protecting a/ways from military?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 1997
Location: 5530N
Posts: 845
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
protecting a/ways from military?
Folks a very basic question but i'd love to know. With the increase in Russian Airforce presence snooping around how do you protect your airways from incursions?. I was reading two GR 4s were scrabbled from Scotland on a intercept. Do these bears just turn up with no warning, (naturally no flight plan) and its all hands on deck with you guys vectoring etc. Or do they purposely stay away from civil airspace?
There is already a thread running on this subject and I think the answer given there is is that provided they remain in international airspace, they can pretty much do what they want - but with both their radar to protect them from ramming into a transatlantic Jumbo and (at least in the area where they are probing our defences) and ground based radar that can spot them at FL 360 there is no real danger.
"Without warning" is not the case as somebody will have been tracking them since they rounded the North Cape .. a good 2 hours flight away from our airspace.
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...ht=bear&page=7
This long running - but with a load of recent posts- thread has responses from those far more knowledgeable than I.
DGG
"Without warning" is not the case as somebody will have been tracking them since they rounded the North Cape .. a good 2 hours flight away from our airspace.
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...ht=bear&page=7
This long running - but with a load of recent posts- thread has responses from those far more knowledgeable than I.
DGG
Last edited by Dave Gittins; 7th Sep 2007 at 12:36. Reason: Found the Thread on "Military"
Beady Eye
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 1,495
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
CAS is not civil airspace? Hhhmmm, I would beg to differ. Not that I'm suggesting that uncontrolled Airspace is 'military', its not, but CAS is (IMHO of course) very firmly civil airspace. Hence approved military units having to ask for a Cleared Flight Path or 'take 5' through CAS and all other remain clear.
BD
BD
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 171
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
No BDiONU, all airspace is military. By agreement we allow the civvies to use certain specified routes without the need for individual coordination. [Provided they maintain within 5NM of those routes and maintain FL450 or below, of course] 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Swanwick
Posts: 99
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"I remember LATCC Mil requesting coordination on a Bear being escorted by F-4s during the 80s!
"
Wow! LATCC (Mil) mistakenly requested co-ordination in the 1980s...lets bring it up 20 years later shall we
DD
"Wow! LATCC (Mil) mistakenly requested co-ordination in the 1980s...lets bring it up 20 years later shall we
DD
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by Hippy
No BDiONU, all airspace is military. By agreement we allow the civvies to use certain specified routes without the need for individual coordination. [Provided they maintain within 5NM of those routes and maintain FL450 or below, of course]
But please put me right if you have a relevant reference.
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: 59°45'36N 10°27'59E
Posts: 1,032
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
but CAS is (IMHO of course) very firmly civil airspace.
And the Russians do not respect or adhere to reg regarding CAS, it's all due regard.
For the airline pilots out there, it's also a strong rumor going, that the Russian air force is flying in the blind spot of commercial aircraft, trying to hide from NATO EW radars. Cheeky bas*****......
I think that Widger meant that the airspace is neither civil, or military. The airspace is a national resource and is managed by both the civil and military agencies. We have an established en-route structure to facilitate civil aircraft movements, controlled by civil air traffic controllers. Military ATCOs control throughout UK airspace, with the onus on the military to take 5 and coordinate passage with civil ATCOs due to the flexibility inherent in military ops compared to civil en-route traffic. At the end of the day however, we all (generally) work to the same set of rules to maintain safe and efficient flight.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Lincs
Posts: 453
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wow! LATCC (Mil) mistakenly requested co-ordination in the 1980s...lets bring it up 20 years later shall we
Last edited by Magic Mushroom; 9th Sep 2007 at 13:07.
Beady Eye
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 1,495
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: May 2007
Location: London FIR
Posts: 104
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
By the way, Concorde operated above FL450... well above...
At the end of the day it gets dark... we all get paid... and we all share the airspace :-)
One BIG happy family
Beady Eye
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 1,495
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From the height & speed sounds like one of those ssshhh, Mums the word, American 'reconnaissance' flights.BD