BAMANAGER

I see that Dear Gordon didn't use BA on his trip today to the United States, completely avoiding T5. Was this as a result of his need to arrive as planned with bags? I suspect so, with the head of goverment avoiding BA that's another great message. Avoid them like the plague!!!

yes.way

just a thought.

Why is everyone blaming BA? Surely the BAA own and are responsible for the infrastructure of T5?

They admitted it was there fault over the baggage yet because of the media everyone still blames BA for all that went wrong.

Yes BA have to learn from what happened but they are not fully responsible for baggage belts, air bridges, trains, esculators etc that don't work.

Maybe it is time for people to realise BA is restricted by LHR. Check the preformance at LGW it is vastly different. Much better baggage delivery and 83 percent on time!

The government should take some responability for not supplying a premier gateway to our country, instead they worry they will lose the green vote! Industry and tourism musn't be worth anyrhing?

T5 wll be good in time, sadly its been tarnished.

Capvermell

As I said my main short haul BA positive experiences from LGW were the GB Airways routes (Southern Spain, Canaries and Gibraltar) and I suppose that was really a different and superior Airline flying in BA colours.

I must also confess to being bothered by who my fellow passengers are. BA passengers short haul are all business persons and nice middle class people. Easyjet passengers are usually much more largely a contingent of oiks (especially PMI where we have a family apartment in the nicer part of the island).

Have Easyjet got rid of not having an allocated seat yet thus forcing you to scrum at the gate for an overwing exit seat or at least an aisle seat in the forward part of the cabin (hate travelling at the back on any aircraft)if you are tall like me on a full flight. And like I say they always resisted any cheap fares under 2 months to departure even if they were undersold. When I looked in January at some offer fares (leaving in the next few weeks) it did look like they were finally starting to bin that dogma (they are big enough now to need to do that though) on routes that were not selling as well as they would like. But then again those were winter fares.

Do Easyjet yet serve anything other than inedible brown bread hovis sandwiches on their new longer haul routes. Also have they stopped charging £3.50 for wine while BA provide it free. I think not. I agree that BA has brought in catering that is not much better than Easyjet on the food side short haul but at least you don't have to take decisions about whether to pay an exorbitant amount for it or go hungry. Or have they shifted to no included food in steerage like BMI?

I agree it does sound like the main BA operation is going down hill from what you say. Perhaps all the decent BA managers went to Easyjet if they are now improving the quality of their operations. Getting rid of Stelios the Greek could only have improved matters on the quality front.

exeng

I and many others had said that heads would fall. They have, but believe me it is not finished yet.

The BALPA open letter will run and run - the large investors will have read it and be knocking at Mr. Walsh's door - going to be a lot more blood yet.

Now Mr Walsh cannot even contemplate a Pilot's strike - please try and find a compromise.

The BACC and Mr Walsh need to sit back and contemplate how they can recover an airline from this; because where they are (and going) is disaster.

'Open Skies' needs to be looked at from an entirely new angle - i.e. compromise. Please do not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

BA can again be the great ICON of the airline world. To be frank it just needs some common sense knocking into both the 'leaderhip team' and the BACC.

If you don't sort it you will all be history.


Regards
Exeng

Capvermell

No he doesn't. The shareholders have the final say who the Directors are if they overstep the mark as they can vote not to re-elect them at the AGM when their terms come to an end. However the Directors do have the final say as to who the Chairman is and can immediately sack the Chairman if he is not performing at any time. Of course the Chairman gets the say about new replacement directors (following resignations etc) between AGMs providing he has the support of the Board.

aidey_f

Further to the point about BAA, was I the only one to notice that, last Friday, when they announced the postponement of the move of the rest of the T4 flights, Radio 4 was asking BMI what BAA were saying, because BAA were refusing to do any interviews.

Capvermell

But it was surely BA's choice to make Heathrow their only major international hub airport and to heavily pull out of Gatwick and never bother with Stansted and/or Luton in the first place, despite their obvious long term potential.

Surely Easyjet's success in running out of three different London airports and BA's decision to shun the growth of any lower cost short haul routes on the basis that their cost base was far too bloated to ever operate efficiently in that sector shows that it is BA who has chosen to make its corporate fate inextricably linked to the state of Heathrow?

BAA has had a cock up at T5 but because it also operates the rest of Heathrow and Stansted and Gatwick too (both of which are going from strength to strength) the incident has not left it irretrievably holed below the waterline. Unless of course recent events persuade the government to let the Competition Commission break up its monopoly control of the majority of UK airport capacity (especially in London).

ICEHOUSES

CAPVERMELL

Agree with you re GB airways, newer aircraft , better service etc on the routes down to spain, as for EZY boarding, this is split into several boarding groups A to C I think, if you check in online your usually group A, and first to board after the priority group have boarded, the overwing exits with leg room have grey seat covers, so head for there. Inflight catering on EZY is not much diff to BA, although you have to pay, at least you dont have to eat a free packet of birdseed as chucked at you by a BA flight attendent as I've experienced,...Sorry for this thread creep, just thought I'd point out the crap BA shorthaul I've experienced at LGW recently.

Hand Solo

If the CAA believed WW was trying to run BA single handedly I'm sure they'd take a close interest. As it is WW has done more no more than take on a focal role until Kirkwood and Noyes are replaced. The people who actually do the real work are still in place and I doubt the CAA will worry too much the change. After all, if Noyes and Deadwood had resigned last year they wouldn't have shut the airline down.

Landing Drinks

Re the appointment of new Directors, this will be a WW man who has the strength to support the business through the changes needed to achieve its longer term business aims. i.e take on the unions and unfavourable work practices that prevent BA from being competative.
The T&C's ruined EI, a National airline that is now regional with "few long haul sectors".. The low cost heathen at DUB we too entranched for EI to recover there mis managed position..

Take this message and apply to BA!!. The low cost boom at LTN, LGW and STN.. these three airports strangle LHR.. So BA can only ever hope to focus on Long Haul... They missed the chance to dominate the regional market by screwing up GO, BCal and Dan's and giving up on LGW... How many atempts do they need... Hardly anyone had heard of FR and Ezy when GO came about... T&C's and greed of the few screwed it for all...

The T&C's saw to this... unless these alter.. Then the demise which came to DUB will arrive in LHR...
Same as on carriers with T&C's that drowned them...
SN in BRU
SR in ZRH
AF in CDG
AI in CIA

The CAA will not interfere with the running of BA.
The AOC requirements are for an Accountable Manager (WW) and the Directors of Flt Ops & Engrg. "Operations" is not something the CAA require as mandatory, although they will be aware of the changes and expect BA to furnish them with thier plans going forward.. This has already been done in the annoucement of a new combined role.. The CAA will support WW & BA during this transition...

Hey ~ "If you can't change the people, CHANGE THE PEOPLE !"

How "punctual" the departures of two yesterday!!, were they on time and allowed to depart accompanied by their "luggage"..
One has to make this joke based on the operational performance since Day 1. Wankers, and one of them should have gone after the TV annoucement..
There are characters on the apprentice who could brief hungry punters and media in a more appropraite way than that...

Have the construction teams and project management firms had anything to say about all this??????????
During my last LRC I hear the trials for the baggage system were only tested with a few hundred empty bags, nothing like peak throughput of a busy week day morning check in.
Also heard was the passenger flows and throughput (signage etc) only tested by staff... The guys from MUC must have some stoires to tell...

What about the BA project team taking two days off before the opening as "all was going to plan".. Is there any truth in this..?

Adjure........ GMT - 6hrs so its rude not too...

Sunfish

I am not going to contribute any more unless there are new developments because this thread is veering off topic.

The only thing I would add is that management get the union behaviours they deserve in my experience.

DarkStar

[QUOTE][/[For the record, the waste at Waterside does not include the fine Ops staff who try against the odds to keep the show on the road and should be in their own Ops centre not Waterside, without a canteen, gym, hairdressers and Waitrose at the weekend, as the 'office' is technically closed]QUOTE]

Sadly, even Ops suffered the old v new BA Management style. Experienced Ops Managers and staff who actually knew what they were talking about and could resolve complex issues were seen as 'dangerous' and 'a threat' to the new breed of BA Ops Managers who were brought in without any Ops experience. So many good staff were encouraged to leave, shameful. There is a famous incident when BA planners were trying to 'design' Project ICEBERG - the move of some L/H flights from T4 to T1 and an Ops Control staff member was asked to attend a planning meeting towards the end of the process, only for him to flag up basic crass mistakes and assumptions. A phone was made to the new Ops Manager asking the 'awkward' Ops Control staff member not to attend further meetings .

This is how the Airline has eroded its experience and T5 sadly is the flagship for failure, but WW will survive

Capvermell

BAEngineering/WillieWalsh we can spot you a mile off no matter how many new identities you create.

Perhaps if you picked a location that was not an empty piece of sea off the cost of the Western Isles you might then appear to be a little more credible? Or is your Engineering base for BA an underwater one?

I presume that -6 GMT is a reference to the number of hours you have left before this forum identity is yet again terminated by the moderators?

Dick Deadeye

That would be the dream win-win situation for BALPA!

They could withdraw the strike ballot, and watch from the sidelines as Noise and Deadwood performed the same management wizardry on OpenLies that made T5 such an outstanding success.

Twelve months would be my guess, with those two at OpenLies, before BA pulled the plug!

No, BALPA couldn't be that lucky.

L337

I have heard exactly the opposite. The system was tested with more bags than it has yet had to cope with. The "rumour" is that the people who program the software, the BAA, never changed the codes for a "real" day, and the system failed to recognise any bags at all. Despite repeated asking from BA to the BAA, they denied a software problem. Eventually after 3 days the BAA admitted the mistake.

Just one of many many stories circulating.

PartickThistleNil

Armpit,


What an offensive statement. Whilst I agree that there shouldn't be a need for volunteers, the operation should be adequately staffed, many people are working in offices through the day and then volunteering to do late shifts and weekend shifts in the terminals.

Your statement is akin to me saying if you only fly for 900 hours a year you are not working hard enough. Don't make assumptions about other people's roles.

You are merely perpetuating the stereotypes and 'them and us attitudes' that exist within the company.

Not everyone who works at waterside works 9-5 four days a week. Many work 12 hours a day, 6 or 7 days a week and more.

And for the record, I'm not management (the word is fast becoming an insult in its own right sadly).

And I used to work on the ramp, so I have been down there. And I drank a hell of a lot more tea and coffee when I worked down there than I have time to now.

SeLFish_Flyer

Unbelievable. With everything that BA has to worry about at the moment (Oil, T5, potential strikes) still we see the old them and us culture that has been at BA for so long.
I am ex Waterside staff.
I was one who volunteered in the past to help out in the Terminals (e.g. terror threats) as well as being part of EPIC and OCIC. Does this mean that I didn't have enough work to do?? Nonsense! It meant that I would volunteer to do either early or late shift to assit my COLLEAGUES (yes we are all one team) in the Terminals. If it was an early shift I would start at 6am, and then at 2pm go back to my office where I would often stay until 22:00. If it was a late shift then I would get to the office at 7am and stay on in the terminals until told to go home (and on occasions this was after 2am). It meant that I sometimes worked weekends either volunteering to help in terminals or catching up on my work. Why did I do this? Because the passengers were essential to me. Without them there was no job.
What did I find in the terminals? Well I was there to cover absence once (I gave up a Sunday). Thie minute I started i was asked if I wanted a tea break, I was shadowing 2 other staff members (permanent T4 staff). I declined, and said I would take a half hour in the middle of my shift if it was OK, they told me no, as that was when they would go and move their cars. They created a tea rota whereby one of us was scheduled to be at break while the other 2 worked. This lasted the whole shift, apart from them both needing 90 mins to move their cars! But did I complain, no, I got on with the job of helping our customers. But I loved it, no other job at BA gave me the buzz that helping out those passengers did. And I dealt with my fair share of irate passengers, including one who was flying to their fathers funeral.....and we cancelled his flight! There were aggressive punters, upset even distressed punters and some of them threatened me. But heleping them get away gave me a real pleasure. I received a number of thank you letters from passengers after these shifts.......which I read while drinking my latte at Waterside

I think it is time (still) for the staff of BA to all remember that, actually, you all have your own jobs to do, but depend upon each and every department to do it. You all need to rally round, remember that first and foremost you should be pleasing your passengers, and make the once great ariline great again.

But what are the chances of that?

VAFFPAX

SLFF - Thank you for being a professional. Thank you for being there for pax when they need support, without complaints, without a demand for recognition. Pax really do appreciate staff who are happy to help, and no doubt you are happy with pax who try to make your life easy as a human in a difficult job too.

In the past I've always been very vocal about my appreciation of beleaguered staff members, especially when they have some difficult (and sometimes selfish) pax who pretty much make their day miserable.



S.

WHBM

If this is the case the management layers must be useless, as in any other reasonable business this would/should have been eliminated long ago. Possibly explains why director level people have to go.

What is all this "move their cars" stuff ?

42psi

A while since I worked at LHR (not for BA) but at that time you could park in the central area car park with a N/side pass after about 18:00 or so.

So if on a late shift it was fairly common to use your break to move the car so you save the staff bus trip at the end of the late shift.