CJayne is correct.

It does depend on how much you want the information and subsequently, how much you want that job!

I've had no hesitation in reading and often re-reading the posts, with great interest. In fact there were times when my reading got carried away late into the night!

I believe a decent degree of motivation is definitely required. Try to absorb the information on here. If you're really determined to get the job, frequenting this forum and other sources of information should help put you in the right frame of mind.

Best of luck. I have now booked my Stage 2, though it's not until the 18th August [earliest possible date!]

At least you don't have to learn much of the information on here - it's all hints and tips to help with the selection process.

Once at the college no doubt the amount of reading required to be done and learnt will make this lot pale in comparison I'm sure! :)

There probably is some merit in tidying this thread up, but I'm not sure who would want that job! :eek:

I am someone who comes on here to offer advice every now and then because I've been through the application proecedure and the advice I am currently offering is that reading through the 200 page long thread is not really going to be the best use of your time in preparing for the interviews. I believe the advice on the current application procedure can be summed up in about a sentence for each stage:

Stage 1:
Learn all the motivation info they send you and practice the exercises e.g. cubes, until you are confident. Seek further examples to practice, I bought a book.

Stage 2:
This was a complete day of computer tests for me, you cannot prepare for it apart from practicing a few more cubes if you are not confident with them.

Stage 3:
Prepare answers to standard interview questions reference motivation etc and have real life examples ready.

What I'm getting at here is that the comment is often made that people should go back and read the whole thread when really they only need a couple of things clarified. I don't believe there is any value in reading this whole thread unless you happen to have the spare time and are interested in other applicants' experiences. I read the latest stuff every now and then and that's just been because it's interesting to see how others are getting on or to check if I can help by answering any questions. I've never felt any need to read the whole thing.

Slight thread deviation I know, but, do candidates applying to to BAE Cwmbran and ASTAC have to sit through long division and 'cubes'?
By the way, early last year I asked what 'cubes' have got to do with Air Traffic Control. Has anyone found out yet? :E

They test spatial awareness. Are you trying to say that spatial awareness has no place in ATC?

Certainly not.
But, "How do they do that"?
- Hang on, we've been here before.

errrrr.....

....... :confused: :ugh:

What the hell are "diagramming tests"'?
Diagrams of what? - The UK Airways system perchance? :}

ATC Hopeful
 

I think maybe because long term posters don't want to look through the whole thread again and find the relevant pages with regards to whatever is being asked at the time is why the general 'read through the whole thread' reply is used. It's down to the people who want the information to go and find it for themselves! I agree that the thread is getting very long indeed, however it is the same stuff again and again and I admire the people who do bother to take the time to reply to people asking the same stuff over and over even if it is just a quick 'read the whole thread'. In a few weeks time someone will ask for information about the stages and someone else will post 'There is a post somewhere in this thread where someone has outlined in 3 sentences what is required of you to do'. Your post itself will get caught up way down the line where people won't be able to find it without really looking...without, maybe, reading through the whole thread...and some people will find it useful to do that.

I believe that there is simply too much information that can be missed by not reading it all and picking out the relevant stuff - even maybe just by skim reading it, sifting out the stuff you don't need. And maybe the bigger point is that if you don't have the time to be reading a post whilst revising for the stages, then what are you doing wasting time on a message board in the first place?!;)

Did you get through stage 3?....I haven't read back through the posts for a long time!!:)

Cjayne
 

We'll have to agree to disagree I think. I don't think you miss out on any vital info by not reading through this whole thread, HR pretty much tell you everything you need to know. You make a valid point about people coming on this message board if they don't have time to get the revision done. I think people come on here for reassurance and sometimes looking for shortcuts which don't exist. Other than that it is just nice to see how others have got on. Also I think if long term posters keep coming onto this thread it can only be because they want to help out new applicants by answering their questions so rather than sending them back to read the whole thread why not just answer the question.

Yes I got through stage 3 and I'm soon to be starting at the college, what about you?

Stage 1
 

First they say you cant revise for the tests but yes you can, second dont worry if you dont get the cubes in initially, its a progressive skill so keep working on them. Third, all the information regarding the aircraft information you were sent thats at the end of the pack eg passenger amount range height flown, you dont need it only the first part of the pack that is the written stuff.

Ok Cube test, get this book Psychometric Tests for Dummies: Amazon.co.uk: Liam Healy: Books and use the net of cubes, aim to do all the questions in 7 mins, after a few weeks at it i could do them in 2 mins. 1 third of the test is in exactly the same format as these, the other 2 thirds are difficult but the revision will help a hell of a lot.

Time speed distance test, this is basic maths but its a lot of calculations in a small period of time. I would start but getting your 6 times table down as much as possible and when it comes to questions work out miles per min for example if aircraft a is doing 480 knots and aircraft b is doing 480 knots, both are flying towards each other they are 32 miles from each other how long till they hit? The answer is 2 mins because both are doing 8 miles per min. Lots like this, and also ones that tell you a decent rate with a fixed speed which airport is closest that sort of thing.

Logic, the working out in sequence stuff, very big paper this just work as quickly and accurately as you can, try finding revision material that gives commands such as reverse the final figures and put into a certain sequence. The amount of times i got to the end of the diagram and it said reverse or delete a command then had to do it all again was unreal but just work fast and accurately

Personality test, this is very small at this stage, the larger one comes in after you pass stage one, just be honest and try to keep the same opinion throughout

Nats questions, based on the paper they give you and an overall aviation knowledge, find out the distance from london to glasgow and london to brussels, they are a few time speed distance questions in the mix here as well, DME distance measuring equipment is range to a beacon, VOR ADF are direction, Glideslope is the angle of decent on the ILS, Localiser is the indicator of being left or right of track on the ILS

Be warned there is alot of outdated stuff in the info that NATS send out, outdated in the sense that alot more aviation knowledge is tested that is not supplied.

I passed stage 1 and the personality questionaire, just waiting to hear my results from stage 2 so if im not suicidal after hearing them i will right a full breakdown of that test here as well

Good luck to you all, apologies about the spelling

DBB

is all that in stage 1!?!?!?!

Yep Afraid so

Wait till you get to stage 2!

DBB

deltacat!

almost a week gone now and no news yet... - how about you?

ps i'm the one who gave you a lift back to the station :p

ATC Stage 3
 

Hi guys,

I was wondering if anyone maybe able to throw me a lifeline?
I have spent days hunting for books on ATC in every shop, library and anywhere with even a hint of selling a book, only to find it's like searching for the missing link!! Not only have i been completely unsuccessful but all i am left with after my endeavour is blistered feet and a disheartened feeling!:ugh:
The only copy of Graham dukes ABC Air Traffic (original cost £8.99) i could find was in a out the way grotty second hand book shop, and they were asking £60 which is a ridiculous mark up!:(
Does anyone have a copy they'd be willing to sell/loan? I have a crazy siberian husky i could swop..lol;)... Joking aside I would be beyond greatful if anyone could help me! Or even point me in a direction where i may have more success in locating books i could use for research to help with stage 3...

Thanks guys

Natasha, certainly some libraries do have it (Surrey county libraries do) so you could go back to the library and see if you can sort out an inter-library service loan (where your local library service requests it from another library service).

Alternatively, I believe the new version should be out fairly soon or you could look at bookfinder.com and find a used copy for a few pounds.

jonathanB
 

Thank you! I will speak to my library and request a copy from surrey if they can arrange it.
I have an order in place for the new release on 6th Aug, however this is only days before my interview and does not give me much time!
I have ordered and paid for a copy of the old book from a supplier on amazon, only to find that they too have delayed sending the book to me for reasons unknown.:rolleyes:
I will have a look on the booker website and hopefully have more success!:8

Thanks so much:ok:

NatashaD
 

NatashaD,

If you're still after an immediate copy of the Graham Duke ATC book, I have the 6th, 8th and 9th editions, I'd be willing to part with a couple if you're interested. :)

Tim91
 

Thank you!!

You are a legend!

I have messaged you my contact details.

Again thank you:)

I managed to find a new copy of the 9th edition in a little HAM bookstore in Dorset (did a LOT of phoning to find it)

Need it until the 28th, but happy to flog it on at cost after that

College
 

Hi I'm new here and am not sure if this is the right place to ask this but here goes!

I've recently passed stage 3 and am awaiting my medical before being posted at the college. I was wondering how leave was determined at the college? How many weeks do you get and is it built into the course or can you take it whenever? I basically wanting to knowif it would be possible to take leave in December.

Thanks

Nigel

The leave is pre programmed into the course. I'm not entirely sure when the leave is though. (i've not started yet, i'm on the october aero course). I assume though that christmas and major holidays are taken off as normal (even though as atc's we wouldnt get that pleasure)

The college try and tell you when your leave should be when you start at the college, but there's no guarantees that it will stay the same as what they told you at the start!

And yes, we do get Christmas and bank holidays off :)

Chrisby!

Hey! No news this side either. Thanks for the lift again. Did you make it to S'hampton ok?

helpful website
 

Aptitude Test Examples | Practice Aptitude Tests | Free Psychometric Test | Personality Tests | Verbal Reasoning this is a helpful website with some cubes and various other helpful practice tests. it is not exactly what is on the test but having completed all stages in UK and Australia it certainly helped

Be advised that you will get christmas off, but there is no guarantee that you won't be working on christmas eve.

The initial tests
 

Hi guys,

I am new to all of this and sat the initial entry exam yesterday so thought I would share my experience with you.

I believe the test has changed a little to what it used to be (although I am going on people's threads not experience).

We arrived at the Nats centre in Whiteley, Southampton and filled out a long 'personality questionnaire'. They say it is not part of the exam but a few friends who work in HR say they put it into a computer and it tells them what kind of person you are and whether you're depressed etc.

After this we all went into a room to sit 4 exams. The first being the motivation paper. I was worried about learning all the specs of the planes but you honestly don't need to know how many people can sit on a 737-200 series. If you read everything they give you you should be fine with this.

Next cam the spatial awareness test . OMG I HAVE NEVER EVER SAT ANYTHING SO HARD IN MY LIFE!! I had practiced many of these online but nothing can prepare you for the one they give you. I think there were 40 questions to complete in 20 minutes. An absolute impossibility!! The first couple are fine as the net is in the traditional T shape. However the 2nd and 3rd nets are very tricky to assemble in your head let alone rotate them and answer questions on them. I would say the best prep you can do for this is to design some 3d boxes yourself. There doesn't seem to be much out there on the net.

Third exam was the diagramming one. Not too bad but still quite different to the example they send you. I think you had 20 minutes to complete 60 of these.

Fourth exam was one they hadn't warned about (but luckily I had revised). It is a mental arithmetic paper consisting of 20 questions in 20 mins made up of speed, distance and time calculations. I completed about 18 of these although some take a long time to work out.

ADVICE: I don't think anyone can complete these tests in the time they give you. As they are all worth 1 mark DO NOT spend ages on a question that will take a long time to complete as you maybe able to do 2 or 3 others in the same time.

I don't think I have made it through the tests. I am truly gutted as I prepared as much as possible. Good luck to everyone in the future taking them. If you got any questions just ask

Russ

It's now been 11 working days since my stage 3 and no word! ARGH!! :\
Anyone else heard back from their s3's from wb 6th July??

alison2002
 

Hi, I was hoping you guys on the 6th had a response already as i was on 7th July, this seems to be a long time to wait, but still 4/5 more working days to go i guess !!!

Stage 3 on 7th July ... ... ... ...
 

Hey Jimmy,

Yeah - still waiting on results too; unbearable!
Wasn't too confident to be honest with the interview but I'd like to know, one way or other!

Good luck to everyone waiting at the moment...

Moo

Stage 3 results
 

Hi all,

Took stage 3 on 7th July, just had the email to say that i failed, so i guess the road ends here.

Good luck to everyone in the process and congratulations to all that have managed to get in.

Very gutted, but life goes on !!!

Hi Alison (and others!)

I sat my S3 on the 6th and just found out I'm in (medical/security checks aside) - I can't believe it!! Totally amazing!!

Hard luck Jimmy, try again next year mate.

Good luck to everyone else, whatever stage you're at - if you need any help/advice, feel free to PM me!

Steven

arghh mental arithmetic :(

i used to be really good at it but now am just crap...damn didn't no that was in stage 1

DaleyDFC, congrats!
 

:ok:
I can't wait to find out now! This was my last attempt, no more goes!
last time missed the interview by about1mark, ... fingers crossed - hopefully see you on the course!!??:confused:

Hi everyone,

I was just wondering how good you have to be at mental arithmacy? Dying to apply, did a couple of aptitude tests and the only bit i'm really dreading is the numerical tests... Any advice would be highly appreciated! :O

Mooomooo
 

Hi Mooomooo. I had my interview on the 6th and my application and all my stuff has gone back to the assessors - I have a horrible feeling I'm going to miss out by a few points. You should ring them the same might be happening with yours :{

Hi,

Can anyone tell me which course is due to start this November? Is it Area?

Cheers

Hiya Daley,

Both Area and Aerodrome will be starting around that time (course 221) but November will probably be Area (provisional dates are Oct 09 for Aerodrome at the moment, but these do/will likely change)...

Anyone else got their Stage 2 on the 10th August?
I just booked flights and a hotel and its just starting to become a reality once again! Nerves and what-not!