Merry Christmas from NATS
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Merry Christmas from NATS
As if todays news on pensions was not bad enough, all the ATSA's here at Scottish got an extra pre Christmas present......a little brown envelope telling them that 30 jobs have to go on entry to NPC then a load more in 2011 with introduction of Electronic strips!!!....A nice Christmas present indeed, great timing I must say.......not!!!!
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Not good news, and i'm afraid that is only the start, i hope that there are no compulsary lay offs, of course about 18 months ago when managment reduced the redundancy terms, the union told us (cpsa) not to worry as only a few people were going to be affected.
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Sorry to hear this. How will they decide who goes ? Will that include the Manch Atsa's ?
My "source" up North has indicated that over the last year or so the union reps 
applied for, and got all the new "safe" jobs that they themselves dreamt up, including the fancy salaries and job descriptions. They of course would have had prior knowledge through "working together at the 5***** Hotel complex" 
Is this actually even remotely true? Surely not ?
the union told us (cpsa) not to worry as only a few people were going to be affected.
applied for, and got all the new "safe" jobs that they themselves dreamt up, including the fancy salaries and job descriptions. They of course would have had prior knowledge through "working together at the 5***** Hotel complex" Is this actually even remotely true? Surely not ?
Last edited by Vote NO; 19th Dec 2008 at 17:30.
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My "source" up North has indicated that over the last year or so the union reps applied for, and got all the new "safe" jobs that they themselves dreamt up, including the fancy salaries and job descriptions. They of course would have had prior knowledge through "working together at the 5***** Hotel complex" 
Is this actually even remotely true? Surely not ?
applied for, and got all the new "safe" jobs that they themselves dreamt up, including the fancy salaries and job descriptions. They of course would have had prior knowledge through "working together at the 5***** Hotel complex" Is this actually even remotely true? Surely not ?
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No compulsary lay offs at the moment.....it is hoped that all the job losses will be taken by re-deployment and PVR'S........posted a similar comment on NATS net and got my arse kicked for it by management!! seems my comments upset someone!! ....told me they are not redundancies!!!....that said I never said they were, but I guess if no one takes a PVR then I guess 30 job losses will become just that......free speech indeed...!!!!
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Or it could be that they could see the writing on the wall! Its not as though stuff like iFACTS, electronic strips etc hasn't been well publicised over the last few years, its only if you've stuck your head in the sand you wouldn't know whats coming. EFPS has been in the main London towers for several years now. I can't comment on the northern centres, but down south any ATSA who isn't considering what their future holds is a fool in my opinion. Thats why there are loads of applicants for any decent non-ATCO job, whilst boards for GS's/ LAS's are dumbed down to ecourage people to apply for them.
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Sorry to hear the news, But not surprised and looks like won't be the last with the company looking to cut overheads throughout. Those at manchester should get their reps to find out the effects, as this could have a major influence on whether you go to scottish. If it was me i would like to know, moving a family up there to find potentially my job was on the line would not be very appealling.
Typical of the company though to hide it behind the pension announcement, spin??? well it has only just begun.
Typical of the company though to hide it behind the pension announcement, spin??? well it has only just begun.
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Yee Haa
I don't know where you work but I find your comment about ATSAs moving in to safe jobs a little offensive. Every one that I know who has "moved" to those jobs was interviewed and has worked extremely hard in those posts.
Are you saying that an incident investigator is a job for the boys????
On the one hand people want to have a safe operation with all incidents reported and investigated and then when you have some one doing that essential job it is an easy life to keep them safe
I don't know where you work but I find your comment about ATSAs moving in to safe jobs a little offensive. Every one that I know who has "moved" to those jobs was interviewed and has worked extremely hard in those posts.
Are you saying that an incident investigator is a job for the boys????
On the one hand people want to have a safe operation with all incidents reported and investigated and then when you have some one doing that essential job it is an easy life to keep them safe
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Feel very sorry for anybody that has to lose their job up at Prestwick/any NATS units. My only question is wont the VCA staff go first? I thought that this was why this agreement was put in place to protect the permanent ATSA staff. Surely if there are 30 posts to go then any VCA staff will go first. No comfort I know for the VCA staff, but when you sign on a VCA contract you know the score.
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Perhaps it will always be so. The very fact that people get involved in unions surely says something about their work ethic and dedication. Why would these people who have gone out of their way to take on extra tasks and get involved not be the logical choice for a position that may require more input than the 'stand and do what you're told' post?
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I think the suggestion is that the same people who dream up these posts write the job description to justify a salary increase over their present job, and they then apply for these jobs. They then get these jobs which comes as no surprise to anyone 
, and the salary hike ,and then palm off some of the duties in the job description that they wrote, to others. 
Nice one, if its true? 
, and the salary hike ,and then palm off some of the duties in the job description that they wrote, to others. Nice one, if its true?
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"My only question is wont the VCA staff go first? I thought that this was why this agreement was put in place to protect the permanent ATSA staff."
No they will not be going, because, (according to our last Branch Chairperson)due to a change in employment law, apparently they now have equal rights of job tenure as the rest of us. PCS sold this VCA agreement to the Heathrow ATSAs on the sole and specific point that, when push came to shove, the VCAs would be leaving first. This is now patently not the case - the VCAs are based in the Heathrow Simulator, or have now achieved trainee LPO ATSA4 positions. There is no talk of them being pushed out to make way for any future reductions in the permanent workforce of 15 ATSA2s - and there will be a reduction of 15 down to 11 in June09 for starters. If there's any vacancies in the Sim, then we can expect to be relocated to there, but if there's not, then the VCAs won't be leaving to make way for us.
If you have VCAs at your place of work, I suggest you talk to your PCS Reps to get their view on this matter.
No they will not be going, because, (according to our last Branch Chairperson)due to a change in employment law, apparently they now have equal rights of job tenure as the rest of us. PCS sold this VCA agreement to the Heathrow ATSAs on the sole and specific point that, when push came to shove, the VCAs would be leaving first. This is now patently not the case - the VCAs are based in the Heathrow Simulator, or have now achieved trainee LPO ATSA4 positions. There is no talk of them being pushed out to make way for any future reductions in the permanent workforce of 15 ATSA2s - and there will be a reduction of 15 down to 11 in June09 for starters. If there's any vacancies in the Sim, then we can expect to be relocated to there, but if there's not, then the VCAs won't be leaving to make way for us.
If you have VCAs at your place of work, I suggest you talk to your PCS Reps to get their view on this matter.
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Has anyone considered that NATS may want to part company with staff on the "old pension scheme" and then recruit through the side door new staff that are much cheaper, due to not being at the top of pay scales and being on the "new pension scheme". I think it's time to wake up and realise that NATS is now an employer that will use dirty tricks to save a few quid.
The bare faced cheek of Barrons cheery Xmas email to staff angers me, I feel as though he is stood in front of the workforce with his middle finger raised, the smug b@strad.
The bare faced cheek of Barrons cheery Xmas email to staff angers me, I feel as though he is stood in front of the workforce with his middle finger raised, the smug b@strad.
Last edited by rumouroid; 21st Dec 2008 at 17:06.
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What on earth are the union doing, i alway believed that they were there to protect ALL the staff, not quite happily eject one set of staff (vca's) to the benefit of others. If they were quite happy to support a 2tier work force, then frankly it doesn't look good for support grades, and how can they complain in the future.
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As a trainee on a minimum wage (or little above it) I actually think the costs of staff and resources involved with publishing the "Bar Stool Blogs" probably exceeds my yearly salary.
But of course, cutting back trainees' salaries a few years ago, and limiting our T&C's quite severely, doesn't seem to have helped financially at all.
We joined knowing that the trainees T&C's are much worse than it used to be a few years ago. But you accept it, because it's already there at the time you join.
Next the pensions.
I feel for my future colleagues that will join the company with the new scheme. But for them it will be normality, 'cause they hadn't known any better. Therefore it won't be too big a blow when in a few years their conditions get furtherly deprived.
Like in a perverse transitive relation, I get shafted, and I'm upset and annoyed about it. Next guy gets shafted, not only I find it normal because it already happened to me, but it also makes me accept the fact I got shafted. After all, happens to everybody... Then the next guy, and the next...
That way our conditions get constantly deprived in the long term.
It can only go one way, and it's not up !!!
But of course, cutting back trainees' salaries a few years ago, and limiting our T&C's quite severely, doesn't seem to have helped financially at all.
We joined knowing that the trainees T&C's are much worse than it used to be a few years ago. But you accept it, because it's already there at the time you join.
Next the pensions.
I feel for my future colleagues that will join the company with the new scheme. But for them it will be normality, 'cause they hadn't known any better. Therefore it won't be too big a blow when in a few years their conditions get furtherly deprived.
Like in a perverse transitive relation, I get shafted, and I'm upset and annoyed about it. Next guy gets shafted, not only I find it normal because it already happened to me, but it also makes me accept the fact I got shafted. After all, happens to everybody... Then the next guy, and the next...
That way our conditions get constantly deprived in the long term.
It can only go one way, and it's not up !!!
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AT
yes, she does! - but whilst I am allowed to peruse these hallowed grounds once again, I'm under strict orders to not explode/implode/throw a wobbler or do anything else which might increase the stress levels which my delicate constitution is currently operating under - even if that means biting my tongue when it comes to discussing contentious NATS issues!
So, with the VCA issue, the Heathrow job reductions, the fcukwit management, the total collapse of Unit morale (especially amongst the ATSA 2s), the pension issue, reduced voluntary redundancy payments, couldn't-give-a-fcuk attitude of HR to just about any request for information, the AFPEX project and its lying, conniving stab-u-in-the-back-and-nick-yer-job project team (yeah, you f&*kers know who I'm talking about!), tosspot Central PCS Reps, etc etc - yep, its looking like a Happy Xmas and Fabtastic New Year for us all!
Its good to be back...
yes, she does! - but whilst I am allowed to peruse these hallowed grounds once again, I'm under strict orders to not explode/implode/throw a wobbler or do anything else which might increase the stress levels which my delicate constitution is currently operating under - even if that means biting my tongue when it comes to discussing contentious NATS issues!
So, with the VCA issue, the Heathrow job reductions, the fcukwit management, the total collapse of Unit morale (especially amongst the ATSA 2s), the pension issue, reduced voluntary redundancy payments, couldn't-give-a-fcuk attitude of HR to just about any request for information, the AFPEX project and its lying, conniving stab-u-in-the-back-and-nick-yer-job project team (yeah, you f&*kers know who I'm talking about!
), tosspot Central PCS Reps, etc etc - yep, its looking like a Happy Xmas and Fabtastic New Year for us all! Its good to be back...