BMI
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FR-, I'm not so sure that Baby is as
as you say it is, actually. Your reasons? Other than the aging -300s, perhaps they aren't so bad.
Mainline, however... is quite another matter.
dead in the water
Mainline, however... is quite another matter.
Last edited by Aero Mad; 12th Sep 2011 at 17:05.
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Didnt say is was a basket case, just that any new owner would need to spend money sooner rather than later.
But still no one has said anything about what may happen, just abuse.
fr-
But still no one has said anything about what may happen, just abuse.
fr-
Lufthansa has appointed Vagn Ove Sorensen, a former Scandanavian Airlines executive, as BMI chairman to handle the disposal or find buyers for BMI Baby and BMI Regional. BMI lost £105m in the first six months this year.
Willie Walsh, chief executive of International Airlines Group (IAG), the holding company for BA and Iberia of Spain, has made no secret of his interest in BMI, not as an airline but for its valuable take off and landing slots at overcrowded Heathrow.
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Maybe this is time for BHX to prosper? BMI could return to grass roots... Hub and spoke out or BHX - would be a pretty good footing for BMI mainline streamlined, it's issue is trying to compete in LHR. Sell the slots, use the money to restructure and go for BHX, plenty of capacity available.
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No-one knows what's happening, that's why. Anyone who comes on here and says different is either;
1) Lying
2) A member of the Lufty Group board
Since I don't imagine many of 2 post here, then 1 is more likely.
Baby is far from being a basket case. It needs some new aeroplanes, but that's hardly a difficult thing to sort out.
1) Lying
2) A member of the Lufty Group board
Since I don't imagine many of 2 post here, then 1 is more likely.
Baby is far from being a basket case. It needs some new aeroplanes, but that's hardly a difficult thing to sort out.
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whoever buys the airline i think we can say goodbye to them from belfast city as with the comments from IAG they want the heathrow slots and i doubt they will use them for domestic flights, maybe whoever buys them will just merge the 3 parts of the airline into 1 and base at a new airport, such as BHX but as 'say again slowly' says we can only guess, im sure all will be revealed soon as i dont feel the airline will be on the market very long
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BHD2BFS, you never know... the amount of transfer passengers BA would get by just laying on a few domestic routes would be a major incentive. Obviously they wouldn't use all the BMI slots for that but just a few could up the numbers quite a bit.
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but they have codeshare with EI from BFS, so no need to run their own metal from N.I
I should add though, love the BD product, crews are always soo friendly. I normally fly from Dub-LHR with them and have never had a bad flight yet!
I should add though, love the BD product, crews are always soo friendly. I normally fly from Dub-LHR with them and have never had a bad flight yet!
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Aviation News Ltd
Virgin Atlantic considers bmi tie-up
Virgin Atlantic has indicated it could be interesting in linking up with British Midland International, or bmi, saying it had "close interest in a combination with bmi."
Virgin could use bmi as a feeder airline for its long-haul network and would help put the airline on a stronger footing to compete with International Airlines Group alliance with American Airlines.
Emirates has confirmed it is not interested in bmi although last year Etihad, along with Air France-KLM, said it could be interested in buying the UK airline.
BMI’s current parent Lufthansa is hoping to make a sale decision by the end of the year.
Virgin Atlantic has indicated it could be interesting in linking up with British Midland International, or bmi, saying it had "close interest in a combination with bmi."
Virgin could use bmi as a feeder airline for its long-haul network and would help put the airline on a stronger footing to compete with International Airlines Group alliance with American Airlines.
Emirates has confirmed it is not interested in bmi although last year Etihad, along with Air France-KLM, said it could be interested in buying the UK airline.
BMI’s current parent Lufthansa is hoping to make a sale decision by the end of the year.
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Does their quoted choice of words indicate that they have no intention of buying BD outright but would prefer to merge with them with presumably LH taking no more than 49% of the new company so SRB can maintain overall control? Not quite what LH would want I suspect.
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Virgin could use bmi as a feeder airline for its long-haul network
Merging long haul VS with short haul BD is a mantra that's been around for years but given that BA and BE * took about a decade to merge properly, it's not that easy to pull off. Remembering that VS just settled with the unhappy pilots, do they really want to open negotiations to merge the seniority lists?
* Not flybe, think about it
Last edited by Skipness One Echo; 13th Sep 2011 at 12:42.
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I think if bmi merges with Virgin it would be one big disaster that would probably sink the whole entity. Virgin just want some slots to play at expanding, they're a tiny player in a badly dented economy.
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Unless BA are willing to pay top money I can't see LH doing a deal with BA for slots only, why would they, the last choice would be to strengthen BA & Virgin may be an attractive partner, it would weaken BA position at LHR & may well suit LH to have a partner in bmi, bmi need West bound long haul services, but starting from scratch from LHR in the current market would be crazy to say the least! So using bmi slots and crews and getting shot of some short haul aircraft and routes may be attractive to both bmi & Virgin
Both baby & regional are at or close to being profitable, so the focus will be on stemming main line losses in the short term.
Both baby & regional are at or close to being profitable, so the focus will be on stemming main line losses in the short term.
With regards to making London a competitive environment for aviation, merging the operations of bmi and Virgin would be ideal.
The difficulty I have is how such a company would be financed and owned.
SRB is presumably very reluctant to hand over more than 49% control of his baby. Further, I understand Virgin is losing money right now and not in a position to spend a lot of cash on a large acquisition like bmi. Virgin has done a lot of talk about future plans, but as far as I know, have not yet been invited into any of the big 3 alliances - I'm also assuming it'll take well over a year between any possible alliance membership invitation for VS, to having changed all the back office systems and being a member.
As we all know, LH either want out of bmi mainline, or want some strategic change in bmi.
So how does one merge the operations of bmi and Virgin into a functionally (if not legally) single operational airline in a way that keeps both sides happy, given financial constraints ?
The difficulty I have is how such a company would be financed and owned.
SRB is presumably very reluctant to hand over more than 49% control of his baby. Further, I understand Virgin is losing money right now and not in a position to spend a lot of cash on a large acquisition like bmi. Virgin has done a lot of talk about future plans, but as far as I know, have not yet been invited into any of the big 3 alliances - I'm also assuming it'll take well over a year between any possible alliance membership invitation for VS, to having changed all the back office systems and being a member.
As we all know, LH either want out of bmi mainline, or want some strategic change in bmi.
So how does one merge the operations of bmi and Virgin into a functionally (if not legally) single operational airline in a way that keeps both sides happy, given financial constraints ?
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bmi need West bound long haul services
If UNITED can't make money on LHR-JFK what makes you think BMI ever stood a chance? London - US is one of the most competitive markets in the world, with everyone from BA to Kuwait Airways fighting for traffic. Their long haul product out of MAN was good but couldn't sustain profitability high enough to make it worth the candle.(According to BMI, there is also a case for arguing they thought they could just make more at LHR, er wrong again chaps)
There is *NO*way BMI could sustain the amount of start up losses required to get into the London-US market, coupled to the fact they have no feed in the US. BA have AA, STAR partners UA and US have their own hubs and operations and are not going to help out BMI to undermine their own LHR operations. As VS have found out, unless you have feed at either end or are a class above the competion, you're in danger.
Last edited by Skipness One Echo; 14th Sep 2011 at 10:15.
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As you say DJ6, Baby & Regional are the more profitable (less loss making) than Mainline so should be easier to move on seperately although Lufty's choice would be to sell BMI all as one unit which I think they know is very unlikely (tried that 2 yrs ago) hence the arrival of the reconstruction bods to consider breaking it up.
This would leave Mainline which anyone would only want for the slots. The financial arrangements would be all down to how desperate Lufty are to sell and how desperate any other parties are to buy and outbid each other, I don't think that will look like feeding a frenzy though.
WW is just playing the long waiting game while his prey slowly dies, time is more than on his side, guess that's why he keeps saying "the ball is in their court, they know we're interested" . He'll wait either to see if & what anyone else bids or wait until Luft'y has finally lost all patience with BMI and are prepared to almost give it away to cut their horrendous losses and soothe their shareholders. Reckon it will all be a protracted nause with speculation rife.
So, after a couple of years here we go again, but one thing is for sure, it's not the long suffering staff's fault, the employer could not have had better. But they will all suffer whilst the big boys put us back in the toybox and go play with another train set.
Be interesting to see how they sanitise the whole issue at their next investors meeting coming up shortly but the board must be very p!$$8d off by now, we must be like a piece of sellotape stuck to it's foot. (Polite version)
This would leave Mainline which anyone would only want for the slots. The financial arrangements would be all down to how desperate Lufty are to sell and how desperate any other parties are to buy and outbid each other, I don't think that will look like feeding a frenzy though.
WW is just playing the long waiting game while his prey slowly dies, time is more than on his side, guess that's why he keeps saying "the ball is in their court, they know we're interested" . He'll wait either to see if & what anyone else bids or wait until Luft'y has finally lost all patience with BMI and are prepared to almost give it away to cut their horrendous losses and soothe their shareholders. Reckon it will all be a protracted nause with speculation rife.
So, after a couple of years here we go again, but one thing is for sure, it's not the long suffering staff's fault, the employer could not have had better. But they will all suffer whilst the big boys put us back in the toybox and go play with another train set.
Be interesting to see how they sanitise the whole issue at their next investors meeting coming up shortly but the board must be very p!$$8d off by now, we must be like a piece of sellotape stuck to it's foot. (Polite version)