Jetstar Agree not to hire Qantaslink Pilots
Nunc est bibendum
S/O I flew with the other day had been checked out for six weeks and was ex QFLink. Started about October last year I think. He wasn't the only regional guy on his course.
It shouldn't have to be this hard for regional guys and gals to move to mainline!
It shouldn't have to be this hard for regional guys and gals to move to mainline!
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Last one out turn off the lights.
They can afford to lose FOs. They cant afford to lose their experienced captains (including C+T) hence why none of THEM are getting into mainline or ****star.
Surprise surprise. VB sees them as a good source of experience and is now snapping the captains up.
Latest is 11 EAA capts confirmed and awaiting start dates. Who knows how many from Sunnies?
Godfrey was right.
All long termers who are totally disillusioned with the jokers who are supposed to be running the show.
So that means park another 3 EAA planes by July.
Good to see #42 is on top of it all! He'll get a promotion out of this!
See youse!
TDI.
Surprise surprise. VB sees them as a good source of experience and is now snapping the captains up.
Latest is 11 EAA capts confirmed and awaiting start dates. Who knows how many from Sunnies?
Godfrey was right.
All long termers who are totally disillusioned with the jokers who are supposed to be running the show.
So that means park another 3 EAA planes by July.
Good to see #42 is on top of it all! He'll get a promotion out of this!
See youse!
TDI.
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I've met a few QFlink guys who have bagged mainline for not offering progression.
After asking if they had applied, the response was NO !!
What percentage of QFlink have applied? Only the newbies and a few others I expect.
MC
After asking if they had applied, the response was NO !!
What percentage of QFlink have applied? Only the newbies and a few others I expect.
MC
Worth making a couple of points, whatever you may say negative about EAA they do not and will not STOP Qlink pilots from progressing, I can say this as I have progressed from EAA to JQ.
The reasoning has nothing to do Federal or state antidiscrimination laws/ EEO as a number of people seem to believe, Federal EEO (state is not relevant in this case) laws guard against anti discrimination based only upon:
Race
Religion
Sexual preference (even this still does not apply to the armed services)
Gender
Pregnancy (unless a complication arises with the nature of the work)
Marital status
union affilliation
The laws are not so complex as to govern what may be considered unfair by an individual employee, that philosophy would go against the workplace reform that both sides of politics have been working on for the last 20 odd years.
It must be remembered that in days of old many people who got into EAA had 5000 hours plus and had already had there two shots at mainline by the time EAA gave them a look in. The same people then turned around and cried poor that they could not get into mainline, despite this many later got a third go despite previous never to reapply letters and subsequently have now progressed.
The deluge of pilots going from EAA to JQ is now famous at JQ as is the amount of people coming from REX to JQ, if it has slowed down, this possibly has more to do with experience levels than anything else.
Qantas will not stop progression because they know that pilots won't even start at EAA if this occurs, despite what you may think of the evil empire they are not that stupid, they simply play a game that aims to put supply and demand in their favour.
Having said all that, I and many others of my time had our external 'progression" delayed by months. That is arguably unfair but to play the devil's advocate I might not have made the cut if it were not for the excellent CRM and multi crew experience I gained at EAA, I choose to see the glass as half full, it's all a matter of perspectives.
The reasoning has nothing to do Federal or state antidiscrimination laws/ EEO as a number of people seem to believe, Federal EEO (state is not relevant in this case) laws guard against anti discrimination based only upon:
Race
Religion
Sexual preference (even this still does not apply to the armed services)
Gender
Pregnancy (unless a complication arises with the nature of the work)
Marital status
union affilliation
The laws are not so complex as to govern what may be considered unfair by an individual employee, that philosophy would go against the workplace reform that both sides of politics have been working on for the last 20 odd years.
It must be remembered that in days of old many people who got into EAA had 5000 hours plus and had already had there two shots at mainline by the time EAA gave them a look in. The same people then turned around and cried poor that they could not get into mainline, despite this many later got a third go despite previous never to reapply letters and subsequently have now progressed.
The deluge of pilots going from EAA to JQ is now famous at JQ as is the amount of people coming from REX to JQ, if it has slowed down, this possibly has more to do with experience levels than anything else.
Qantas will not stop progression because they know that pilots won't even start at EAA if this occurs, despite what you may think of the evil empire they are not that stupid, they simply play a game that aims to put supply and demand in their favour.
Having said all that, I and many others of my time had our external 'progression" delayed by months. That is arguably unfair but to play the devil's advocate I might not have made the cut if it were not for the excellent CRM and multi crew experience I gained at EAA, I choose to see the glass as half full, it's all a matter of perspectives.
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The reasoning has nothing to do Federal or state antidiscrimination laws/ EEO as a number of people seem to believe, Federal EEO (state is not relevant in this case) laws guard against anti discrimination based only upon:
Race
Religion
Sexual preference (even this still does not apply to the armed services)
Gender
Pregnancy (unless a complication arises with the nature of the work)
Marital status
union affilliation
Race
Religion
Sexual preference (even this still does not apply to the armed services)
Gender
Pregnancy (unless a complication arises with the nature of the work)
Marital status
union affilliation
The listed basis of discrimination you have provided are DIRECT FORMS of discrimination. Of which you can add to your list:
Disability (physical or intellectual)
Parental Status
Age
Family Responsibilities
Changed Sexuality
Criminal Record
Political Beliefs & Activities
Medical Records
The anti discrimination laws I was reffering to in my previous post are INDIRECT DISCRIMINATION in the form of:
A practice or policy or procedure which results in a person treated either more/less favourably so that another person or group is either DISADVANTAGED or ADVANTAGED.
As for EEO, it is legislated that a person shall have an equal probability of success for a job position & a right to be considered for a job they are suitably skilled or qualified for.
So examples of this would be, because QF mainline is a seperate company to that of QFlink or J*.
Due to indirect discrimination, mainline could not show preference to recruit only from subsidiaries as this would be discriminating to those that are not part of the QF group who are equally qualified for the same positions.
Alternatively, mainline could not favour recruitment from other than subsidiaries for the same reason. Being they would be favouring non QF group individuals therfore indirectly discriminating against individuals employed by the subsidiaries.
So a policy of recruiting the most suitable individual based on selection criteria should be utilised by any responsible company.
MC
Last edited by Mstr Caution; 27th Mar 2008 at 09:23.
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They never learn OR listen...
IMHO this sort of bollocks has been done in many places and always fails.
The end result of any kind of recruitment embargo (either total or partial) just results in the group losing its best staff to the competition and resentment amongst those who remain.
Its not necessary. Some airlines overseas have a policy of progressing their people from the regionals. Especially in the US. They realise there are 2 type of employees, those who will never leave (due location, family whatever), and those who will. So they have a choice - keep those good people within their organisation and continue to reap the benefits of all that training and operational memory your company paid for OR ignore them and lose them to who exactly? THE COMPETITION - THATS WHO! Oh yeah real smart move bucko!
Most pilots won't accept it, they just leave! And spread resentment before they go. If there was a demonstrated career path, all that corporate memory would be retained and there would be a real group spirit. In my view it's short sighted and selfish, and whats more it doesn't work!
In the 1990's Air NZ mainline did the same to us in Link at Air Nelson & Mt Cook whilst it took the least experienced / qualified pilots in the entire group from Eagle motors OR complete outsiders.
We had top CHK & TRN people with all the bells and whistles. Many with high EFIS, airline multi crew hours, degrees etc, been with the Air NZ group for many years - but they couldn't even get interviews.
RESULT - WE LEFT!
Europe, OZ, HK etc. And who really lost? IMHO Air NZ lost; their best crews and ANY good will they had left (which wasn't much) by showing no loyalty, appreciation or even simple recognition for long service.
Lets hope QANTAS wakes up and treats their people better. If not their loss is CX's / VB's / J*'s / Tiger's gain...
The end result of any kind of recruitment embargo (either total or partial) just results in the group losing its best staff to the competition and resentment amongst those who remain.
Its not necessary. Some airlines overseas have a policy of progressing their people from the regionals. Especially in the US. They realise there are 2 type of employees, those who will never leave (due location, family whatever), and those who will. So they have a choice - keep those good people within their organisation and continue to reap the benefits of all that training and operational memory your company paid for OR ignore them and lose them to who exactly? THE COMPETITION - THATS WHO! Oh yeah real smart move bucko!
Most pilots won't accept it, they just leave! And spread resentment before they go. If there was a demonstrated career path, all that corporate memory would be retained and there would be a real group spirit. In my view it's short sighted and selfish, and whats more it doesn't work!
In the 1990's Air NZ mainline did the same to us in Link at Air Nelson & Mt Cook whilst it took the least experienced / qualified pilots in the entire group from Eagle motors OR complete outsiders.
We had top CHK & TRN people with all the bells and whistles. Many with high EFIS, airline multi crew hours, degrees etc, been with the Air NZ group for many years - but they couldn't even get interviews. RESULT - WE LEFT!
Europe, OZ, HK etc. And who really lost? IMHO Air NZ lost; their best crews and ANY good will they had left (which wasn't much) by showing no loyalty, appreciation or even simple recognition for long service.Lets hope QANTAS wakes up and treats their people better. If not their loss is CX's / VB's / J*'s / Tiger's gain...
