Chaos at Terminal 5
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Scotland and BA
Further to my earlier post about the current shambles that is T5, increasing numbers of Scots going internationally are choosing to fly via Europe, the Middle East or the US rather than use T5, and more specifically, BA. Questions have even been asked in the Scottish Parliament as to why when BA has a problem the first flights to be cancelled always appear to be Glasgow or Edinburgh? In the past business leaders have demanded explanantion from Oor Wullie, but things are even worse now. And like everyone else, we Scots like our luggage to be waiting for us at our destination... together BA and BAA are a lethal combination of badly-managed incompetence.
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To be fair to L337 it's probably this part of the post that was being referred to
Quote:
I never go to Heathrow (or any other London airport) if I can possibly avoid it - a dirty disorganized expensive inefficient and rude place (but then so is most of England at present).
Nice first post to come on here and slate the entire country.
Quote:
I never go to Heathrow (or any other London airport) if I can possibly avoid it - a dirty disorganized expensive inefficient and rude place (but then so is most of England at present).
Nice first post to come on here and slate the entire country.
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Actually I've just had a perfectly reasonable experience out of and into the country through terminal 3---even if due to jet lag I thought I had landed in Bombay by mistake.
Since I fly as a holiday maker I have to use whatever airport I'm told to. But I am damn sure all "professional" travellers can and will do everything they can to use Madrid, Paris, Hamburg, whatever rather than Heathrow. And I'm damn sure they will be delighted to see them.
Hence my comment about Ferrovial assisting Barajas. It was a crack with my tongue firmly in my cheeks or whatever the saying is.
Since I fly as a holiday maker I have to use whatever airport I'm told to. But I am damn sure all "professional" travellers can and will do everything they can to use Madrid, Paris, Hamburg, whatever rather than Heathrow. And I'm damn sure they will be delighted to see them.
Hence my comment about Ferrovial assisting Barajas. It was a crack with my tongue firmly in my cheeks or whatever the saying is.
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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i believe the space given up by BA has been committed contractually to other airlines
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> "in a £4bn terminal, only five or so gates have a bimoetrics system".
I was amazed when they switched from fingerprints to iris recognition with just days to go before opening T5. I'd assumed that when the data protection people got upset they would just throw up some extra barriers to keep averyone apart while it was sorted out. I guess they must have anticipated it to some extent. Anyone know why iris recognition is OK but fingerprints aren't? Seems to make little sense.
I was amazed when they switched from fingerprints to iris recognition with just days to go before opening T5. I'd assumed that when the data protection people got upset they would just throw up some extra barriers to keep averyone apart while it was sorted out. I guess they must have anticipated it to some extent. Anyone know why iris recognition is OK but fingerprints aren't? Seems to make little sense.
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I am wondering about what knock on effects the disruptions are having on crews.
Is this disaster badly effecting crews due to delays and frustration?
An angry crew cant be very good for safety!
Can any crew comment?
The problems have been ongoing for a while now and I wonder if the BA crews are being affected.
Is this disaster badly effecting crews due to delays and frustration?
An angry crew cant be very good for safety!
Can any crew comment?
The problems have been ongoing for a while now and I wonder if the BA crews are being affected.
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Re Scotland and BA
BA have (and have never had) any interest in serving intercontinental destinations from Scotland-or for that any other regional point in the United Kingdom.
Obviously this is not commercially viable and Emirates,Etihad,Qatar Airways are being forced to serve regional airports in the United Kingdom at a loss to themselves,not.
BA would sooner you booked a domestic sector with them to increase their profits and subject you to the horrible Heathrow disaster,as opposed to transitting somewhere like Doha or Dubai.
The perceived BA alternative to flying to LHR to connect with a long-haul flight is to drive on the awful UK road system to LHR at great cost and in so doing boost the tax revenue to the government in fuel taxes(and soon road tolls as well),and VAT for parking your car in a (probably overpriced and BAA run)car park.
Obviously this is not commercially viable and Emirates,Etihad,Qatar Airways are being forced to serve regional airports in the United Kingdom at a loss to themselves,not.
BA would sooner you booked a domestic sector with them to increase their profits and subject you to the horrible Heathrow disaster,as opposed to transitting somewhere like Doha or Dubai.
The perceived BA alternative to flying to LHR to connect with a long-haul flight is to drive on the awful UK road system to LHR at great cost and in so doing boost the tax revenue to the government in fuel taxes(and soon road tolls as well),and VAT for parking your car in a (probably overpriced and BAA run)car park.
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Bit of thread creep but Dairyground's post 1100 was surprising only in one respect - the fact that BA robbed a serviceable aircraft for parts for one that wasnt. Last March I was at LHR on a 744 to Cape Town when the exact same thing happened (cracked bolt in the nose landing gear). We had to wait for another 744 to come in that was due for heavy maint, BA eng swapped over the bolt, filled in the forms and off we went into the night. All cheerfully announced by the flight deck, as if it was no big deal.
I assumed it was highly unusual but having read Dairygrounds post I now wonder? If this is SOP then I am appalled. I mean, how African.
Pinkman
I assumed it was highly unusual but having read Dairygrounds post I now wonder? If this is SOP then I am appalled. I mean, how African.
Pinkman
Pinkman:
We call that process "Christmas treeing" where I come from. Provided the "parts" (usually sub assemblies such as actuators, black boxes etc.) are within their legal limits it's no big deal. Everybody does it at one time or another, and airlines have tracking systems to keep track of exactly what is fitted where to who...
We call that process "Christmas treeing" where I come from. Provided the "parts" (usually sub assemblies such as actuators, black boxes etc.) are within their legal limits it's no big deal. Everybody does it at one time or another, and airlines have tracking systems to keep track of exactly what is fitted where to who...
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Cwatters - I suspect the difference between fingerprints and iris recognition is that it's much easier to accidentally leave a fingerprint where it will embarrass or incriminate you - less easy to mislay the biometrics of your iris!
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ryanair, rather than ba
ive never had lost luggage or late flights with ryanair, whose record is much better than ba, last time i flew easyjet i had a ba cabin crew member sitting beside me, knowing he was crew the staff were very good to him bringing him food and drink, after they had served him he made sneering remarks to me about their uniforms. i dont think ba has hte right to look down on budget airlines, at they least they get you there on time, with your bags and are polite, last time i flew ba the purser was stretched out over three passenger seats asleep
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BA have (and have never had) any interest in serving intercontinental destinations from Scotland-or for that any other regional point in the United Kingdom.
Obviously this is not commercially viable and Emirates,Etihad,Qatar Airways are being forced to serve regional airports in the United Kingdom at a loss to themselves,not.
BA would sooner you booked a domestic sector with them to increase their profits and subject you to the horrible Heathrow disaster,as opposed to transitting somewhere like Doha or Dubai.
The perceived BA alternative to flying to LHR to connect with a long-haul flight is to drive on the awful UK road system to LHR at great cost and in so doing boost the tax revenue to the government in fuel taxes(and soon road tolls as well),and VAT for parking your car in a (probably overpriced and BAA run)car park.
Obviously this is not commercially viable and Emirates,Etihad,Qatar Airways are being forced to serve regional airports in the United Kingdom at a loss to themselves,not.
BA would sooner you booked a domestic sector with them to increase their profits and subject you to the horrible Heathrow disaster,as opposed to transitting somewhere like Doha or Dubai.
The perceived BA alternative to flying to LHR to connect with a long-haul flight is to drive on the awful UK road system to LHR at great cost and in so doing boost the tax revenue to the government in fuel taxes(and soon road tolls as well),and VAT for parking your car in a (probably overpriced and BAA run)car park.
Clearly you have NO commercial awareness whatsoever. Dubai have their hub in Dubai, BA in London, both are served from Scotland. It's a classic hub and spoke operation, you can choose the BA hub, or the Emirates, or for that matter KLM hub. It is against BA's own business plan to serve a variety of long haul UK routes from outside London as they dilute the feed to London Heathrow, which is built to feed the long haul services. Think about Continental serving Bristol and Belfast, feeding their hub at Newark. Don't like Heathrow? Fly another hub, but get real about why BA don't fly long haul from say Glasgow to the US and Canada. It didn't make money and it's not the 1980s !!!
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Bit of thread creep but Dairyground's post 1100 was surprising only in one respect - the fact that BA robbed a serviceable aircraft for parts for one that wasnt. Last March I was at LHR on a 744 to Cape Town when the exact same thing happened (cracked bolt in the nose landing gear). We had to wait for another 744 to come in that was due for heavy maint, BA eng swapped over the bolt, filled in the forms and off we went into the night. All cheerfully announced by the flight deck, as if it was no big deal.
I assumed it was highly unusual but having read Dairygrounds post I now wonder? If this is SOP then I am appalled. I mean, how African.
I assumed it was highly unusual but having read Dairygrounds post I now wonder? If this is SOP then I am appalled. I mean, how African.
I don't see anything wrong with it, it is a servicable part so what is the problem?
Back to the thread hopefully T5 improves this week, still waiting to hear how they will work switch 2.
UkEng
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I assumed it was highly unusual but having read Dairygrounds post I now wonder? If this is SOP then I am appalled. I mean, how African.
Well I lived the adventure, it makes for a pretty fine shopping mall I must say! Plenty of staff at Dixons, PC world, World DutyFree, had a great burger at Giraffe, oh and there’s aeroplanes with blue bellys and shooshie tails (my daughters saying) parked outside too.
HA! I had the dubious pleasure of being in transit through T5 this afternoon in uniform coming from the continent in transit to a UK domestic destination.
Getting off the plane was hassle free even getting to the immigration cue was straightforward, but definitely not enough signage.
Immigration cue….. well it was like arriving at Sydney at 6am with 4 other widebodys….. no where near enough immigration staff to deal with the numbers. Next was to be fingerprinted…. Errrr no the machine was buggered so I got my photo taken instead, which is ok however once the chap told this old fart to remove my glasses then I don’t know whether I was looking at the camera or the short skirt belonging to the blond in front of me!
Then it was up the escalator to go through security again, well if you thought the days of “flight connections” shambles at T1 was history….. its not. Cues just the same no where near enough security staff manning the new wiz bang x-ray machines for the crowds, it took close to 30 mins which is really not acceptable, given that this place was meant to be better!
The culprit was two things, staff undergoing training and the new wizbang xray machine that returns the grey buckets itself….. great idea.. less people required. However the was an lass in front of us with a Cello…. If its not in the buck it wont fit, also there was a super size me pram for twins…. Nope did no go through either…. No bucket, no fit,
Also the amount of people that set the walk through metal detector off also meant that there was no one to collect their bucket…. So there was a bucket back up to the point where no more was being screened.
In summary there would be more capacity however it is foiled but the one thing that can never be accurately gauged. The human element.
If, and this is a big If, the operators at the terminal saw what the retail “customer service” business have in relation to staff then their may actually be customer service for the airline transport medium, which I thought was one of the reasons we flew full service airlines.
Operationally I just watched a 747 sit ½ in the bay because it appeared the guidance system did not work until you guessed it the magic wands came out and they moved onto blocks. Another 5 min delay here and its subsequent flow on effects.
The finish to the building, well its not finished! Once you get away from a retail area then there is things missing… like lifts, doors, the roof, ok maybe some of it is meant to be exposed but there are some bits that are not. On the far northern end (A1/2) with some BA office/ lounge things, one of them does not even have the glass door installed yet so there is an ill fitting wooden door in frame that has gaps above and below but the keypad lock is still there.
The floors are dirty, you would not think the place has been open only a couple weeks, the loose chairs are scattered around like kids toys, there is rubbish, (food wrappers, newspaper and the like) that have not been picked up on chairs and the floors….. and come to think of it I have yet to see a cleaner doing the rounds like you used to in the other terminals.
So in summary its been rushed and that is visible, BA/BAA wanted something world class, well they got it, a World Class F***UP! Thinking of big buildings at airports HKG puts the place to shame.
Thankfully I did not have any checked bags, I would not like to have had to write that story.
Finally there is this billboard at gate A2……. Says it all really
HA! I had the dubious pleasure of being in transit through T5 this afternoon in uniform coming from the continent in transit to a UK domestic destination.
Getting off the plane was hassle free even getting to the immigration cue was straightforward, but definitely not enough signage.
Immigration cue….. well it was like arriving at Sydney at 6am with 4 other widebodys….. no where near enough immigration staff to deal with the numbers. Next was to be fingerprinted…. Errrr no the machine was buggered so I got my photo taken instead, which is ok however once the chap told this old fart to remove my glasses then I don’t know whether I was looking at the camera or the short skirt belonging to the blond in front of me!
Then it was up the escalator to go through security again, well if you thought the days of “flight connections” shambles at T1 was history….. its not. Cues just the same no where near enough security staff manning the new wiz bang x-ray machines for the crowds, it took close to 30 mins which is really not acceptable, given that this place was meant to be better!
The culprit was two things, staff undergoing training and the new wizbang xray machine that returns the grey buckets itself….. great idea.. less people required. However the was an lass in front of us with a Cello…. If its not in the buck it wont fit, also there was a super size me pram for twins…. Nope did no go through either…. No bucket, no fit,
Also the amount of people that set the walk through metal detector off also meant that there was no one to collect their bucket…. So there was a bucket back up to the point where no more was being screened.
In summary there would be more capacity however it is foiled but the one thing that can never be accurately gauged. The human element.
If, and this is a big If, the operators at the terminal saw what the retail “customer service” business have in relation to staff then their may actually be customer service for the airline transport medium, which I thought was one of the reasons we flew full service airlines.
Operationally I just watched a 747 sit ½ in the bay because it appeared the guidance system did not work until you guessed it the magic wands came out and they moved onto blocks. Another 5 min delay here and its subsequent flow on effects.
The finish to the building, well its not finished! Once you get away from a retail area then there is things missing… like lifts, doors, the roof, ok maybe some of it is meant to be exposed but there are some bits that are not. On the far northern end (A1/2) with some BA office/ lounge things, one of them does not even have the glass door installed yet so there is an ill fitting wooden door in frame that has gaps above and below but the keypad lock is still there.
The floors are dirty, you would not think the place has been open only a couple weeks, the loose chairs are scattered around like kids toys, there is rubbish, (food wrappers, newspaper and the like) that have not been picked up on chairs and the floors….. and come to think of it I have yet to see a cleaner doing the rounds like you used to in the other terminals.
So in summary its been rushed and that is visible, BA/BAA wanted something world class, well they got it, a World Class F***UP! Thinking of big buildings at airports HKG puts the place to shame.
Thankfully I did not have any checked bags, I would not like to have had to write that story.
Finally there is this billboard at gate A2……. Says it all really
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"Hotels" provided by BA for delayed passengers?