Early morning drinking and low cost profit
The airports are just money making machines who do not care about anything else. Customer service, decent treatment of staff, all irrelevant if they can make money.
Manchester Airport being a prime example as demonstrated by the stupid duty free shop you are forced to zig zag past just before emerging into the public area on arrival in terminal one and the ridiculous location of staff parking. Who cares about how long it takes to get to and from your car when on min rest when you can sell parking near to the terminal to the Public for a vast amount of money!
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I watched astounded a few months ago as a barman served more alcohol to a group of guys who were already so drunk they could barely stand. This happened airside at Belfast International Airport.
I'm not sure if they ever made their Easyjet flight to AMS after realising the 'gate is closing lads' and staggered on the long walk to the gate.
The fix is simple but probably very controversial; there must be common sense approach with zero tolerence enforcement. Airports must be made to responsibly serve alcohol and airlines must start refusing to fly those who turn up at the gate drunk. Don't just offload one, offload the entire party which forces a level of responsibility on those who are involved in this type of behaviour.
There will be confrontation to begin with of that there is no doubt. Plan for it and hire extra security staff. Once the message of zero tolerance gets out the problem will reduce.
Two weeks ago I sat next to a couple on a flight who earlier this summer had been subject to 'hell' on a flight from Belfast to Palma which was full of stag and hen parties. They were travelling with a young family and were stuck in the middle of rowdy, swearing and totally ambivalent groups who gave zero regard to their surroundings. The drunken state of these passengers was evident at the gate yet they were allowed to board. I find the airlines' disregard the for safety and comfort of the majority of their passengers quite distasteful.
I'm not sure if they ever made their Easyjet flight to AMS after realising the 'gate is closing lads' and staggered on the long walk to the gate.
The fix is simple but probably very controversial; there must be common sense approach with zero tolerence enforcement. Airports must be made to responsibly serve alcohol and airlines must start refusing to fly those who turn up at the gate drunk. Don't just offload one, offload the entire party which forces a level of responsibility on those who are involved in this type of behaviour.
There will be confrontation to begin with of that there is no doubt. Plan for it and hire extra security staff. Once the message of zero tolerance gets out the problem will reduce.
Two weeks ago I sat next to a couple on a flight who earlier this summer had been subject to 'hell' on a flight from Belfast to Palma which was full of stag and hen parties. They were travelling with a young family and were stuck in the middle of rowdy, swearing and totally ambivalent groups who gave zero regard to their surroundings. The drunken state of these passengers was evident at the gate yet they were allowed to board. I find the airlines' disregard the for safety and comfort of the majority of their passengers quite distasteful.
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I find the airlines' disregard the for safety and comfort of the majority of their passengers quite distasteful.
Ut Sementem Feeceris
.....but the ground crew shouldn't let them through the gate in the first place. This is simply passing the buck to the Cabin Crew on the aircraft which is a much more difficult environment in which to deal with the problem.
In the past the Captain was informed if there was a problem passenger(s) at the gate, but now with everything time target driven, in my experience, it doesn't happen any more. All the pax through the gate by STD-15 - job done. The fact that 10 of them are a stag party and drunk doesn't come into the equation because that's now somebody else's problem (CC and Flightdeck)
A4
In the past the Captain was informed if there was a problem passenger(s) at the gate, but now with everything time target driven, in my experience, it doesn't happen any more. All the pax through the gate by STD-15 - job done. The fact that 10 of them are a stag party and drunk doesn't come into the equation because that's now somebody else's problem (CC and Flightdeck)
A4
.....but the ground crew shouldn't let them through the gate in the first place. This is simply passing the buck to the Cabin Crew on the aircraft which is a much more difficult environment in which to deal with the problem.
In the past the Captain was informed if there was a problem passenger(s) at the gate, but now with everything time target driven, in my experience, it doesn't happen any more. All the pax through the gate by STD-15 - job done. The fact that 10 of them are a stag party and drunk doesn't come into the equation because that's now somebody else's problem (CC and Flightdeck)
A4
In the past the Captain was informed if there was a problem passenger(s) at the gate, but now with everything time target driven, in my experience, it doesn't happen any more. All the pax through the gate by STD-15 - job done. The fact that 10 of them are a stag party and drunk doesn't come into the equation because that's now somebody else's problem (CC and Flightdeck)
A4
Constantly threatened job security if they don't 'make the numbers'
Also mentally not connected with the 'final product', they're just a 'cog in the machine'.
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Is it too simplistic to ask why the solution isn't just to strictly
enforce the Air Navigation Order which states that no person
shall board an aircraft, or be in an aircraft, while drunk.
Edit: sorry just read the previous posts and see they think same.
enforce the Air Navigation Order which states that no person
shall board an aircraft, or be in an aircraft, while drunk.
Edit: sorry just read the previous posts and see they think same.
In more sensible times the ground staff would ask the Senior cabin crew to take a look at any passenger who had a bit too much to drink.
If their assessment was they were too far gone they would inform the Captain who would always say "If you think they are not safe to fly then off load them". Never had a problem with pre-loaders when this routine was followed.
If their assessment was they were too far gone they would inform the Captain who would always say "If you think they are not safe to fly then off load them". Never had a problem with pre-loaders when this routine was followed.
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There are relatively simple answers to this problem: it requires a will to resolve it and some decent co-operation and co-ordination between the relevant parties at the Airports. They all know the 'general' flight destinations that the 'target groups' will be flying on.
If they have a 'purge' and a) insist the bar staff at the airports warn people not to have too many before flying, and refuse service to people who are clearly OTT b) have additional security and police around for the 'target flights' and c) refuse offenders boarding at the Gates , then I reckon that the penny will drop with the people who over do at, as they'll either miss their holiday or have to pay out big time for subsequent flights......
at the moment, the 'guzzlers' know it's a free for all and they can do as they please.......
If they have a 'purge' and a) insist the bar staff at the airports warn people not to have too many before flying, and refuse service to people who are clearly OTT b) have additional security and police around for the 'target flights' and c) refuse offenders boarding at the Gates , then I reckon that the penny will drop with the people who over do at, as they'll either miss their holiday or have to pay out big time for subsequent flights......
at the moment, the 'guzzlers' know it's a free for all and they can do as they please.......
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In past times, the road traffic acts said that you couldn't drive when drunk. It was realised that a measurable criterion was needed, so we had the breathalyser.
Surely the Air Navigation Order needs to be similarly amended to define drunk. The blood alcohol limit doesn't need to be quite as low, but the gate staff should have a duty to breathalyse any customer showing signs of undue 'merriment'.
Surely the Air Navigation Order needs to be similarly amended to define drunk. The blood alcohol limit doesn't need to be quite as low, but the gate staff should have a duty to breathalyse any customer showing signs of undue 'merriment'.
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I noticed signs up at Glasgow warning of being refused boarding if you've had too much. That's the first and only time I've seen it in the U.K., in fact the first time I've seen it anywhere.
If the situation described by the previous poster in Belfast is true, that's actually a criminal matter because the server would be in breach of the licensing act to serve patrons who are clearly inebriated.
So again it comes back to a point I previously made, you don't need additional rules or restrictions you just need existing frameworks to be adhered to.
If the situation described by the previous poster in Belfast is true, that's actually a criminal matter because the server would be in breach of the licensing act to serve patrons who are clearly inebriated.
So again it comes back to a point I previously made, you don't need additional rules or restrictions you just need existing frameworks to be adhered to.
This is my way of thinking as well. If the binge drinkers find that they miss 3 or 4 days of their holiday because they were denied boarding, then they might act more responsibly next time. It might take time, but hopefully the message will eventually become widely understood.
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Not always the obviouse routes either. My last two EK flights down to DXB were delayed leaving Manchester due to off loading of passengers who were actually denied boarding at the gate, and then had to have bags off loaded obviously. Good on EK and their ground staff I said, even though I personally then missed a connection on one occasion.
Regards
Mr Mac
Regards
Mr Mac
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So, to the "you wouldn't see airports abroad stopping alcohol sales" guy, of course you wouldn't, while its not a exclusively British issue, its very much a mostly British issue. Most nations know how to behave, have a healthy relationship with alcohol and most of the people who behave like this, are flying home very hungover from airports abroad.
I feel that we need to just start hammering anyone who disrupts a flight with removal of passport for a period of time, up to and including life depending on the severity of the incident. Those of us who can get on a plane with a few (but never excessive) number of beers in us and interact with the crew properly and not be a nuisance, should not be punished. Just make it clear to people what will happen to anyone who transgresses and let them hang themselves. A few high profile lengthy travel bans and attitudes will soon change.
The only change I would enforce on airports, as they need the money, is that sales of miniatures should be banned as these are almost certainly bought in the majority of cases buy people who intent to sneak them onto the plane. Also immediate removal from the airport of anyone consuming duty free on site, no refund, no holiday.
There's something wrong with the idea of managing everybody due to the lowest common denominator.
I feel that we need to just start hammering anyone who disrupts a flight with removal of passport for a period of time, up to and including life depending on the severity of the incident. Those of us who can get on a plane with a few (but never excessive) number of beers in us and interact with the crew properly and not be a nuisance, should not be punished. Just make it clear to people what will happen to anyone who transgresses and let them hang themselves. A few high profile lengthy travel bans and attitudes will soon change.
The only change I would enforce on airports, as they need the money, is that sales of miniatures should be banned as these are almost certainly bought in the majority of cases buy people who intent to sneak them onto the plane. Also immediate removal from the airport of anyone consuming duty free on site, no refund, no holiday.
There's something wrong with the idea of managing everybody due to the lowest common denominator.
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I watched astounded a few months ago as a barman served more alcohol to a group of guys who were already so drunk they could barely stand. This happened airside at Belfast International Airport.
I'm not sure if they ever made their Easyjet flight to AMS after realising the 'gate is closing lads' and staggered on the long walk to the gate.
The fix is simple but probably very controversial; there must be common sense approach with zero tolerence enforcement. Airports must be made to responsibly serve alcohol and airlines must start refusing to fly those who turn up at the gate drunk. Don't just offload one, offload the entire party which forces a level of responsibility on those who are involved in this type of behaviour....
I'm not sure if they ever made their Easyjet flight to AMS after realising the 'gate is closing lads' and staggered on the long walk to the gate.
The fix is simple but probably very controversial; there must be common sense approach with zero tolerence enforcement. Airports must be made to responsibly serve alcohol and airlines must start refusing to fly those who turn up at the gate drunk. Don't just offload one, offload the entire party which forces a level of responsibility on those who are involved in this type of behaviour....
On the crazier idea end. Maybe someone should start a private prosecution of an air carrier for violating the ANO.
