DURHAM TEES VALLEY AIRPORT - 5
It's a chicken and egg situation - without commercial flights, noone will be willing to invest in public transport links that won't make money (would you fund a bus to Bagby, or Fishburn airfield?); without transport links to nearby towns/citys/attractions no airline will gamble in the middle of a recession.
I flew into DTV as a commercial pilot earlier this year, nearly 10 years after my first trial flight from same airport. It saddened me to see just 3 departures on the board, at the airport I grew up next to. And even then I was only flying in because the runway at NCL was closed.
Sad, Sad, Sad.
TTR
<Edit: I flew in this year. Seems like last year though! And it is nearly a decade since my first ever trial flight with Teesside Aero Club. Where did the years go?>
I flew into DTV as a commercial pilot earlier this year, nearly 10 years after my first trial flight from same airport. It saddened me to see just 3 departures on the board, at the airport I grew up next to. And even then I was only flying in because the runway at NCL was closed.
Sad, Sad, Sad.
TTR
<Edit: I flew in this year. Seems like last year though! And it is nearly a decade since my first ever trial flight with Teesside Aero Club. Where did the years go?>
Last edited by thetimesreader84; 24th Aug 2009 at 23:46.
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It is not a sad situation , it is an impossible situation. Current estimates for this metro system are running at £220 million pounds which includes an input of £75 million poundsfrom Railtrack. Bearing in mind that these provisional estimates are usually made by someone who once estimated the number of rolls of wallpaper he needed to paper his lounge and therefore feels he is adequately qualified to estimate a huge civil engineering contract,the final fiqure will be somewhere in the region of twice that with 10% added for adding up mistakes.Half a billion pounds in the present financial climate for a new train set? I don't think so.
As an aside I cannot remember the last Japanese/US/European tourists who landed at Teesside Airport on spec looking for public transport to the bright lights of the Teesside Conurbation. I could be proven wrong but I think that 95% of the passengers leaving Teesside actually come back here and the others have secure arrangements with family/company or friends.Just because International is in the title,it dosen't really mean a grown up airport. It is a regional holiday slightly business airport with aspirations to be bigger than it can possibly be.BMI insisted that Durham be put in the title because they didn't understand the dynamics of the area any more than the current owner's appear to.Please let somebody local have an input into it before it is too late. With Jet2's announcements at NCL it may already be too late.
As an aside I cannot remember the last Japanese/US/European tourists who landed at Teesside Airport on spec looking for public transport to the bright lights of the Teesside Conurbation. I could be proven wrong but I think that 95% of the passengers leaving Teesside actually come back here and the others have secure arrangements with family/company or friends.Just because International is in the title,it dosen't really mean a grown up airport. It is a regional holiday slightly business airport with aspirations to be bigger than it can possibly be.BMI insisted that Durham be put in the title because they didn't understand the dynamics of the area any more than the current owner's appear to.Please let somebody local have an input into it before it is too late. With Jet2's announcements at NCL it may already be too late.
Paarmo, that may be true, but why shouldnt people come and use MME to visit the local area? Why couldn't we have gone for that market? For years Teesside has been used as a base by coach companies doing trips to North Yorks, County Durham and surrounding areas. With some of the redevelopment going on, why wouldnt people want to visit Yarm, Middlesbrough, Durham, Darlington? I'm out of the area now, but still go back occasionally, and it certainly compares favourably with the area I live in now, which is generally regarded as a tourist hotspot. Certainly there have been many North Americans strolling around this summer, despite the Credit Crunch.
I agree that the local metro system will probably be a white elephant. One only has to look at events in Edinburgh to see how not to input a Metro system. But MME does not need a metro system. An hourly bus service running along the A66 from Darlington Station to Middlesbrough, Via the airport would make an impact, I'm sure. I may be proved wrong, but I think MME was, and remains, the only airport on our route network not served by a regular (at least every 1/2 hour) bus/rail/metro service to the nearest centre of population. Certainly I'm hard pressed to think of one.
However, the big problem as I see it is that Teesside suffers from an ID problem, one that seems to be exacserbated by some sections of the local community and media. MME will never be an East Midlands or Liverpool airport, but why can't it be successful? And why can't Teesside as a whole attract more tourists?
I agree that the local metro system will probably be a white elephant. One only has to look at events in Edinburgh to see how not to input a Metro system. But MME does not need a metro system. An hourly bus service running along the A66 from Darlington Station to Middlesbrough, Via the airport would make an impact, I'm sure. I may be proved wrong, but I think MME was, and remains, the only airport on our route network not served by a regular (at least every 1/2 hour) bus/rail/metro service to the nearest centre of population. Certainly I'm hard pressed to think of one.
However, the big problem as I see it is that Teesside suffers from an ID problem, one that seems to be exacserbated by some sections of the local community and media. MME will never be an East Midlands or Liverpool airport, but why can't it be successful? And why can't Teesside as a whole attract more tourists?
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Actually the airport does have a half hourly bus to Darlington, one of those runs hourly to Stockton and Middlesbrough, which is the 12 run by Arriva.
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Timesreader,
Foreign tourists do like to visit an area of specific interest to them. The scenery is spectacular from several high vantage points over looking the Tees Estuary but only if you a fan of the film Bladerunner.( Expanation too long for here please see Scott brothers film directors) . We are locally and perhaps regionally proud of the largest working transporter bridge in the world and the oldest surviving lifeboat in the world at Redcar ( The Zetland 1802 ) but then we start to struggle and I am not sure that these are nationally of great import let alone of international interest. Durham Cathedral I hear you shout. Yes possibly but it is actually 3/10ths of a mile closer to NCL than MME. So much for BMI.
I am a great supporter of Teesside but even I struggle to map a tourist trail. Even Captain Cook's house dosen't exist anymore.
I do think the international tourist trade is beyond Peel and anyone else for that matter to project with any confidence on the world stage.
Nice thought though. Back to the drawing board. Does anyone else have any marketing ideas for Teesside Airport?
Foreign tourists do like to visit an area of specific interest to them. The scenery is spectacular from several high vantage points over looking the Tees Estuary but only if you a fan of the film Bladerunner.( Expanation too long for here please see Scott brothers film directors) . We are locally and perhaps regionally proud of the largest working transporter bridge in the world and the oldest surviving lifeboat in the world at Redcar ( The Zetland 1802 ) but then we start to struggle and I am not sure that these are nationally of great import let alone of international interest. Durham Cathedral I hear you shout. Yes possibly but it is actually 3/10ths of a mile closer to NCL than MME. So much for BMI.
I am a great supporter of Teesside but even I struggle to map a tourist trail. Even Captain Cook's house dosen't exist anymore.
I do think the international tourist trade is beyond Peel and anyone else for that matter to project with any confidence on the world stage.
Nice thought though. Back to the drawing board. Does anyone else have any marketing ideas for Teesside Airport?
Last edited by paarmo; 27th Aug 2009 at 13:11.
Whitby, Saltburn, Hartlepool Historic Quay? Great Ayton, Roseberry Topping, Stokesly, Yarm, Darlington Railway Museum, Barnard Castle, MiMa, North York Moors, High Force, Tees estury SSSI, the Cpt. Cook trail in Marton? All off the top of my head. All, I think, worthy of any advertising campaign, and things that Teessiders can be rightly proud of.
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Yes we are proud of them but more as lifestyle enhancers rather than tourist hotspots. After all they have to compete with the Tower of London , Houses of Parliament , Grand Canyon ,Yosemite ,Hawaii ,Great Wall etc etc. As I said earlier great for locals,even regionally and at a push nationally but to attract foreign tourists with all the other attractions both in the UK and abroad ? It's a hard sell and I don't know of anyone especially at Peel who could do it. In the meantime the airport dies. A slightly easier sell is to tour companies but even that appears to have foundered at the moment.
At the moment there dosen't appear to be any direction and focus for the airport. I don't think that they know where they want to position themselves in the market. I don't think that a mass influx of foreign tourists is likely and mass influxes is what they need.
At the moment there dosen't appear to be any direction and focus for the airport. I don't think that they know where they want to position themselves in the market. I don't think that a mass influx of foreign tourists is likely and mass influxes is what they need.
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Any large influx of foreign tourists at a level that would support new services is fantasy. The airport has been in decline for many years, and what is more relevant is that historically there was never enough support when the figures were around 1m pax to add further growth at the time.
Even more important is that times have changed & the competition has grown stronger, with investment being made to strengthen the position of NCL & LBA.
As for the local population, then a habit has formed whereby alternatives to DTV are more often than not, given favourable consideration. DTV is now operating well below it's critical no. of pax to breakeven suggesting further cuts in overheads. At this late stage throwing investment at transportation links really isn't going to offer any short to medium term support in attracting additional pax. All the while further losses need funding & by whom ?
The future for growth is on a 'regional basis' & this positions have now been occupied by NCL to the North & LBA to the South. Most people I talk to have no qualms at all about travelling to LBA or NCL to take a Loco holiday flight & that together with a catchment area now more attractive than ever to competition says a lot.
As for the Loco's operating in a very difficult & competitive environment, then it makes absolutely no sense to increase risk by placing aircraft at airports which effectively increase their risk profile.
Even more important is that times have changed & the competition has grown stronger, with investment being made to strengthen the position of NCL & LBA.
As for the local population, then a habit has formed whereby alternatives to DTV are more often than not, given favourable consideration. DTV is now operating well below it's critical no. of pax to breakeven suggesting further cuts in overheads. At this late stage throwing investment at transportation links really isn't going to offer any short to medium term support in attracting additional pax. All the while further losses need funding & by whom ?
The future for growth is on a 'regional basis' & this positions have now been occupied by NCL to the North & LBA to the South. Most people I talk to have no qualms at all about travelling to LBA or NCL to take a Loco holiday flight & that together with a catchment area now more attractive than ever to competition says a lot.
As for the Loco's operating in a very difficult & competitive environment, then it makes absolutely no sense to increase risk by placing aircraft at airports which effectively increase their risk profile.
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What surprises me is that Cobham haven't moved to Leeming where there's heaps of room, military partners (esp. 100 Sqn) on base, virtually identical proximity to North Sea/Spadeadam airspace, and presumably lower costs to the MoD budget.
NS
NS
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Military partners at Leeming is exactly correct. They are still civilians who are partners to the military.Even though they have access to most operational systems there is still the security headache of accessing a military base. On top of that they are not exclusively contracted to the MOD. They could secure contracts with others ,highy unlikely I realise ,for downtime with their aircraft. On top of that they operate " pretending to be exercises " at regular intervals and operating into a civilian airport makes them more realistic.
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Ah well, will be flying business class back to Manchester from the US tommorow. This was a holiday trip to Florida with the wife. I used to fly into London then head up to MME on the BMI. I found first on the transpennine fairly comfortable though a rather slow 2 and a half hours but will have to get used to it in the future.
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Ah well, will be flying business class back to Manchester from the US tommorow. This was a holiday trip to Florida with the wife.
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Flybe may one day do a Belfast City, some will say they won't because they already fly into NCL from there, but it hasn't stopped them flying to both LBA & DSA & most of the airports down in the South West. Still a long shot though, apart from that, a based loco might try BFS, but that's an even longer shot.