BELFAST (BHD) - 3
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Runway length
Yes this old question that seems to bring so much confusion. I read today that a FCA aircraft sank on a taxiway at LDY (probably A320)-I know the sweltering temperatures of Ulster are too much to bare this time of year. Anyway the inbound flight apparently had 180 passengers on board and was from Malaga (Salou). This was a holiday flight full payload etc. So how come FR flight is restricted to 140 passengers at ldy. I wish someone would put this issue to bed.
Yes this old question that seems to bring so much confusion. I read today that a FCA aircraft sank on a taxiway at LDY (probably A320)-I know the sweltering temperatures of Ulster are too much to bare this time of year. Anyway the inbound flight apparently had 180 passengers on board and was from Malaga (Salou). This was a holiday flight full payload etc. So how come FR flight is restricted to 140 passengers at ldy. I wish someone would put this issue to bed.
Join Date: Feb 2007
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Ba/bmi Lhr
British Airways lost some serious money on BFS-LHR whereas Midland made loads. Can someone give me the honest short answer why this was the case as I wold have thought that with the vast array of connections BA would have won hands down.
Was there an underlying issue?
True BA lost serious money on BFS-LHR.
Note so sure BMI was making loads of money though.
In fact one of BA's concerns at the time was that BMI would pull off first
lumbering them with the route .
BMI initially had big gains but this has gradually eroded as EasyJet expanded to LGW,LTN,STN and the travelling public has got used to these gateways after years of using LHR.
BA's problems were cost and yield.
On the cost side , the BA station at Aldergrove was very expensive to run.Most of the staff had been there for many years ( wonderfully experienced ) but at top of scale and on 'old' BA contracts ,so very expensive.The small scale of operation meant productivity was low....the early shift handled 3 deps/arrs as did the late shift , so the cost per passenger handled was very high , probably EVEN double that at LHR.
The Cabin Crew base (while excellent in terms of service ) was similarly costly due to productivity .
On the revenue side , BA did carry 55-60% of LHR traffic with less than
50% of the capacity/frequency so that wasn-t the issue .
Yield was much poorer than EDI/GLA-LHR because BFS carried a lot more
leisure traffic on promotional fares .Connecting traffic also diluted the yield,
BA had for years wrestled with how to solve this problem and pulling out was an impossibility due to the political situation.
Just prior to Sep 11 , BA had been looking at a LGW operation which wud have released the valuable LHR slots and saved face by not ditching BFS completely. ( as they did with JER ).
Sep 11 provided the opportunity to pull off LHR without having to replace with LGW which would never had made money anyway.
Finally I don-t know what the fixation is with a late LHR/BFS flt.
The high yielding business traffic wants to travel 1700-1900.
Customers need to be incentivised to travel this late by offering lower fares . BEA , for the older reader , used to offer a 'Night Flight' and British Caledonian offered 'Moonjet' services at considerably reduced prices on
what is essentially a positioning flight.
Was there an underlying issue?
True BA lost serious money on BFS-LHR.
Note so sure BMI was making loads of money though.
In fact one of BA's concerns at the time was that BMI would pull off first
lumbering them with the route .
BMI initially had big gains but this has gradually eroded as EasyJet expanded to LGW,LTN,STN and the travelling public has got used to these gateways after years of using LHR.
BA's problems were cost and yield.
On the cost side , the BA station at Aldergrove was very expensive to run.Most of the staff had been there for many years ( wonderfully experienced ) but at top of scale and on 'old' BA contracts ,so very expensive.The small scale of operation meant productivity was low....the early shift handled 3 deps/arrs as did the late shift , so the cost per passenger handled was very high , probably EVEN double that at LHR.
The Cabin Crew base (while excellent in terms of service ) was similarly costly due to productivity .
On the revenue side , BA did carry 55-60% of LHR traffic with less than
50% of the capacity/frequency so that wasn-t the issue .
Yield was much poorer than EDI/GLA-LHR because BFS carried a lot more
leisure traffic on promotional fares .Connecting traffic also diluted the yield,
BA had for years wrestled with how to solve this problem and pulling out was an impossibility due to the political situation.
Just prior to Sep 11 , BA had been looking at a LGW operation which wud have released the valuable LHR slots and saved face by not ditching BFS completely. ( as they did with JER ).
Sep 11 provided the opportunity to pull off LHR without having to replace with LGW which would never had made money anyway.
Finally I don-t know what the fixation is with a late LHR/BFS flt.
The high yielding business traffic wants to travel 1700-1900.
Customers need to be incentivised to travel this late by offering lower fares . BEA , for the older reader , used to offer a 'Night Flight' and British Caledonian offered 'Moonjet' services at considerably reduced prices on
what is essentially a positioning flight.
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Re "Why is there sometimes an early BMI arrival at BHD with an out-of-sequence flight number (BD7xxx I think), from LHR?"
Its a A319 brought in to do Verona twice on a sat(lake Grada Charter in summer and ski charter in the winter) it goes back out to Inverness on Sunday Mornings.
Runways have a Pavement Classification Number(PCN) which is based on the aircraft load bearing, so each aircraft type has a PCN should be checked before operating into each airport re last nights stuck aircraft prob just a soft spot on the taxi way or area.
The FR pax reduction is prop performance related not PCN but Ive never operated the 737 so unsure of the performance operating out of Eglington.
rgds
Keepitlit
Its a A319 brought in to do Verona twice on a sat(lake Grada Charter in summer and ski charter in the winter) it goes back out to Inverness on Sunday Mornings.
Runways have a Pavement Classification Number(PCN) which is based on the aircraft load bearing, so each aircraft type has a PCN should be checked before operating into each airport re last nights stuck aircraft prob just a soft spot on the taxi way or area.
The FR pax reduction is prop performance related not PCN but Ive never operated the 737 so unsure of the performance operating out of Eglington.
rgds
Keepitlit
So operate late at cheap fares but expect a few full fare pax to fall back from the earlier service. Your Yield management team may even find they can overbook the earlier service by more seats.
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A later flight from LHR will be welcomed by all those who do business in London and have to leave the city by 17.00 at the latest to get to LHR with time to get through the hell that can be Heathrow especially on Thursday and Friday, these are the only days I visit London, but I hear it can be hellish most days, to get the last bmi to city.
I have used the LCY in the passed and it was fine but I don't like such small aircraft.
I have used the LCY in the passed and it was fine but I don't like such small aircraft.
London City would be my suggestion. The late evening flight at 2005 allows you to leave Bank at 1900 by train and still make it without sweat. And the Dornier that Scot Airways use on behalf of Cityjet is a fine aircraft, notably more of a sports car than a plodding Dash8. It's amusing to see you are steadily overtaking down below a 146 headed for the Isle of Man as you go out over the Irish Sea.
Belfast BA
BCALBOY - BA handled many more than 3 arrivals/departures on our shifts at Belfast! Don't forget the Maersk to BHX, Citiexpress to MAN/ABZ/CWL/EDI/GLA. As a load controller, I expect we did an average of 7 loadsheets per shift, covering ops in between - and there were two of us. Saturday late/sunday early were the only slack periods. The craic was great, but it wasn't a holiday camp either - 'multifunctional' meant mucking -in with everything including baggage, and some of the most motivated people were the new starts on the poorest-paid contracts. Ironic now to be in the very same office. in orange!
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Verona flight late again tonight 22.30pm. That's most Saturdays this summer with at least one diversion to BFS. If BHD want to operate charter flights with aircraft based there they should have them timetabled to arrive no later than 20.00 as charters are prone to delays. This is a disgrace that almost every week this flight is arriving in past 21.30. BHD should review the timings for this flight as it's operating next year as well. This should be highlighted at the up and coming review. They really do take the mickey and then wonder why residents complain. I think that BHD/BFS can operate alongside each other but BHD should monitor situations like this as it only works against them in the long run.
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Gate,
What are you going to do WHEN (not if!) BHD are allowed to operate to EU city airport rules (hours 6am to 11pm local), do you think they are fitting noise gear to keep the res group happy, once they show BHD is no worse than the likes of LCY they will get approval.
If you think bmi are noisy just wait till MOR throws this toys in the ring.
All your doing is crying wolf, people will soon get fed up with your rantings and blank you then when you have a valid comment no one will care.
Ive a good idea there is a PC game called airport manager have a go at that, jugding by the time you spend and the sh*te you write here you could be up to speed in a short time and then get a job at BHD then it would close down!
rgds
Keepitlit
What are you going to do WHEN (not if!) BHD are allowed to operate to EU city airport rules (hours 6am to 11pm local), do you think they are fitting noise gear to keep the res group happy, once they show BHD is no worse than the likes of LCY they will get approval.
If you think bmi are noisy just wait till MOR throws this toys in the ring.
All your doing is crying wolf, people will soon get fed up with your rantings and blank you then when you have a valid comment no one will care.
Ive a good idea there is a PC game called airport manager have a go at that, jugding by the time you spend and the sh*te you write here you could be up to speed in a short time and then get a job at BHD then it would close down!
rgds
Keepitlit
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Jet2 @ Bfs
Just checking the flights released so far by Jet2 for S08. Hope I have this right, but Thursday sees 4 departures between7 and 8am and Saturday 3 at the moment. Does this indicate there might be 4 based aircraft with more flights to be released?
True Blue
True Blue
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Any further rumors on cityjet operating bhd-cdg it would be nice to see easyjet get some competition and would be good for connecting passengers to longhaul (Not having to use heathrow
).
).
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GMU this morning said that Cityjet may start operations from SNN to LCY to replace the AL Heathrow service, don't know that this will pacify the residents in Shannon but I think it more likely than a direct CDG from the city.
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I'm going to side with keepitlit. Gate 22's whinging is annyoing. Anyways, it's a forum in which I like to think people do not resort to petty insults and it's getting rather close to that so lets just let it go, or better, just ignore his rants about BHD.
Anyways, any word on where they're going to shove all these new planes?
It's great having EI at BFS. I saw the churches near Shannon are wading into the debate and saying that EI should not cut services from the place. Bit desperate if you ask me. It doesn't make a great deal of sense to have so many flights from somewhere if a company, operating as a commercially orientated body, feels they could make more money/be better used elsewhere. I suppose if the Irish state is a shareholder then they have a say but a load of clergy giving off stink is a bit laughable.
Anyways, any word on where they're going to shove all these new planes?
It's great having EI at BFS. I saw the churches near Shannon are wading into the debate and saying that EI should not cut services from the place. Bit desperate if you ask me. It doesn't make a great deal of sense to have so many flights from somewhere if a company, operating as a commercially orientated body, feels they could make more money/be better used elsewhere. I suppose if the Irish state is a shareholder then they have a say but a load of clergy giving off stink is a bit laughable.
