Qantas grounding?
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Leaked 12 months Ago
I was told this was in the pipe works 12 Months ago from a pretty good source within QANTAS. I didn't believe them but it sounds like its all falling into place for the big wigs at QANTAS, they want the airline to go arse up and the unions who thought they had a handfull of aces are in fact playing with a handfull of Jokers, playing right into the QANTAS hierachy hands. Jetstar are to take over apparantly with the 787 internationally leaving the A380 to cover the Eastern Seaboard to LA. Be interesting to see if this happens as my source has been correct so far. It's a shame really, I really love the iconic brand. When your overseas and it's time to return home after a few weeks away, nothing beats walking down the terminal stopping at the gate to see that big white jet with the red tail and the white kangaroo, knowing your heading home. How do we save our Airline? Because lets face it, it is our airline, Australia's airline......or is it????
12 months?
would think that ASIC would be rather interested in a proposal to wreak havoc on the share price of a publicly traded company... ? Additionally, a preplanned action that materially affects the trading position of the company planned 12 months before the act, that is then conducted the day after the AGM without advice to the shareholders....
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Seems they waited until HM the Queen left, but some of the Commonwealth leaders and ministers have been 'caught' I believe.
Commonwealth leaders stranded by Qantas grounding - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
Commonwealth leaders stranded by Qantas grounding - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
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None of the major cable news channels have mentioned that c
t Joyces 71%
pay rise .
I hope the unions put that information out to the world pretty damn quick, that should
sink the "offshore/ outsourcing cost cutting is necessary to save Qantas " arguement.
t Joyces 71% pay rise .
I hope the unions put that information out to the world pretty damn quick, that should
sink the "offshore/ outsourcing cost cutting is necessary to save Qantas " arguement.
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Good luck to all the staff on this one, how many times have we all heard the management speak that they have to pay "top dollar" to obtain the idiots who run these companies into the ground.
Then when it comes to the staff pay "Oh no we cannot afford more that X%" so as to appease the shareholders and allow management to award themselves 71% pay awards.
Then when it comes to the staff pay "Oh no we cannot afford more that X%" so as to appease the shareholders and allow management to award themselves 71% pay awards.
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The Qantas media machine is attempting to blame the unions.
However, basied on a few non-aviation forums I visit, the reaction from the SLF public is not buying it and most comments are anti-management and pro union.
...a relatively small sample though.
However, basied on a few non-aviation forums I visit, the reaction from the SLF public is not buying it and most comments are anti-management and pro union.
...a relatively small sample though.
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Like it or not airlines are a price sensitive commodity and commodities are traded, its all about money . Win or lose Joyce will get a fat pay cheque , Qantas will never be the same and a lot of people are going to lose their jobs. This is not a knee jerk reaction I feel to ground the airline , ducks are in a row . What I think would be interestrng is to see what large purchases and sales of airline shares have been made in the last month . Who is really pulling the strings ?
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First time poster, infrequent outside observer. Please be gentle.
This is text I posted to another forum of relevance, mainly relevant to flyers, outlining Joyce's remuneration package, the union claims, and the QF issues. I'm reposting it here due it it's relevance to some of the points already raised.
Some of the references are a little Australian, for example the waterfront dispute, but you can find out what these are about with a google search.
And don't shoot me down for expressing a view about Joyce's suitability and results. This was yesterday, and my view has shifted a little since then in light of today's action.
Further, any negative comments expressed are targeted at other unions and not necessarily AIPA, who I note has had reasonable demands and haven't been all that disruptive compared to others.
This is text I posted to another forum of relevance, mainly relevant to flyers, outlining Joyce's remuneration package, the union claims, and the QF issues. I'm reposting it here due it it's relevance to some of the points already raised.
Some of the references are a little Australian, for example the waterfront dispute, but you can find out what these are about with a google search.
And don't shoot me down for expressing a view about Joyce's suitability and results. This was yesterday, and my view has shifted a little since then in light of today's action.
Further, any negative comments expressed are targeted at other unions and not necessarily AIPA, who I note has had reasonable demands and haven't been all that disruptive compared to others.
Having just watched the AGM webcast and seen James Strong (Chairman, Remuneration Committee) lay this issue out in detail - the assertion that Joyce is getting "such an obscene increase" is without merit.
The claims that he is getting a 71% pay rise are false, completely misrepresent the pay structure of the companies CEO, and re-affirms QF's decision to implement a salary package of which the majority is an at-risk component.
For those not familiar with at-risk in the context of salary packages, this means that receipt of a designated amount of the salary is entirely dependant on achieving specific, measurable goals for corporate performance. Think of it as the executive version of commission based pay.
Joyce's salary package for FY2010/11 is set at AUD 6.02m, of which AUD 2.04m is cash salary. Frankly, on the basis of the work he has done to date trying to strengthen the business and diversify to improve revenue, he's earned every cent.
The remaining AUD 3.98m is only payable when Joyce has delivered against the medium and long term targets set as part of his remuneration package, which was voted on and approved at their AGM last year. I wasn't able to discern from the meeting if the allocation of ~1.7m shares (which form part of the Qantas Long Term Incentive Plan - LTIP) is reliant on the meeting of goals and forms part of the AUD 3.98m figure.
Targets set for Joyce to earn that additional AUD 3.98m and the LTIP shares are pretty steep, and include a number of metrics rating QF's performance against the ASX/S&P Top 100, and the basket of globally listed airlines. A bit more info about this can be found in the notice of meeting for today's AGM (See pg. 4, col 2).
Further, any award of shares to Joyce under the LTIP has to be approved by a vote of shareholders at an AGM. I'd happily wager that if institutional investors weren't happy with the CEO's performance, they'd be doing a lot more than voting done a LTIP motion at an AGM.
Further, let's get back to why the airline hasn't reached agreement with the engineers, ground staff and pilots union. It's because these groups are wanting to impose conditions as part of an industrial relations agreement which enshrine old and redundant work practices, and could reasonably prevent the airline from seeking out lawful opportunities to grow the company which would in turn help deliver the job security they so desperately desire.
And I've already covered the legal issues regarding this in another thread, looking at how such conditions could be a plain text breach of the Competition Act subject to the union meeting the criteria for the activities test which would enable this to be classified as restrictive conduct.
Unions in this country have for at least the last 30yrs been heavily resistant to change. We just have to look at the waterfront disputes during the 90's and the significant work done by the previous Federal Government to break apart the stranglehold of the Building and Construction unions.
I'm all for people getting job security, but what I won't, nor do I expect Qantas to stand for, is allowing these groups to hold it to ransom and acting for themselves rather than the greater good. The unions [and not necessarily the pilots whose demands seemed reasonable] need to grow up, and realise it's high time for their industrial practices to move on.
The claims that he is getting a 71% pay rise are false, completely misrepresent the pay structure of the companies CEO, and re-affirms QF's decision to implement a salary package of which the majority is an at-risk component.
For those not familiar with at-risk in the context of salary packages, this means that receipt of a designated amount of the salary is entirely dependant on achieving specific, measurable goals for corporate performance. Think of it as the executive version of commission based pay.
Joyce's salary package for FY2010/11 is set at AUD 6.02m, of which AUD 2.04m is cash salary. Frankly, on the basis of the work he has done to date trying to strengthen the business and diversify to improve revenue, he's earned every cent.
The remaining AUD 3.98m is only payable when Joyce has delivered against the medium and long term targets set as part of his remuneration package, which was voted on and approved at their AGM last year. I wasn't able to discern from the meeting if the allocation of ~1.7m shares (which form part of the Qantas Long Term Incentive Plan - LTIP) is reliant on the meeting of goals and forms part of the AUD 3.98m figure.
Targets set for Joyce to earn that additional AUD 3.98m and the LTIP shares are pretty steep, and include a number of metrics rating QF's performance against the ASX/S&P Top 100, and the basket of globally listed airlines. A bit more info about this can be found in the notice of meeting for today's AGM (See pg. 4, col 2).
Further, any award of shares to Joyce under the LTIP has to be approved by a vote of shareholders at an AGM. I'd happily wager that if institutional investors weren't happy with the CEO's performance, they'd be doing a lot more than voting done a LTIP motion at an AGM.
Further, let's get back to why the airline hasn't reached agreement with the engineers, ground staff and pilots union. It's because these groups are wanting to impose conditions as part of an industrial relations agreement which enshrine old and redundant work practices, and could reasonably prevent the airline from seeking out lawful opportunities to grow the company which would in turn help deliver the job security they so desperately desire.
And I've already covered the legal issues regarding this in another thread, looking at how such conditions could be a plain text breach of the Competition Act subject to the union meeting the criteria for the activities test which would enable this to be classified as restrictive conduct.
Unions in this country have for at least the last 30yrs been heavily resistant to change. We just have to look at the waterfront disputes during the 90's and the significant work done by the previous Federal Government to break apart the stranglehold of the Building and Construction unions.
I'm all for people getting job security, but what I won't, nor do I expect Qantas to stand for, is allowing these groups to hold it to ransom and acting for themselves rather than the greater good. The unions [and not necessarily the pilots whose demands seemed reasonable] need to grow up, and realise it's high time for their industrial practices to move on.
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The problem nowadays is that airlines are run by bean counters and not by aviation professionals. You get a CEO (appointed by a board made up of investors who know SFA about the business) who knows SFA about the airline business, who then gets rid of anybody who knows anything about the airline business in case they might show up his total lack of capability. Swiss Air anybody?
I'm glad I got out of that side of the business 35 years ago when airlines where still run by professionals who had moved up through the ranks and got years of practical experience before they took over the top job. It used to be said that Airline industry was one of the few that you could never learn from books, only by hand on experience. Nowadays it seems that you can become chief pilot 10 minutes after you get your PPL
I'm glad I got out of that side of the business 35 years ago when airlines where still run by professionals who had moved up through the ranks and got years of practical experience before they took over the top job. It used to be said that Airline industry was one of the few that you could never learn from books, only by hand on experience. Nowadays it seems that you can become chief pilot 10 minutes after you get your PPL
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As a regular long haul passenger I tried booking a flight HGK to FRA this week did not even think of Qantas despite being an Australian expat and Emirates appalling timetable to Europe. Reading of the pay rise before this moment of total madness was bad enough as a business owner (not a CEO) what was he thinking of. I was also so shocked I looked at his employment history and then wondered how did he get this job? He complains that Australia is the end of the line and not an Asian hub when flights from the HK and Singapore airports can be booked another misleading statement. I’m glad I’m booked this month as flights will be premium price now. Maybe get a good discount for next months flight if I book Qantas.
If I was booked on a Qantas flight I would be a bit (words not allowed) never mind being in the queue at 3.00pm after a 3 hour journey to the airport a few hours packing and a week’s planning to be told sorry closed. I only hope that the staff were not abused, Interesting you could still book flights on the website tonight for tomorrow, you can get a nice hotel in HK for $350. Share price Monday morning is going to be interesting given his reported $10 million looks like he just lost his pay rise next two years.
If I was booked on a Qantas flight I would be a bit (words not allowed) never mind being in the queue at 3.00pm after a 3 hour journey to the airport a few hours packing and a week’s planning to be told sorry closed. I only hope that the staff were not abused, Interesting you could still book flights on the website tonight for tomorrow, you can get a nice hotel in HK for $350. Share price Monday morning is going to be interesting given his reported $10 million looks like he just lost his pay rise next two years.
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You can have heavily unionised under performing airlines or you can have cheap flights but not both, unfortunately the travelling public that pay our wages seem to prefer the latter....
When exactly did southwest last make a loss?
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Can anyone outline the action taken so far and action planned by each of the groups involved?
This seems like a massive overreaction, not sure how the management can justify it to their customers.
This seems like a massive overreaction, not sure how the management can justify it to their customers.
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Well the CEO can blame it himself. If you give yourself a bonus of 2.000.000$ aus, of course you p*ss on your own people. And thats what you get.
What surprises me is that he doesn't seem to care too much about the airline. Willy Walsh turned it around after lots of struggle but can't recall he gave himself a fat bonus during the fights.
What are the odds he gives back the bonus to start fresh with negotiations with the union?
Problem remains with all CEOs, they milk their own airline/ company before they leave. And that I hate with a passion.
Fire the guy!
What surprises me is that he doesn't seem to care too much about the airline. Willy Walsh turned it around after lots of struggle but can't recall he gave himself a fat bonus during the fights.
What are the odds he gives back the bonus to start fresh with negotiations with the union?
Problem remains with all CEOs, they milk their own airline/ company before they leave. And that I hate with a passion.
Fire the guy!
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For those not familiar with law:
Strikes and lockouts are just different sides of the same coin. Having both, secures the parity between unions and companies.
Both parties start the dispute at their own risk, e.g.:
- The union has to pay the wages out of their own cash box
- The company will loose turnover and ultimately loose customers
Having one side stripped of their rights, will lead to a dangerous imbalance. Take a look at the UK, after the "Iron Lady" manged to destroy the power of the trade unions for decades...
Strikes and lockouts are just different sides of the same coin. Having both, secures the parity between unions and companies.
Both parties start the dispute at their own risk, e.g.:
- The union has to pay the wages out of their own cash box
- The company will loose turnover and ultimately loose customers
Having one side stripped of their rights, will lead to a dangerous imbalance. Take a look at the UK, after the "Iron Lady" manged to destroy the power of the trade unions for decades...