:Dnice bag, but the flag is wrong:=

Is it still raining???????:cool: ahhhhhhhhhh..........

only in our hearts since you left. .............................us in the sh1t

In the what?????!!!!!!!:eek: Should I revise my decision about the job?

relax.its just making fun. you know ...jokes. First i say '' it's raining in our hearts since you left '' then i say '' nnnnnot! '' get it.

Yeah, I'm cool:cool:. Joking too:ok: I'm sure that I will recognize you in Shannon by your style of joking;)

look forward to working with you . you will enjoy working here and may even find it to be a refreshing change. see you soon.

Do you two want to get a room? :}

azamat bogatov springs to mind. not such a good idea.

Temporary Accomodation in Dublin
 

I am joining Dublin next month; could anyone advise me where can I get a decent temporary accommodation. Initially I will be coming alone after few months I will bring my family. I searched daft.ie, but I don't know which part of the city will be better for me. I need help. Thanks a lot

Anywhere in Temple Bar - if you want to see the nightlife (highly recommended)

where in dublin
 

using Daft- check out the town of swords as a starter. its only a few kms from the airport/acc and has decent (by irish standards) transport links. the town itself has pretty much everything that you may need. there are plenty of other places close enough to the acc, but this is a good starting point.

A question for all you people giving up jobs in Oz etc .

Why on earth would you want to come to Ireland? It has rained non stop for the last 3 months (Irish summer ), the cost of living is possibly the highest in Europe , the health service is third world, the economy is in freefall, the rosters we work are murder, you will never get a word of appreciation from our management . In fact the only face to face you will get is when you are in trouble. You will never get a days casual leave.

If you dont believe me read the threads for the last 12 months on pprune.

Apart from all this the lads are good to work with and you will be treated with fairness and respect on the operations floor.

Any comments please.......

accommodation.
 

anywhere along the coast is nice. Donabate, Malahide, Portmarnock, lots of controllers living there, Baldoyle , sutton and Howth. Howth is very nice, good pubs, restaurants, harbour, its scenic and is the last stop on the Dart line.

I'm on my way across in 2 weeks:

Well it's an opportunity to explore the world, well Europe anyway.
I have noticed, it will be a nice change, for a while anyway, the weather is a concern, but not insurmountable, tis only the weather, we'll see after I'm there for a while...
Maybe true, but life's an adventure; my decision is not financially based, if it were I wouldn't be flying 6 hours past the middle east; where I had an offer.
They look good compared to what we have in Oz and the current contract discussions the employer want's to make them worse, a little consistency will be appreciated.
Just like any other ANSP; ASA probably has the trophy of worlds worst? (and there are many contenders) We had Global recruits come in 12 months ago, all those on LWOP from their previous employer, except the Sth Africans, will be going home after their LWOP runs out; none like the management or the company.
same same. Have you noticed the TIBA thing going on in OZ, almost everyday in the last 6 months without exception I have worked in a short staffed environment, enough is enough.

For me Ireland is an escape vehicle, I hope I'm headed in the right direction; if not I can always change my mind at some time; it's not like it's irreversible; even if ASA doesn't take me back; the Middle East will always have vacancies, particularly post Dubai World Central opening.

I'll keep my answers sensible.

We get practically no rain in Melbourne any more which can be as bad as having rain all the time. Apart from that I have been keeping an eye on the Dublin weather and it is not quite true to say that it has rained non-stop for the last 3 months.

The cost of living is getting higher and higher in Australia and according to the latest cost of living figures, Sydney is more expensive to live in than Dublin is and Melbourne is closing fast. London is still far more expensive to live in than Dublin so it is also not true to say that the cost of living is possibly the highest in Europe.

The health service in Australia is not perfect either, the waiting lists for public hospitals are ridiculously long and Private Health Insurance premiums are rising at about 8-10% a year.

This isn't unique to Ireland and in some way is a bonus because it means that rents are coming down and house prices are falling.

I can't see how working 5on 3 off is murder, we work a variety of shifts from 3 on 1 off to 4 on 1 or 2 off and 5 on 2 off. We also can finish at 11.30pm on the last shift, have 2 days off then start with an 0730 on the first day of the new cycle which can make your days off go very quickly.

????? Where does this happen? If you are looking for praise from management than you are in the wrong job.

I prefer to avoid any face to face contact with management, it is better to come in, talk to the aircraft than go home.


This is the same in Australia and in fact if the current mob get their way we also won't have any proper days off. They are looking to introduce a system where you will practically be on call during your days off because if you turn down an overtime shift you will have to explain to your immediate manager why you said no.

Have a look at the "ASA Solves Staff Shortage" Thread in "D&G Reporting Points" and you will see that it is no better and possibly a lot worse in Australia. We are up to August 51st on the "Gregorian" Calendar because our staff shortages will be fixed by the end of August!

This is all you want when you work in ATC, it is the same in Australia that the people who work on the floor with you are good value and make it all worthwhile.

Speaking personally I was born in Ireland and moved out to Australia with my family when I was 7 years old. I am looking forward to coming "home" to Ireland and to experiencing a different kind of life. I have had the same comments from some of my family as to why would I want to go to Ireland and my answer is always the same.

"Because I want to experience a different life to the one that I have lived for the last 30 years and Europe is so accessible, the amount of places we will be able to see is endless."

Jackl, with all due respect you seem to have lived all your life in Ireland and it is understandable that you are tired of the IAA and the Irish weather.

Don't discourage people who have the courage to try something different and experience a different kind of life. It takes a lot of strength to relocate countries and the last thing people need to hear is generalized negativity from people like yourself.

I can guarantee you that anyone who has made the decision to move to Ireland has not done it lightly and will have done a good bit of research prior to making the decision.

My final reason for moving?

Guinness!

Maybe we can have one together if you work in Dublin :ok:

Oh and trying to finish this post, other reasons for moving.....

Liverpool FC
Dublin GAA
Republic of Ireland Internationals
St Andrews, Ballybunion, K Club, Portmarnock etc. (I play off a 6 handicap)
Shopping in Paris for the other half (not sure if this is good or not :{ )
Europe!!! :cool:


Hope this helps you understand.

Hey Block,

You posted your reply while I was typing my version of War and Peace! :}

Some very good points in your post also.

Jackl check this out also

YouTube - We still have TIBA at home...

Dublin Wx
 

Pay no attention to Jackl. It's beautiful
Dublin Weather Forecasts on Yahoo! Weather

West Atc that's the spirit
 

With an attitude and an outlook like that you will have no problems no matter where you go. I hope you take the up one of the positions with the IAA, we could do with your kind and lots more like you. I hope your attitude rubs off on a few of our more negative colleagues.It would be a good idea if one of our current Direct entries came on this thread to give an honest opinion and comparison. ''6 handicap''. Portmarnock for you. Although Donabate has a fine selection of courses. Best of luck and hope you take the job.

IN my defence,,

If I come across as overly negative that was not the intention but I would like to state the following,

(a) The last twelve to eighteen months have been a bruising and difficult time for controllers in IAA. The dispute was difficult and morale sapping for all staff and the comments made in the media about us by our management were uncalled for, hurtful and downright disrecpectful to a staff that carried out major changes in rosters, equipment and procedures without complaint . Did this make me angry .You bet it did !!!!!

(b) As regards contract staff, I for one welcome anyone who will make our lives a bit easier and allow us to get a day off for a wedding , christening etc. I admire their bravery to travel so far as i have worked abroad and know what it is like .Just join the union and dont let yourselves be used as a stick to beat us in the next dispute.

(c) As i stated ,the job itself is fine and you will be treated fairly by all the staff. As regards not getting any recognition for work well done ,if it is an international thing in ATC centres it is still wrong and it costs very little to appreciate good hard working staff with a few words of praise or a company sponsored night out. After all as far as I know we are still the revenue generating side of the company.

(d) Mabye it is the weather just getting at me as we have had the worst summer on record or perhaps the fact that i have just paid a second mortage on childcare this month .

Apart from all that we are still a great little country ..

Operation desert storm......
 

Jackl has a few valid points......I don't think that he is trying to paint a grim picture of Ireland and working for the IAA. There are certain things that need to be said. Yeah, the weather is crap.....if ya like the rain, go out and get wet!!! Irish weather is sh**e for the most of the year anyways. It does get you down and I'm convinced its why half the country is depressed!!! The IAA isn't a bad company to work for. Yeah they could be better but what company couldn't. And I think the IAA know this very much!! The one thing that you do feel working there is secure. I did anyways. With regards to the economy.....from what i'm hearing, it is in freefall. It was bound to happen. No doubt it will pick up again in the future. It IS expensive to live there. Let no-one tell you otherwise. Cars aren't cheap, petrol isn't cheap, childcare isn't cheap, food isn't cheap. I'm saying this because even tho the salary is high compared to the average industrial wage in Ireland, you still feel a pinch. If you want to go to Ireland to make money, forget it. If you want to go to feed your appetite for adventure, go for it. The grass is always a little greener wherever you go. When I decided to leave the emerald isle, I asked myself one question: In 20 years time will I look back and regret not walking away from the comfort zone and walking into something I knew little about? The answer is I would. So far so good.....but you never know. Take it as it comes. Ireland is a great place....but right now, the desert is better!!! (and hotter!!!!)....

In Your Defence
 

Jackl,
Your mood and tone are just typical of an IAA controller at this moment in time. We were crapped on by our own management quite publicly and foolishly. The troubles continue and the battle goes on. The IAA still don't realise the damage they've done . They still haven't seen the effects. They still believe that they are in control and we will capitulate , roll over and tow the company line. You and I both know that EB and his Motley Crew can, for now, and the foreseeable future go F**k themselves. The head of this organisation has been severed from the body.
In the meantime we need to do what we can to improve our conditions of work and staffing. You and I will continue to do our jobs to the best of our ability and soldier on til we get to the light at the end of the tunnel.
Any day at work that you don't have contact with management is a good day. Your chance will come to make a difference in ATC and when it does , just remember the antics of the current management regime and where it got them. That's if you haven't taken your (in demand) skills and ability somewhere (warmer) instead.:ok:
They just ain't the sharpest tools in the shed

Thanks for the information folks.

I've been lurking here for a while; obviously I've tried to be informed about the decision my family and I have made.

We definitely aren't doing this as a money making exercise. We definitely aren't expecting the IAA to be significantly better than ASA, but I hope it is better. From what I have garnered so far, it is better in terms of work life balance; even if some of you consider the rosters to be sh!te; it's what you are used to I guess, ASA is becoming the envy of the world, NOT!. :mad: :ugh:

This pretty much sums up why we are going to Ireland. Well except the last sentence. I would have loved to have gone straight to the desert, but with the family in tow it was going to be too big a challenge and too culturally confronting. (even though my first few phone calls to natives have left me thinking what have I done, what did he say?) :}

Hopefully the Irish adventure will give us as a family the courage to go live in the desert (or elsewhere) for a while when homeward bound, as a money making exercise... but there are many other parts of the world that may open up to us once we've taken the step outside our comfort zone time will tell.

Being further away from family will be a challenge, but life is an adventure, but right now we see most of them twice a year anyway.

PS, I'm coming across on a 3 year contract, being a former VP of our union in OZ, my intention is to join your union ASAP.

Hey Guys,

Good to hear some balanced discussion about the IAA and advice on what we should be keeping an eye on.

I have joined the IAA as a permanent employee and I will be joining IMPACT as soon as I am permitted too, I have already had a good look at the website.

We are unlucky (lucky) enough that we don't have any kids!

Hear, Hear!

Life is too short to wonder what if?

Thanks for that, a change is as good as a holiday as they say. I have taken up one of the permanent positions and will be arriving in Dublin on October 1st. I will be coming into the ACC early the following week to have a look and hopefully get a head start on my training, I'm expecting it to be tough but not insurmountable.

If any of the guys in Dublin want to go out for a drink or a round of Golf sometime after I arrive let me know by PM. :ok:

Sometime.ya kidding. that's all they do up there.
they'll bring you drinking first. Get that handicap upto a respectable double figure.

My two cents:

Cost of living - Rental accomodation is much cheaper than Australia and NZ, working out of Shannon anyway, can't vouch for Dublin. Food is on a par with Australasia, fruit and vege a little more expensive, but averages out the same. Utilities a little more expensive, but a better choice of broadband and satellite. Cars are very expensive, but you are buying and selling in the same market, so your depreciation is the same as at home. The only real killer is the tax on cars. You are taxed on the size of your engine, so if you want a SUV like home, expect to pay 2000 Euro a year just for registration. Insurance is also very expensive.

Work Environment - the guys/gals in the ops room are all very friendly and welcoming. First class training. Can't vouch for management as haven't had any dealings there yet.

Weather - It rains, sure, but there is no such thing as bad weather, just the wrong clothing. Been lovely here in the West the last week too.

Compared to the Middle East - There is no comparison. It's apples and oranges. It all comes down to lifestyle choice...ie do you want a lifestyle or money? Of the 5 expats in Shannon, 4 are ex-Middle East, that must count for something?

Union
 

We have seen the worse management, the management that made terrorist out of innocent controllers. I think ATCO community is more bounded and loyal to the Job than the organizations. I assure you that we will be part of you and will never work against with fellow controllers

What ^^^^^ ???????????

Very good thread this espeacially the last couple of pages. It gives a very good and honest idea of the good and the bad of both the IAA and Ireland Inc.

In general if you want to come and focus on doing your job then you have no worries. Stick with your new colleagues. On a day to day basis working is fine. As i have stated before we go in,do our thing and go home. The problems that have arisen have eminated in their entirety from further up the food chain.

Losing touch with what your core business is and focusing on extracting the absolute maximum from your bottom line have led to a management team that have lost sight of the big picture and the fact that it is the intangable benefits that make a good company and a good product. The IAA is one of the biggest ATC providers in europe and for such a large ANSP we charge the lowest unit rate or close to it every year. We have a good business and we should keep it that way.

Perhaps the last few months may have gradually opened up their eyes to the fact that by turning the IAA into the rIAAnair of ATC by just screwing with your main asset (us-the very flexible,hardworking and compliant staff) is not the way to build a sustainable business. I hope that lessons are learned from the last few years and we are never backed into a corner where we have to fight in order to make people see sense and reality.I Hope....................

Anyway rant over

To all the new arrivals welcome and thanks for coming. It does take guts to leave the comfort zone and head off. Im sure you will be welcomed and may even like the place.......but not the f"$%*ing weather!

Any Sheilas coming our way?

Dublin (great City)
 

Fot anyone coming to Dublin or thinking about it.
YouTube - It's a Beautiful Day for Dublin

Only the wives of the controllers coming over.... :}

Oh ...!
 

I was going to post this question but it's probably not such a good idea.
YouTube - Kevin Bloody Wilson-Do ya **** on 1st dates

Kevin "bloody" wilson is why I'm leaving.

In response to the question, no generally because

YouTube - Dead Kennedys: Too Drunk To **** - Finland 1981

and while we are trading in cultural cliches..

YouTube - Danny Boy - Foster & Allen

They sell Viagra here in holy Ireland, you know. Although, being a Foster and Allen fan, you'd probably take them just to stop you from falling out of the bed. :ok:
Here's one for you and the rest of the returning sons.
YouTube - Fields of Athenry
this is what you'll need it for
YouTube - Munster V Sale - Fields of Athenry

Thank you for the education. Magnificent. Makes Aussie Aussie Aussie Oi Oi Oi
rather flaccid by comparison.

It is one of many reasons for us coming over...

I will be in Dublin from the 22nd of Oct, if anyone would like a drink feel free to pm me.

I'm sure you'll give a heartfelt rendition of this ,next January 26th in Dublin.
Oh ! not to mention this

Heartfelt indeed, but will probably sound like this,

YouTube - Tom Waits Waltzing Matilda live 1977

and I'm more partial to this version of the latter,

YouTube - The Pogues - And the Band Played Waltzing Matilda (LIVE!)

and this would get me homesick as well

YouTube - Warumpi Band : My Island Home (1987)

I worked my last shift with lipservices this morning. 26 years, most of my coworkers are more like family,

this is for them....

YouTube - GOLDEN EARRING Radar Love

We'll have you converted in no time. Just like this bloke.
and you can leave this !!!!e behind ya .
Here's one for the plane.
Looks like we're soon to become the
IAA ( Irish Australian Association):ok:

No need... it's just some of the Irish that were sent to the penal colonies returning home. ;)

The Most Important Aussie Band.

And presciently, they foretold the IAA in 1976...