Economy Long Haul - Best carrier ?
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BD
I am finding clients happy with SQ EK and particularly happy with MH. VS also gets a very good rap. QF/BA are tolerated by those with OneWorld memberships for that very reason.
Korean sneaks in with very good reports, but connections over Incheon suck badly at times and Thai is also popular. There are some very good combination TG/LH J class fares into Europe albeit with an extra stop on the way. If you are a high up QF fractured flyer then you are more likely to get an upgrade on CX if it is full down the back than even their own Asia Miles members. Just a little marketing ploy to gain your future business.
Avoid anything Mainland Chinese lest you get a fortune cookie that states "That wasn't chicken!"
Your agent should be seat allocating you, but before you do so check out seatguru.com - a very handy resource. Most major carriers are listed as are most aeroplane types they operate. The seat rating system is dirt easy to use.
Just don't tell your agent about it. Official Secrets Act and all that!!!!
Best regards
EWL
I am finding clients happy with SQ EK and particularly happy with MH. VS also gets a very good rap. QF/BA are tolerated by those with OneWorld memberships for that very reason.
Korean sneaks in with very good reports, but connections over Incheon suck badly at times and Thai is also popular. There are some very good combination TG/LH J class fares into Europe albeit with an extra stop on the way. If you are a high up QF fractured flyer then you are more likely to get an upgrade on CX if it is full down the back than even their own Asia Miles members. Just a little marketing ploy to gain your future business.
Avoid anything Mainland Chinese lest you get a fortune cookie that states "That wasn't chicken!"
Your agent should be seat allocating you, but before you do so check out seatguru.com - a very handy resource. Most major carriers are listed as are most aeroplane types they operate. The seat rating system is dirt easy to use.
Just don't tell your agent about it. Official Secrets Act and all that!!!!
Best regards
EWL
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EWL
Thanks for your imput.
Whenever Ive flown EK on the 777 in the past, Ive tried to book a seat in the back where there are only 2 side by side - row 47/8/9 ? Have found that there is more room by the window due to the curvature of the fuselage there. Obviously the last row is to be avoided due to the bulkhead behind resulting in limited recline!
DogGone
Thanks for your imput.
Whenever Ive flown EK on the 777 in the past, Ive tried to book a seat in the back where there are only 2 side by side - row 47/8/9 ? Have found that there is more room by the window due to the curvature of the fuselage there. Obviously the last row is to be avoided due to the bulkhead behind resulting in limited recline!
DogGone
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No problemo BD
EK is allocatable by Travel Agents who know how to drive the system properly. Snagging those seats on a 777 should be no problem providing you aren't dealing with a Fright Centre life support system for a set of genitalia.
The same fuselage narrowing is not as effective on the A345 as the extra seat is removed by the 4 in the middle becoming a 3.
Row 71 I think it is in a QF 744 is the 2 on the outboard seats start point. More to the point, if the flight is lightly loaded it is also the place where you would be most likely to jag a 4 agross the guts. For some unknown reason the punters want to be in the pointy end.
Personally I don't really care where I am in the aeroplane as long as I am comfy, well watered and fed.
Years of subloading has taught me that a seat on the inside is just fine, thank you!!
Best regards
EWL
EK is allocatable by Travel Agents who know how to drive the system properly. Snagging those seats on a 777 should be no problem providing you aren't dealing with a Fright Centre life support system for a set of genitalia.
The same fuselage narrowing is not as effective on the A345 as the extra seat is removed by the 4 in the middle becoming a 3.
Row 71 I think it is in a QF 744 is the 2 on the outboard seats start point. More to the point, if the flight is lightly loaded it is also the place where you would be most likely to jag a 4 agross the guts. For some unknown reason the punters want to be in the pointy end.
Personally I don't really care where I am in the aeroplane as long as I am comfy, well watered and fed.
Years of subloading has taught me that a seat on the inside is just fine, thank you!!
Best regards
EWL
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Just went economy to the states on a Qantas 744. Service was great, entertainment was great but the seats were absolutely ****e ! Considering I then went around on low cost southwest in complete comfort (would have much rather flown all the way back on that aircraft) I was pretty disappointed really. So unless I want to endure 12 hours of numb arses and crook backs I won't be on qantas again. (unless bus or 1st class of course
) Those new AirNZ cabins are streaks ahead....
) Those new AirNZ cabins are streaks ahead....
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It all depends what aircraft you're on, rather than airline per se. If you're on the 747 you'll be stuffed in like cattle, but a 767 for instance may have more room, which I discovered flying JAL.
I'm 190cm tall, so I really make sure that I have a decent seat on a 8+hr flight. I would be more comfortable in a Cessna 150 for 8hours than 747 economy (actually I may need to think about that
).
I'm 190cm tall, so I really make sure that I have a decent seat on a 8+hr flight. I would be more comfortable in a Cessna 150 for 8hours than 747 economy (actually I may need to think about that
).
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Just for something different - think about routing via South Africa using some combination of SAA/QF/VS/BA.
I work on the basis that no matter who you fly with, 24 hours in economy is going to be pretty dire. I usually splurge miles to upgrade if flying on my own pocket if I can.
The advantage of going this way is that you have been in the right time zone for at least 14-15 hours by the time you get to LHR so you generally feel a bite more human on arrival.
Just booked my next economy loop around the world SYD-SFO-DEN-JFK-ZRH-BCN-GVA-LHR-JNB-SYD
I work on the basis that no matter who you fly with, 24 hours in economy is going to be pretty dire. I usually splurge miles to upgrade if flying on my own pocket if I can.
The advantage of going this way is that you have been in the right time zone for at least 14-15 hours by the time you get to LHR so you generally feel a bite more human on arrival.
Just booked my next economy loop around the world SYD-SFO-DEN-JFK-ZRH-BCN-GVA-LHR-JNB-SYD
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Probably awful whatever - they only really compete on price so why expect any difference?
I wonder how QF will go charging premium prices when the Macquarie/US Venture capitalists get them - Mrs Wheeler won't fly anything else because they are Australian and reliable... HA! We just paid $8K for QF retun to London with one 4 year old.child. I dont think they got off on time once. Cathy were about $6.8K and Virgin were $6K. I know which one I will go for next time. I doubt they could be that much worse! I will say I did the Emirates thing a couple of yeras ago ...and in terms of on-time running and getting folk on and off they really were bad! Food was eatable though.
I wonder how QF will go charging premium prices when the Macquarie/US Venture capitalists get them - Mrs Wheeler won't fly anything else because they are Australian and reliable... HA! We just paid $8K for QF retun to London with one 4 year old.child. I dont think they got off on time once. Cathy were about $6.8K and Virgin were $6K. I know which one I will go for next time. I doubt they could be that much worse! I will say I did the Emirates thing a couple of yeras ago ...and in terms of on-time running and getting folk on and off they really were bad! Food was eatable though.
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So, although choosing "the best carrier" is personal and obviously very subjective, the bottom line (no pun intended) may be the ergonomics associated with the seating; thats obviously dependant on acft type and carrier. If you get stuck in the middle of a row anywhere down the back I think its equally claustrophobic and will mar the overall travel experience
Which reminds me of an event when flying back to BN from Dubai last year.
On boarding a busy flight (777/300) I felt particularly smug getting a window seat around row 20 something just in front of the loos and near the galley. Quite private really - no one to step over me etc etc. Just me and my book and later the cleaners at Changi, for the next 16 hours. Or so I thought!
My neighbour was a plump, older Russian lady complete with a dead furry looking thing (Stole?) wrapped around her neck. Being Aug it was 40 C + outside and she made me feel hot just looking at her. After a bit of a wrestle with her bags, hat, fox etc she settled herself down into her seat and, due to her size 20 - part of mine (there goes the armrest - but at least I still have the window!!)Though she spoke little English we made polite conversation as one does - or rather she talked at me keen to improve hers! 16hrs of this ? nightmare!
Also about this time a waft of very strong BO floated by - just as a guy in leather jacket and trousers (still 40+ outside) sat down across the aisle in a middle seat. The aisle seat next to him remained empty ! Still loading so pitty the poor bar steward getting that one! Everything in the garden was definitely not Rosy!
There was then a bit of a commotion further down the back. A couple from Blighty travelling together had been seated separately and they weren't having it. One of the trolley dollies (cant spell stewardessess?) noticed the odd couple sitting together i.e me and Eva, and asked us if we were travelling together? If not could we give up our seats and move to two non co-located seats? Certainly - No worries - In fact my pleasure!!- time to escape Eva and Mr Stinky (or so I thought). So for the first and only time in my life I gave up my seat! Eva dully scuttled off down the back. Me ? I was allocated the only other free seat available - across the aisle next to Mr Stinky! DOHHHH!!
After about an hour or so the first meal was served. As she bent over me to serve Mr S I saw the TD 's eyes widen as she got a waft. It really was that bad. After the usual fussing (EK staff were good) she quietly asked me if everything was OK and that if I wanted there was one free seat down the back. quicker than a semi finalist in musical chairs I moved again. And guess what ? I ended up in the middle of a middle row right at the back. Cramped or what! And my new neighbours - Eva one side and what looked like her mother on the other- so no armrests! Fly Emirates - Keep Discovering!!!
To this day Ive no idea how these two seats became available next to each other bearing in mind the fuss by the POMMS earlier!
Lesson learnt - Never give up a reasonable seat !
Yet to book, (and dont fancy 777/200 from Oz) but leaning towards SA for a short break,shower and duty free T shirt in Singapore. But VAtlantic may get my vote as Im curious about the AirBus.
Sore ar*e or otherwise anyone?
Thanks all for feedback.
DogGone
Which reminds me of an event when flying back to BN from Dubai last year.
On boarding a busy flight (777/300) I felt particularly smug getting a window seat around row 20 something just in front of the loos and near the galley. Quite private really - no one to step over me etc etc. Just me and my book and later the cleaners at Changi, for the next 16 hours. Or so I thought!
My neighbour was a plump, older Russian lady complete with a dead furry looking thing (Stole?) wrapped around her neck. Being Aug it was 40 C + outside and she made me feel hot just looking at her. After a bit of a wrestle with her bags, hat, fox etc she settled herself down into her seat and, due to her size 20 - part of mine (there goes the armrest - but at least I still have the window!!)Though she spoke little English we made polite conversation as one does - or rather she talked at me keen to improve hers! 16hrs of this ? nightmare!
Also about this time a waft of very strong BO floated by - just as a guy in leather jacket and trousers (still 40+ outside) sat down across the aisle in a middle seat. The aisle seat next to him remained empty ! Still loading so pitty the poor bar steward getting that one! Everything in the garden was definitely not Rosy!
There was then a bit of a commotion further down the back. A couple from Blighty travelling together had been seated separately and they weren't having it. One of the trolley dollies (cant spell stewardessess?) noticed the odd couple sitting together i.e me and Eva, and asked us if we were travelling together? If not could we give up our seats and move to two non co-located seats? Certainly - No worries - In fact my pleasure!!- time to escape Eva and Mr Stinky (or so I thought). So for the first and only time in my life I gave up my seat! Eva dully scuttled off down the back. Me ? I was allocated the only other free seat available - across the aisle next to Mr Stinky! DOHHHH!!
After about an hour or so the first meal was served. As she bent over me to serve Mr S I saw the TD 's eyes widen as she got a waft. It really was that bad. After the usual fussing (EK staff were good) she quietly asked me if everything was OK and that if I wanted there was one free seat down the back. quicker than a semi finalist in musical chairs I moved again. And guess what ? I ended up in the middle of a middle row right at the back. Cramped or what! And my new neighbours - Eva one side and what looked like her mother on the other- so no armrests! Fly Emirates - Keep Discovering!!!
To this day Ive no idea how these two seats became available next to each other bearing in mind the fuss by the POMMS earlier!
Lesson learnt - Never give up a reasonable seat !
Yet to book, (and dont fancy 777/200 from Oz) but leaning towards SA for a short break,shower and duty free T shirt in Singapore. But VAtlantic may get my vote as Im curious about the AirBus.
Sore ar*e or otherwise anyone?
Thanks all for feedback.
DogGone
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Great story BurglarDog - Yep Economy sure is miserable. The worst things are full planes... I dont know how some of those poor folk work in that day in and day out. But when the focus is on load factors and cramming in as many seats as possible to get the costs down and profits up- what do we expect? I've tried most of 'em - believe me miserable is the right word whichever you choose unless you are lucky enough to strike a half full plane - and really give Geoff the pip!
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The last couple of trips I've used TG and QF. Was travelling on subload tickets, but QF was upgradable. Anyway I got economy on both.
TG on their B747-400 and B777-300, I thought had a better seat ptich than QF in ecy. The entertainment on TG is not as up to date as QF (just a screen in each zone). The food and service was nothing special, but it was not bad either. If you have an Ipod and some good books, the flight isn't too bad. I prefer to travel TG when I go to BKK as I'm in MEL and going with QF is a hassle. To use QF you need to travel to SYD then o'night in BKK if you are travelling anywhere else in Thailand. With TG you can get the midnight flight and be by the pool by about midday in Phuket.
QF ecy is good on the food and entertainment points, but it feels like it has less room than TG. It shouldn't feel like this as TG actually 10 more seats in ecy than QF. The service was like TG, nothing special but not bad either.
Overall I would say most major airlines ecy are pretty similar. If I wasn't travelling subload and had to pay full fares, I would be looking at the price, connections (if applicable) and what else is included (eg:hotels).
TG on their B747-400 and B777-300, I thought had a better seat ptich than QF in ecy. The entertainment on TG is not as up to date as QF (just a screen in each zone). The food and service was nothing special, but it was not bad either. If you have an Ipod and some good books, the flight isn't too bad. I prefer to travel TG when I go to BKK as I'm in MEL and going with QF is a hassle. To use QF you need to travel to SYD then o'night in BKK if you are travelling anywhere else in Thailand. With TG you can get the midnight flight and be by the pool by about midday in Phuket.
QF ecy is good on the food and entertainment points, but it feels like it has less room than TG. It shouldn't feel like this as TG actually 10 more seats in ecy than QF. The service was like TG, nothing special but not bad either.
Overall I would say most major airlines ecy are pretty similar. If I wasn't travelling subload and had to pay full fares, I would be looking at the price, connections (if applicable) and what else is included (eg:hotels).
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Wow, BurglarDog.
I feel sorry for you. The worst person I've ever had to sit next to was my old step-brother. I've always ended up sitting next to businessmen who ignore you, old ladies who like to talk, but politely so you aren't comfortable or other people who are also awesomely friendly, Though the biggest flight for me ever has been the trans-tasman hop with Garuda in one of thier old DC-10s, that was with my brother and being 8 it was no suprise he would be so damn annoying. (He kept taking my activity pack.)
Heading up to Brissie these holidays with Mary Blue so it'll be interesting to see if my luck will turn and I get stuck to the smelliest, oldest, most over dressed Russian lady ever.
I feel sorry for you. The worst person I've ever had to sit next to was my old step-brother. I've always ended up sitting next to businessmen who ignore you, old ladies who like to talk, but politely so you aren't comfortable or other people who are also awesomely friendly, Though the biggest flight for me ever has been the trans-tasman hop with Garuda in one of thier old DC-10s, that was with my brother and being 8 it was no suprise he would be so damn annoying. (He kept taking my activity pack.)
Heading up to Brissie these holidays with Mary Blue so it'll be interesting to see if my luck will turn and I get stuck to the smelliest, oldest, most over dressed Russian lady ever.
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Perhaps you could look at TG from BNE. From next week, Thai will increase services to BNE from thrice weekly to 5x weekly and will switch from the 773 (really old interiors) to their brand new 777-200ERs.
3x3x3 across in Y, 34" in most rows, PTVs and great service
Have never flown TG, but have heard many good reports from PAX flying with them out of Brisbane.
Cheers
3x3x3 across in Y, 34" in most rows, PTVs and great service
Have never flown TG, but have heard many good reports from PAX flying with them out of Brisbane.
Cheers
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Best economy??
You must work for them or have taken an extremely good sleeping pill Aussie. Even Saudia is better than EK, although not from Australia. My money is on Cathay and Malaysian.
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Another vote for Malaysia Airlines in economy, prices were good seat pitch was great, food was good. Previous year tried Singapore Airlines which was good.
I think overall that SQ provide a slightly better product but for me Malaysia seat pitch was great and a half empty flight from KUL to LHR to get some sleep across 3 seats.
Singapore has a better schedule overall but Malaysia had a schedule that suited me fine.
I think overall that SQ provide a slightly better product but for me Malaysia seat pitch was great and a half empty flight from KUL to LHR to get some sleep across 3 seats.
Singapore has a better schedule overall but Malaysia had a schedule that suited me fine.
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See you your 3 seats and raise you a fourth!
Flying emirate back to Oz (again)
Empty flight so great - went down the back to seek out a few rows to myself! Trouble was the FA's insisted on waking me up everytime the seatbelt sign went on to put on a lapstrap! Most off pis**ng . Anyway can this be done whilst lying down. I couldnt fumble it!! So dont think so. Bit of an over reaction in my opinion! Dont think Id have come off the seat too far regardless. Hit some real Turb out of Christchurch this year on J* and without holding on I reckon Id have gone through the roof!! Very unnerving when youve attended many a Flight safety course!!
Anyone else been woken for no apparent reason or is this Industry standard - i.e Stewards dont need to think and use common sense - just follow the rule book and Nike - Do it !!
DogGone
PD A customer in our cafe today advised he and his family incl 4 very loud young kids are flying BN back to LHR for Xmas on EK. May be a good flight to avoid if anyone needs the date PM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Flying emirate back to Oz (again)
Empty flight so great - went down the back to seek out a few rows to myself! Trouble was the FA's insisted on waking me up everytime the seatbelt sign went on to put on a lapstrap! Most off pis**ng . Anyway can this be done whilst lying down. I couldnt fumble it!! So dont think so. Bit of an over reaction in my opinion! Dont think Id have come off the seat too far regardless. Hit some real Turb out of Christchurch this year on J* and without holding on I reckon Id have gone through the roof!! Very unnerving when youve attended many a Flight safety course!!
Anyone else been woken for no apparent reason or is this Industry standard - i.e Stewards dont need to think and use common sense - just follow the rule book and Nike - Do it !!
DogGone
PD A customer in our cafe today advised he and his family incl 4 very loud young kids are flying BN back to LHR for Xmas on EK. May be a good flight to avoid if anyone needs the date PM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Originally Posted by BurglarsDog
Trouble was the FA's insisted on waking me up everytime the seatbelt sign went on to put on a lapstrap! Most off pis**ng
No sympathy here.
Originally Posted by BurglarsDog
Anyway can this be done whilst lying down
Keep your seatbelt on (and visible to the crew, ie over your blanket) and you will be left to your own devices if the seatbelt sign comes on.
Last edited by sinala1; 26th Nov 2006 at 12:33.
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[thanks to cavortingcheetah - it's from an old post but very topical here]
Always book three seats when my wife and I travel economy. That's cheaper than business or first and usually more comfortable.
I go LHR-JHB 3/4 times a year. If you cost out the price of an extra seat, round trip on that flight, say £400 for twenty four hours total flying. That works out at about £16 per hour or £8 if you divide it by two, as both my wife and I use the empty seat between us.
That's a bargain on a double overnight flight.
1. What name do you use for the extra seat?
I use my own name. So far I've never had a problem.
2. How often do you find check-in agents misunderstanding what you have done?
Never had a problem with check in staff even in funny places where their not used to such an approach.
3. Do you have difficulty getting the full baggage allocation for the third seat?
Never had a problem with the extra 20kgs. I suspect that some might baulk if I tried to take an extra 10kgs on top as water sport gear. So far no problems though.
4. Do you come under pressure to give up the seat?
I have come under pressure to give up the seat, especially on KLM which is the airline I use most often on AMS/JHB. I always politely refuse to give up the seat unless the airline is prepared to move both of us up into business or first. You've just got to grit your teeth on this one and grin inanely at the other passengers. Something I do quite well by all accounts. On a Jumbo, the extra seat is always the middle of a three row on the port side so the usual form is a family who want to change and sit three together. Often they are standbys, poor souls, but I just hold out for the upgrade.
It is all quite kosher and the cabin crew have to go along with my plan at the end of the day. I have threatened to show the crew my hip replacement scar in the past to reinforce my need for extra room. It looks like a shark bite.
Always book three seats when my wife and I travel economy. That's cheaper than business or first and usually more comfortable.
I go LHR-JHB 3/4 times a year. If you cost out the price of an extra seat, round trip on that flight, say £400 for twenty four hours total flying. That works out at about £16 per hour or £8 if you divide it by two, as both my wife and I use the empty seat between us.
That's a bargain on a double overnight flight.
1. What name do you use for the extra seat?
I use my own name. So far I've never had a problem.
2. How often do you find check-in agents misunderstanding what you have done?
Never had a problem with check in staff even in funny places where their not used to such an approach.
3. Do you have difficulty getting the full baggage allocation for the third seat?
Never had a problem with the extra 20kgs. I suspect that some might baulk if I tried to take an extra 10kgs on top as water sport gear. So far no problems though.
4. Do you come under pressure to give up the seat?
I have come under pressure to give up the seat, especially on KLM which is the airline I use most often on AMS/JHB. I always politely refuse to give up the seat unless the airline is prepared to move both of us up into business or first. You've just got to grit your teeth on this one and grin inanely at the other passengers. Something I do quite well by all accounts. On a Jumbo, the extra seat is always the middle of a three row on the port side so the usual form is a family who want to change and sit three together. Often they are standbys, poor souls, but I just hold out for the upgrade.
It is all quite kosher and the cabin crew have to go along with my plan at the end of the day. I have threatened to show the crew my hip replacement scar in the past to reinforce my need for extra room. It looks like a shark bite.