Qantas increases A380 order
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[QUOTE=Wingspar;2934742]Again where will Jetstar fill up a A380 with all economy (OK and Star class) seats in or out of Australia?
Perhaps to LAX? 800 economy class passengers on discounted fares in one go? $A1000 return?
Perhaps to LAX? 800 economy class passengers on discounted fares in one go? $A1000 return?
With regards to the LA route,
http://www.theage.com.au/news/Nation...709485124.html
I stated,
The money isn't in economy!
A report by investment bank JPMorgan said Qantas' most profitable route earned 15 per cent of the company's overall profit, and 41 per cent of the profit from its international operations despite accounting for 27 per cent of its international capacity.
I stated,
Dixon said, with regards to the two brands, that the capital will go to where the best return will be.
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Yes, that true for today, however once the private equity buyout has been done and the government then relaxes the restrictions on other airlines servicing the pacific route, what will qf's margins be?
Competition will end qf's dominance of this route and so end the mega profits it gouges from this one route.
Then where will the best reurn be for the A380?
One qf capt 300 000++
One qf FO 220000++
Two qf SO's 2x140000+++
Total 800000+++ (per crew)
OR
One jq capt 180000++
one jq fo 100000++
two jq cruise f/o's 40000++ (are still unable to fathom how they are a A380 f/o when last year they were in a C210......)
Total 360000++ (per crew)
Now, thats what I call return on capital.
Competition will end qf's dominance of this route and so end the mega profits it gouges from this one route.
Then where will the best reurn be for the A380?
One qf capt 300 000++
One qf FO 220000++
Two qf SO's 2x140000+++
Total 800000+++ (per crew)
OR
One jq capt 180000++
one jq fo 100000++
two jq cruise f/o's 40000++ (are still unable to fathom how they are a A380 f/o when last year they were in a C210......)
Total 360000++ (per crew)
Now, thats what I call return on capital.
I'm talking about product positioning not a simple comparison of pay rates. If QF make such a margin from the route and it's their best by far then why screw it up!
The route is a premium one and the premium product will be the most appropriate. Sure there will always be the budget traveller wanting to go to LA but the real money is in the higher yield pax. Just wait and see what product Virgin will put on the route....I bet it won't be a A380 with 800 economy seats.
As far as pay rates go, gone are the good days. As long as the QF boys negotiate a competitive rate then QF will be happy. QF management have stated that already! QF flt ops have training pilots and sims ready to go so the intent has already been demonstated.
The route is a premium one and the premium product will be the most appropriate. Sure there will always be the budget traveller wanting to go to LA but the real money is in the higher yield pax. Just wait and see what product Virgin will put on the route....I bet it won't be a A380 with 800 economy seats.
As far as pay rates go, gone are the good days. As long as the QF boys negotiate a competitive rate then QF will be happy. QF management have stated that already! QF flt ops have training pilots and sims ready to go so the intent has already been demonstated.
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You're missing the point.
It will eventually be a matter of paint jobs. Sure the 380 will be painted the appropriate colour, no question.
But the real question is, who will be up the front? Answer, the qf pilots who sign the awa to fly it.
Guess what the awa will be based around?
Think qf guys won't sign up? Think again.
It will eventually be a matter of paint jobs. Sure the 380 will be painted the appropriate colour, no question.
But the real question is, who will be up the front? Answer, the qf pilots who sign the awa to fly it.
Guess what the awa will be based around?
Think qf guys won't sign up? Think again.
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Sonny,
I think you are being a bit paranoid. The current EBA for Longhaul commits the company to QF pilots flying the Dugong. Keg's post is the current understanding of the Company's position.
I'm not saying other scenarios are out of the question, just that the above is the most likely one.
Rgds
N
I think you are being a bit paranoid. The current EBA for Longhaul commits the company to QF pilots flying the Dugong. Keg's post is the current understanding of the Company's position.
I'm not saying other scenarios are out of the question, just that the above is the most likely one.
Rgds
N
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Paranoid? I wish I were.
EBA commitments? You obviously work there, and know as I do that EBA commitments mean nought to management.
Remember the SH EBA commitment to work with SH in the event of a new LCC?
Remember the commitment to provide a seat at the table for J* Int?
And don't even start about the various other EBA commitments that have been dishonoured or ignored by QF cause it didn't suit anymore.
After all, they knew AIPA didn't (post tense) have the balls to do anything about it.
At the end of the day, the pilots are being forced to sit on there current EBA's, due to the legislation and the companies unwillingless to offer ANY commitment for job security. Dixon will use this as evidence that the pilots are holding back his master plan and the punishment will come in the form of opening up the A380 slots, so as to be able to drive the price of operating it down, amongst other things.
I wish I were wrong but really, can anyone really say with a straight face that they think Dixon is all of a sudden going to start working with the pilots to fly the new toy when he has his platform to cut costs further(J* crewing and the AWOL arrangement precedent)?
Happy new year.
EBA commitments? You obviously work there, and know as I do that EBA commitments mean nought to management.
Remember the SH EBA commitment to work with SH in the event of a new LCC?
Remember the commitment to provide a seat at the table for J* Int?
And don't even start about the various other EBA commitments that have been dishonoured or ignored by QF cause it didn't suit anymore.
After all, they knew AIPA didn't (post tense) have the balls to do anything about it.
At the end of the day, the pilots are being forced to sit on there current EBA's, due to the legislation and the companies unwillingless to offer ANY commitment for job security. Dixon will use this as evidence that the pilots are holding back his master plan and the punishment will come in the form of opening up the A380 slots, so as to be able to drive the price of operating it down, amongst other things.
I wish I were wrong but really, can anyone really say with a straight face that they think Dixon is all of a sudden going to start working with the pilots to fly the new toy when he has his platform to cut costs further(J* crewing and the AWOL arrangement precedent)?
Happy new year.
Sonny,
Assume APA deal goes through and QF is now severely debt ridden.
Will GD risk everything on crewing a handful of aircraft by threating 2400 mainline pilots with all three EBA's up for negotiation? What exactly will be his threat? There is only a handful of JQ pilots in comparison and they are all busy. How will he get the numbers to crew every other aircraft?
GD has managed to be very successful with JQ because he didn't threaten the QF senior boys who have a lot to lose financially if they are touched. Take away the premier aircraft from them and watch the sparks fly! Remember the basic philosophy of AIPA for years is QF can chip away at everything but the 400 Captain's club. Even flt ops management won't shoot themselves in the foot, it is their retirement cruise ship.
Sure the JQ factor is a bargaining chip but lets be realistic. They get a better deal than what exists and they won't rock the boat too much. They are not that stupid especially with owners with an A380 full of debt!
Assume APA deal goes through and QF is now severely debt ridden.
Will GD risk everything on crewing a handful of aircraft by threating 2400 mainline pilots with all three EBA's up for negotiation? What exactly will be his threat? There is only a handful of JQ pilots in comparison and they are all busy. How will he get the numbers to crew every other aircraft?
GD has managed to be very successful with JQ because he didn't threaten the QF senior boys who have a lot to lose financially if they are touched. Take away the premier aircraft from them and watch the sparks fly! Remember the basic philosophy of AIPA for years is QF can chip away at everything but the 400 Captain's club. Even flt ops management won't shoot themselves in the foot, it is their retirement cruise ship.
Sure the JQ factor is a bargaining chip but lets be realistic. They get a better deal than what exists and they won't rock the boat too much. They are not that stupid especially with owners with an A380 full of debt!
