Airservices Australia Global Search for ATCs
Join Date: May 2003
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Diving Duck,
Unfortunately... I think you will be proven correct.
In respect of the non-selection of overseas applicants, it may be worth noting that there has been a distinct shift in Australian ATC in Area to create an environment of controllers who are more Sensing than Intuitive on a Meyers-Briggs... more processing than thinking... more following than leading. An environment where hierarchical relationships are valued more highly than innovative thought and action.
...emphasis on the word empowering.
Unfortunately... I think you will be proven correct.
In respect of the non-selection of overseas applicants, it may be worth noting that there has been a distinct shift in Australian ATC in Area to create an environment of controllers who are more Sensing than Intuitive on a Meyers-Briggs... more processing than thinking... more following than leading. An environment where hierarchical relationships are valued more highly than innovative thought and action.
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Join Date: May 2001
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Hey TT
G'day old son, long time no hear!
Regarding the topic in question....quicker than you can say "cheap overseas labour" it will be "us against them" and not meaning management in this context.
Some people will do just about anything, pay any price etc, just not to have to live in certain places in the world and bring their families up in a place like Australia.
I do not blame them for a minute, however, they initally will have totally different goals than the current workforce.
The present Aussie workforce are focussed on salary, terms and conditions. The newbies will be focussed on the passport, escaping their current abode and safety for their families...all good bargaining points from a management perspective.
There will of course be the small minority that get the passport, and immediately head off for the Gulf etc...because they can now return to Australia at any time. But that is just the cynic in me.
cheers
Regarding the topic in question....quicker than you can say "cheap overseas labour" it will be "us against them" and not meaning management in this context.
Some people will do just about anything, pay any price etc, just not to have to live in certain places in the world and bring their families up in a place like Australia.
I do not blame them for a minute, however, they initally will have totally different goals than the current workforce.
The present Aussie workforce are focussed on salary, terms and conditions. The newbies will be focussed on the passport, escaping their current abode and safety for their families...all good bargaining points from a management perspective.
There will of course be the small minority that get the passport, and immediately head off for the Gulf etc...because they can now return to Australia at any time. But that is just the cynic in me.
cheers
Join Date: Apr 2001
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CYNIC???
Diving Duck .... excuse me if I am wrong but when you are only restating history e.g. the saga of the disappearing US controllers and the Hong Kong chinese when they they became paper aussies .... does that not make you a realist rather than a cynic???
WOW no longer a PPrune virgin ...
WOW no longer a PPrune virgin ...
Join Date: Nov 2006
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I can only speak for myself here but I'm not about to just sit around while you sell me short. Yes I want to come to Oz for a better quality of life (less crime, etc) but do not think for a moment that we here don't have the same salary issues you do and have been fighting the same fights you've been over various issues. It will not be you against us, I (we) come to face the same issues you do and to fight in the trenches with you.
You will find a lot of us an assett to work with and in time hopefully appreciate our efforts in transplanting our lives to another country which will be of mutual benefit to us all.
You will find a lot of us an assett to work with and in time hopefully appreciate our efforts in transplanting our lives to another country which will be of mutual benefit to us all.
Last edited by BOK2GO; 29th May 2007 at 09:02.
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Bok, I think you speak for a lot of us.
Guys, I think you're judging us a bit harshly. Of course, there may be some like that, but in general we are seasoned, professional controllers with a reasonable quality of life, and fairly mobile at that. A lot of us have kids, and I know of more than one who were already talking to ASA before the launch of GS. We've applied for Oz because that's where we want to be. As for cheap labour, we'll have to wait and see what they offer, but I for one am not about to bring my family over from a reasonable (but rainy) standard of life to a poorer (though sunny) one.
ap
Guys, I think you're judging us a bit harshly. Of course, there may be some like that, but in general we are seasoned, professional controllers with a reasonable quality of life, and fairly mobile at that. A lot of us have kids, and I know of more than one who were already talking to ASA before the launch of GS. We've applied for Oz because that's where we want to be. As for cheap labour, we'll have to wait and see what they offer, but I for one am not about to bring my family over from a reasonable (but rainy) standard of life to a poorer (though sunny) one.
ap
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In defence of DD he is only stating what is already an Australian government policy with regards to work sponsored visas. They are only being issued as a means of holding down wages growth in a booming economy across many sectors of the Australian economy.
I suspect AsA went through the process (charade) of interviewing expat Aussie controllers to placate any concerns the government had with regards to issuing more visas.
In terms of our antipodean brothers some are leaving for safety concerns others (probably most) are just like the rest of us chasing a (better) buck and a change of lifestyle.
Once you get to Aussie and get rated don't expect any great pay rises as the workforce is so indebted with outrageous mortgages at bull**** high interest rates no one can afford to miss a pay day. AsA ain't no father/mother Xmas.
Good luck to all those still waiting for the call up
I suspect AsA went through the process (charade) of interviewing expat Aussie controllers to placate any concerns the government had with regards to issuing more visas.
In terms of our antipodean brothers some are leaving for safety concerns others (probably most) are just like the rest of us chasing a (better) buck and a change of lifestyle.
Once you get to Aussie and get rated don't expect any great pay rises as the workforce is so indebted with outrageous mortgages at bull**** high interest rates no one can afford to miss a pay day. AsA ain't no father/mother Xmas.
Good luck to all those still waiting for the call up
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Just wondering, to those who applied and were interviewed, were you told that AsA would be offering you jobs on the current ATC Certified Agreement or were contracts (Australian Workplace Agreements - AWAs) mentioned? A little birdie told me that AWAs were mentioned to the RAAFies who were interviewed. Only time will tell......
Cheers,
NFR.
Cheers,
NFR.
Join Date: Mar 2007
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CA or AWA
NFR,
I asked pointedly during the interview, whether we would be on CA or AWA and I was told we were definately going to come under the CA. I was interviewed in BrisVegas, and still waiting for an offer or otherwise.
FGS
I asked pointedly during the interview, whether we would be on CA or AWA and I was told we were definately going to come under the CA. I was interviewed in BrisVegas, and still waiting for an offer or otherwise.
FGS
Join Date: Mar 2007
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They mentioned
that they understand us RAAFies need to give 3 months notice. In corresspondence last week I was told they are still negotiating with the college when they can run a short course. We wait with baited breath.
FGS
FGS
Join Date: Sep 2005
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PMS;
I absolutely agree with what you said! The 'rub' for me was that they e-mailed me strongly advising me to apply as they needed bums in seats quickly. As it turned out I wasn't interested in enroute and they wouldn't have liked my asking price. To all those overseas controllers that do get offers - don't sell your souls; think carefully about your value and that of your future workmates. Remember supply and demand!!
I absolutely agree with what you said! The 'rub' for me was that they e-mailed me strongly advising me to apply as they needed bums in seats quickly. As it turned out I wasn't interested in enroute and they wouldn't have liked my asking price. To all those overseas controllers that do get offers - don't sell your souls; think carefully about your value and that of your future workmates. Remember supply and demand!!
Join Date: Jul 2003
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Are any of the new blokes coming in as ALMs?
Secondly, anyone who holds anything against these people applying for and taking these jobs is a fckn idiot and needs to pull their head in.
Secondly, anyone who holds anything against these people applying for and taking these jobs is a fckn idiot and needs to pull their head in.
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It is like a supervisor type role kind of. There is quite a bit of hoo haa about the process at the moment and I thought it likely that AsA would/might hire some newies straight into these positions as they are not current employees and there would be no legal issues with contracts/agreements etc as per Oz industrial law(or lack of it).
Join Date: Nov 2006
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Did anyone else get an email from AsA regarding the confusion of salary and that course dates are in the final stages of planning and that we'll be told of the outcome of our application soon?
PS. Could some of the Melbourne ATC's please PM me. There's a lot of questions I'd like to ask.
PS. Could some of the Melbourne ATC's please PM me. There's a lot of questions I'd like to ask.
Ohcirrej
Join Date: Feb 2003
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Nope.
Just added a 600 sq foot deck and hot tub to the back of Jerricho Manor...................... -35C outside? Who gives a sh*t when you're sitting in a hot tub. Just make sure you drink yer beer before it freezes.
As Plaz has said before, for some people it would be a sideways move, or even a hit with the wage and cost of living factored in. Also, as I've said before, the logic of putting Terminal/Approach controllers in enroute/procedural sectors is questionable to say the least.
Just added a 600 sq foot deck and hot tub to the back of Jerricho Manor...................... -35C outside? Who gives a sh*t when you're sitting in a hot tub. Just make sure you drink yer beer before it freezes.
As Plaz has said before, for some people it would be a sideways move, or even a hit with the wage and cost of living factored in. Also, as I've said before, the logic of putting Terminal/Approach controllers in enroute/procedural sectors is questionable to say the least.