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EAST MIDLANDS - 6

Old 12th Mar 2019, 08:18
  #3461 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: UK
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Originally Posted by Crusher1 View Post
As much as I'd like to see long haul from EMA I can't see it happening any time soon. I feel that maintaining some of our existing routes/frequency may be a problem in itself. For a variety of reasons ABZ/BRU/GLA/EDI have all been hit recently. GR694 had a total of eleven pax yesterday and you have to wonder how viable the route is out of season. A hub service is required so that people like me could use the airport again but there's no sign of that happening at the moment. Cargo has been, and may well continue to be, the main growth area - having the worldwide freight connections on our doorstep has helped our business no end and I would guess it has encouraged many others to locate in the vicinity - so I don't think it's all doom and gloom!
The problem is that hub services have been tried, and failed. DUB (for North America), AMS with KLM, FRA and BRU with BMI / Star Alliance, for a variety of reasons, mostly the proximity of BHX and to a lesser extent LBA that makes multi-daily connections to serve these hubs properly unviable. If EMA / GCI can only muster 11 PAX out of the holiday season is dire, and frankly surprising. It make you wonder who is bank rolling the service. That might just have been a bad day.

Long haul passenger schedules are pie in the sky, won't happen - ever, not least because the airport's owners want to attract that traffic to MAN first, and then STN. Again BHX with it's limited long haul is one hour down the road from Nottingham, Derby and Leicester so where is the business case for Emirates, Qatar, Air India or PIA - who serve the VFR traffic opportunities that undoubtedly exist from those three East Midlands cities?

Cargo is the business for EMA, along with bucket and spade traffic to European destinations. Sadly, it looks as though some new business in the way of Cargo Logic may have gone to DSA; surely one that EMA would have wanted to capture. However against that the parcels integrators continue to grow and prosper.

So far as road infrastructure is concerned, once again the Department for Transport has spent millions not improving the access to the MI from the A453 westbound, with traffic still queuing over a mile towards the J24 island at peak times because they have done half a job (no different to what they to across the UK road network by the way) by not putting in proper sliproad directly on to the M1 and flying the A453 over the M1. They'll be doing it all again in 5 years time! Then there is Donnington Park, and whenever there a big events getting to the airport is difficult and stressful. Dualing the A453 past the airport was obvious, but hasn't been done, I don't know if it has even been considered. The local authorities need to sort out whether they want a worldclass regional airport or a racing circuit / entertainment venue. Presently the two don't work together
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Old 12th Mar 2019, 22:15
  #3462 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Nottingham
Posts: 18
Crusher1
I agree with you last comment. (Regrettably) time the persons at the airport to promote EMA and not just sit back in their ivory towers and get paid every month. With extras pay due to the cargo operations that is the only part making the profit. Another thing i check regually on prices i:e Jet2 it is more expensive to fly from EMA than BHX just because it's 45miles away.
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Old 13th Mar 2019, 09:37
  #3463 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: loughborough
Age: 60
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Originally Posted by Trev4521 View Post
Crusher1
Another thing i check regularly on prices i:e Jet2 it is more expensive to fly from EMA than BHX just because it's 45miles away.
not true.....RASK (revenue per available seat kilometre) are broadly similar....
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Old 26th Mar 2019, 22:57
  #3464 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Wolverhampton
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Originally Posted by JonEMA View Post
not true.....RASK (revenue per available seat kilometre) are broadly similar....
RASK isnt what the Pax looks at - its the p he pays for bum on seat. And I pay more for my FUE flights ex-EMA than ex-BHX.
However, BHX consign longer flights to second rotations, meaning arriving back at BHX at Stupid o'clck, whereas the EMA is daytime, single rotation and that has an attendant preference = more expensive.
I'll be checking EMA vs BHX for 2020 when they are published. No rush.
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Old 23rd Apr 2019, 12:41
  #3465 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Suffolk, Diss, UK
Age: 48
Posts: 668
Inverness new route and Brussels resumed...
http://www.loganair.co.uk/new-routes-east-midlands
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Old 23rd Apr 2019, 20:28
  #3466 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Nottingham
Posts: 18
Thanks for the info, BALaddy had mentioned in Feb that they were recruiting, and now finally we have Ema -Brussels and Ema -Inverness may not be a direct route
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Old 20th May 2019, 20:46
  #3467 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 2,410
Drop Off Charges - DOUBLED!!

Rip off Britain is alive and well, and residing at EMA!

For 2 you now only get 5 minutes to drop off or pick up, slashed from 10 minutes, so essentially doubled in price. Extra minutes are still charged at 1. So if you were to take 10 minutes, which is quite easily done given the snails pace that even the contactless payment system works, and that's before you start on incompetent drivers who either can't find change, can't find their cards, or even can't manage to park their cars close enough to the machine to pay in the first place you will rack up 7 in parking, as opposed to 2 - so I'm actually wrong in the title above. Prices haven't doubled, they have increased by 350%. Is that some sort of record for a price hike at a UK airport?

I called in at Robin Hood Airport today, there it's 2 for 15 minutes, much more spacious and better laid out parking area, and far superior terminal layout. EMA needs to get it's act together methinks.

Rant over.
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Old 21st May 2019, 03:16
  #3468 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: In the sticks
Posts: 8,671
Those 5 minutes will start from the moment the driver drives past the camera and not when the driver has stopped. 5 minutes seems very tight if their exit is blocked.
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Old 21st May 2019, 06:27
  #3469 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 2,410
Indeed, that's the point.

Imagine you're picking up a family of, say, 2 adults and 2 infants, let's say 1 of the kids aged one, and the other three. You wait off airport until you get a call from the passengers that they're out of immigration, have their bags and are headed for the pick up area (that's how I work it when picking up my wife at EMA (I was dropping her off last night).

Clock starts ticking when the ANPR picks up your entry to the pick up are, and it takes 30 seconds to get from the electronic "barrier" to where your passengers are standing. You've then got to get all the baggage, pushchairs and paraphernalia into the boot, whilst trying to load secure two (probably tired and grouchy) young children into the car, load yourselves, belt up and get ready to move off. From bitter experience I can say it can take 2 minutes to get a 3 year old strapped into a car seat whilst they're mucking around and after their favourite toy. The younger one might be more cooperative! So probably another 4 minutes to get moving, towards the barriers and payment, which at EMA seems to take 30 seconds for each vehicle. 2 vehicles in front of you, and hey presto! EMA (or Manchester Airport Group in truth) gets an extra quid out of the customers. In all likelihood it will be more than that.

What sort of a bunch of robbing [email protected] do the airport management think they are?

The airport does (helpfully!!) advise that if you want longer you can spend 4 and park in the short stay carpark, but even that is double what you could have paid previously in the drop off / pick up zone.

The issue with the EMA zone is it really isn't fit for purpose. If you're picking up PAX at peak IT arrival times, with a couple of 738s disgorging from bucket and spade flights the area it totally unfit for purpose. If you have the misfortune to be dropping PAX off during one of these busy periods getting out of the area, for reasons previously stated within the allotted time frame is also a challenge.

I don't "do" social media; if I did I'm sure I'd be "taking to Twitter" to whinge bitterly.
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Old 21st May 2019, 06:33
  #3470 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Warwick
Age: 40
Posts: 396
Originally Posted by ATNotts View Post
What sort of a bunch of robbing [email protected] do the airport management think they are?
I've not been to EMA since I moved to the North West a few years ago... but as my local airport is the Home of MAG (owners of EMA), I feel I can answer this:

Professional, practised, and thoroughly robbing [email protected] That's what sort they are.
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Old 21st May 2019, 07:30
  #3471 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Northumberland
Posts: 6,430
I called in at Robin Hood Airport today, there it's 2 for 15 minutes, much more spacious and better laid out parking area, and far superior terminal layout. EMA needs to get it's act together methinks.
And where can you fly to from DSA compared to EMA? Is DSA really more spacious, or was there just nobody there?

It's not rip-off Britain - its paying for what you need. If it takes you a long time to load the car, it is no different than paying more cos you have to have hold bags rather than just a carry on.

An off repeated point, but in real terms flying is now dirt cheap - airports have to make money some how.
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Old 21st May 2019, 07:38
  #3472 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: UK
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Originally Posted by SWBKCB View Post
And where can you fly to from DSA compared to EMA? Is DSA really more spacious, or was there just nobody there?

It's not rip-off Britain - its paying for what you need. If it takes you a long time to load the car, it is no different than paying more cos you have to have hold bags rather than just a carry on.

An off repeated point, but in real terms flying is now dirt cheap - airports have to make money some how.
The drop off point is certainly more spacious and better laid out than it's EMA equivalent. The terminal is certainly better designed, though undoubtedly smaller in terms of square metres, but certainly fit for purpose, something that cannot be said for many airports, EMA included.

I absolutely accept that airlines baulk at paying for the services they use, one of EMA's two principal airline customers certainly falls into that category. I also accept that it was UK government over reaction to one incident that lead to dropping off passengers on terminal frontages being stopped (it hasn't in many other European countries) and enabled airports to milk the passenger in the way that EMA does. I even reluctantly accepted the 2 charge for 10 minutes as it was just about workable. However there comes a point where at busy periods it is pretty well physically impossible to get through the drop off area within the minimum charge period and that is unfair - plain and simple.
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Old 21st May 2019, 21:46
  #3473 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Derbyshire
Posts: 17
Totally agree with you SWBKCB Although now Tui are taking their B788 up the road to DSA next year, maybe they will try and get a bit of extra revenue from the 300 extra pax per Dreamliner flight they will have
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Old 23rd May 2019, 21:40
  #3474 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
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Hopefully they will spend the extra funds on the roads, I have visited third world countries with less potholes, the place is a disgrace, the road infrastructure is falling apart.
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Old 23rd May 2019, 21:52
  #3475 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
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Originally Posted by ATNotts View Post
The problem is that hub services have been tried, and failed. DUB (for North America), AMS with KLM, FRA and BRU with BMI / Star Alliance, for a variety of reasons, mostly the proximity of BHX and to a lesser extent LBA that makes multi-daily connections to serve these hubs properly unviable. If EMA / GCI can only muster 11 PAX out of the holiday season is dire, and frankly surprising. It make you wonder who is bank rolling the service. That might just have been a bad day.

Long haul passenger schedules are pie in the sky, won't happen - ever, not least because the airport's owners want to attract that traffic to MAN first, and then STN. Again BHX with it's limited long haul is one hour down the road from Nottingham, Derby and Leicester so where is the business case for Emirates, Qatar, Air India or PIA - who serve the VFR traffic opportunities that undoubtedly exist from those three East Midlands cities?

Cargo is the business for EMA, along with bucket and spade traffic to European destinations. Sadly, it looks as though some new business in the way of Cargo Logic may have gone to DSA; surely one that EMA would have wanted to capture. However against that the parcels integrators continue to grow and prosper.

So far as road infrastructure is concerned, once again the Department for Transport has spent millions not improving the access to the MI from the A453 westbound, with traffic still queuing over a mile towards the J24 island at peak times because they have done half a job (no different to what they to across the UK road network by the way) by not putting in proper sliproad directly on to the M1 and flying the A453 over the M1. They'll be doing it all again in 5 years time! Then there is Donnington Park, and whenever there a big events getting to the airport is difficult and stressful. Dualing the A453 past the airport was obvious, but hasn't been done, I don't know if it has even been considered. The local authorities need to sort out whether they want a worldclass regional airport or a racing circuit / entertainment venue. Presently the two don't work together
Totally agree, the airport needs a direct entrance off junction 23a, the A453 should have been upgraded to dual carriageway to the race track, the East Mids railway hub is miles from the place, the new freight development over the other side of the runway should have had the rail spur extended up to the terminal.
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Old 25th May 2019, 08:19
  #3476 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Essex
Posts: 1,371
Jet2.com Summer 2020

Jet2.com (LS/EXS) Summer 2020 schedule finally released. Two new destinations Izmir (ADB) and La Rochelle (LRH) and going up to 8x based B738s (that's correct, no more 733's).
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Old 26th May 2019, 12:38
  #3477 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: UK
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Originally Posted by NutLoose View Post


Totally agree, the airport needs a direct entrance off junction 23a, the A453 should have been upgraded to dual carriageway to the race track, the East Mids railway hub is miles from the place, the new freight development over the other side of the runway should have had the rail spur extended up to the terminal.
That railway line off which the distribution development spur runs could be a very useful asset for EMA, and for the wider Midlands infrastructure, cutting out, as it would, the dog leg for passenger train services from Nottingham to Birmingham that takes them via Derby, and lengthens the journey time by minimum 10 minutes. Were the whole line to be upgraded, allowing higher speeds, and Castle Donnington station reinstated at Hemington, which a little ingenuity a free shuttle bus could be put in place for to transfer rail passengers from the new station to EMA passengers could be attracted to EMA from towns like Tamworth where the airport of choice would undoubtedly be BHX. EM Parkway could also be served by free shuttle bus. Problem is with such ideas is they require a mentality for a joined up, integrated public transport system, which appears to be an incomprehensible concept to UK planners.
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Old 26th May 2019, 14:23
  #3478 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Daws Heath Essex
Posts: 446
Originally Posted by ATNotts View Post
That railway line off which the distribution development spur runs could be a very useful asset for EMA, and for the wider Midlands infrastructure, cutting out, as it would, the dog leg for passenger train services from Nottingham to Birmingham that takes them via Derby, and lengthens the journey time by minimum 10 minutes. Were the whole line to be upgraded, allowing higher speeds, and Castle Donnington station reinstated at Hemington, which a little ingenuity a free shuttle bus could be put in place for to transfer rail passengers from the new station to EMA passengers could be attracted to EMA from towns like Tamworth where the airport of choice would undoubtedly be BHX. EM Parkway could also be served by free shuttle bus. Problem is with such ideas is they require a mentality for a joined up, integrated public transport system, which appears to be an incomprehensible concept to UK planners.
Well it seems to have happened at SEN with it's own on airport station and up to eight trains an hour into London. However the railway seems to be more u/s these days with the line closed for 'necessary maintenance and upgrading'.
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Old 26th May 2019, 17:45
  #3479 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Centre of Universe
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Originally Posted by NutLoose View Post
Hopefully they will spend the extra funds on the roads, I have visited third world countries with less potholes, the place is a disgrace, the road infrastructure is falling apart.
Sums it up very nicely
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Old 26th May 2019, 20:17
  #3480 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Wolverhampton
Posts: 0
Just lucky??

Reading all the bad things about EMA here I was beginning to think I'd picked a 'wrong 'un' in forsaking BHX for EMA this year. So with some trepidation on May 12th we set off on our first round trip of the year.
Distance is 15 miles more but took only 5 minutes longer than to BHX. Traffic via M42/A42 was 'normal', certainly not as manic as M6. Only issue was the roundabout at Donington Services etc where traffic flies round there and you just have to pick a gap and go for it. The A453 was fine (its only a mile or so on it anyway) and road surface was OK inc airport roads.
Check in was 9am. I expected busy but Jet2 had us done in 10 mins. I had bought Express Security based on BHXs long queues but there WAS no queue, or very minor, so probably wasted my money there.
After following the ubiquitous black sparkly path of 'Duty Free' into Airside we felt it was all quite laid back and not always in your face like BHX. Gate info was clear and boarding didnt need a bus or airbridge. Might have felt different if it had been raining. Lol.
On time departure.
Inbound arrival was on time too.
Baggage carousels were 'busy' - 3 flights allocated to one carousel - but even so, doors open to being in Meet & Greet Reception was no more than 20/25 mins.
No biometrics for Passports, the good old-fashioned personal check working well.
Y'know what - instead of dreading the next run, end June, we're actually looking forward to it.
Were we just lucky?
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