“...enhance British Airways’ UK regional network”
- from a city that is just 80 miles from London. :rolleyes: |
and re-engage with customers lost from the very same routes that were so popular with Flybe! 👍
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I’ve always thought this is a perfect airline for SOU
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Indeed. It’s now SOU time to make them work and prove there is a market.
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Great news for SOU,the runway extension strip becomes even less relevant,and in fact probably will not happen in today's world. Given that Covid 19 comes under control by next spring,then this move by BA could be SOU saviour.One note of caution will be WIzz announcement that they are starting a base at Bournemouth,which surely will be imminent!
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I'm not sure how good this news really is for SOU. BACF will operate for max 6 months of the year, for 2 days per week. The aircraft and crew will not *really* be based at SOU - it's more akin to a night-stop, so BA are not making any significant commitment to SOU. It didn't matter at STN because BACF were a relatively small player in a very large market - there was plenty of effective clear commitment from Ryanair and Jet2
There is zero chance of BA restarting their SOU base from 15 years ago. I imagine the fees paid by BACF to SOU will be low, not much more than the cost to SOU to provide airport services - and certainly not enough to generate much for the "SOU long term investment" piggy-bank SOU as a sizeable urban area which is very unlikely to ever have significant inbound seasonal tourism, needs airlines which operate to/from SOU at least 360 days of the year, not an opportunist skimming off the seasonal high-fat cream which will dissuade anybody from setting up a real SOU-centric non-transient operation |
Well put and I believe they also doing VRN from BHD next Summer as well.
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LBIA
And this is why it pays to be a glass half full person! :) Well done to the management at SOU who have dealt with the demise of BE amazingly! :D Apart from Stobart, who are in a very bad way currently, I make that now all the regional airlines in this country operating routes at SOU, indeed some have even been competing on routes. What other regional airport in the country, let alone during a global pandemic(!), can say that? This news should not be underestimated, and leaves me with the following thoughts: 1. BACF have traditionally not strayed from their base at LCY, certainly not opening 11 new routes at a time! The fact they have chosen SOU for such an uncharacteristic move speaks volumes for SOU and its catchment. It further builds on the fact Volotea chose SOU as their first airport in the UK. These things speak volumes for SOU's potential. 2. The variety of routes is very encouraging and again speaks volumes of the confidence in SOU's potential. We have bucket and spade routes, regional French routes and even some city break routes like Berlin and Florence. 3. The fact that the frequencies are relatively low at this stage is irrelevant. The industry is obviously at a low point currently, so going all in with a base in these times is not going to happen. The possibility was someone coming along and testing the waters, and guess what, someone has. When times are better, a base could definitely be a possibility. 4. Seeing as pretty much all of the regional operators have now opened routes from SOU, I wonder if the runway extension was being built whether we would see the same urgency to open routes from the low cost carriers? As has long been discussed, their larger aircraft are not the right fit for SOU in its current state. In my opinion, we would see the same urgency, as if regional operators with their higher cost base are all very keen to have a piece of the pie, why would low cost operators with their low cost base not also see an opportunity to make money at SOU? On the runway planning being delayed, lets hope this is not because of the BACF news, and perhaps what is going on behind the scenes with a new BE. I take comfort from the fact that it was previously delayed whilst SOU produced more reports on noise, so it could very well be true that they just need more time to produce something else to mitigate a particular concern. I suspect they will end up having to go down the appeal route, so the more stuff they collate to support their argument the better. Lastly, although it is important to never mention anyone by name, and in turn feed the trolls if you like, I hope this latest bit of good new will give this thread some respite from their trolling and relentless negativity, but I will not hold my breath (indeed it looks like the usual suspects have already started). I would implore others to ignore their attempts at trolling though, if this thread is ever going to go back to a place of healthy debate which all other threads seem to be. |
Point 1 is rather incorrect, you saw this exact move by BACF to STN/MAN and to a lesser extent BHX and BRS. The BER aircraft rotation is the former STN positioning/destinations.
Either way great news for SOU. |
I for one think this will be a pre-curser to much more activity by BACF at SOU probably by autumn next year. Edinburgh should be increased in frequency at an appropriate time and with capacity to hand. It’s all up to us to support these new routes now.
If I were SOU management I’d be doing everything possible to sweeten BACF and keep them happy so that growth is forthcoming. I’m sure they’re already doing this and well done to them! Does anyone know if the flights are being operated by ERJ-190’s or ERJ-170’s? |
I believe it’s all E190. BACF only have 2 E170s left.
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davidjohnson6
In the current position, a bird in hand is worth two in the bush (or cash in the bank is worth more than the promise of cash in the future). These BACF weekend schedules have been rather nomadic, so doubt whether any one seriously thinking about a fulltime base would be put off. We will need to see how quickly LCY recovers. There is at least the possibility that what at the moment is an exercise in keeping a/c earning rather than sitting on the ground might develop into something more substantial for SOU, and that's got to be worthwhile. Changing the subject, presumably the Bergerac on the Tuesday is a 'W' from LCY? |
Well, that explains the appearance in the BA.com destinations menu right enough!
This is a good match. For Cityflyer, they find a weekend home for their aircraft outside LCY that doesn't involve a battle on price against Ryanair, Jet2, easyJet & others as the weekend operations at STN and MAN did. For SOU, they get the weekend leisure flying covered with a very credible carrier and even if that airline isn't paying much at SOU, the volume going through the airport and generating spend is good. The local perception of having BA flying from SOU is also a major boost and having these routes back on the map (and some new ones too) is a real plus. I view it as good news in the most diabolical of times and I'm not inclined to agree with the views of those of a negative disposition towards it. |
Are they night stopping crews at SOU throughout the summer?
Sounds like an expensive overhead for a 100-seat aircraft with LCY and EDI based crews operating out of SOU. |
Another potential benefit for SOU is that these flights should be pretty visible to BA's London customer base, perhaps more so than any flights operated by other carriers from SOU.
Head for points and other websites will be read by a lot of business travellers in the London area, so now they'll know that there are holiday flights from the airport down the road that they can spend and acquire Avios points on. This may entice a few more SW London passengers to drive down the M3 or jump on the train than may otherwise have been the case. |
Cuillin Hills
The EDI base was closed earlier this year. The previous MAN and STN weekend ops (plus GLA charters) saw crews night stopping so would imagine this will be the same. Remember that these aircraft only have four crew in total. |
Just a projection at what the departure board might look like over the summer period , pretty impressive have to say
Looks like 6 night stopping E 190 !!! Just out of interest is there enough stands for this type of aircraft or would some have to parked at a different area of the airport Friday 2050 EDI 190 2235 BER. 190 Saturday 190 IBZ 0645 190 PMI 0805 1045. EGC. 190 LIG 1130 1220. IBZ. 190. EGC 1420 1305 PMI. 319 PMI 1330 Volotoa 1310. PMI 190 FLR. 1440 1345. PMI 190. FAO. 1450 1355. AGP 190. AGP. 1505 1410 IBZ 190 NCE 1500. LIG 190 1715. JMK. 190 1800. EGC. 190 1940. FLR. 190 2030. NCE. 190 2125. FAO. 190 Sunday 190 FLR 0730 190. IBZ 0755 190. PMI 0800 190 EDI 0900 190 EGC 0915 190. JMK 1000 1230 FLR. 190. BER 1320 1335. PMI 190. AGP. 1420 |
This is great news for SOU, but interestingly compared to previous route / airline launches at the airport from KLM, EasyJet and Volotea the reaction on social media is massive and I have seen numerous posts all over FB and Twitter from people who are not in the industry / interested in airliners etc sharing and commenting on the news. It's clear the value that the flag carrier has is huge and will likely generate demand in its own good. South Hampshire is the UK's 8th largest urban area and Hampshire has the largest economy in the UK outside of London/Surrey/Manchester/West Mids and could easily sustain demand, particularly with the high number of regular BA flyers in the area that would more than happily use the airport in comparison to places such as MAN, BRS and BHX.
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On a separate note it looks like Easy jet have pretty much binned the Geneva route for this winter, with the Saturday service gone in March now
With France wanting to keep the ski slopes closed it’s not really a surprise |
Presumably four will use stands 2,3,4,5 and the other two would have to use stand 13 and 14 which would be problematic security/boarding wise. In the past SOU have parked Flybe/Aurigny ERJs on the taxiway behind stands 2,3,4,5 so maybe a repeat of that?
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Stands 8-12 are big enough for E190 but not sure they have ever parked on these due to tail height obstacles lining up with ILS? Maybe some dispensation for this although unsure!
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Seen a Stobart E90 parked nose in on one of those stands before so is possible
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I think it was stand 10 or 11 that a Flybe E195 was parked nose out and the APU exhaust burnt the stand number sign on the lamp post.
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Basically there are four stands that th e190 can use unristricted.The others could be possibly be used with nose out,although the ILS could be compromised ,something that the airport management overlooked many years ago.SOU is heavily restricted in stand aircraft size ,probably more then any other regional airport.
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Shocking decision back then to sell off the Royal Mail site!
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if we ever get an A320 operator wanting to start an operation they are currently restricted to 3 at a time between stands 1 - 5 , as an A320 requires 1 1/2 stands, which is why they are planning to widen them, and re-designate them as stands 1 - 4. If that is done we can accommodate 4 A320 at a time.
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BACF schedule
Bergerac
BA2907 SOU 09:15 EGC 11:45 7 BA2909 SOU 14:20 EGC 16:50 6 BA2909 SOU 17:30 EGC 20:00 2 BA2908 EGC 10:15 SOU 10:45 6 BA2910 EGC 16:20 SOU 16:50 2 BA2910 EGC 17:30 SOU 18:00 6 Berlin BA2937 SOU 13:20 BER 16:15 7 BA2938 BER 21:40 SOU 22:35 5 Edinburgh BA2900 SOU 09:00 EDI 10:30 7 BA2939 EDI 19:15 SOU 20:50 5 Faro BA2927 SOU 14:50 FAO 17:50 6 BA2928 FAO 18:40 SOU 21:25 6 Florence BA2921 SOU 07:30 FLR 10:40 7 BA2921 SOU 14:40 FLR 17:50 6 BA2922 FLR 11:25 SOU 12:30 7 BA2922 FLR 18:35 SOU 19:40 6 Ibiza BA2915 SOU 06:45 IBZ 10:10 6 BA2915 SOU 07:55 IBZ 11:20 7 BA2916 IBZ 10:55 SOU 12:20 6 BA2918 IBZ 12:45 SOU 14:10 6 Limoges BA2911 SOU 11:30 LIG 13:55 6 BA2912 LIG 14:35 SOU 15:00 6 Malaga BA2925 SOU 14:20 AGP 18:15 7 BA2925 SOU 15:05 AGP 19:00 6 BA2924 AGP 12:15 SOU 13:55 6 Mykonos BA2933 SOU 10:00 JMK 15:50 7 BA2934 JMK 15:20 SOU 17:15 6 Nice BA2931 SOU 15:45 NCE 18:50 6 BA2932 NCE 19:35 SOU 20:30 6 Palma BA2903 SOU 08:00 PMI 11:25 7 BA2903 SOU 08:05 PMI 11:30 6 BA2902 PMI 11:45 SOU 13:10 6 BA2904 PMI 12:10 SOU 13:35 7 BA2904 PMI 12:20 SOU 13:45 6 |
GLCYZ
It is still a considerable cost that EZY, RYR, EXS etc generally don’t have and is proportionate to the size of the aircraft - plus you need standby cover etc and there is also associated loss of efficiency of crews as they spend their working days (Friday pm, for example) positioning for Saturday earlies. Taxi costs also add to the total bill. Stansted was also considerably closer to London City than Southampton is. Best wishes to SOU and CFE but all the above will hit the bottom line. |
The crews HOTAC costs will be covered by a return club fare to Mykonos by the look of the prices :}
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I understand the need to operate aircraft in/out of Southampton through W-Pattern to save on positioning flights, but what is the rationale for operating only 1 inbound Malaga flight but with 2 outbound... and 2 outbound Palma but 3 inbound. How will half of the passengers get back from Malaga?
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That's a very good point!
Perhaps there will be tweaks made to the schedule nearer the time. |
Great news for SOU that they've picked up some extra routes for S21, something quite positive after the extension decision delay etc. I can see France doing really well, not so confident initially on a few of the others but time will tell I guess, price will be key, good to see a BA presence returning.
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It will all be E190 as the !70's will have left the fleet by then. One 170 will go in Dec and the other possibly Jan.
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6 replacement E190’s will have been delivered by summer G-LCAC-H, 4 already delivered to NWI and parked
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Surprised the popular routes of CDG and ALC have not reappeared as yet although BACF don’t operate these from LCY either, any other carriers that would be interested?
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Would Air Nostrum consider sending a CRJ 900 or 1000 from Alicante to Southampton ? Would a CRJ have payload issues with SOU's runway ?
Or is Ryanair's route from Bournemouth to Alicante too strong a competitor ? |
It was never their's (BAA) in the first place. Gazeley Developments bought the whole airport site off Nat Somers, BAA then bought the current site and the still undeveloped NE corner, deciding that they didn't need the site that Royal Mail sorting office was built on. It was then all downhill with future deveopment opportunities, including the nonsensical decision made by their then MD to (against all operations staff advice) build the short term car park right up to the boundary fence, rather than leave room to extend Stands 7-12 to permit nose-in jet parking.
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I'd say no stronger than the Faro, Malaga and Palma routes BACF are going to be competing against RYN on. CDG and AMS would be good routes to add by another carrier.
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KLM will be back on AMS in Feb I think, unless there's been a change I'm not aware of.
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