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h&s
27th Nov 2009, 10:49
Issue being they already fly almost the same destinations from BRE or BLL. For example, only 2 destinations destinations out of LBC is not served from BRE: PSA & DUB, but quite sure they already tried them and it was not working

They may add an extra AC at BRE and increase capacity but unfortunately, frequency effect usually doesn't really work for FR, especially at secondary cities.

Can be a good opportunity for easyJet, but quite sure they won't do anything as always as their expansion so slow

kick the tires
27th Nov 2009, 11:59
eastjets expanision is measured because it has the flexibility to defer deliveries.

As I understand it, RYR cant, hence the expansion in such odd places.

janus627
27th Nov 2009, 19:40
BRE is not really an alternative as most Hamburgers - especially from the north - would not like to travel the way through their tunnel and then to Bremen - many traffic jams.
BLL is no alternative, as it is to far away, even as Rostock which is more than 200 km away from Hamburg. Maybe Parchim or Jagel, if they open an airport there, but I don´t believe. So either FR buys LBC, finds an investor or they loose at least half of their potential in this region to Air Berlin, Easyjet and Germanwings at Hamburg International.

eu01
28th Nov 2009, 13:53
In the news today:Published: November 28, 2009

Michael O'Leary expects to retire as chief executive of Irish airline Ryanair in two to three years' time, he said on Saturday.
"In two or three years' time I expect to be gone out of Ryanair," O'Leary told RTE radio, adding he would like to see the takeover of Irish rival Aer Lingus before he goes.His stand on the issue is precisely the same as almost three years ago, or is it?[February 14, 2007]

Ryanair boss Michael O'Leary is heading for the departure lounge. O'Leary, 45, says he will quit Europe's largest budget airline within two years because it no longer needs his maverick leadership, and he would rather spend time with his family. "You can't be my sort of Robin Hood jumped-up Paddy running around shouting at governments," O'Leary told Irish radio. "I'll be gone partly because Ryanair will have to change."So far nothing has changed, neither MOL nor Ryanair. But what about MOL's opinion expressed back in 2007? Isn't Ryanair in the need for change any more?

The Real Slim Shady
28th Nov 2009, 14:09
Ryanair will change when MOL leaves: the traits needed to grow the business from a few 200s to 300+ 800s are different from those needed to run a mature enerprise. MOL has always acknowledged that.

The problem that arises from MOL's departure is not one for FR to worry about:on the contrary, as the airline changes and adapts to new leadership, a revised business model and an alternate view on service delivery the worriers should be the minnows in the marketplace, easy, AB, Wizz, BA, EI, bmi ( if it still exists) et al

INKJET
28th Nov 2009, 15:05
Some interesting minnows in your list!!

All party's come to an end sooner or later, Maxwell, the British Empire, Dubia the Blair era

Ryanair's day will come, its only the when and the means by which it comes to pass nothing lasts for ever!

Boeing wont do another buy two get one free deal nor will Airbus, the airport owners are getting fed up with the Irish fair weather friend, pax numbers are falling across the UK regional market, not in spite of MOL but because of him, airlines have followed Ryanair down market and the pax are getting bored with feeling raped, it start at the car park and goes all the way to were your going!!

mickyman
28th Nov 2009, 15:08
eu01

I think the dates on the 'piece' have been changed to suit !!

MM

eu01
28th Nov 2009, 16:58
mickyman

No, the date is right, check it here (http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2007/02/14/2337812.htm).

Anyway, I don't claim MOL should step down as soon as possible. I only dare to insist he should urgently recruit a PR specialist to change Ryanair's image and add the degree of attractiveness resulting not solely from low prices. Some better route & schedule ideas also required.

mickyman
28th Nov 2009, 20:36
eu01

I think Ryanair are doing fine as they are.

MM

Wellington Bomber
29th Nov 2009, 08:13
Share price at a 12 month low

flybar
29th Nov 2009, 09:11
VISA Electron card to be phased out by most banks - Interesting to see what Ryanair do in response. It says that 30% of its punters pay by this method.

ryan2000
29th Nov 2009, 10:30
MOL said on Irish radio yesterday that they're waiving the fee for Prepaid Master Cards. These are widely available in the U.K. and Ireland.

mickyman
29th Nov 2009, 14:13
Wellington bomber

Look outside your window.....

MM

racedo
29th Nov 2009, 22:46
VISA Electron card to be phased out by most banks - Interesting to see what Ryanair do in response. It says that 30% of its punters pay by this method.

Quite a few years off yet and there will no doubt be a replacement to meet the criteria required.

fanrailuk
29th Nov 2009, 23:36
Does anyone have any experience of Ryanair recruitment and/or being sent to random bases? I've an interview in London but am a little concerned with their extremely random bases where they could place me!

Please message me.

PP;)

jferreira20
30th Nov 2009, 10:00
Press conference in Oporto on Wednesday.

Based
30th Nov 2009, 10:10
MOL said on Irish radio yesterday that they're waiving the fee for Prepaid Master Cards. These are widely available in the U.K. and Ireland.

Prepaid Mastercards now officially announced as free. Charges for Visa Electron use to increase to the standard €5 fee from January 1st.

Noxegon
30th Nov 2009, 10:20
Nice. I wonder how many people signed up for Electron (or more likely Entropay) just to use Ryanair...

Amelia Earhart
30th Nov 2009, 11:13
. . . . never furnish your accomodation at your new base with more than you can carry in a suitcase . . . .

That would be £30.

Never furnish your accomodation at your new base with more than you can carry in hand luggage observing the 10 kilo limit! :rolleyes:

pee
30th Nov 2009, 12:34
Ryanair's assertion:
The MasterCard Prepaid card is much more widely available than Visa Electron and can be picked up from financial institutions/ card issuers throughout Europe

EU Availability
Country.... Electron.... MasterCard Ppd
Finland ....... Y ............... Y.

Oh really? Please name just a single bank or any other institution in entire Finland offering MasterCard Prepaid cards? Just one? :=

Hollymead
30th Nov 2009, 18:11
So with a card issue fee , monthly fees , and a charge to actually load the card up with money , for most people its not worth getting .

Be interesting to see how this hits the £1 promotions .

flybar
30th Nov 2009, 19:31
Anybody keeping control of their Bank Account gets a Debit Card.
They are unlikely to want a Pre-Paid Mastercard.
Some of our major Banks now only issue Visa Cards and have moved away completly from Mastercard.
Electron Cards were intended for those who did not qualify for a Debit Card!
This is another ploy by Ryanair to ensure that most of their punters have to pay their extortionate card fees.
Dont forget that they charge £5 per person per sector so a return flight for two people costs £20. Other airlines charge a flat fee per complete booking.

Wellington Bomber
1st Dec 2009, 07:47
Mickeyman

My head is always looking out of the window, looking for altitude busting Ryanair aircraft, seeing as they are always nearly number one on the list:rolleyes:

GnRdL
1st Dec 2009, 09:57
3 New Aircrafts at ALC airport
7 New Destinations
3 Million Pax/Year

In Spanish:


3 nuevos aviones, 7 nuevas rutas y 3 millones de pasajeros al año en Alicante
a partir de 2010


Ryanair, la aerolínea favorita del mundo, ha anunciado hoy 1 de diciembre, que a partir de Marzo de 2010, añadirá tres nuevos aviones (nueve en total), abrirá siete nuevas rutas (56 en total) y transportará tres millones de pasajeros al año en su base de Alicante, manteniendo 3.000 puestos de trabajo. Ryanair operará cerca de 500 vuelos semanales desde y hacia Alicante lo que supone una inversión en el aeropuerto de más de 600 millones de dólares.

Las nuevas rutas a Altemburgo, Cracovia, Sevilla, Smaland (Vaxjo), Estocolmo (Vasteras), Valladolid y Venecia (Treviso), así como el incremento de frecuencias en 9 rutas permitirán disponer de más tarifas bajas, competencia y posibilidad de elección a un número aún mayor de consumidores españoles y turistas.

[...]

Hoy en Alicante Michael O’Leary ha dicho,

“En Ryanair estamos entusiasmados de anunciar tres nuevos aviones y siete nuevas rutas desde Alicante a partir de Marzo, que nos permitirán ofrecer más tarifas bajas, competencia y libertad de elección a un número cada vez mayor de turistas y consumidores españoles.

Las nuevas rutas de Ryanair así como el incremento de frecuencias en rutas existentes permitirán generar tres millones de pasajeros anuales y el mantenimiento de al menos 3.000 puestos de trabajo en Alicante y su región.

Ryanair celebra estos nuevos tres aviones, rutas y frecuencias sacando a la venta una oferta de Navidad de 250.000 billetes a 5€ para viajar en más de 500 rutas de Ryanair a finales de Diciembre. La oferta esta disponible hasta la medianoche del jueves y la demanda promete ser enorme.”

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/710/nuevasrutasryrenalc.png (http://img37.imageshack.us/i/nuevasrutasryrenalc.png/)

*****

jferreira20
2nd Dec 2009, 07:24
Press conference this afternoon in Porto.

Lots of rumours about it:

- 2 new planes to be based in Porto (I think this is the strongest rumour)
- Base in Faro
- Any information about starting operations in Lisbon.

globetrotter79
2nd Dec 2009, 07:54
Not so sure about LIS.
I can see between 3 and 5 FR aircraft being based in FAO by the summer.

jferreira20
2nd Dec 2009, 08:19
I'm pretty sure they won't announce that they will start flying from and to Lisbon, but I think it's possible that they make some demands, or so. It's public here in Portugal that they interest in it, and that an important person form Ryanair visited LIS two weeks ago.

btw, OPO-Bristol, OPO-LPL and OPO-BHX are back in the summer with two flights per week. These flights will be operated by UK based aircrafts.

VanBosh
2nd Dec 2009, 10:08
Press conference this afternoon in Porto.

Lots of rumours about it:

- 2 new planes to be based in Porto (I think this is the strongest rumour)
- Base in Faro
- Any information about starting operations in Lisbon.

I assume if it was a Lisbon or Faro base the conference would be at either airport, so I reckon a few more aircraft for porto.

How many are there at the moment?

Charlie Roy
2nd Dec 2009, 10:19
I wonder will Ryanair launch more domestic routes in Portugal, namely to the islands (Madeira and the Azores)?

jferreira20
2nd Dec 2009, 10:42
Madeira has very expensive taxes and there a huge aviation lobby in Azores.

jferreira20
2nd Dec 2009, 15:52
Any news about Porto's press conference?

eu01
2nd Dec 2009, 16:41
To celebrate the launch of the new page (website) in Portuguese, Ryanair releases 250 thousand seats at the price of 5 euros, as Christmas gift. Really! :}

Shingles
2nd Dec 2009, 17:10
After the news of the impending death of the Visa Electron card, we now know how Ryanair is going to play it (http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009...ryanair-charge-visa-electron-users). You'll still be able to avoid booking fees though, apparently (http://insidetraveller.co.uk/blog/?p=629), if you're clever.

MAN777
2nd Dec 2009, 17:25
Am I right in assuming that Ryanair have to offer at least one form of free payment method because if it charged a fee for all cards then advertised prices would have to include credit/debit card fees ??

ara01jbb
2nd Dec 2009, 17:32
Yep, MAN777, you are indeed right.

Likewise, you'll notice that the £5 online check-in fee never applies to 'sale' fares (i.e. whichever are included in the current promotion). Ryanair never advertises any fare other than the current promotion, so if you choose a flight that's not included in the current promotion, you'll get stung for another £5 per person per sector.

This is slightly more subtle, because the law seems to state you can't advertise a fare that accrues an additional fee. FR avoid the debit/credit card fee by always exempting one type of card. They get round the online check-in fee by simply never advertising those fares that have it added.

Noxegon
2nd Dec 2009, 17:44
After the news of the impending death of the Visa Electron card, we now know how Ryanair is going to play it. You'll still be able to avoid booking fees though, apparently, if you're clever.

...and a permanent UK resident, at least with that linked card.

h&s
2nd Dec 2009, 19:56
I was just checking few prices for this summer, and again the same stupid revenue management from Ryanair.

Just an example: Brussels - Milan, out Fri 4th july, return 6th july, evening flights for a short break weekend.

easyJet price: 40€
Ryanair price: 125€

:D:D:D

The low brain airline is 3 time more expansive than easyJet!

I also checked many fares in June from London to France - every single scenarios or destinations (EGC, PUF etc), prices are of 120€ return. Is it a joke???

Usually, maximum revenue are obtained by starting with low prices and increase them when approaching the date of the flight isn't it? It looks like this is the opposite for Ryanair! I better understand how they can kill their yields by 20% with such non sense.

Just for fun, I will follow these prices, and I bet you that 2 months before departure, they would be at 10€ all inclusive :ugh: Two comments then:

- never book Ryanair tickets in advance - usually, best fares are obtained at 1 or 2 months before departure, except for bank holidays & special events

- quite sure if Ryanair is not profitable on these routes, it would be for sure because of the airports: too high costs, not enough marketing support etc and they will again use their favourite sentence: "reduce your charges/increase your marketing support or we leave"!!!

Easy no? you do shit work, but it's not your fault: it's airports that have to offset your incompetence :ugh:

h&s
2nd Dec 2009, 20:11
Basically, one way fares for july from Milan to Brussels are all of 60€ (vs. 20€ for easyJet). We'll see how they evolve.
I bet you tuesday or wednesday flights will be something like:
- today: 60€ one way
- in january: 50€
- in february: 40€
- in march: 40€
- in april: 40€
- in may: 5€ without check in fee (this is when they will realise that actually they have shit load factors on the route, exactly when people are ready to pay a bit more)
- in june: 10€ (same story)
- in july: 15€ until 7 days before departure where prices will slightly increase
- days of departure: 189€ (lol)
= non sense

MUFC_fan
2nd Dec 2009, 21:00
Ryanair do have high(ish) prices for next summer as they need to keep their extremely cheap seats for which they put on sale, at ludicrous prices, about 2 weeks - 2 months before departure.

They work different from other carriers for the simple reason that they use their prices as their main weapon.

easyJet are usually the most consistent airline with their fares and work with the first come first served method whereas Ryanair's is much more:

book early: pay regular fare
book couple of months in advance: extremely cheap
book day before: ludicrously expensive

Remember - Ryanair have a reputation of being cheap, so when a high percentage of Ryanair passengers (which is into the tens of millions!) check their website, the automatically assume that will be the cheapest fare on the web because they are seen as the cheapest airline. You would be amazed how many people do not shop around.

Why do you think you receive all those promotional emails from x, y and z - they know if you see a decent price on their ad, nine times out of ten, you won't check anywhere else, even if it is cheaper.

I'm sure Ryanair spend a small fortune on their pricing strategies and they will be getting their monies worth out of all of the employees who are involved working out fares etc.

Charlie Roy
2nd Dec 2009, 22:14
Usually, maximum revenue are obtained by starting with low prices and increase them when approaching the date of the flight isn't it?

I'm sure Ryanair know what they're doing...

pee
3rd Dec 2009, 11:22
Oh dear!MINISTER FOR TRANSPORT IGNORES RYANAIR'S COMMITMENT TO GROW TRAFFIC

Ryanair’s proposal to reverse Finnish passenger collapse ignored by Minister for Transport

Ryanair plan to deliver 2m pax p.a. and 2,000 jobs at Helsinki

Ryanair, the world’s favourite airline, called for Ms Anu Vehvilainen, Minister for Transport, to explain why she has failed to even acknowledge a proposal from Ryanair which would reverse Finland’s collapsing passenger traffic by delivering 2m passengers p.a. at Helsinki – growing the airport’s traffic by 15% and creating 2,000 new jobs.

Ryanair confirmed that it has requested a meeting with the Minister on three separate occasions over the past four months to discuss its growth plan but has failed to receive any acknowledgment from the Minister.

Ryanair currently offers seven routes to/from Tampere which deliver 500,000 passengers pa, sustaining 500 local jobs. Ryanair said that Finland’s high passenger charges have discouraged airlines from developing Finnish routes. Ryanair guaranteed growth in Helsinki if the government incentivised all airlines to develop new routes in return for a reduction in its high passenger taxes and airport charges.

Ryanair’s Stephen McNamara said,

“Ryanair is the only major European airline growing this year and we will be the only airline to grow in 2010. Ryanair can reverse the collapse in traffic at Helsinki Airport if the government incentivises airlines to grow but our proposal to the Minister for Transport has so far been completely ignored.

Ryanair is eager to work with Ms Vehvilainen to develop and promote Finnish tourism and we call on the Minister to explain to the Finnish taxpayer why she has refused to meet with Europe’s largest airline to deliver growth and new jobs. With Finnish passenger traffic collapsing Ms Vehvilainen must take action to protect jobs in the tourism and hospitality industries by meeting with Ryanair – the only airline that can guarantee growth at Finnish airports in 2010.”
Know what?

Generally, I do sympathize to some extent with Ryanair. I do agree that HEL is too expensive and I can foresee the need to have a low-cost terminal or airport in the region of the capital city. I do not like Ms. Vehviläinen either, she is... well, never mind. But for God's sake, what Mr. McNamara wants to achieve by such kind of statement? We have here the formalist-bureaucratic-egalitarian kind of mass-democracy and (after reading some comments) such a call will probably have precisely reverse effect.

Is it just FR, or are the mentality differences really so vast between the nations?

racedo
3rd Dec 2009, 11:28
pee

Its a way of highlighting to the electorate that you were prepared to invest but politicians not interested.

Let media and electorate ask the questions.

Charlie Roy
3rd Dec 2009, 12:03
I do agree that HEL is too expensive and I can foresee the need to have a low-cost terminal or airport in the region of the capital city.

If there is something positive to take from this is that at least Ryanair haven't "forgotten" Finland, so to speak...

underfish
3rd Dec 2009, 12:19
Does it mean, that negotiations with Lappeenranta failed? Pee, don't you know share of Russians, travelling with Ryanair from Tampere?

G-AWZK
3rd Dec 2009, 13:16
Its a way of highlighting to the electorate that you were prepared to invest but politicians not interested.

The problem is that Ryanair are usually asking the government to do the investing, and the airports to provide services for free. The justification being that Ryanair will then stimulate the economy by brining pax in, however it doesnt always work out that way and there have been a few airports that have been fleeced by FR taking and not giving in return or dropping routes as soon as the subsidies run out.

STN Ramp Rat
3rd Dec 2009, 14:47
Where does the Servisair take over of Aviance leave Ryanair’s UK regional operation? Undoubtedly the handling rates will rise and in airports with only one handling agent Ryanair have a choice of paying or leaving the airport. The interesting scenario of the Airport wanting to do a deal to get/keep Ryanair but Ryanair not getting the handling deal they want and leaving or not showing up in the first place.

derelicte
3rd Dec 2009, 17:21
Can anyone tell me how many more planes Ryanair are committed to having delivered and what rate they are arriving at? I am just curious, especially with so many currently laid up.

Seljuk22
3rd Dec 2009, 18:04
210 in service, 105 on order (deliveries until 2012) + 173 options (2008-2014)

Charlie Roy
3rd Dec 2009, 18:09
Reported in the Birmingham thread:
Canarias 7. Economía. Ryanair volverá a operar en la Isla a partir de marzo y establecerá 15 rutas en 2010 (http://www.canarias7.es/articulo.cfm?id=150147)

Ryanair seemingly to return to Fuerteventura from next summer: 15 routes.

derelicte
3rd Dec 2009, 20:15
Cheers. They're probably going to have to start being civil to some of the bigger airports soon then.

The Real Slim Shady
3rd Dec 2009, 21:29
Market forces: Mrs Thatcher introduced the concept. Enjoy.

If you own an airport, it is just a large asphalt field unless you have airplanes bringing passengers or freight.

If the airline / airlines wish to negotiate from a position of some strength....market forces.

You can dislike whoever you like and you can dislike their business practices: that is why you are a pilot and open to exploitation.

johnnychips
3rd Dec 2009, 21:36
I did think someone called JS Mill, and probably others as well, explained the theory of a market economy long before Mrs T.

The market economy also implies that the owner of resources can decide what to do with them; and Ms V, for whatever reason, has decided that she doesn't want to deal with Ryanair.

pee
4th Dec 2009, 09:15
They're probably going to have to start being civil to some of the bigger airports soon then.You don't have to be analyst to realize that at least one end of the route should be located near the bigger population centre to be successful, especially when using 189-seat aircraft and providing no connecting flights.

FR need London, even if not flying to Heathrow. In Ireland MOL is fighting with DAA simply because any other apt in the country cannot offer enough profitability. Without Beauvais or anything else close to Paris also France is less attractive, and so on. MOL has been successful getting deals in MAD and fortunate enough not to be thrown away from Ciampino so far. He will start at El Prat if everything goes well and will reduce the traffic at GRO and REU if necessary. FR could also succeed in CPH when the new low cost terminal is completed and should consider BTS as a good “two-in-one” airport serving nearby Vienna too. “Proudly” present at SXF but a bit unhappy not allowed to have an “own” airport near Berlin while BBI fees are set to rise. But not everywhere the same is possible.

FR didn't succeed in making good deals in places like AMS, WAW or LIS (so far). Also HEL belongs to this group. Of course, even in HEL Ryanair could make money by linking it with some of its present bases and thus becoming eligible for new route discounts. There are for example some 30 thousand Finns living in Spain alone, many more travelling occasionally, lower prices would lure numerous to become FR customers. But besides, it seems unlikely they FR could develop there especially well. In a way or another also Finnavia tends to protect the domestic carrier, hence the Finnish capital city is not an easy goal for anybody else.

FR could create some indirect opportunities instead.
Does it mean, that negotiations with Lappeenranta failed?
To my knowledge, these negotiations were successfully concluded this year, at least one new route was to be announced in October or so – nothing happened. We are witnessing new routes announcements every week now so it's still possible the first route to Lappeenranta will be among them. With FR however, you can't be sure before you see the actual schedules on the website.
don't you know share of Russians, travelling with Ryanair from Tampere?
Not more than 10-15%. Nevertheless I think it's pretty much, taking into account the distance between St. Petersburg and TMP. One can also observe many Russian cars parked near the airport, every day.
If Ryanair wants to intensify its activity in Finland, that's obviously the opportunity I have mentioned.

Living too far from the Russian border I do not travel there regularly,. Last time I've been to Russia in 1990's, it was so cheap there 15 years ago... But now so much has changed. Let's take the Taloussanomat (http://www.taloussanomat.fi/myynti/2009/12/03/venaja-vs-suomi-vain-mcdonaldsilla-halvempaa/200924997/135) newspaper from yesterday. “Only McDonalds is cheaper in Russia when compared to Finland”. “Finland is a shopping paradise for Russians these days, everything is less expensive here (in Helsinki)”. If Helsinki is so competitive, what about Paris, London or Frankfurt?

The opportunity for FR could lie in getting Russians from St. Petersburg via Lappeenranta-kind of airport elsewhere to the EU for shopping and leisure. Former Leningrad could possibly create bigger passenger streams than HEL, in both directions, with no need to argue with anybody trying to get the privileges and fight the competition elsewhere.

Charlie Roy
4th Dec 2009, 10:28
From next summer Ryanair plan to add 3 more aircraft at their Charleroi base, bringing the total number of aircraft to 11.
They also expect to add approximately 10 new routes. (I am very curious...)

Ryanair va baser trois avions de plus à Charleroi - lesoir.be (http://www.lesoir.be/actualite/economie/2009-12-04/ryanair-va-baser-trois-avions-de-plus-a-charleroi-741662.shtml)

MUFC_fan
4th Dec 2009, 17:26
Is Ryanair's 'online check-in fee' a different name for a fuel surcharge?

darren1
4th Dec 2009, 19:32
Of course it is. MOL is the biggest hypocrite out there, abuse airlines for adding a fuel surcharge yet has the audacity to charge for everything else himself. Unfortunately people and airports fall for his nonsense.

mickyman
4th Dec 2009, 22:57
darren1

60+ million every year...............

MM

DILLTHEDOG
5th Dec 2009, 07:02
The reason 60+ million fly with Ryanair is not because they like MOL or Like Ryanair, or the way the do business, or due to their excellent customer service record :rolleyes: ( Not )

It's because they are Cheapest !

I wish Ryanair would stop trying to justify everything they do by the number of Pax that fly with them.

I actually admire MOL, but then I don't have to work for Him or do business with Him. ( Thank God )

mickyman
5th Dec 2009, 08:21
dillthedog

60+M put 'up' with this nevertheless.
You cannot argue with the figures.
Whether you LIKE the figurehead
of the airline or his methods IS irrelevant.
I dont like WW but it doesnt stop me flying
with them.

MM

eu01
6th Dec 2009, 06:40
A new Catalan airport will have FR?Alguaire Airport (Lleida) will open on 17 January. One of the airlines to fly in will be Ryanair

The announcement came from the Regional Minister of Territorial Policy and Public Works, Joaquim Nadal.

The airport has an investment of more than 95 million euros and aims to boost tourism in the area, as with the airports in Girona and Reus.

For the next ten years is estimated to carry about 395,000 passengers a year, connecting Spanish and European cities, and generate annual revenues of close to 47 million euros. It will create hundreds of jobs, 60 of them direct.

Vueling will offer two weekly flights to Paris and Ryanair will operate three frequencies per week as well as another company, which has not made its name public yet.
If the rumour about FR coming to El Prat is true, Lleida would be Ryanair's fourth airport in Catalonia. While the place could be of some value to the tourists, Lleida itself is a pretty small city with approx. 130,000 inhabitants.

I have some doubts if this €95 million investment is economically viable, time will tell. Some reports (http://www.neurope.eu/articles/94978.php) show however that "Spanish airports had some productive inefficiency in their operations, and should have been able to cope with more travelers and aircraft, and that "economies of scale cannot be properly achieved at the sizes studied for Spanish airports, meaning production could be higher, and cost less, if the airports were larger and served more aircraft, passengers and cargo. [Spain should] redirect its airport policy, with operations being concentrated in a single airport in some areas, focusing on just one airport out of the existing three".

It's obviously of no concern for Ryanair, but even for them the profitability of the operations to some of these destinations could be questionable.

Tom the Tenor
6th Dec 2009, 14:34
Any likelihood that FR would fly to Huesca in northern Aragon rather than, say, Pau, France? I note that Iberia/Air Nostrum are starting some seasonal flights from Palma, Valencia and, I think, Seville to Huesca. I guess this is in connection with the ski season at Panticosa and Formigal ski stations.

davidjohnson6
6th Dec 2009, 15:00
Tom - Huesca is only an hour from Zaragoza by (infrequent) train. To get FR to fly to Huesca could well require local Govt paying a *lot* of 'marketing support'.

While a similiar argument may apply to Turin + Cuneo, I would imagine that non-domestic demand for skiing in the Italian Alps is somewhat larger than that of the Spanish Pyrenees

Keyvon
6th Dec 2009, 20:03
@ tom

at the moment, Huesca airport caters only for inbound charter flights run by Pyrenair (spanish domestic destinations such as La Coruna, Madrid, Valencia and Palma) on behalf of Air Nostrum, as well as thomson holidays (which is using a Monarch Airlines weekly charter flight leaving from Gatwick). Passengers flying on these flights are bound to the local ski resorts (namely Formigal, Panticosa) and they mainly travel on a package tour.

pee
7th Dec 2009, 13:03
Copenhagen Airport’s new low-cost concept, CPH SWIFT, is now materialising. The construction of a new building to provide facilities for continuous growth of low-cost traffic will start soon.

As Ryanair too expressed its interest to be one of the future users, you might be interested to learn more on the CPH website (http://www.cph.dk/CPH/UK/Newsroom/News/2009/Construction+of+CPH+SWIFT.htm).

geordiejet
7th Dec 2009, 14:13
Hey. I'm seriously considering applying to be cabin crew with FR. Can anyone tell me where FR are expanding in the coming months? I know I could be based anywhere, but I'm trying to work out the likelyhood of where this would be. So is anywhere in the UK receiving new based AC?

Charlie Roy
7th Dec 2009, 15:19
So is anywhere in the UK receiving new based AC?

From March 28th 2010: Liverpool +2 and Bristol +1.
But there are constantly cabin crew vacancies arising at all existing bases (UK and non-UK) through people resigning, moving base, getting pregnant, getting sick, getting fired.
The only bases where the chance is almost zero of a placement are probably Shannon and Cork. I don't know the ins and outs to be honest, but best of luck with your career.

potash
7th Dec 2009, 17:57
My source who is very rarely wrong is hinting that flights to Ireland/Spain/Germany and Uk will be operated from fue based aircraft now that will be a shock to the system we shall see :hmm:

Charlie Roy
7th Dec 2009, 22:48
This article (in Polish, sorry) expects 10 new routes for Krakow:
Ryanair uruchamia nowe po??czenia z Krakowa - Rzeczpospolita (http://www.rp.pl/artykul/9135,402644_Ryanair_uruchamia_nowe_polaczenia_z_Krakowa.html )

Madrid, Girona, Malaga, Charleroi and Hahn are mentioned.

Seljuk22
8th Dec 2009, 08:02
NRN gets a 8th a/c in March
new: Lappeenranta (Finland) and Szczecin (Poland) each 2 weekly & increased frequencies to Gerona, Faro, Ibiza, Malaga and Trapani
Ryanair kündigt zwei neue Strecken für März 2010 an: Ab Düsseldorf (Weeze)* dann auch nach Lappeenranta (Finnland) und Szczecin (Polen) (http://www.lifepr.de/pressemeldungen/ryanair/boxid-136126.html)

pee
8th Dec 2009, 10:10
Welcome to St. Petersburg-West!

Ryanair are extremely prudent starting just twice-weekly flights on the NRN-LPP route. Well, the airline underestimates the potential coming from across the Russian border, presumably. Never mind, let's wait and see. I live pretty far from Lappeenranta, but intend to fly therefrom to be able to estimate the percentage of Russians aboard. :ok:

Edit. Btw. Our beautiful Saimaa lake is nearby. If you don't find any reason to travel to Russia, just come in the Summer to see the Finnish nature at its best.

Jippie
8th Dec 2009, 10:16
They(Ryanair) even mention St. Petersburg in their press release.

"Was die Kleinstadt richtig interessant macht: Russland ist lediglich 20 Minuten entfernt. Bis St. Petersburg, ... , sind es rund 200 Kilometer."

Translation:
"What makes the (little) city really interesting is that Russia is just 20 minutes away. To St. Petersburg, ..., it's about 200 kilometers.

anna_list
8th Dec 2009, 11:26
Now it's Charleroi's turn:

Ryanair - 6 New Routes from Brussels (Charleroi) - London Stock Exchange (http://www.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/prices-and-news/news/market-news/market-news-detail.html?announcementId=10303024)

4 more aircraft (12 in total), 6 new routes increased frequencies on 14 routes.

But the post 2012 Boeing order looks in trouble:
UPDATE 1-Ryanair says likely to shelve 200-plane Boeing deal | Reuters (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSGEE5B70YY20091208?type=marketsNews)

AndyH52
8th Dec 2009, 11:57
How do the recent announcements on capacity increases tie in with deliveries - or are the aircraft becoming available as a result of reductions elsewhere on the network?

So far Ryanair have announced 15 aircraft being added to new / existing bases in March alone - Leeds (2), Bristol (1), Liverpool (1), Rygge (3), Alicante (3) and now Charleroi (4). This is in addition to the aircraft at Bari (2 in Jan '10) and Bari (1 in Feb '10).

Charlie Roy
8th Dec 2009, 12:27
in March alone - Leeds (2), Bristol (1), Liverpool (1), Rygge (3), Alicante (3) and now Charleroi (4)

And Weeze (1).

For completeness, the new routes for Charleroi are:

Nador (Ryanair increasing their presence on the Belgian - Morocco market)
Ibiza
Kaunas
Krakow (Wizz and Brussels Airlines won't be happy)
Zadar
Seville (about time!)

Seljuk22
8th Dec 2009, 12:53
About aircrafts:
FR has 210 aircraft (more to come until March) right now but I think only 170 or 180 are needed during this winter.
STN (40 down to 24) and DUB (18 down to 14) lost 20 a/c and I doubt they'll gain all of them during next summer - any infos on that?
SNN down from 4 to 3 last July and only 1 based a/c next summer.

Isn't it more like this:
end of March/begin of April:
CRL (4), ALC (3), RYG (3), LBA (2), LPL (2), BRS (1), NRN (1), TPS (1), BLQ (1)
May: TPS (1)

With all of these a/c I count round about 195.
If STN goes up from 24 to 40, DUB from 14 to 18, PSA back to 6, REU back to 3 and AHO back to 2 it must be more or less 220.

Last summer (July) FR had about 190 aircrafts. If it goes up to 220 it would be an increase of 15%.

Scottish Flyer
8th Dec 2009, 13:25
Although no announcement has been made, the summer schedule now on sale for Prestwick needs 6 based aircraft (up 1 from 5). There is a small increase in overall number of flights but the much longer stage lengths with many more flights to Spain and the Canaries will need an additional aircraft to operate the schedule.

jferreira20
8th Dec 2009, 14:59
At least some news to Porto. We will have now 5 weekly flights from CRL to OPO, instead of four.

Skipness One Echo
8th Dec 2009, 15:38
many more flights to Spain and the Canaries will need an additional aircraft to operate
Is it not the case they will be crewed and operated from the Southern end?

Scottish Flyer
8th Dec 2009, 16:19
Some Prestwick flights will be operated from the southern end but the current schedule for next summer has 6 aircraft departing between 0600 and 0800 on 5 days of the week - Monday actually has 7 departures! It is clear an extra aircraft is required.

Skipness One Echo
8th Dec 2009, 17:05
More likely the schedule is a WIP. I would be very surprised to see PIK get another unit this summer. This is not uncommon with the schedules, especially as they had an inbound turned and out by 0815 last year.

I would however be DELIGHTED to be wrong. Fingers crossed!

eu01
8th Dec 2009, 18:03
Earlier I have envisaged LPP as a dark horse in the region, so I'll keep my eye on it.
Today on the net I've spotted the audio version of the interview given by Ryanair's Erik Elmsater to Finnish Radio. Swede and Finn were talking to each other in English (in a funny, but understandable way). I hope the link will work, try to listen (http://www.yle.fi/media/asxgen.php?file=radiosuomi/etelakarjalanradio/Erik_Elmsater_Ryanair.wma)...

scr1
8th Dec 2009, 18:32
ryanair's latest london airport

Eday Airport - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eday_Airport)

ericlday
9th Dec 2009, 07:59
Not part of my family.

Kerosene Kraut
9th Dec 2009, 08:55
Ryanair is in final talks with Boeing about buying 200 more 737. (300 were already ordered before) However they claim Boeing's prices are still "too high" and threaten to buy european instead or delay their growth.
I didn't find this in english so here is a german language link.

Ryanair verhandelt über den Kauf von 200 Boeing 737-800 - FLUG REVUE (http://www.flugrevue.de/de/zivilluftfahrt/airlines-flugbetrieb/ryanair-verhandelt-ueber-den-kauf-von-200-boeing-737-800.16142.htm)

Avman
9th Dec 2009, 09:21
Probably to start replacing some of the (relatively) older models - for which they'll still get a good price. The cheaper the new purchases, the more profit from the sales of the older fleet.

Evanelpus
9th Dec 2009, 10:21
Ryanair is in final talks with Boeing about buying 200 more 737. (300 were already ordered before) However they claim Boeing's prices are still "too high" and threaten to buy european instead or delay their growth.

MOL sabre rattling again, I'm almost convinced he will go with Boeing.

Temet_Nosce
9th Dec 2009, 10:32
I think the price has been agreed:

Delta, Ryanair Boeing orders in jeopardy?
Delta Air Lines may abandon an inherited order for 18 Boeing 787 Dreamliners (http://blog.seattlepi.com/aerospace/category.asp?blogID=23&category=602), while Ryanair says talks for a new Boeing 737 order have broken down, according to media reports.
Delta inherited the 787 order when it merged with Northwest Airlines. But Flight International reported (http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2009/12/07/335889/delta-fleet-stabilisation-plan-throws-more-doubt-on-787.html) Monday that Hank Halter, Delta's chief financial officer, said the carrier would invest in upgrading its existing fleet rather than ordering new aircraft.
This follows previous previous comments and filings that suggested the 787 order might be in trouble.
Meanwhile, Reuters (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSGEE5B70YY20091208?type=marketsNews), Bloomberg (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601102&sid=ar3DMvcinqvk) and The Wall Street Journal (http://www.nasdaq.com/aspx/stock-market-news-story.aspx?storyid=200912080740dowjonesdjonline000199&title=ryanair-unlikely-to-place-big-order-with-boeingceo-says) quoted outspoken Ryanair Chief Executive Michael O'Leary as saying Ryanair and Boeing reached agreement on the price for a deal to buy 200 aircraft, but talks broke down over the weekend because Boeing wanted to change delivery terms.
"We're going to make a final decision at the board meeting next Thursday," O'Leary told Reuters. "Unless there's some change in their position over the next week, it's off."
Airbus appears uninterested in trying to step in, with Chief Operating Officer John Leahy telling Bloomberg: "I would have no problem selling aircraft to O'Leary at reasonable prices, but I have not seen anything reasonable from him."
Bombardier's (http://blog.seattlepi.com/aerospace/category.asp?category=2633) CSeries (http://www.nowisthefuture.com/) aircraft are too small for Ryanair's plans, O'Leary told Bloomberg.
Boeing spokesman Jim Condelles declined to comment on either order, citing company policy not to talk about its discussions with customers.

LINK (http://blog.seattlepi.com/aerospace/archives/187614.asp)

What could they mean by 'change delivery terms' I wonder?

:suspect:

Sonic Bam
9th Dec 2009, 10:34
It would be madness if he didn't but he'll do everything he can to get the price down.

TurningFinals
9th Dec 2009, 10:36
An aritcle in from the Irish Independant. (http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/ryanairs-negotiations-with-boeing-break-down-1967921.html)

Kerosene Kraut
9th Dec 2009, 10:42
So obviously Boeing accepted FR's price request but fine tuned another contract detail instead.

poss
9th Dec 2009, 10:48
MOL is clearly playing a game, one that he will win simply because of the amount of orders he wants to place. Boeing wont pass up an oppertunity in this climate to sell 200 737s.

CargoOne
9th Dec 2009, 11:41
It is not only Boeing who wants a customer for 200x 738s.. Ryanair also have to find customers willing to buy their 200+ 738s.

FR so far ordered 338 aircraft, 236 were delivered, around 200 in current operation. Even if FR will grow to 250 or even 300 aircraft fleet (which I doubt), they still have to dispose 200+ aircraft.

callum
9th Dec 2009, 11:49
Where abouts do FR's 737-800's get maintained/serviced? Do they have a huge facilty at a quiet airport?

Davidsoffice
9th Dec 2009, 12:03
Most checks are done at Prestwick as far as I know with some of the more regular checks contracted out where the aircraft are based in mainland Europe

dubh12000
9th Dec 2009, 12:38
I am suprised any airlines is looking at such a large order in a time when the airframers are looking at the Geared turbofan from PW and the LeapX from CFM. Jump in now and you could see a product coming in with a 15% fuel efficency leap in a few years time.

Also, what is keeping that Bombardier C-Series out of the equation? Looks an excellent fit on the face of it.

Kerosene Kraut
9th Dec 2009, 12:45
GTF? Think they are looking for earlier deliveries from 2013.

wxjedi
9th Dec 2009, 12:55
Like them or hate them.
Thats a impressive order in thee times.

Tom

BALLSOUT
9th Dec 2009, 13:06
Callum, Ryanair have maintainance facilities and hangars at Stanstead, Dublin and Prestwick. All three facilities handle the regular maintainance of the fleet but most of the heavy maintainance is carried out at Prestwick.
Almost all Ryanair bases also have line engineering facilities, This is simply Engineers who look after the aircraft in service while on the ramp. They too can carry out routine checks etc.

RAT 5
9th Dec 2009, 14:28
"So obviously Boeing accepted FR's price request but fine tuned another contract detail instead."

Could someone be having some fun with the kaiser of add-on charges? Boeing could go down the route of selling the basic model, but the GLX costs a wee bit more.

Seljuk22
9th Dec 2009, 14:44
As a sidenote: new flights from CRL to Ibiza, Nador, Seville and Zadar will start from 7th to 9th April and not in May like it was announced in the press release.

fmgc
9th Dec 2009, 15:18
Ailerons are an added extra!!!!

Kerosene Kraut
9th Dec 2009, 15:32
Or they have to buy them online using visa electron.

Skipness One Echo
9th Dec 2009, 15:38
Ever seen Fred McCauley on Mock The Week with the MOL buying a pint of Guiness in a bar gag?
"That's 50p Michael."
"Yes that IS cheap."
"Well it's another £1 if you want a head."
"And £2 for the glass....."

Boeing should try the same approach. Sell him 200 737 with no engines, just leave it in the VERY small print...

dubh12000
9th Dec 2009, 15:45
Maybe something to do with MOL not wanting the "baggage hold" option.

Getting back to the GTF powerplants, there was an article in Aviation week recently about Airbus making some sort of progress with the powerplant on the 320 family. They are likely to be ahead of Boeing with the next gen powerplant in anycase.

Air NZ are also to be the first customer with the new winglets.

The Real Slim Shady
9th Dec 2009, 15:51
FR so far ordered 338 aircraft, 236 were delivered, around 200 in current operation. Even if FR will grow to 250 or even 300 aircraft fleet (which I doubt), they still have to dispose 200+ aircraft.

Absolutely correct to doubt that.

but most of the heavy maintainance is carried out at Prestwick.

FR don't do heavy checks: the aircraft are sold before a C check is needed. Keeps the costs down.

dubh12000
9th Dec 2009, 16:04
FR don't do heavy checks: the aircraft are sold before a C check is needed. Keeps the costs down

Genius! :}

CCR
9th Dec 2009, 16:58
dubh12000,

I'm also perplexed why Ryanair wouldn't consider moving to a next generation aircraft with more fuel efficient engines such as the Bombardier C series. The largest version is 149 seats which isn't small and would enable Ryanair to compete on thinner routes. A Bombardier/Ryanair deal would really make Bombardier a player in this segment of the market!

jpthomas72
9th Dec 2009, 18:46
Krakow expansion:
Madrid, Girona, Malaga, Charleroi and Hahn are mentioned.We'd like to get Krakow back from Hahn, we have Wizzair to Katowice, but it's not the same. Back then, Hahn-Krakow was not around for very long. Strange with the aggressive expansion that Hahn gets so little of it, even cuts. Ryanair seem to like Weeze better these days. The German state of Northrhine-Westphalia is possibly happier to give even higher subsidies than Rhineland-Palatinate, who already sunk millions into Hahn. Operational loss is 15 million Euros/year, and erratic decisions by Ryanair regarding routes e.g. to UK don't help. OK, shouldn't complain too much, Hahn has a nice collection of routes and can probably be happy like it is. Just something not Spain or Italy for a change would be nice.

smith
9th Dec 2009, 19:29
If they don't want to use the cargo hold could they not add some stairs down to there, put extra seats in and make them into double deckers?

eastern wiseguy
9th Dec 2009, 21:23
Question......what happens to the aircraft they have at the moment? Who is in the market for RYR's (or anyones) second hand aircraft in this current economic climate?


ta

poss
9th Dec 2009, 21:27
I'm also perplexed why Ryanair wouldn't consider moving to a next generation aircraft with more fuel efficient engines such as the Bombardier C series. The largest version is 149 seats which isn't small and would enable Ryanair to compete on thinner routes. A Bombardier/Ryanair deal would really make Bombardier a player in this segment of the market!

From what I've read 149seats isn't enough and wouldn't allow the company to grow. Why get rid of 200 737's that can take 180 passengers in favour of 149?

MUFC_fan
10th Dec 2009, 15:42
New routes across Europe
Düsseldorf (Weeze) and Brussels (Charleroi) are to benefit from the ever growing Irish airline with two and six new routes respectively.


The German airport will benefit from one new aircraft, bringing the total to eight at the respective airport. This will lead to the introduction of two new routes to Lappeenranta, Finland and Szczecin, Poland from March 2010. The new Boeing jet will also mean frequency increases on a number of other routes: Barcelona (Girona); Faro; Ibiza; Malaga and Trapini. The base will now consist of 8 aircraft supporting 3,000 local jobs while carrying 3 million passengers between the airport and destinations across Europe.


The second airport to benefit from expansion, Brussels (Charleroi), will see 50% more aircraft from March as the airline invests in a further 4 airplanes for the airfield bringing a total of twelve jets. This will increase passenger numbers to four million plus and sustain 4,000 local jobs. The six new routes are: Ibiza; Kaunas; Krakow; Nador; Seville and Zadar. Further increases in frequencies will also be added to a number of already established routes:

Alicante 10pw
Ancona 3pw
Barcelona (Reus) 4pw
Fez 4pw
Madrid 19pw
Marrakesh 3pw
Oporto 5pw
Palma 4pw
Riga 6pw
Rome (Ciampino) 21pw
Tangier 3pw
Trapani 4pw
Valencia 6pw
Valladolid 5pw

Ryanair’s 4million passengers p.a. will sustain 4,000 local jobs in Charleroi in 2010.


HUGE expansion for Brussels - 50% increase! I guess that they have to put their aircraft somewhere and the UK and Ireland's resistence to reduce their rising aviation taxes won't help their own cause.

I somehow feel that some of these aircraft going to destinations across Europe could have been based on our shores.

colegate
10th Dec 2009, 17:34
The Real Slim Shady, I cannot undersatnd your pessimsism about RYR's fleet numbers. Current published plans, all of which are in the reservations system and with bookings being taken require 232 aircraft before the end of March. The current delivery rate is 4 aircraft per month. Still to be announced are the additional routes and frequencies that will inevitably be announced for later in 2010. Every month for years now RYR has announced new routes and frequencies. Sure there are cancellations and winter cutbacks. The net effect however is a growth rate that has not been below 12% per year for years now. It will be the same for this year and next year.

On this basis the maximum fleet to be operated this summer will be around 245 aircraft and in 2011 it will be in the range 270-280, maybe just a few more. The 2012 figure will be around 315-320.

What MOL is talking with Boeing about is primarily a net fleet increase beyond these figures to around 360 in 2013 amd over 400 in 2014.

The are a lot of RYR knockers in these columns but do not forget that RYR has become by far the biggest single European airline in terms of pax carried. Over these next four years its annual pax will grow from 67 million to around a hundred million in 2013.

RYR has enormous growth opportunities. It is truly a pan-European airline. In this field it is already half as big again as its nearest competitor and the gap is growing rapidly. It has achieved this by growing the market and bringing airline service to cities that effectively had none before. It can do this by sheer efficiency.

I have been a big user of RYR in the last couple of years. All my flights have arrived on time or early. Not one minute's delay. Every time I have checked baggage it has been on the belt before I have got there. I have never experienced this level of service on any other airline. On top of all that my travel bill has gone down about 40%. I can now even use my phone on board.

That is why people use RYR. It has got all the key components that people want to buy and it is becauase of that that it wiii acquire those planes and people will buy seats on those planes.

Sober Lark
10th Dec 2009, 18:59
What was in the 'small print' of a recent Boeing contract that caught MOL out and has him so perturbed?

Seat62K
11th Dec 2009, 06:55
Something to do with performance guarantees (or lack of)?

The Real Slim Shady
11th Dec 2009, 10:05
Colegate,

thanks I know all about the expansion, how many airplanes are needed per year, what they are for, and probably more than you having been at the company meetings. I also know the next 3 bases as well.

I was taking the MOL !

colegate
13th Dec 2009, 10:26
The Real Slim Shady,

I made my posting because I really get fed up with Ryanair knockers. I had no idea that you might be associated with the company in some way. I worked in airlines for many years latterly at Director level. I am now retired and it is a few years since I worked in an airline. I have a number of fine pioneering schemes to my name, attempting to get low fares approved in a time of intense anti-competitive regulation was one of them.

I would like the knockers to read this posting because it may help them to recognise waht is going on in the real world.

Fact, Ryanair has been in a sustained growth programme for at least the last fifteen years. In that time it has grown from nearly nothing to be the largest airline passenger carrier in Europe. There is no way that that can have been achieved without massive customer support. The knockers acgieve nothing, the passengers make the company.
Fact, RYR has a strong balance sheet with more than 2 bilion Euros of cash. How many other airlines in the world can claim that?
Fact, the company's growth has enabled it to break out from its homeland to operate a network that encompasses almost every European country. In doing so it has become the largest airline in Ireland, the second largest in UK, Italy, Spain, Belgium, Poland, Malta etc. No other airline has achieved anything like that.
Fact, RYR has achieved double digit growth through the teeth of a two year recession. No other significant airline in the world has achieved that.
Fact, No other airline in the world has as many bases at which saircrfat and crew are based.

Fact, RYR has brought airline service to numerous cities that previously had none. This has grown the overall European market and provided previously impossible travel opportunitiews. Ask any one in provincial Poland, Italy, Spain just how much they have benefitted from this.
Fact, with the lowest retail prices, RYR achieves the highest profits. This is done by sheer efficiency at all levels.
Fact RYR achieves the best punctuality performance of any substantial airline in Europe. Punctuality is a vital customer service standard.

Fact, RYR loses fewer bags than any other European airline.

Fact RYR uses some terminals that are vastly more efficient than those used by BA, LH etc. I was very impressed by the simplicty and operating efficiences possible at Ciampino and Budapest terminal 1.
In doing all this and more RYR has set a completely new standard.

My own experience is that over 20 sectors in the lase 18 months all flights have arrived early or on time. My baggage has always been on the belt before I have been able to get there. I have never experienced that with any other airline.

The lowest fare I paid was 1 euro cent including tax. I expect soon to be able to find a flight to somewher I want to go for nothing.

I look forward to a flight sometime probably in 2013 when RYR carry their 100 millionth passenger in a single year. It would be great to be that passenger.

thebobster
13th Dec 2009, 14:25
One reason why they lose less bags is due to the smaller amount carried due to surcharges for baggage. Pax refuse to pay it and cram things into their handluggage and buy the rest at the destination !:ugh:

Rob

racedo
13th Dec 2009, 15:29
One reason why they lose less bags is due to the smaller amount carried due to surcharges for baggage. Pax refuse to pay it and cram things into their handluggage and buy the rest at the destination !

You ovelook the obvious in that what FR have done is to force passengers to consider whether they need all that gear to lug around when cutting it in half still makes no impact on the overall enjoyment of the trip.

FR in following Flybe in introducing charges has changed the way people travel and stopped the lets take loads of stuff just in case we need it. A big benefit has been that aircraft don't burn fuel to carry stuff from country to country that stays in a suitcase.

Sober Lark
13th Dec 2009, 18:11
.and why would anyone want to pay £135 to bring 20 kilos of dirty washing home, when they only paid £35 for themselves?

davidjohnson6
13th Dec 2009, 18:33
why would anyone want to pay £135 to bring 20 kilos of dirty washing home

Nothing stopping you from paying your hotel to launder your clothes for you when you're next staying in a hotel away from home. That way you'd be paying £135 for bringing home 20 kilos of clean washing instead ! Wouldn't that make you feel better ? :8

EI-BUD
13th Dec 2009, 21:20
Colegate, well done on an excellent posting. I can concur that I have never had a delayed Ryanair (well one substantial one and that wasnt their fault at all-sick passenger on board on arrival).

The plane is always modern and quite new, it always has left on time, I have flown to all over Europe on Ryanair some flights at 1p each way. I remember the day they that Ryanair first took off I was very young. Being an Irishman, I have an immense sense of pride about Ryanair. I was flying into Alicante late one Friday night in September and there was a line of Shiny new 738s at the terminal, it was an amazing site. What was even more impressive was that these aircraft had arrived from all over Europe not just from its country or Origin or the UK! Long may their growth continue and to hell with the begrudgers!!

On the subject of Boeing and Ryanair being at odds, I would like to see Ryanair looking at a second type eg C Series and this would allow them to serve routes that are either marginal or too thin for 738, (or routes who would be attractive to airlines like BE at multi daily frequencies).

There are a host of destinations/routes that Ryanair probably wont do with a 738. Boeing ok have been good to Ryanair but for me this is Ryanair's signal to look to a smaller type and then wait and see what opportunities arise later in the next decade!!!

EI-BUD

Tom the Tenor
14th Dec 2009, 15:46
Just heard on the RTE Radio evening programme that the Irish Aviation Authority have 666 members of staff and for the most recent year for which records are available their pay bill was Euro 90 million.

I can barely add so someone will have to work out the figures for me but it has got to be a nice tidy sum per employee when you do the numbers!

That is interesting - 666 members of staff - it just jumps out at you!

jferreira20
14th Dec 2009, 16:01
Press conference with MOL on Wednesday in Faro.

The press release that informs about the press conference has exactly the same information that the one that informed about the press conference that announced the base at Porto.

colegate
15th Dec 2009, 08:47
EI-BUD. Thanks.

Yes it right tht there are routes that are too small for the 738 but I do not think that RYR will ever operate another completely different type. Their business model depends on simplicity. Everything has to be the same.

What they are going to have to do though is get closer to the really big markets which already generate vast traffic volumes for numerous airlines. They are very weak in Paris and Berlin just for starters. The Rhine basin needs more flights and routes. Scotland looks to be opening up for them if the rumours about Globespan are half true. Leeds/Bradford serves the second largest conurbation in Britain and offers huge opportunities. They can surely offer better prices and services than Jet2. There are opportunities at Gatwick. Spain and Italy are both excellent opportunities for them. The largest carriers in both countries are strapped by high costs.

They have nothing in Greece and the Canaries, particularly to Scandinavia in the winter have huge promise.

IMHOThere will be little difficulty in filling the next 200 hundred planes.

Charlie Roy
15th Dec 2009, 08:53
IMHOThere will be little difficulty in filling the next 200 hundred planes.

I couldn't agree more!

John_Mc
15th Dec 2009, 10:25
Yep, and its the most popular story on the papers website now. Not quite as sensational and incorrect as would be printed in their main competitors though. Said competitor published an article this year about going to the Berlin love parade... which is strange because it hasnt happened in 2 years!

AMS flyer
15th Dec 2009, 11:57
According other (German) Forums, Ryanair will announce two new bases (FAO and AGP) within a few days from now.... :D

pee
15th Dec 2009, 13:32
The flight reductions from Dublin seem to continue over the Summer. In mid-October FR already started selling the tickets for the DUB-TMP route for the period end March till the end of the season. Yesterday all flights have disappeared from the booking system. If not switching to Helsinki, what is unlikely, it looks like the next route originating from Dublin is to be totally discontinued.

-----------------------

Here in Finland, I've observed the surge of interest in Lappeenranta flights coming from across the Russian border.

The English-language Sankt-Petersburg Times (http://www.times.spb.ru/index.php?action_id=2&story_id=30552) has published an opinion of Mr. Sergei Korneyev, the head of the northwestern branch of the Russian Tourism Union. “It’s very likely that the flight will be popular, particularly during the economic crisis when everyone is trying to save money. Many people in St. Petersburg already take budget flights to Europe from the airports of Riga, Tallinn and Helsinki. Such trips may not be very convenient because of the transfers, but there’s no doubt that they allow you to save money,” said Korneyev. The newspaper interviewed also Ryanair's McNamara, whose answer was pretty brusque: “Our target group is very broad. We’re interested in anyone who has a form of payment and a pulse,” that's all what McNamara was able to say.

A dozen of Russian-language articles were much more passionate. In spite of my very unsatisfactory school knowledge of Russian, I'll try to translate you some fragments.


О присутствии Ryanair в аэропорту Лаппеенранты давно мечтали любители дешевых авиаперевозок.
The lovers of cheap air travel have long dreamed of Ryanair's presence at the airport of Lappeenranta. (Gorod 812).


По различным оценкам, спрос на бюджетные полеты в Европу может составить минимум 20-30 тыс. пассажиров в месяц только в Петербурге. Если взять соседние регионы, то очевидно, что выбор Лаппеенранты откроет Ryanair путь на огромный российский рынок и будет экономически оправдан.
According to various estimates, the demand for budget flights to Europe could reach at least 20-30 thousand passengers per month only in St. Petersburg. If you take also the neighboring regions, it is obvious that the choice of Lappeenranta will open Ryanair the way for Russia's huge market and be economically justified. (Ratanews)


70 000 жителей Лаппеенранты и окрестностей рейс точно не загрузят. Прицел взят на Питер, до которого всего 200 км. До Лаппеенранты можно доехать микроавтобусом за 15 евро, или на своей машине. Парковка в местном аэропорту стоит в два раза дешевле пулковской (4 евро в день). Проблема только в непредсказуемых очередях на КПП в Брусничном, за 15 км от аэропорта.
70 000 residents of Lappeenranta is not enough for a flight load. The sight is taken to Petersburg only 200 km away. Lappeenranta can be reached by minibus for 15 euros, or by own car. Parking at the local airport is two times cheaper than Pulkovo (4 euros per day). The only problem is the unpredictable queuing at a checkpoint in Brusnichnoe, 15 km from the airport. (St. Peterburzhets)


Лаппеенранта уведет пассажиров из Пулково. Лаппеенранта находится к Петербургу ближе, чем к Хельсинки и Тампере, откуда сейчас летают бюджетные авиакомпании. И появление в местном аэропорту дискаунтеров может спровоцировать отток пассажиров из Пулково-2. Если в Лаппеенранту действительно придет Ryanair, летать из финского города будет значительно дешевле, чем из питерского Пулково-2, - даже с учетом затрат на бензин и парковку или трансфер из Петербурга в Лаппеенранту.
Lappeenranta will drive away passengers from Pulkovo. Located closer to St. Petersburg than Helsinki and Tampere, where the budget airlines now fly, the discounters may provoke outflow of passengers from the Pulkovo-2. Flying from the Finnish city will be much cheaper than from the St. Petersburg Pulkovo-2 - even taking into account the cost of petrol and parking or shuttle service from St. Petersburg to Lappeenranta. (812 online)


Бюджетные авиаперевозчики окружили Петербург. Ирландский лоукостер Ryanair объявил, что в апреле начет полеты из аэропорта финского города Лаппенранта, который находится всего в 200 км от Петербурга. Из–за политики российских авиационных властей цены на полеты из России лоукостерами значительно отличаются от установленных в соседних государствах Европы. Поэтому многие путешественники предпочитают добираться наземным транспортом до Хельсинки, Тампере, Риги или Таллина, а уже оттуда лететь в Европу.
Budget carriers have surrounded Petersburg. Low-coster Irish Ryanair has announced that it will start flights from the airport of Lappeenranta, which is located just (!) 200 kilometers from St. Petersburg. Because of the Russian aviation authorities' policy of prices on flights from Russia differ significantly from those established in the neighboring countries of Europe. That's why many travelers prefer to travel by road to Helsinki, Tampere, Riga or Tallinn, and from there fly to Europe. (Delovoi Peterburg)


Anyway, the Russians seem to have much more expectations concerning this route and are much more optimistic than Ryanair itself... :8

underfish
15th Dec 2009, 14:00
Pee, thank you for observation or Russian press. There is really a huge enthusiasm about this route here, in Saint Petersburg.

Only few days of sale behind, but almost all starting promotional fares (12 euros one way) for April and May flights are gone. The price of the very first flight LPP - NRN at 1st of April is already 55.47 euros, return flight at April, 4 is 51.06 euros.

Taxes and fees from Lappeenranta are 20.48 euroes per person and the are similar for the ones in Tampere.

thebig C
15th Dec 2009, 14:06
Hey EI-BUD

Completely concur about the need for Ryanair to operate a second smaller ac. The 738 is just too big for alot of routes. Also, a more economical plane might actually open up new routes from some of the smaller airports they service. As an aside I would say pretty much the same about Aer Lingus and the A320.

As for Ryanair fly to Russia, is this 100% because I have been hearing that rumour for at least 3.5-4 years:)

C

jferreira20
15th Dec 2009, 14:46
Faro's set to be announced tomorrow.

Skipness One Echo
15th Dec 2009, 15:40
a more economical plane might actually open up new routes from some of the smaller airports they service

Blah blah blah except the Ryanair model works on the economies of scale of not doing precisely this. Occam's razor can be very effective. It keeps crewing and costs down.

GnRdL
15th Dec 2009, 18:27
News for tomorrow (in Spanish):

News in Málaga:

16-Dec-2009

- 09,30 horas: en Málaga, el presidente de Ryanair, Michael O'Leary, anuncia novedades de la línea aérea de bajo coste para Málaga. En la sala de prensa del aeropuerto de Málaga.

Agenda 16-december-2009 (http://www.ymalaga.com/economia/andalucia-malaga-agenda-informativa-de-europa-press-para-manana-16.27509.html)*****

And then in Faro (in Portuguese):

News in Faro:

O secretário de Estado do Turismo Bernardo Trindade participa amanhã, dia 16, às 10h00, na apresentação do importante aumento da capacidade aérea do Aeroporto de Faro, no âmbito do Programa Iniciative.pt.

[...]

As 25 novas ligações aéreas reforçam, ainda segundo a mesma nota, «o comprometimento do Governo no desenvolvimento das diversas regiões, bem como a aposta por parte das companhias aéreas em Portugal».

Esta apresentação será seguida de uma conferência de imprensa, que contará com a companhia aérea lowcost Ryanair.

News in Faro (http://www.barlavento.online.pt/index.php/noticia?id=38392)


*****

Charlie Roy
15th Dec 2009, 22:00
So according to that article 25 new routes for Faro. That's a huge number of routes.
I'm guessing a lot of France, Germany, UK and Scandinavia. Not forgetting Eindhoven.
(Maybe they mean a total of 25 Ryanair routes from Faro? Wait and see I suppose...)

Malaga press conference at 8:30am GMT, Faro at 10:00am GMT.

Jippie
15th Dec 2009, 23:13
Would be interesting though if they go to EIN from FAO (and maybe AGP).
Some years ago transavia.com started EIN-ALC/AGP/FAO to "stop ryanair going into every market" as they said.
This winter Ryanair started EIN-ALC in direct competition to transavia.com and now FAO and AGP could come as well. There's no way that transavia.com can sustain these flights, but ALC-EIN was the first route in direct competition and maybe they're happy with the results(and transavia.com isn't).

Master_Dn
15th Dec 2009, 23:21
Faro - Paris (Beauvais)
Faro - Madrid
Faro - Marselle
Faro - Milan (Bergamo)
Faro - Eindhoven
Faro - Birmingham
Faro - Maastricht
Faro - Billund
Faro - Stockholm (Skavsta)
Faro - Oslo (Rygge)
Faro - Memmingen (Munich West)
Malaga - Krakow
Malaga - Paris(Beauvais)
Malaga - Berlin
Malaga - Bratislava
Malaga - Maastricht
Malaga - Eindhoven
Malaga - Gothenburg City
Málaga - Santiago
Malaga - Santander
Malaga - Aarhus
Malaga - Zaragoza
Malaga - Tampere

edit: add

Faro - Knock
Faro - Kerry
Faro - Derry
Malaga - Valladolid
Malaga - Memmingen (Munich West)

and maybe more to come...

Charlie Roy
16th Dec 2009, 00:01
Malaga - Tampere

pee will be in his element :ok:
11 new routes for Faro brings the total there to 25.
12 new routes for Malaga brings the total there to 32.
Indeed Transavia won't be happy to see Eindhoven and Maastricht getting new routes from the 2 new bases.
Beauvais will be happy to have 2 new routes.
Torp must be disgusted Ryanair have found a new favourite in Rygge.
Faro to Madrid to be reintroduced it seems.
But yes, maybe more to come. New Ryanair route(s) to be announced for Knock tomorrow, so I was expecting Knock to be included in these Faro/Malaga base announcements...

davidjohnson6
16th Dec 2009, 01:43
Assuming this all comes to fruition tomorrow (and I have no reason to believe otherwise), 14 new routes from Faro, 14 new routes from Malaga and 7 new routes from Alicante all announced in a 10 day period seems to indicate one big new bet on beach routes to the Iberian peninsula.

I'm sure FR know what they're doing though !

jferreira20
16th Dec 2009, 08:13
Ryanair ANNOUNCES 38th BASE AT Malaga


4 aircraft, 39 routes and 2M passengerS P.A. from 2010


Ryanair today (16th Dec 09) announced it would open its 38th base at Malaga in June 2010 with 4 based aircraft and 19 new routes (39 in total) being launched. Ryanair will create over 200 direct jobs and offer 360 weekly flights to/from Malaga in an investment of over $250 million in the airport.

Ryanair's 19 new routes from Malaga to Aarhus, Berlin (Schonefeld), Bratislava, Eindhoven, Gothenburg, Krakow, Maastricht, Memmingen (Munich West), Oslo (Torp), Paris (Beauvais), Pisa, Santander, Santiago, Stockholm (Skavsta), Tampere, Valladolid, Venice (Treviso), Wroclaw and Zaragoza will increase Ryanair's traffic at Malaga to over 2m passengers p.a. which will sustain 2,000 well paid local jobs in the Malaga region.

pee
16th Dec 2009, 09:04
Malaga - Tampere

pee will be in his element
In my opinion FR is a very bad "matchmaker" and usually does not make any thorough research before planning new routes. Hence I suppose they didn't investigate this new route either. But... you know what? This time, possibly by chance, they've made an extraordinary decision. After Spaniards, the second-largest population living around Malaga are Finnish people. Some 10.000 approximately.

If it's a pure coincidence, "every dog has his day", they say...

anna_list
16th Dec 2009, 09:38
Here's the official blurb for the new base in Faro (14 new routes, 3 aircraft)

Ryanair Announces 39th Base at Faro - London Stock Exchange (http://www.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/prices-and-news/news/market-news/market-news-detail.html?announcementId=10313177)

And SNN-ALC and SNN-FAO "switched" to NOC and KIR (although ALC-NOC is an existing route):

Ryanair Switches Shannon Routes to Kerry and Knock - London Stock Exchange (http://www.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/prices-and-news/news/market-news/market-news-detail.html?announcementId=10313178)

Cyrano
16th Dec 2009, 10:47
Is Malaga-Tampere going to be the longest Ryanair route, then? Great Circle Mapper says it's 1824 nm as the crow flies - Stansted to Gander would only be 2061 nm great circle! :-)

Limburg
16th Dec 2009, 11:26
The new Maastricht schedules have been published at the Airport's website. FAO 3x weekly and AGP 2x weekly.

Origin Dest. Flight Days Depart. Arrival
FAO MST FR 7468 .2...6. 07:00 10:55
FAO MST FR 7468 ...4... 17:15 21:10
MST FAO FR 7469 .2...6. 11:20 13:30
MST FAO FR 7469 ...4... 21:35 23:45
AGP MST FR 2547 ..3...7 06:25 09:35
MST AGP FR 2548 ..3...7 10:00 13:10Making a total of 6 Ryanair routes at Maastricht, quite a surprise with the airport being surrounded by the large bases Weeze & Charleroi and the frequent destination Eindhoven. All of them within 1.5 hours driving from Maastricht!

Seat62K
16th Dec 2009, 13:43
Cyrano,

What interesting data!

What chance 737-800s flying Stansted-Gander- (fill in blank space)?

(Please, no responses along the lines "MOL has stated that Ryanair will not introduce trans-Atlantic services" etc., etc.; I know all about it!)

Tom the Tenor
16th Dec 2009, 14:18
Dont know about Gander but I am sure that there are a lot of Newfoundlanders that would be more than happy about a three or four weekly flight from Stansted to St Johns? I bet the Newfoundland government would be more than happy to provide some incentive funds to re-establish a St Johns - London flight in the wake of the departure of the short lived Air Canada A319 service from a few years ago and preceding that the 767 service. There must be a reasonable market there as even I know a person whom was a regular on that flight down the years.

Would be worth a punt over the course of a summer season to see if it would work so how about it? If we ask Leo nicely he might be good enough to say to it Michael?

fivejuliet
16th Dec 2009, 14:28
Going to newfoundland might be a slight problem as the 738's are only fitted with HF radios for delivery, and they would be required to operate flights across the pond. Also crew duty hours etc would become an issue.

fivejuliet
16th Dec 2009, 19:46
They'd have to reinstall them back into a practical number of aircraft, some crew may require HF training :suspect:......and other associated costs, it probably wont happen.

Charlie Roy
16th Dec 2009, 20:59
Faro - Paris (Beauvais)
Faro - Madrid
Faro - Marselle
Faro - Milan (Bergamo)
Faro - Eindhoven
Faro - Birmingham
Faro - Maastricht
Faro - Billund
Faro - Stockholm (Skavsta)
Faro - Oslo (Rygge)
Faro - Memmingen (Munich West)
Malaga - Krakow
Malaga - Paris(Beauvais)
Malaga - Berlin
Malaga - Bratislava
Malaga - Maastricht
Malaga - Eindhoven
Malaga - Gothenburg City
Málaga - Santiago
Malaga - Santander
Malaga - Aarhus
Malaga - Zaragoza
Malaga - Tampere

edit: add

Faro - Knock
Faro - Kerry
Faro - Derry
Malaga - Valladolid
Malaga - Memmingen (Munich West)Other new routes announced today:
Malaga - Pisa
Malaga - Oslo Torp
Malaga - Stockholm Skavsta
Malaga - Venice Treviso
Malaga - Wroclaw
Alicante - Kerry
Pisa - Krakow
Stockholm Skavsta - Beziers
Oslo Rygge - Zadar
Wroclaw - Bologna

After Spaniards, the second-largest population living around Malaga are Finnish people.Wow, if I'm not mistaken the only other scheduled service from Finland to Malaga is with Finnair from Helsinki?

FARO
Of the 14 new routes, 7 are to existing bases. These 14 new routes are being made possible by 6 aircraft! So far I have heard some frequencies of the new routes, and they are not very high, but granted the average sector length is long. But 6 aircraft! I imagine some of Faro's existing routes will now instead be operated by Faro based aircraft, thereby freeing up a bit of capacity at the other bases concerned.

MALAGA
Of the new routes only 2 are to existing bases. The 4 aircraft will operate rather long sectors, although the domestic flights will help to keep the average sector length under control. It's only a matter of time before we see a Madrid route, even if there are already 3 other airlines on it.


Where are the next big announcements, be it bases or significant expansion?
Fuerteventura as rumoured. More Spain in general? Barcelona BCN?
More Italy?
Memmingen and Eindhoven getting a lot of routes.
Rumours of a Krakow expansion are coming to fruition: Charleroi, Malaga, Pisa announced recently.
I think Bordeaux has a lot of potential.
A couple of Greek routes have been rumoured for the new Volos airport.

ICING AOA
17th Dec 2009, 02:31
fresh rumors about Paris beauvais to become a base...:hmm:

compton3bravo
17th Dec 2009, 06:33
I doubt very much you will see a Madrid service as there are three airlines on the route and there is an excellent high speed rail link which runs on time and is quite cheap and has taken many passengers from the airlines. Also disagree with the Finnish population around Malaga it is the British I am afraid which is second after the Spanish followed by Moroccans and Romanians.

pee
17th Dec 2009, 08:14
Also disagree with the Finnish population around Malaga it is the British I am afraid which is second after the Spanish followed by Moroccans and Romanians.
You are right. It was based on Finnish sources, but Spanish sources say: "Población Inmigrante en Málaga" Reino Unido Total 62.558. Without any doubts, UK people are much ahead. A well-chosen route in spite of that. :ok:

Jippie
17th Dec 2009, 08:50
Charlie Roy, Eindhoven won't be a base untill they have more relaxed opening hours. Ryanair have said this numerous times and I think it's that easy, yes they like Eindhoven(look at the number of routes and growth) but Ryanair can't profitably operate a base with the current opening hours.
However, in Holland there's work going om to change some regulation to make Schiphol less crowded(or grow slower) and I think when that goes into effect, Eindhoven will have better opening hours and Ryanai will start a base. Maybe march 2011?

MUFC_fan
17th Dec 2009, 12:37
fresh rumors about Paris beauvais to become a base...


Longest running Ryanair rumour?

About bl**dy time!

Nakata77
17th Dec 2009, 12:41
will BOH get a 2nd and 3rd aircraft in 2010?

DILLTHEDOG
17th Dec 2009, 13:43
At the rate Ryanair are opening bases in Mainland Europe, I doubt they will need UK Bases at all !

I flew into BOH a couple of weeks ago and there were 3 RYR parked up !

It would be better for BOH if it was a mixture of operators rather then a Ryanair Stronghold.

Seljuk22
17th Dec 2009, 13:48
Other rumour: a new base in Central/Eastern Europe will be announced mid January.
KRK, WRO, RIX, BTS...

eu01
17th Dec 2009, 16:05
Just ONE of the above-mentioned, you mean?
The best chances seem to have 1.KRK, 2.BTS, but I'd not put my bet yet.

potash
18th Dec 2009, 04:42
FR
FR to announce fue flights to day 18 dec 12.30 pm from puerta del rosario uk flights to follow later datehttp://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

Cyrano
18th Dec 2009, 06:56
From today's Irish Times:

Ryanair ends talks with Boeing
CHARLIE TAYLOR

Ryanair confirmed this morning it has terminated negotiations with Boeing for an order of up to 200 new B737-800 series aircraft for delivery between 2013 and 2016 .

The airline said the breakdown in negotiations will not effect its plans to take delivery of 112 B737-800 aircraft during the next three years.

The announcement was expected after Ryanair chief executive Michael O'Leary said earlier this week that a deal was unlikely because the US plane manufacturer wanted to change the delivery conditions.

Mr O’Leary has previously warned that in the absence of an agreement with Boeing, Ryanair would “change course” and slow its growth post-2012 – at which point it expects to be carrying 90 million passengers – and distribute cash to shareholders.

In a statement this morning, Mr Michael O’Leary said while the airline had reached agreement with Boeing on pricing the plane manufacturer "was unwilling to incorporate some other terms and conditions from our existing agreement into this new aircraft order."

Ryanair has made clear to Boeing that we will not order aircraft if we believe that either the pricing or the other contractual terms and conditions will be inferior to those which we currently enjoy, as this would not be a wise or sensible use of shareholders funds," he said.

The airline said it does not intend to reopen discussions with Boeing or any other aircraft manufacturers.

"We will focus our efforts on maintaining Ryanair’s strong traffic and new route growth into 2010 and we look forward to briefing shareholders in the first quarter of the New Year with a revised strategy which will comprise much reduced capital expenditures through 2011 and 2012, thereby generating substantial surplus cash balances for distribution during the period 2012-2015," said Mr O'Leary.

"I believe it is appropriate to return these surplus funds to shareholders, if we cannot use them to purchase aircraft on terms which enable us to meet our demanding return on capital targets," he added.

Powerjet1
18th Dec 2009, 07:36
From The AirDB

Restarted:Puerto del Rosario, Fuerteventura (FUE) to Dublin (DUB)
Restarted:Puerto del Rosario, Fuerteventura (FUE) to Hahn, Frankfurt-Hahn (HHN)
Restarted:Puerto del Rosario, Fuerteventura (FUE) to Liverpool, John Lennon (LPL)
Restarted:Puerto del Rosario, Fuerteventura (FUE) to Dusseldorf, Weeze (NRN)
Restarted:Hahn, Frankfurt-Hahn (HHN) to Forli, Luigi Ridolfi (FRL)
New:Bergamo, Orio Al Serio (BGY) to (ILD)
New:Bournemouth, International (BOH) to Ibiza (IBZ)
New:Bournemouth, International (BOH) to Gudja, Malta International (MLA)
New:Bournemouth, International (BOH) to Valencia (VLC)
New:Puerto del Rosario, Fuerteventura (FUE) to Bergamo, Orio Al Serio (BGY)
New:Puerto del Rosario, Fuerteventura (FUE) to Bournemouth, International (BOH)
New:Puerto del Rosario, Fuerteventura (FUE) to Brussels, Charleroi Brussels South (CRL)
New:Puerto del Rosario, Fuerteventura (FUE) to Madrid, Barajas (MAD)
New:Puerto del Rosario, Fuerteventura (FUE) to Glasgow, Prestwick (PIK)
New:Puerto del Rosario, Fuerteventura (FUE) to Pisa, Galileo Galilei (PSA)
New:Hahn, Frankfurt-Hahn (HHN) to (ILD)
New:Ibiza (IBZ) to Birmingham, International (BHX)
New:London, Stansted (STN) to Trapani, Birgi (TPS)

pee
18th Dec 2009, 08:00
Returning to Forli, really? And what is ILD?

boyzinblue
18th Dec 2009, 08:06
ILD is Lleida and a new destination. It is very close to Reus.

Seljuk22
18th Dec 2009, 08:06
Lleida (Spaniards call it Lerida) has 120.000 inhabitants and it is located between Zaragoza and Barcelone.
HHN-Lleida 2 weekly starts 2nd April.
FR has/had some curios routes from HHN: Lleida (only other route to BGY), Forli (up to now no other FR flights to FRL) or Osijek (last summer).

Whiskey Papa
18th Dec 2009, 09:03
200 B738 cancelled by FR, BBC reports

D O Guerrero
18th Dec 2009, 09:08
The aircraft haven't been cancelled. They were never ordered in the first place. Boeing won't play ball and reduce the price to a pound each...

TheBeak
18th Dec 2009, 09:23
And they wont be ordered because they can't re-sell their older aircraft. Ryanairs business model will suffer heavily - they rely upon buying for less than they sell. This company will get it where the chicken got the axe.

kick the tires
18th Dec 2009, 09:27
He (MOL) said the two partners had agreed pricing on the 200 aircraft, but that Boeing was unwilling to include some other terms and conditions that his company enjoyed in existing contracts.

How does that work then? You agree a price but then say, oh actually I want a bit more thrown in! What? you are not willing to do that? Phew, great, right, I have an excuse to cancel a contract that I dont want!

Well done Boeing. More and more Companies and Airports are standing up to RYR and their bully boy, I'm god's gift, you can have my business if I let you, arrogant tactics.

BBC News - Ryanair pulls out of Boeing deal for 200 aircraft (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8419914.stm)

BoeingMEL
18th Dec 2009, 09:28
Is it not true that MOL buys the 737s personally and then sells them on to FR? If true (as widely and previously reported), it's difficult to see how they could be sold at a profit....IMHO Cheers bm

CJ1234
18th Dec 2009, 09:29
Glad for Boeing - it felt very strange to see the sale of 737s being treated like the sale of a job-lot of fridges.

That said, I was strangely proud of Ryanair for boasting such an enormous order in such difficult times. I'm beginning wonder, however, if the order was just a bit of bravado.

smith
18th Dec 2009, 09:35
Is FR's business model to sell their aircraft just before their C checks hence keeping costs down?

TheBeak
18th Dec 2009, 09:50
I believe they do buy them through a secondary 'Ryanair' company but they sell them through the same. As I understand it they, to this point, have not made a loss on their aircraft re-sale relative to purchase price. Average fleet age is 2.8 years, they are still pretty new on re sale and he really did get a very good price for them just after 9/11 - something like a third of standard cost.

ROSCO328
18th Dec 2009, 09:56
I hope that s**thead gets exactly what he deserves.:mad:

Dysag
18th Dec 2009, 09:57
Airbus appears uninterested in trying to step in, with Chief Operating Officer John Leahy telling Bloomberg: "I would have no problem selling aircraft to O'Leary at reasonable prices, but I have not seen anything reasonable from him."

Piltdown Man
18th Dec 2009, 09:58
I'm truly amazed that Boeing have not properly screwed FR before now. If I didn't know any better, I'd say that FR are totally committed to 737/800's and any change would be so expensive it not be worth considering. Therefore if I was Boeing I'd price my product just a few pence less than the comparative Airbus product and have a party with the cash that would be generated. But there again, what do I know...

PM

Sober Lark
18th Dec 2009, 09:59
Such bad grace. How many of you have had the means (not dreams) of buying 200 Boeings?

I don't fly with them myself, but I think I'll buy myself a present of a few more Ryanair shares for Christmas.

MrSoft
18th Dec 2009, 09:59
How does that work then? You agree a price but then say, oh actually I want a bit more thrown in! What?

The world of commercial negotiations. Looks pretty normal to me.

Doug the Head
18th Dec 2009, 10:05
Boeing needs the order and sell aircraft in today's tough economic climate, but at the same time FR's leverage in shopping somewhere else (i.e. Airbus) is somewhat limited...

I seriously hope that Boeing won't budge.

p.s. as bit of a contrarian strategy, Boeing might actually prefer to weaken low-cost airlines a bit (by making them pay more for their aircraft) as this in turn will increase their operating costs and thus allows traditional airlines a better chance of earning money...to pay for 787's and 74-8's with a higher profit margin. Why subsidize the fox (selling aircraft at a loss/zero profit) that attacks the goose laying the golden eggs? Perhaps Airbus and Boeing have finally figured it out?

compton3bravo
18th Dec 2009, 10:13
For those interested the new airport at Lleida (Lerida) is due to open for business on 17 January 2010 so I would think Ryanair are being ´paid` to operate their four weekly flights to get things moving so to speak.

Jet A1
18th Dec 2009, 10:21
Get the -200's back !

WHBM
18th Dec 2009, 10:23
This account of "buying them cheap to sell them on and make a profit" is rather overblown.

Ryanair have 203 737's in the fleet at the moment, with another 109 firmly ordered and still to come. They have only ever sold 25 737-800s, the oldest ones, beginning just over two years ago. These were the first 737-800s they bought, aircraft about 7 years old, and they are trickling out at about one a month, far less than their current delivery rate. There are a number of other carriers who do the same "rollover" of 7-year old aircraft. Most of the ex-Ryanair aircraft have moved on to third-world/Eastern European secondary carriers, who are unlikely to pay high prices for them. In fact Boeing must be doing quite well in supplying aftermarket spares and support for them.

The spartan interior spec that Ryanair adopted after the first few years of 737 deliveries (no seat pockets, no window blinds, etc) will make the more recent aircraft distinctly more difficult to move on secondhand compared to other sources, without the purchaser spending quite a bit on a cabin refurb, which will depress their value further.

No, Ryanair don't want a lot more aircraft, and they don't want to get into buying and selling en masse. Michael O'Leary said that if he couldn't agree a good deal he would reduce growth and return funds to the shareholders. My own hunch is that Bonderman has told him to do exactly this before it becomes more difficult for TPG to get back some of their investment, and the whole "another 200 aircraft, oh no, well we will just have to give the money back then, it's all Boeing's fault" is a cover story for this.

I hope Boeing didn't waste the time of their A-team on this "sales deal that never was".

Avman
18th Dec 2009, 10:25
I hope that with RYR having said no to the original price, Boeing now up the price!

I don't dislike RYR for being successful, I just detest their arrogant attitude. Some may say that's what's needed to succeed. I don't believe so. Southwest Airlines have succeeded thirty odd years and they managed by being fiercely competitive but never arrogant.

ryanair1
18th Dec 2009, 10:32
RYANAIR ANNOUNCES 4 NEW ROUTES FROM BOURNEMOUTH
to Fuerteventura, Ibiza, Malta & Valencia From March ‘10
2 Aircraft, 650k Pax p.a. & 650 Jobs at Bournemouth

Ryanair, the world’s favourite airline, today (18th Dec) announced that it will add one new Boeing 737-800 aircraft (2 in total) and open four new routes (16 in total) from its Bournemouth base to Fuerteventura, Ibiza, Malta and Valencia from late March 2010. This brings Ryanair’s investment in Bournemouth to two aircraft worth over $140million.

These four new routes along with increased frequencies on three other routes to Alicante, Malaga and Palma will increase Ryanair’s annual traffic at Bournemouth to 650,000 p.a. which will sustain 650 local jobs.

To celebrate its further expansion at Bournemouth Ryanair is extending its 500,000 £5 January seat sale, for travel on Tuesdays, Wednesday and Thursdays, until midnight Sunday (20th Dec) on www.ryanair.com .

Speaking in Bournemouth today, Ryanair’s Lesley Kane said:

“Bournemouth today celebrates its 2nd Ryanair based aircraft, four new routes to Fuerteventura, Ibiza, Malta and Valencia and increased frequencies on three other routes to Alicante, Malaga and Palma from late March 2010. These new flights go on sale today and with 16 low fare routes from Bournemouth consumers/visitors can continue to beat the recession by choosing Ryanair’s lowest fares and guaranteed no fuel surcharges to exciting destinations all over Europe. Ryanair’s 650,000 passengers p.a. will sustain 650 local jobs in Bournemouth in 2010.

To celebrate these new aircraft and routes at Bournemouth, Ryanair is extending its 500,000 £5 January seat sale to midnight Sunday. Since seats at these crazy low prices will be snapped up quickly, we urge passengers to book them immediately on www.ryanair.com”.

New routes
Route
Begin
Freq (pw)
Fuerteventura
1st April
2pw
Ibiza
30th March
2pw
Malta
30th March
2pw
Valencia
2nd April
2pw
Increased frequencies
Route
Freq (pw)
Alicante
5pw
Malaga
5pw
Palma
4pw

Microburst2002
18th Dec 2009, 10:47
The situation in Europe is different.

I think that well run low cost carriers, that is RYR, EZY and Air Berlin, have managed to umbalance the whole sector.
It's like the english longbows against the french armored knights in Crecy or Asincourt. They wiped out 90% of the french noblemen in a couple of battles.
The old airlines can't turn into low cost carriers, though they would love to. There is no way to fight back them. This umbalance is agravated by the lack of borders in the UE.
I wonder when will some balancing forces come into play. Years, decades...?

befree
18th Dec 2009, 10:52
At some point everyone stops growing. The end of rapid growth at Ryanair marks a big change for FR that will be "grown up". If FR keept growing it would run out of pax to feed ever growing needs.

The shareprice is up 6% which shows the market think it is a good outcome. I think the killer to growth has been the need to reduce fares by 10% to fill up each 10% extra capacity.

Ryanair could no longer blackmail boeing or airports to do below cost deals.

other airlines could be helps by the end of aggressive growth of FR that often leads to massive job losses at other airlines.

black kettle
18th Dec 2009, 10:56
Avman
This sort of assertion has been made several times on different forums but do you actually incontravertibly KNOW that Southwest haven't similarly "screwed" Boeing or,for that matter,airports which FR are frequently described as doing, 'cos I certainly don't?

ryanair1
18th Dec 2009, 11:03
We are still taking delivery of over 100 aircraft over the next three to four years we are not stopping growth, we are slowing it down. The % we grow will of course naturally slow as the baseline capacity rises.

LEGAL TENDER
18th Dec 2009, 11:12
Well done Boeing. More and more Companies and Airports are standing up to RYR and their bully boy, I'm god's gift, you can have my business if I let you, arrogant tactics.

I'm sure that a lot of flight crew, cabin crew and ground staff that are in a job also because of RYR would rather see them and the airports they serve do well.

Aggressive business tactics apply to all successful companies. Do you go to the petrol station and negotiate the price, or accept BP's and Shell's arrogant tactics ??? What about banks ? Energy providers ? The list goes on...

BEagle
18th Dec 2009, 11:16
When Ryanair's charming little CEO appeared on TV crowing about how Ryanair had 'raped' Boeing with its last aircraft order, no doubt the word soon got back to ol' Bubba Boeing.

Who vowed "Next time you won't be so b£oody cocky".

Airbus have told Ryanair on many occasions that they won't get anything for less than anyone else - and appear to have done so once more. Now Boeing appears to have taken the 'Valued customer, but not that valuable really' approach as well. Good.

Tough luck MoL. If you're looking for sympathy, you'll find it in the dictionary - between $hit and syphilis.....

Incidentally, there are some cracking deals available on legacy carriers these days - just take a look around all the Internet websites!

BabyBear
18th Dec 2009, 11:19
With so few aircraft manufacturers out there it may be difficult to go elsewhere, however I find it peculiar that other Boeing customers seem to simply sit back and say nothing about Boeing giving their competition an advantage by selling 737's to MOL at way below what they can buy them at themselves.

Somehow I don't see the major domestic US carriers accepting MOL is going to consistently buy at significantly less than they can.

Something doesn't add up. At best MOL got a one off deal due exceptional circumstances. Boeing simply cannot sell him aircraft at way below prices charged to other customers and have them effectively subsidise Ryanair.

vanhigher
18th Dec 2009, 11:43
if Boeing agree to sell aircraft to anybody for whatever price they are HAPPY TO DO SO if they weren't then the deal wouldn't go through

being good negotiators is one of the reasons FR are so successful

ozaggie
18th Dec 2009, 11:59
What the fcuk is an umbalance?. I may have missed something in my theory subjects!!!:bored:

spinnaker
18th Dec 2009, 12:17
BEagle

between $hit and syphilis.....

LMAO. :D Long time since I heard that one. Do you hail from anywhere near egbw per chance?

top jock
18th Dec 2009, 12:42
I heard Boeing were happy to sell the aircraft to him but CFM refused to sell him engines at the price he wanted.

Ancient Observer
18th Dec 2009, 13:32
WHBM

I agree. This is a TPG play, not a Ryanair play. Bonderman is the money man, not motormouth.

stitch666
18th Dec 2009, 14:06
Am I the only one woh thinks that the flight live information on RYR's website is inacurrate?

this is the post from skavsta intl(?) airport
FR4136 from Frankfurt Hahn scheduled at 1540 arr is expected at 1635

this is the info from RYR's live flight info
DUE 1540 flight 4136 Hahn-Skavsta ON TIME

???
15:40FR4136Frankfurt HahnExpected 16:35Ryanair
15:40FR4136Frankfurt HahnExpected 16:35Ryanair
15:40FR4136Frankfurt HahnExpected 16:35Ryanair

BALLSOUT
18th Dec 2009, 14:13
Smith, there is normaly a steady stream of 800's through Prestwick to undergo "C" check.

bizdev
18th Dec 2009, 14:42
A few comments to previous posts:

There was a major shock in the industry when EZY switched from Boeing to Airbus - the learned opinion at the time was that the B737 is the LLC aircraft of choice so Airbus made them a deal they could not refuse. EZY continue to buck traditional LCC thinking by continuing to operate a mixed fleet as the B737s have still not left the fleet.

RYN, and any other Airline for that matter, can squeeze major discounts out of (any) supliers due to the numbers involved - in commercial parlance its called a volume discount - any airline with a potential order of 200 magnitude would be criticized for not obtaining such a discount.

C-Checks occur around 3000 - 4000 Flight Hours or around every 18 months depending on each airline's approved maintenance programme which is based on their operational profile. So RYN are not selling their a/c before a C-Check - more likely before a 6C which I believe is the first biggy in the programme.

bizdev

Pitch Up Authority
18th Dec 2009, 15:04
I really do not think that MOL is any different than any other customer when it comes down to negotiating prices.

Boeing is only interested in beating Airbus. Short term and long term.

colegate
18th Dec 2009, 15:44
Both Boeing and RYR need this order. They will be back doing a deal within 6 months. Remember the aircraft are still on option. There is still plenty of time to firm up an order. Just negotiating, tough but it will still be effective.

captjns
18th Dec 2009, 15:57
You can read between the lines if you wish. Cash flow way down. Can't dump the older slugs to unsuspecting buyers. Aircraft being cleaned every other evening with cabin crew cleaning the aircraft on the other evenings without additional pay.

At the end of the day if you can't fill 210 airplanes now with passengers how are you going to fill 320 airplanes with passengers?

Oh well...:(

Just a spotter
18th Dec 2009, 16:01
In the absence Airbus jumping into the ring, I wonder if there are any Russian banks running the rule over their options on making a call to FR and putting together a financing deal for some TU204-500's (TU could do with the order and the Russian banks could do with the $'s or €'s).

Or is that just too low cost even for Mr. O'Leary's tastes.:}

JAS

Ivor Fynn
18th Dec 2009, 16:25
What - no comment from 'The Real Slim Shadey' or 'Leo Hairy Camel'!

Whats up guys? - not having a good day.:E:E

Ivor

OFSO
18th Dec 2009, 16:33
Maybe I read this thread too quickly but I didn't see any mention of the fact that while Ryanair are not proceeding with the 'negotiations' for an additional 200 aircraft, they will be taking delivery of 112 737NG's between now and 2015. (Source BB1 one today). For those people who love to think Ryanair is on its last legs, think again.

apaul
18th Dec 2009, 23:12
If you can stomach it, there's lots of O'Leary in Saturday's Financial Times. An interview with the great man and a piece about the failed Boeing deal. Funniest line: 'Ryanair ... delivers a terrific customer service'. FT.com / Columnists / Lunch with the FT - Lunch with the FT: Michael O?Leary (http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/073c8d40-e9ca-11de-ae43-00144feab49a.html)

Sober Lark
18th Dec 2009, 23:50
"What - no comment ."

You see I don't think Leo is Leo but is someone employed by Leo to act as Leo. I came to this conclusion last year when I found he couldn't spell St. Stephen's day. I mean what Irish man couldn't spell St. Stephen's day? Surely only an outsider would spell it 'Steven's day' so that's why I don't think Leo is Leo.

I liked the FT interview especially the allergy to Blackberries, e mails and PCs.

eu01
20th Dec 2009, 09:45
The independent.ie (http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/ryanairs-phoney-war-with-boeing-just-a-lot-of-hot-air-1982475.html) writes today:
While Ryanair naturally blamed Boeing, accusing it of failing to meet unspecified delivery conditions, for the rupture, no one seems to be asking the obvious question. How on earth was Ryanair going to fill another 200 aircraft?

Ryanair has grown passenger numbers by 20 per cent a year for almost a decade. In the year to March 2010, Ryanair will carry 70 million passengers. In terms of passenger numbers carried, Michael O'Leary's outfit is now the largest airline in Europe.

Now that it is operating off such a high base it becomes more and more difficult for Ryanair to maintain these growth rates. Even before the recession decimated the demand for cheap, discretionary travel it was clear that Ryanair's growth rates would have to slow. Otherwise it would be carrying something like 175 million passengers by 2015 and 435 million by 2020.

Quite clearly that's not going to happen. Otherwise everyone in Europe would end up spending every waking hour either airborne or at the airport -- a truly terrifying thought.The evidence of overcapacity is growing. And other problems emerging as well.

The less Ryanair are willing to pay the airports they use, the more likely emerge problems with their maintenance and development. Like in Germany, where the carrier could soon lose a couple of its destinations (Lubeck, Altenburg), no-one wants to pay to keep the places open for them.

The more marketing support FR demand for its routes, the more prone they are to reactions like that in France (http://www.americas-fr.com/tourisme/actualite/ryanair-fait-du-chantage-avec-les-aeroports-francais-3906.html): Ryanair fait du chantage avec les aéroports français.
Le chantage aux subventions et aux baisses des taxes aéroportuaires est devenu une pratique courante de la compagnie aérienne à bas prix Ryanair. La compagnie aérienne irlandaise s'installe dans des aéroports secondaires moyennant certains avantages financiers puis menace ensuite de se retirer si ceux-ci n'acceptent pas les nouvelles conditions imposées par Ryanair.

Ryanair is blackmailing French airports.
Blackmailing to get subsidies and tax cuts at airports has become a common practice for Ryanair. After being granted certain financial benefits the Irish airline installs itself into secondary airports and then threatens to withdraw if some new conditions imposed by Ryanair are not accepted. As an example, the article mentions the Poitiers and Angouleme airports. The latter one has signed a 5-year contract with FR to operate between 2008 and 2012 and the agreement stipulated that the airline would receive €400.000 in 2008, 300.000 in 2009 and 225 000 in 2010. Now Ryanair wants 175.000 more, the economic crisis as a pretext. So far the Charente Departament's Chamber of Commerce didn't agree. Last days of Ryanair in Angouleme, presumably?

Not only in France, similar problems emerge for example in Poland. Bydgoszcz has been promised a few new routes to be announced very soon. However, the marketing support has not been granted by the City Council. Regardless of other routes' profitability, FR threatens to withdraw completely from the entire BZG, unless ongoing negotiations bring a solution to this dispute.

MARKEYD
20th Dec 2009, 17:49
Just noticed that the Bournemouth to Edinburgh route is no longer bookable after the 27 March

Is this the final end to there attempt of offering a domestic link from Bournemouth and to concentrate on the Med routes with there 2 based aircraft

Would be a shame as Prestwick was good loads for years until the 2nd service was introduced then cancelled and Edinburgh offered up but with the worst time s of departure !

Random Flyer
20th Dec 2009, 17:52
It would make sense for FR to go back to offering PIK-BOH. It was always an extremely popular route and I never understood why it was cancelled.

shamrock7seal
21st Dec 2009, 07:08
BOH carried 128,000 pax apparently in 2008 between PIK and BOH and at one point there were 4 flights a day from BOH to Scotland; 2 to EDI and 2 to GLA.

I find it hard to believe that the routes worked well for 5 years but suddenly didnt and had to be dropped? Surely thats a sign of poor flight times or too much capacity?

frfly
21st Dec 2009, 09:12
EDI BOH will probably go back to EDI based unit. A/C 5 should be announced shortly and the schedules finalised. Usually a/c operates LCJ/WRO AGP BOH in a day, TuThSaSu, however this is subject to change, as I thnk WRO has been dropped from EDI. FR are always chopping and changing schedules, I would expect the finalised one to be complete by end of January. I would aslo expect more Sun destinations from FR from EDI with the end of GSM. Dublin are probably finalising schedules to accomodate increases to AGP, ALC, PMI etc. Wouldnt be surprised if AGP and ALC went daily now.

jferreira20
21st Dec 2009, 23:53
It's ridiculous to think that FR will continue to grow as they are doing right know.

But the truth is that it could grow much more. There are lots of destinations not served or underserved that could sustain a high growth rate. For example: sun destinations like Egypt, Greek Islands, Madeira, Tunisia and so on.

They could also start flying to Slovenia, Bulgaria, Cyprus. They could invest a lot more in Porto, Prague, Romania. And there is also the opportunity of longer flights. Connections from Portugal to Cape Verde. Connecton to the USA, and so on.

Hombre
22nd Dec 2009, 06:57
St Stephen's Day: 26 December, Boxing Day

St Stephen, the First Martyr (Stoned to death): Patron Saint of .....wait for it......Altar Servers.

(I even have a silver St Stephen medal somewhere for ten years' service!!) And, no, never had a dodgy priest. Got a lot of sweets though:}

Feliz Navidad para todos.

eu01
22nd Dec 2009, 07:48
It's ridiculous to think that FR will continue to grow as they are doing right know.
But the truth is that it could grow much more.
Many of these potential destinations you mentioned are distant ones, less attractive from the lcc's point of view. Of course one can calculate a number of options, if it pays. I'd rather concentrate on improving the product to appeal to a broader range of passengers. In many ways; improving the way people perceive the brand, addressing business travellers, refining the schedules. More controversial remains the question of connecting flights, in some(!) cases it also could be considered as a viable minimal-risk option bringing new streams of pax, though.
They could also start flying to Slovenia, Bulgaria, Cyprus.Actually, they used to fly to Slovenia a couple of years ago (to Maribor) and withdrew.

Feliz Natal!

At the end I'll show you the curiosity I've found today. The Financial (http://finchannel.com/news_flash/Travel_Biz_News/54761_Ryanair%27s_reaction_to_BAA_appeal_on_Monopoly_break-up/) publishes Ryanairs reaction tp BAA appeal on monopoly break-up. It's a copy of a Ryanair News Release, with one exception:

Ryanair:Ryanair, Britain’s favourite airline, today (21 Dec 2009) said it was deeply disappointed by the decision of the Competition Appeals Tribunal to allow part of the appeal by the BAA monopoly...The Financial:Ryanair, Britain’s one of the favourite airlines, today (21 Dec 2009) said it was deeply disappointed by the decision of the Competition Appeals Tribunal to allow part of the appeal by the BAA monopoly...:oh: Merry Christmas to all!

Master_Dn
23rd Dec 2009, 01:33
I think that the only way to reach the USA is from the Azores. Ryanair's Boeing 738 range would not be enough to reach the USA from London in safety. From Boeing's website we know that the maximum range is 3060 nm and from STN to JFK we have 3016 nm. From Lages (TER) in Azores to JFK it's only 2139 nm. The longest FR route at the moment is from AGP to TMP and has 1824 nm. From OPO to Lages ( TER ) it's 860 nm and from STN to Lages ( TER ) it's 1386 nm.
FR could have a route from the USA to the Azores, which would be very useful for Portuguese emigration and at the same time a link to Europe.
Niagara Falls (IAG) to Lages (TER) would be 2335 nm.

Greece, Egypt and Madeira on the other hand, would be interesting destinations as Ryanair is trying to enter the charter market...

From OPO to Sal ( SID ) in Cape Verde, it's 1642 nm so it's a possibility in a far future.

ICING AOA
23rd Dec 2009, 02:03
Ryanair is about to open a new route between corsica and spain, probably Figari-Gerona or Figari-Reus.

lfc84
23rd Dec 2009, 08:45
bbc reporting ryanair plane overshoots prestwick runway. all 129 off.

h&s
23rd Dec 2009, 08:56
Ryanair is about to open a new route between corsica and spain, probably Figari-Gerona or Figari-Reus.


If true, it would be a new clear evidence that the "state subsidised" strategy of the airline generates non sense/uneconomical decisions, as there is a very very tiny market for a route such as Gerona/BCN to Figari even considering the few VFR from Perpignan area. It would be as a disaster as for Figari Bergamo which exists has been operated less than 5 months!

h&s
23rd Dec 2009, 09:06
It would make sense for FR to go back to offering PIK-BOH. It was always an extremely popular route and I never understood why it was cancelled.


Popular? well, it was cancelled because it was not performing well. Actually, it was not bad when 1x day, but then they increased to 2x day. I remember the (non sense) fanfare of the announcement and Sean Coyle saying it was to accomodate business passengers (business passengers, on Bournemouth Prestwick???) and to offer an alternative to very high fares Flybe service. On this forum I said 2x day was non sense, PIKBOH was not a business route and business men will hardly never give up a SOHGLA for a BOHPIK. Few months later, Ryanair totally cut the route :D
And flybe is still there :ok:

XSBaggage
23rd Dec 2009, 09:23
I always seem to remember the PIK-BOH route being busy when the flight was daily in the early afternoon. The morning flight from BOH when it went 2 x daily always appeared very quiet. Often FR seem to just "join the dots" on a map of Europe with apparent randomness and the route works but on others some refinement is required, PIK and EDI to BOH being good examples. Its not a case of "fly the route and they shall book" all the time, some regard to scheduling (which was not given) was required here, and the routes have been discontinued.

XSB

Random Flyer
23rd Dec 2009, 13:01
Popular? well, it was cancelled because it was not performing well. Actually, it was not bad when 1x day, but then they increased to 2x day.

It performed well at once daily, so much so that Ryanair thought it would work at twice daily. It didn’t. So it would have made more sense to put it back to once daily rather than completely cut the route.

Random Flyer
23rd Dec 2009, 13:06
Ryanair’s chopping and changing of routes seems very odd at times. The most recent example I can think of is Glasgow to France. The airline recently cancelled its PIK-Marseille route and replaced it with a PIK-Carcassonne route. Surely PIK-Marseille would be a far stronger route than PIK-Carcassonne?

It also appears PIK-TRP is for the scrap.

ICING AOA
23rd Dec 2009, 13:28
Quote:
Ryanair is about to open a new route between corsica and spain, probably Figari-Gerona or Figari-Reus.
If true, it would be a new clear evidence that the "state subsidised" strategy of the airline generates non sense/uneconomical decisions, as there is a very very tiny market for a route such as Gerona/BCN to Figari even considering the few VFR from Perpignan area. It would be as a disaster as for Figari Bergamo which exists has been operated less than 5 months!


You are kidding? look at Gerona-Alghero, it works very well. But also lots of spaniards want to go to corsica, the problem is that it is extremely expensive and they only options are to drive down to Marseille, Toulon, or Nice, that s 4 hours drive from the pyrenees. They can also take air france at MRS, ORY or NCE and this is the same sh.it, expensive and long journey.
I dont understand why ryanair opened Figary-Milan or Figari-Brussels, but for sure Firgari-Barcelona, Figari-Paris, could well be a big success. Anyway, the monney comes from the region of Figari, not from MOL's bank account. :)

eu01
23rd Dec 2009, 15:05
A new fuss in Italy!Ryanair annuncia la chiusura temporanea delle rotte domestiche da 10 basi italianeAll domestic routes in Italy will cease to operate from Saturday, January 23. It's the result of ongoing row with ENAC concerning the ID identification requirements. ENAC wants Ryanair to accept a variety of less secure forms of identification on domestic Italian flights.

The original Ryanair announcement (in Italian) can be found here (http://www.ryanair.com/it/novita/gen-it-231209).

Blackmailing again. For a reason, perhaps, but what about their pax?

Noxegon
23rd Dec 2009, 16:34
Shrug, I never figured why a passport was a requirement in the first place. Various other forms of ID were acceptable right up until Ryanair went 100% online checkin. I can only assume the reason they're not now is due to laziness in coding the online checkin system.

jferreira20
23rd Dec 2009, 17:13
I never needed passport. Always Identity Card.

eu01
23rd Dec 2009, 17:42
I never needed passport. Always Identity Card.
Ryanair say ENAC wants them to accept driver's licenses, fishing licenses etc.

FA10
23rd Dec 2009, 18:02
I think that the only way to reach the USA is from the Azores. Ryanair's Boeing 738 range would not be enough to reach the USA from London in safety. From Boeing's website we know that the maximum range is 3060 nm and from STN to JFK we have 3016 nm. From Lages (TER) in Azores to JFK it's only 2139 nm. The longest FR route at the moment is from AGP to TMP and has 1824 nm.


Europe to Lajes would work, however Lajes to US is not possible with the 737 because of missing ETOPS approval.
It is simply not allowed to fly over such a large pond without good ("suitable") alternate airports on the way!

Keyvon
23rd Dec 2009, 18:24
Please stop dreaming about improbable long-haul routes to NA with intermediate stop in Azores Islands or anywhere else 'cause it's to going to happen at any time.

MO'L clearly stated several times that Ryanair is not going to operate any flight to the States with their own metal anytime soon.

Master_Dn
23rd Dec 2009, 18:48
"Flyglobespan uses a 737-800 on its Glasgow-Boston route. What does this mean for other budget carriers dreaming of launching a low-cost, long-haul service?"

link : US-Europe on a 737: Flyglobespan does it. Will others follow suit? (http://strategic-business-planning.suite101.com/article.cfm/useurope_on_a_737)

Flyglobespan may not be the best example :X

flying_shortly
23rd Dec 2009, 19:57
I reckon it could work. But it would have to be sustainably run with slow growth initially. It would be a much bigger risk than buying a lot of 737's. You'd have to find a jet that is able to run from Germany to USA. That jet would be used on all LH operations to keep costs low. Staff would be put up in houses owned by the airline. They would clean and cook for themselves. No hotels. Only 3/4 bases in Europe, strategically situated such as London, Madrid and somewhere in Germany and or France. Cheap fares offered to travel to these bases with Ryanair. Options to buy dinner when booking ticket and selected seating an added cost. The planes will have entertainment but you will pay for it. This model will differ in that it won't ever be free. During slacker months fares will be higher and always cheaper than main operators.... Going to the loo will be free but toilet paper and soap added extra. Showers on board an option.... A bar area provided by drink supplier that pays rent to use the area. Cargo operation also to help cover costs.

h&s
23rd Dec 2009, 20:18
You are kidding? look at Gerona-Alghero, it works very well. But also lots of spaniards want to go to corsica

Hi Icing, no I am not kidding ;-) First how do you know Gerona Alghero is working very well? In the eventuality you have the load factors (which is possible even if probably not the case), don't forget that sometimes, Ryanair is not profitable with routes above 90% LF...
However, I do agree with you that the route should work reasonably (and not very) well but Figari and Alghero are very different markets. Just look at the size of Alghero markets, it's around 400 000 inhabitants within 60 mins drive, vs what - 50 000 for Figari maximum... I also assume most than a half of the passengers are coming from Alghero on GROAHO whereas I can guarantee you that if you have 2 people per flights coming from Figari, that would be a miracle. Futur will tell, but I think the route won't survive its first year of operation (except if Ryanair for such non sense route blames the airport, so Figari gives even more money or Ryanair leaves the airport etc etc)
Anyway, the monney comes from the region of Figari, not from MOL's bank account. http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/smile.gif

We agree on this point - is Ryanair the most subsidized airline in the world?

h&s
23rd Dec 2009, 20:23
Thanks eu01 for the info. Italy is Ryanair best market so I can't believe they won't find a solution with ENAC. As always, Ryanair prefers the brutality than the negociation, but in this affair they are for once not in the privilegied position as they can't give up all their italian domestic routes


Blackmailing again. For a reason, perhaps, but what about their pax?


I am sure you know the answer :ok:

1sky
23rd Dec 2009, 20:58
All domestic routes in Italy will cease to operate from Saturday, January 23. It's the result of ongoing row with ENAC concerning the ID identification requirements. ENAC wants Ryanair to accept a variety of less secure forms of identification on domestic Italian flights.

I agree with Ryanair on this one. I don't see why ENAC should be allowed to interfere with what, at the end of the day, is a commercial decision by the airline.

The visa stamp requirement, where they are unwilling to provide checks close to gate areas even at large bases such as STN/DUB and where I have seen passengers lied to on numerous occasions, is quite another story.

MUFC_fan
23rd Dec 2009, 23:07
Does anyone know when Ryanair will put their March sale fares online?

I seem to have noticed they work two months in advance - so I assume January - it that correct?

Thanks.

h&s
24th Dec 2009, 08:41
yes MUFC, probably after xmas period. Again without easter in march, we can probably expect some big discounts even eventually the 100% free one :-)

underfish
24th Dec 2009, 08:53
All Italian domestic routes are gone 23rd, January - 19th, March in Ryanair booking engine. My friend was notified that his flight Trapani - Bergamo on 27th of January is cancelled. Is it blackmailing?

h&s
24th Dec 2009, 09:25
that's ryanair christmas present for its best market :ugh:

MUFC_fan
24th Dec 2009, 09:33
The UK is Ryanair's 'best' market.

The UK is it's largest followed by Italy, Spain and Germany.

The size difference between the UK and Italy is too great for Italy to be Ryanair's 'best' market.

If you have some data to support your argument then please do share, but I would be very surprised.

racedo
24th Dec 2009, 10:01
Italian politics in play to protect Alitalia..............different day, same stuff.

anna_list
24th Dec 2009, 10:07
Hi,

You can get a rough idea of FR's largest markets by looking at the departing seat capacity graphs at the bottom of this page:
ELFAA - The European Low Fares Airline Association (http://www.elfaa.com/statistics.htm)

Note that the largest markets may not necessarily be the 'best' markets, depending on how you choose to define 'best'.

According to the most recent (Oct 2009) points on the graph, FR's largest markets by monthly departing seat capacity are:

1. UK - roughly 1.7M departing seats per month (and declining)
2. Spain - roughly 1.3M (massive growth)
3. Italy - roughly 1.25M (massive growth)
4. Ireland - roughly 0.7M (declined to below 2007 levels)
5. Germany - roughly 0.6M (strong growth)

Domestic capacity in Italy appears to have grown rapidly to over 0.45M departing seats per month. FR have been developing a strong position in the Italian domestic market. Is it really worth jeopardising this for the sake of a fishing licence?

racedo
24th Dec 2009, 10:59
Domestic capacity in Italy appears to have grown rapidly to over 0.45M departing seats per month. FR have been developing a strong position in the Italian domestic market. Is it really worth jeopardising this for the sake of a fishing licence?

You got to wonder why any country would start to want to minimise security to such an extent that an easily obtainable fishing licence becomes the standard for entering a plane.

Given that Italy has its own home grown terrorists and the various Mafiosa factions its a surprising thing to want to do expescially when you consider the level of armed police you find in any city.

eu01
24th Dec 2009, 13:17
A very costly decision. Creating great opportunities for competitors (Alitalia, U2), many disappointed passengers, their confidence strained...

And something else. Just imagine the schedules. I think we can expect pretty massive changes concerning many international flights from Italy as well. You wouldn't expect the aircraft to wait at the airport some three hours for the next international flight while the domestic flight in between is no more in the schedule, would you?

Charlie Roy
24th Dec 2009, 14:25
I think we can expect pretty massive changes concerning many international flights from Italy as well.

I expect though that it'll be resolved before it ever happens...

polax52
25th Dec 2009, 21:01
Just had an e-mail from Ryanair to the effect that they are cancelling all domestic Italian flights,Whats going on?

daz211
25th Dec 2009, 21:13
Its all the the Ryanair thread.

h&s
26th Dec 2009, 10:49
The UK is Ryanair's 'best' market.

I would rather say than the uk is its worst market
Beleve me or not, nobody is making money with the uk market at the moment

Coquelet
26th Dec 2009, 17:57
I have an FR domestic Italian flight booked on 24th february and I have not yet received any notification of cancellation.

daz211
26th Dec 2009, 18:08
I dont think Ryanair should back down on this one, with all thats going on in the USA
with Delta/NW. what are the Italians thinking :=.

Skipness One Echo
26th Dec 2009, 18:15
Tell me what the connection is Daz? Are BA risking my life in not asking for a passport for my domestic legs? Utter alarmist claptrap. This is pure revenue protection.