasing more than linearly with radius increasing.
Of course, this is oversimplified, longer blades (fans) often have much lower rpm than shorter ones (turbine blades)....
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Gunger - the atc recording i heard (the link to live ATC) had several transmissions "stuck" together (so there is some obvious repetition where they overlap). Also some transmissions clearly havent been recorded.
Sounded very calm/professional to me from the bits I heard.
As for this bit
...is largely irrelevant - as Australian registered aircraft are approved to use their Flight Admin manual and procedures. The Jepp WWT (world wide text) outlines a summary of the main changes which are relevant (in addition to company Route Manual).
From what we have seen over the years the USA /FAA /ATC dont have a particularly good track record with Radio Voice Procedure. Its all a bit care free really.
Sounded very calm/professional to me from the bits I heard.
As for this bit
You might want to look into the FAA procedure in regards to PAN/EMERGENCY!
From what we have seen over the years the USA /FAA /ATC dont have a particularly good track record with Radio Voice Procedure. Its all a bit care free really.
