NEWCASTLE - 8
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Manchester, England
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NYC from regionals
Skipness is right about the problem with getting market penetration. At MAN we know all about this - the figures say there is a market for HKG, BKK, SYD and more, but we still don't have these routes because there are so many good alternatives available via a myriad of connections. Add to that the complexities of frequent flyer clubs etc which draw away business to hubs, and you need a market which is perhaps 3 or 4 times the capacity offered on a direct route before it could work commercially. A direct route to NYC remains a rite of passage for regionals seeking intercontinental status, but the sad fact is that very few could support it. MAN does just about, but even then it has seasonal capacity shifts and relies on B757 economics.
Join Date: May 2009
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There's an advert for an air traffic controller position at Newcastle if anyone is interested, noted it whilst looking on the website earlier.
Back to the US. If I'm in planning from a US airline I'd see Newcastle and question whether I could interrupt a market and upset my alliance buddies by taking traffic away from connections through AMS and CDG. In terms of US geography its really not far for people to travel and I wouldn't want to challenge it.
What I'd prefer is a route to FRA or an alternative to get me back to Newcastle from home. I'm fed up of BA and LHR!!
Still, from an enthusiast point of view, NCL is one of the few airports in Europe that can provide a daily 757 ride!
Back to the US. If I'm in planning from a US airline I'd see Newcastle and question whether I could interrupt a market and upset my alliance buddies by taking traffic away from connections through AMS and CDG. In terms of US geography its really not far for people to travel and I wouldn't want to challenge it.
What I'd prefer is a route to FRA or an alternative to get me back to Newcastle from home. I'm fed up of BA and LHR!!
Still, from an enthusiast point of view, NCL is one of the few airports in Europe that can provide a daily 757 ride!
Join Date: Jul 2005
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NCL - New york
I hear the first LS flight to/from New York is sold out with the next one almost full.
Of course that in no way means a regular sheduled flight would work.
I cannot see the advantage of a connection at EWR or JFK for onward travel to major cities in the US versus say a single connection through AMS, LHR, or CDG.
Of course that in no way means a regular sheduled flight would work.
I cannot see the advantage of a connection at EWR or JFK for onward travel to major cities in the US versus say a single connection through AMS, LHR, or CDG.
Join Date: Aug 2003
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fl dutchman – How many US or Caribbean cities are available direct from AMS/LHR versus direct from EWR or JFK!! It would make smaller destination a one stop from NCL!!
I am very surprised at the negativity on NYC! Why should the people of the North East not have a direct link to the US! Just think of the prestige a link to the US would bring to the North East region and to businesses! Emirates direct link to DXB did just that! I am amazed also the number of people who are happy to put down this route after a slight drop in pax's on one month!! They are quick to forget the record month the route had in the previous month.
Why should we have to travel down to Manchester or via a hub city to get to the US! Lets face it NYC is only a third more the distance of Sharm el Sheikh!!
We should totally behind the regions push for a NYC link, you will notice I did not say airport but region, its that big a deal!
I am very surprised at the negativity on NYC! Why should the people of the North East not have a direct link to the US! Just think of the prestige a link to the US would bring to the North East region and to businesses! Emirates direct link to DXB did just that! I am amazed also the number of people who are happy to put down this route after a slight drop in pax's on one month!! They are quick to forget the record month the route had in the previous month.
Why should we have to travel down to Manchester or via a hub city to get to the US! Lets face it NYC is only a third more the distance of Sharm el Sheikh!!
We should totally behind the regions push for a NYC link, you will notice I did not say airport but region, its that big a deal!
Join Date: Jul 2005
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10 DME ARC.
I was refering to major cities in the US.
Of course there are those travelling to the smaller places where via AMS there may be 2 stops ie NCL AMS then onward via Detroit etc to a number of smaller places.
So yes there could be an advantage if the airline who flies to JFK or EWR has onward connections available to the smaller places with one stop only.
I would love to see a regular schedule from NCL to New York for all the reasons you mention, after all my roots are from the North East of England.
Unfortunatley I dont have an accurate figure showing how many people go from NCL via AMS, CDG, LHR to a major destination where they terminate, versus those who go to a major US city then onward to a smaller destination.
Someone will have those numbers, and I am sure it will have been considered.
One day it will happen.
Re the Emirates I think it will be upgraded to a larger airctaft sooner than some people may think.
Lets all be positive.
I was refering to major cities in the US.
Of course there are those travelling to the smaller places where via AMS there may be 2 stops ie NCL AMS then onward via Detroit etc to a number of smaller places.
So yes there could be an advantage if the airline who flies to JFK or EWR has onward connections available to the smaller places with one stop only.
I would love to see a regular schedule from NCL to New York for all the reasons you mention, after all my roots are from the North East of England.
Unfortunatley I dont have an accurate figure showing how many people go from NCL via AMS, CDG, LHR to a major destination where they terminate, versus those who go to a major US city then onward to a smaller destination.
Someone will have those numbers, and I am sure it will have been considered.
One day it will happen.
Re the Emirates I think it will be upgraded to a larger airctaft sooner than some people may think.
Lets all be positive.
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NE ENGLAND
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10 DME ARC
I fear that you really need to get down off your soap box on this one as you seem to becoming rather blinkered & somewhat "jingoistic" on this subject.
Before the flack comes back, then I am not a spotter, I cross the Atlantic several times a year on a regular basis, and I live in the North East and probably have been around for even longer than yourself.
A few points, then you could do better than reconsider the content of the previous post by "Roverman" which sets out the economic issues very clearly & succinctly, assuming that you are able to get over any prejudice you may have towards MAN.
I find it very interesting that
which for whatever reason you choose not to divulge, and is now totally irrelevant.
The reality is that no one has taken up the route as they are able to make more money elsewhere with the same available resources.
Next point, I don't particularly feel full of joy that on many west bound flights crossing UK airspace at FL310 or above having endured 2 hours flight time & 90 minutes at hub in transit, and if it were as simple as boarding at NCL and deplaning in NYC then this gripe would be valid. However NYC is rarely a final destination & as such a connection somewhere would always be necessary, though I do take on your point that this may turn into two connections for those travelling on to "Backofbeyondsville".
The simple fact is that on most occasions I am able to get to my destination with one stopover ex AMS/CDG. Moreover as I like a bit of comfort, then there are also many more seating arrangements and class choice available than would be on offer on a "3:3" 757 ex NCL. As such unless the timing was suitable, and on offer was a single "point to point" route, then I hate to admit that I would probably consider all European hub alternatives.
Interestingly I have on occasions looked at the alternative transatlantic offerings on 757 from EDI and assume that on a similar price structure, then unlikely to be any cost savings vs.the use of the current Euro hub connection.
Finally to revisit “Rovermans” point then it’s extra pax that are required! i.e. “excessive demand”, as simply stating that there is a demand understates the issue as to the effect on dilution of traffic on all currently available Euro feeder routes.
I am very surprised at the negativity on NYC! Why should the people of the North East not have a direct link to the US! Just think of the prestige a link to the US would bring to the North East region and to businesses!
Before the flack comes back, then I am not a spotter, I cross the Atlantic several times a year on a regular basis, and I live in the North East and probably have been around for even longer than yourself.
A few points, then you could do better than reconsider the content of the previous post by "Roverman" which sets out the economic issues very clearly & succinctly, assuming that you are able to get over any prejudice you may have towards MAN.
I find it very interesting that
" you do know the reasoning behind AA dropping the route!"
The reality is that no one has taken up the route as they are able to make more money elsewhere with the same available resources.
Next point, I don't particularly feel full of joy that on many west bound flights crossing UK airspace at FL310 or above having endured 2 hours flight time & 90 minutes at hub in transit, and if it were as simple as boarding at NCL and deplaning in NYC then this gripe would be valid. However NYC is rarely a final destination & as such a connection somewhere would always be necessary, though I do take on your point that this may turn into two connections for those travelling on to "Backofbeyondsville".
The simple fact is that on most occasions I am able to get to my destination with one stopover ex AMS/CDG. Moreover as I like a bit of comfort, then there are also many more seating arrangements and class choice available than would be on offer on a "3:3" 757 ex NCL. As such unless the timing was suitable, and on offer was a single "point to point" route, then I hate to admit that I would probably consider all European hub alternatives.
Interestingly I have on occasions looked at the alternative transatlantic offerings on 757 from EDI and assume that on a similar price structure, then unlikely to be any cost savings vs.the use of the current Euro hub connection.
Finally to revisit “Rovermans” point then it’s extra pax that are required! i.e. “excessive demand”, as simply stating that there is a demand understates the issue as to the effect on dilution of traffic on all currently available Euro feeder routes.
Couple of interesting press release on the NIA website
Newcastle Airport - Record summer marks Jet2.com's sixth anniversary at Newcastle Airport
says that:
- ???
Also Manx2 to introduce a Saturday lunchtime flight:
Newcastle Airport - Manx2 increases Newcastle schedule
An interesting piece in the Northern Echo about KLM/Air France and their views on the relative merits of Newcastle and DTVA:
KLM shows support for the region's airports (From The Northern Echo)
Interesting - presumably the increases are the 146 replacing the CRJ for AF and the normally seasonal switch to bigger aircraft for KLM.
Newcastle Airport - Record summer marks Jet2.com's sixth anniversary at Newcastle Airport
says that:
This year alone has seen strong growth for the airline, with a 56 per cent more passengers travelling this summer
Also Manx2 to introduce a Saturday lunchtime flight:
Newcastle Airport - Manx2 increases Newcastle schedule
An interesting piece in the Northern Echo about KLM/Air France and their views on the relative merits of Newcastle and DTVA:
KLM shows support for the region's airports (From The Northern Echo)
Interesting - presumably the increases are the 146 replacing the CRJ for AF and the normally seasonal switch to bigger aircraft for KLM.
Join Date: Mar 2008
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Noones denying that a 757 couldnt be filled NCL-NYC. The issue is, the demand for premium fares is likely to be low and most seats would need to be dirt cheap to fill. (Jet 2 NYC case in point) and most of them are packages
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Newcastle
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Ref KLM & AF
Great to hear some possitive news from 2 very important airlines @ Newcastle.
Yes it will be a 146 replacing the CRJ7.
Also with the terminal being extended this winter and the Pier upgrade nearing completion which looks alot better than what it was. It's not all bad up north.
Something happening after xmas ............. watch this space (its not new year)
Great to hear some possitive news from 2 very important airlines @ Newcastle.
Yes it will be a 146 replacing the CRJ7.
Also with the terminal being extended this winter and the Pier upgrade nearing completion which looks alot better than what it was. It's not all bad up north.
Something happening after xmas ............. watch this space (its not new year)
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Newcaslte upon Tyne
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Good news on the CDG route with about 90 extra seats a day.
Great to see a full A321 on the 1830 BA to LHR flight on Tuesday, although I was only paying £30 o/w I hope thats not the only way they are filling it.
Any news on when the BRU will get upgraded?
Great to see a full A321 on the 1830 BA to LHR flight on Tuesday, although I was only paying £30 o/w I hope thats not the only way they are filling it.
Any news on when the BRU will get upgraded?
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: London
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The KLM announcement for AMS is a bit more important than that. The winter frequency goes up from 3 to 4 daily with aircraft as follows:
0755 737/800
0935 737/700
1335 EMB190
1725 737/700
0755 737/800
0935 737/700
1335 EMB190
1725 737/700
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Newcastle
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ops guy
Ops guy we all know what it happening in the new year....
Delta direct to New York......lol
This is what i think anyway most likely to happen in the new year
Jet 2 - 6 based aircraft and if they get the 767's long haul.
Monarch - based aircraft for summer 2012? if not flights by MON
Easyjet - 4th based aircraft and new routes
EK - upgrade to daily 777
Virgin - Operating flights to Orlando with A330 from NCL
BMI - 2 aircraft to operate Frankfurt, oslo and Zurich??
Flybe - extra based aircraft after years of them saying....
manx2 - 2x daily to isle of man!!
anything else guys??
Delta direct to New York......lol
This is what i think anyway most likely to happen in the new year
Jet 2 - 6 based aircraft and if they get the 767's long haul.
Monarch - based aircraft for summer 2012? if not flights by MON
Easyjet - 4th based aircraft and new routes
EK - upgrade to daily 777
Virgin - Operating flights to Orlando with A330 from NCL
BMI - 2 aircraft to operate Frankfurt, oslo and Zurich??
Flybe - extra based aircraft after years of them saying....
manx2 - 2x daily to isle of man!!
anything else guys??
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Newcastle
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Newcastle
HH6702, Very Optimistic, Can Not See Virgin Operating Here, Maybe EK Possibly The Only Realistic 1, I As A Newcastle Plane Spotter Would Like This To Happen But By The Sounds Of It You Maybe Have Had To Much To Drink... I Suppose Stranger Things Have Happened...
Join Date: Aug 2003
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Skyman771
Sorry not getting off the box at the moment as it is a subject I believe in! I have worked in Aviation for the last thirty years and whilst not in marketing I 'believe' I have a good grasp of the area. As for "prejudice" against Manchester I have no prejudice! I do have a aversion against the 2-3hr, on a good day, drive down the A1/M62/M60!! Or the near 5hr return to the NE I had a few years ago after a transatlantic night flight in ice and snow!!
Whats wrong with the seat pitch on a 3-3 170-180 seat B757?? Much better to the 3-3-3/2-5-2 of a 300-400 seat B777!!
Dilution? Whilst yes they will be some dilution of pax's from other hubs, as we have found on the DXB it comes back to other destinations. Plus the percentage that decide not to make that drive!!
As a final point why don't we let the interested parties, the airlines and they ARE some, make the decision instead of us!!
Sorry not getting off the box at the moment as it is a subject I believe in! I have worked in Aviation for the last thirty years and whilst not in marketing I 'believe' I have a good grasp of the area. As for "prejudice" against Manchester I have no prejudice! I do have a aversion against the 2-3hr, on a good day, drive down the A1/M62/M60!! Or the near 5hr return to the NE I had a few years ago after a transatlantic night flight in ice and snow!!
Whats wrong with the seat pitch on a 3-3 170-180 seat B757?? Much better to the 3-3-3/2-5-2 of a 300-400 seat B777!!
Dilution? Whilst yes they will be some dilution of pax's from other hubs, as we have found on the DXB it comes back to other destinations. Plus the percentage that decide not to make that drive!!
As a final point why don't we let the interested parties, the airlines and they ARE some, make the decision instead of us!!