17/01/08
Beady Eye
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 1,495
Likes: 1
From: UK
Its called humour mate.
Are you saying that both lifts at Heathrow Tower were working fine the night before? I was working at Swanwick that night (software delivery and AIRAC) and the brief was that they were out and the operation was being conducted from the old tower, a decision would be made at 0200 whether or not it was likely they could go back to the new tower. If they hadn't gone back we were briefed to expect a rate of 30%, which is what I was querying in my post.
BD
I think you should check the facts in the rest of your message.....
BD
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 530
Likes: 0
From: UK
Are you saying that both lifts at Heathrow Tower were working fine the night before? I was working at Swanwick that night (software delivery and AIRAC) and the brief was that they were out and the operation was being conducted from the old tower, a decision would be made at 0200 whether or not it was likely they could go back to the new tower. If they hadn't gone back we were briefed to expect a rate of 30%, which is what I was querying in my post.
Did they leave the new tower during the night and run the operation from the old?
Beady Eye
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 1,495
Likes: 1
From: UK
Beady Eye
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 1,495
Likes: 1
From: UK
Thanks for the confirmation that the lifts were out.
BD
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 104
Likes: 0
From: London FIR
I think its bloody funny - black humour indeed, but given that everyone is ok, then IMHO I think it’s perfectly alright to post it. If there had been fatalities, then it would be a different matter.
Good one BD
Good one BD
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,044
Likes: 0
From: UK
YS....
BA can cope because we use a computer "performance" system... which is either already programmed for S/N4, or was very quickly. If the US carriers do not have the data on board, or via their company computers, they cannot go...
Whilst they get little or not delay in using 27R, and/or nobody has got onto UA/AA etc. and said you need to provided S/N4 data or you will be delayed, I doubt anything will happen....
There are plenty of outstations we got to where the local airline uses intersections we do not have data for...
HTH?
NoD
Wig Wag 2,
I am amazed at how well 744 and 346 are getting airborne from S4/N4E, it just goes to show that full power take offs are very different from the de-rated departures they must do all the time.
The huge pi$$ take for me is why aren't the US carriers playing ball?? Every BA longhaul is taking 27L regardless of destination as they are adjusting cargo loading etc accordingly, but all the US 777 and a lot of AC767's are saying they need 27R, this is making the air positions very hard and unjustly delaying those that are playing the game nicely and accepting 27L from 4
I am amazed at how well 744 and 346 are getting airborne from S4/N4E, it just goes to show that full power take offs are very different from the de-rated departures they must do all the time.
The huge pi$$ take for me is why aren't the US carriers playing ball?? Every BA longhaul is taking 27L regardless of destination as they are adjusting cargo loading etc accordingly, but all the US 777 and a lot of AC767's are saying they need 27R, this is making the air positions very hard and unjustly delaying those that are playing the game nicely and accepting 27L from 4
Whilst they get little or not delay in using 27R, and/or nobody has got onto UA/AA etc. and said you need to provided S/N4 data or you will be delayed, I doubt anything will happen....
There are plenty of outstations we got to where the local airline uses intersections we do not have data for...
HTH?
NoD
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 476
Likes: 2
From: Hongkers
BD......only a few seconds after it skidded to a halt, just as I was going to put the second call on, I had a call from tels (God knows why I answered it!) and they calmly asked me why had I turned the 27L ILS off....
BDIONU - Thanks for the animation.
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 222
Likes: 0
From: The world's biggest beach
bekolblockage,
the 27L ILS didn't fail, as Gonzo says. he turned it off as per unit instructions. You don't have an ILS radiating to a closed runway!
Nigel,
cheers for the info!
GT3,
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=309136 I may have misunderstood the tone! But it seemed negative
the 27L ILS didn't fail, as Gonzo says. he turned it off as per unit instructions. You don't have an ILS radiating to a closed runway!
Nigel,
cheers for the info!
GT3,
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=309136 I may have misunderstood the tone! But it seemed negative
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 4,432
Likes: 33
From: LHR/EGLL
Errrr, no I didn't YS, you presume I had any clue as to what was going on!!!I believe the BAW38 passing very close to, or taking out, some sensors on the 09R LLZ caused the ILS to trip out.
BD.....we've not had BOTH lifts working since early December... I believe I was the last one to use the outside lift on the 7th December, when I got stuck in it for nearly four hours.The 'old tower' is the contingency now.It was unfortunate that ten minutes before BAW38 went in the remaining lift had failed again...I had just phoned TC to tell them that Heathrow might be transitioning back to the old tower contingency if it wasn't fixed. After the incident, that soon reached AC as chinese whispers that the a/c had crashed very near the tower as we were going to evacuate!
BD.....we've not had BOTH lifts working since early December... I believe I was the last one to use the outside lift on the 7th December, when I got stuck in it for nearly four hours.The 'old tower' is the contingency now.It was unfortunate that ten minutes before BAW38 went in the remaining lift had failed again...I had just phoned TC to tell them that Heathrow might be transitioning back to the old tower contingency if it wasn't fixed. After the incident, that soon reached AC as chinese whispers that the a/c had crashed very near the tower as we were going to evacuate!
Last edited by Gonzo; 19th January 2008 at 23:52. Reason: Formatting
Guest
Posts: n/a
Was wryly amused by the BMA domestic flight that pitched up at BNN this evening and said he could only hold for 10mins before diverting with delays 15 to 20mins and increasing.
Hello? Has someone missed what's been happening? Reduced flow rates all day, bit breezy, delays a bit unpredictable due to not knowing how many 27R departures there would be. Surely not a good time to arrive with minimal holding fuel with not even a flash car at stake.
Anyway, very good of the BAW pilot to immediately offer to swap places so that the BMA got in with no issues. Top bloke.
BAW 1 BMA 0.
Hello? Has someone missed what's been happening? Reduced flow rates all day, bit breezy, delays a bit unpredictable due to not knowing how many 27R departures there would be. Surely not a good time to arrive with minimal holding fuel with not even a flash car at stake.
Anyway, very good of the BAW pilot to immediately offer to swap places so that the BMA got in with no issues. Top bloke.
BAW 1 BMA 0.
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 4,432
Likes: 33
From: LHR/EGLL
I have to applaud BAW's efforts over the past few days. I even saw the BAW9 going off to Singapore this evenning take the 2407m 27L! And I can't remember any BA long haul a/c not being ready for departure on reaching. Fantastic work by everyone concerned.
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
From: SOUTHEAST ENGLAND (SOMEWHERE)
Yes well done to everyone.
Also to C watch in the in the Airfield ops unit.
The time given for the fire service was quoted as 1 min something, i arrived with the first fire unit and there was already airfield ops staff assisting with the evac, and then after that there was a runway to be re opened, many leaders to be done with the emergency services as well as leading aircraft around the unlit taxiways, also marshalling aircraft on to stands they shouldnt really go on and turning aircraft in small spaces.
So well done to the airfield ops unit for helping ATC and other important groups as well as the emergency services keeping the airport functioning,
And whos used to the well known phrase
"We have no stand guildance i dont suppose theres a marshaller about"
Cheers for now.
big
Also to C watch in the in the Airfield ops unit.
The time given for the fire service was quoted as 1 min something, i arrived with the first fire unit and there was already airfield ops staff assisting with the evac, and then after that there was a runway to be re opened, many leaders to be done with the emergency services as well as leading aircraft around the unlit taxiways, also marshalling aircraft on to stands they shouldnt really go on and turning aircraft in small spaces.
So well done to the airfield ops unit for helping ATC and other important groups as well as the emergency services keeping the airport functioning,
And whos used to the well known phrase
"We have no stand guildance i dont suppose theres a marshaller about"
Cheers for now.
big
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
From: Hayling Riviera
I even saw the BAW9 going off to Singapore this evenning take the 2407m 27L!
Well done to everyone involved - and btw, the graphic had me laughing
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 222
Likes: 0
From: The world's biggest beach
BD fully agree, the graphic was funny, thank F*Łk we can laugh about it as everyone walked away
Gonzo I stand, as always, corrected. Sir, I always presume you know whats going on, thats why I always ask you
I assumed you'd gone through the closed runway check list once the dust had settled! But, then I realised that 27L was never officially closed by ATC
Gonzo I stand, as always, corrected. Sir, I always presume you know whats going on, thats why I always ask you
I assumed you'd gone through the closed runway check list once the dust had settled! But, then I realised that 27L was never officially closed by ATC
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
From: Middlesex
agree with Gonzo, all the leader types have done us proud these last few days (unlike certain of our managers who have been conspicuous by their absence while we kept things running- does anyone else feel like we're in some sort of social experiment where they'll keep throwing more and more s@*t at us till we all implode?)
BD, thought the graphic was rather amusing
BD, thought the graphic was rather amusing