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Old 26th Nov 2018, 11:57
  #2281 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SEN Observer
Anyone got any idea how Paderborn is performing after its very rocky first flight?
Double figures I believe, but nobody there has been counting.
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 12:23
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Originally Posted by Planespeaking

Rather a bizarre comment! I may be wrong but hasn't LTN just had severe restrictions placed on it because it exceeded it's night movement quota? Hence the upturn of biz jets at SEN. And LTN is an airport owned by it's local authority. Not much concern shown to local residents there I feel.

Not sure why it is a bazaar comment. All residents should be entitled to a good nights sleep even at airports that are owned by local authorities. At Luton the night noise limits were busted so the problem was moved to Southend so their residents would also suffer. Just think of a noisy party night after night that wakes you up. Should you just sit there and say nothing even if you moved next to a pub?
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 12:43
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Originally Posted by LTNman
Not sure why it is a bazaar comment. All residents should be entitled to a good nights sleep even at airports that are owned by local authorities. At Luton the night noise limits were busted so the problem was moved to Southend so their residents would also suffer. Just think of a noisy party night after night that wakes you up. Should you just sit there and say nothing even if you moved next to a pub?
You have been very quiet about night noise at LTN until it was caught out LTNMan, now suddenly because SEN is becoming busier you have come over all eco friendly. By the way I understand SEN is well within it's legal night movement limits. And just for the sake of the Queen's English....bizarre is odd and strange and bazaar is a street market in old Bagdad!
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 13:21
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Originally Posted by mik3bravo
Are SEN operating outside of their planning approval hours of operations? If so, then to what extent: infrequently, or becoming an increasing trend on a daily or weekly basis? Any data available to illustrate the factual position of movements outside approved hours of normal business operations?
The Section 106 agreement which formed part of the runway extension planning consent permits a maximum of 120 night period movements per month. I believe that diversions are not included in that number but delayed scheduled flights are. Since June this year when the LTN restrictions came in I don't think that quota has ever been exceeded, although it is permissible to do so as long as any additional movements above 120 are deducted from the next month's quota, but it has probably come close to being fully used. Recently night bizjet activity has picked up again but not to the extent it was in the summer.

LTNman
I'm surprised at your apparent sudden conversion to the environmental cause but I assume you will now be campaigning fro LTN's night quota to be reduced to at least the levels at SEN to prevent annoyance to local residents. By the way, what is the LTN night movement quota number currently? SEN also operates a preferred runway policy with all possible departures being on 05 and arrivals on 23, thus keeping the flight paths away from built-up residential areas.
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 13:42
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Originally Posted by tophat27dt
Double figures I believe, but nobody there has been counting.
Thank you, tophat.
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 14:07
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All airport operators have to show respect to their neighbours in this modern age & at the very least engage & attempt to mitigate noise issues & act responsibly & be seen to act responsibly.

SEN being a constricted site when it comes to very well established residential areas surrounding it & being unused to night jet movements would have due cause to heed.

LTN has been pointed out as one example & MAG/STN surrounded by fields (lots & lots) according to some views has taken these issues most seriously & delayed seeking further expansion until representation from the local regions was listened too & acted upon as far as possible.

STN has an excellent web track facility for the public too to view any potential noise infringers.

SEN will do well to listen to locals very carefully if only to draw the attention away nationally from night time ops which are increasingly becoming more & more restrictive.
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 14:52
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[QUOTE=southside bobby;10320848]
SEN being a constricted site when it comes to very well established residential areas surrounding it & being unused to night jet movements would have due cause to heed./QUOTE]

I think it's worth mentioning that prior to the Section 106 agreement which limited SEN night period movements to 120 per month, the previous quota limit was 900 per month. Historically SEN was very busy at night and in the 1980s the local jokes included one which suggested that SEN would close during the day if runway resurfacing was required as it was much busier at night. After that in the 1990s SEN was a freight hub with Electras and CV580s etc. operating an intensive night programme.

The latest SEN Annual Report states that 87% of night movements adhered to the preferential runway policy of 23 arrivals and 05 departures. A glance at satellite imagary will readily show the noise benefits that produces.

Last edited by Expressflight; 26th Nov 2018 at 15:58. Reason: Additional info added
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 14:59
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Talking of runway surfaces, does anyone have any further information on the grooving?
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 15:29
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Have no problems at all with historical data but will that actually cut it in the modern age?.

Obviously the residents reported as "getting very upset" require due diligence from the airport operator in various forms.

They appear not to remember the `80`s anyway evidently.

The backstory is it is redirected & reallocated traffic & not generated by SEN itself in this instance.

Although the poster from LTN was chided as "sour grapes" I think he has a point as when or if a local journo gets the story we could write the headline perhaps..."Noisy multi millionaire`s private jets thrown out of Bedfordshire airport now ruining Southend residents peace at night".

In today`s syndicated journalism the headline would be nationwide very swiftly I feel.
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 15:35
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Originally Posted by Planespeaking

You have been very quiet about night noise at LTN until it was caught out LTNMan, now suddenly because SEN is becoming busier you have come over all eco friendly. By the way I understand SEN is well within it's legal night movement limits.

You have no idea what campaigns and committees I sit on or what battles I have had over the table with officials. Being legal does not make it right so I would support residents rights to protest as no doubt like Luton the council just ignored them and set a figure that they thought the airport would never reach. I can understand why the plane spotters here can't see a bigger picture and probably don't really care but can anyone find the airport's noise contour maps. I can't find any which suggests there isn't any so are there forces trying to bury bad news seeing there are homes that sit between the approach lights. As a way of comparison this is Luton's so lets play spot the homes within the contour lines. What looks like homes to the west of the runway is in the main a business park.

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Old 26th Nov 2018, 15:55
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Originally Posted by LTNman
I can understand why the plane spotters here can't see a bigger picture and probably don't really care but can anyone find the airport's noise contour maps. I can't find any (for SEN) which suggests there isn't any so are there forces trying to bury bad news seeing there are homes that sit between
There are indeed noise contour maps which I believe are a legal requirement together with noise monitoring sites around the airport. Unfortunately I haven't the time to find them just now as I'm just setting off on a three day trip. I would suggest the SEN website via the 'Corporate and Community' link at the bottom of their home page might be the place to start.
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 16:23
  #2292 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Expressflight
There are indeed noise contour maps which I believe are a legal requirement together with noise monitoring sites around the airport. Unfortunately I haven't the time to find them just now as I'm just setting off on a three day trip. I would suggest the SEN website via the 'Corporate and Community' link at the bottom of their home page might be the place to start.
Spot on - Googling Southend Airport and then searching the website with the keyword "noise" takes you to the page linked below - the second link on the page is the "Noise Action Plan" and noise contour maps feature in the annexes of this document.

Noise Management at London Southend Airport
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 17:02
  #2293 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SWBKCB
Spot on - Googling Southend Airport and then searching the website with the keyword "noise" takes you to the page linked below - the second link on the page is the "Noise Action Plan" and noise contour maps feature in the annexes of this document.

Noise Management at London Southend Airport
Interesting read.
Appears in the summary that the noise action plan and contours (2011) relate to 2014-2019 forecasts.
Does this mean that the Airport will reevaluate next year and could this be a reason the locals are starting to kick off?
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Old 26th Nov 2018, 18:36
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The noise contours were last done in 2011, which is a year before the arrival of Easyjet. As most will know noise is measured in dB but what most folk won't know is that for every additional 3dB of noise the noise level increases by 100% as noise is measured on a logarithmic scale. This is why contour maps are in 3dB segments.
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Old 27th Nov 2018, 05:57
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Originally Posted by LTNman
The noise contours were last done in 2011, which is a year before the arrival of Easyjet. As most will know noise is measured in dB but what most folk won't know is that for every additional 3dB of noise the noise level increases by 100% as noise is measured on a logarithmic scale. This is why contour maps are in 3dB segments.
......... and I believe the A320neo is around 3db quieter than the A320ceo. There is one neo now based at SEN and reportedly it will be joined by a second such aircraft. The reduction in noise levels is very noticeable and has been commented on locally.
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Old 27th Nov 2018, 06:54
  #2296 (permalink)  
 
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Wonder what aircraft Ryanair will base at SEN, given advances in Airbus engine noise reductions which Easyjet enjoy.
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Old 27th Nov 2018, 07:21
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Re the RYR base...a local posed the question of the r/w grooving yesterday & I have asked the question twice before concerning grooving as I thought this was conditional for commencement of RYR ops.
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Old 27th Nov 2018, 07:35
  #2298 (permalink)  
 
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RYR Ops

Originally Posted by southside bobby
Re the RYR base...a local posed the question of the r/w grooving yesterday & I have asked the question twice before concerning grooving as I thought this was conditional for commencement of RYR ops.
From what I have read on Sen OPS FB page some ancillary works have been taking place over last few weeks with the Grooving due to start in January.

FM
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Old 27th Nov 2018, 07:39
  #2299 (permalink)  
 
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Good news in October over 145,000 passengers used the airport taking rolling 12 month figures well over 1.45m. Looks like the most popular routes were Amsterdam and Dublin. Manchester not doing well at all by the look of it.
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Old 27th Nov 2018, 07:46
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Grooving...thanks for the info.That would fit the timeline then for Spring`19 commencement.
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