Ryanair - 5
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 1,114
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Surprised to see that it is being touted as a subsidiary of Ryanair as the word on the street I heard was that MOL was going to go solo with this when he left FR in a few years time. Also heard that apparently Boeing were willing to do 777's at knockdown prices given how much business they had generated to date.
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Timbuktu
Posts: 638
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Still giving this bull credence?
Sheeesh.....OK dammit, I'll bite.
10 reasons why FR doing long-haul is patent BS.
10. He said he'd never touch long-haul because its 'not the Ryanair model'.
9. He says single fleet Ops is a key element of Ryanairs success.
8. The announcement is timed to suppress EI share price after Open Skies boost.
7. EU passengers won't accept 8 hours of FR abuse.
6. US passengers won't accept FR abuse, ever.
5. You can strand 50 pax in Santander and possibly get away with it, but you won't get away with stranding 300 in Chatanooga.
4. The A350 won't be delivered until 2013 - a tad late for his 'start date'.
3. The 787 will be delivered in late 2008 - then there are over 540 orders stretching through to 2012. Where does he get a slot - never mind 50 of them?
2. The crap about prices soon dropping? See above.
AND AT NUMBER.1.........
1. MOL making an announcement of something he's gonna do in 3 to 5 years? So out of character! He has nothing to deliver here, just hot air, yet he rushes to make this announcement. Why now? Think it through. Its bull.
Boeing will NOT do MOL any favours on pricing this time round. He blew their goodwill when he crowed about how he had shafted them on his 737 order.
In addition to that, my good contacts in the leasing world tell me he's been pedalling 737's for the last year like a second hand car salesman, often under cutting Boeings own prices with his new deliveries - it keeps the cash flow going and avoids the embarrassment of having a/c parked up with no where to go. But it sure pisses Boeing off.
He's laughing at you mugs.
Sheeesh.....OK dammit, I'll bite.
10 reasons why FR doing long-haul is patent BS.
10. He said he'd never touch long-haul because its 'not the Ryanair model'.
9. He says single fleet Ops is a key element of Ryanairs success.
8. The announcement is timed to suppress EI share price after Open Skies boost.
7. EU passengers won't accept 8 hours of FR abuse.
6. US passengers won't accept FR abuse, ever.
5. You can strand 50 pax in Santander and possibly get away with it, but you won't get away with stranding 300 in Chatanooga.
4. The A350 won't be delivered until 2013 - a tad late for his 'start date'.
3. The 787 will be delivered in late 2008 - then there are over 540 orders stretching through to 2012. Where does he get a slot - never mind 50 of them?
2. The crap about prices soon dropping? See above.
AND AT NUMBER.1.........
1. MOL making an announcement of something he's gonna do in 3 to 5 years? So out of character! He has nothing to deliver here, just hot air, yet he rushes to make this announcement. Why now? Think it through. Its bull.
Boeing will NOT do MOL any favours on pricing this time round. He blew their goodwill when he crowed about how he had shafted them on his 737 order.
In addition to that, my good contacts in the leasing world tell me he's been pedalling 737's for the last year like a second hand car salesman, often under cutting Boeings own prices with his new deliveries - it keeps the cash flow going and avoids the embarrassment of having a/c parked up with no where to go. But it sure pisses Boeing off.
He's laughing at you mugs.
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: T2
Posts: 196
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Maxalt, I agree 100%. It's so transparent what his game is.
From what I read somewhere, Boeing weren't too pleased with O'Leary crowing how he " raped " Boeing with the order after Sep 11th
From what I read somewhere, Boeing weren't too pleased with O'Leary crowing how he " raped " Boeing with the order after Sep 11th
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: On the Camel's back
Posts: 395
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In addition to that, my good contacts in the leasing world tell me he's been pedalling 737's for the last year like a second hand car salesman, often under cutting Boeings own prices with his new deliveries - it keeps the cash flow going and avoids the embarrassment of having a/c parked up with no where to go. But it sure pisses Boeing off.
The whole pack of cards is gonna come updone in a big way at some point, be in sooner or later. The big question is, what will be the undoing. In my view, it's a 3 way race between 1) the investors coping on, 2) the cheap aeroplanes running out or 3) the inevitable accident. With any luck either 1) or 2) will occur before micko manages to kill 189 punters, however I fear that won't be the case if the recent near accidents are anything to go by.
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 2,069
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Premium service - maybe, MOL is to be out of the airline within a couple of years...
23 EU bases - Which new ones? Haven't got that many yet. Obviously there will be one in eastern europe.
STN- About time it was to get more transatlantic flights!
Will EZY have to follow to keep with competition, and will FR operate connection flights?!... don't think so!
23 EU bases - Which new ones? Haven't got that many yet. Obviously there will be one in eastern europe.
STN- About time it was to get more transatlantic flights!
Will EZY have to follow to keep with competition, and will FR operate connection flights?!... don't think so!
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: London Whipsnade Wildlife Park
Posts: 5,038
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
MALTA
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Flensborg
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think MOL says the truth! There is an new unidentified order for 30 new 787 at boeing.com!
Source: http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/index.cfm
Source: http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/index.cfm
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: North Notts
Posts: 48
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
dumdumbrain
Go to http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?ca...id=11&sglid=11
March 2007 figures have been uploaded today but EMA's figures are not showing for the time being. If you check again early next week they should have been added.
Cheers
Go to http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?ca...id=11&sglid=11
March 2007 figures have been uploaded today but EMA's figures are not showing for the time being. If you check again early next week they should have been added.
Cheers
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: STN
Posts: 258
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From the Boston news
officials at two big airports closest to Logan are eager to close a deal with the as-yet-unnamed Ryanair spinoff.
"We were pleased to learn about these plans, and we expect to be in conversations with Ryanair shortly," said Patti Goldstein , a spokeswoman for T.F. Green International Airport in Warwick, R.I. "We're pleased to be in one of the markets Ryanair are targeting, and we hope to be working with Ryanair in the near future."
"We were pleased to learn about these plans, and we expect to be in conversations with Ryanair shortly," said Patti Goldstein , a spokeswoman for T.F. Green International Airport in Warwick, R.I. "We're pleased to be in one of the markets Ryanair are targeting, and we hope to be working with Ryanair in the near future."
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Ireland
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From RTE website
Looks like Ducksie will have something elso to complain about.
Commission prepares for Ryanair decision
Friday, 13 April 2007 13:43
A report from the Reuters news agency says the European Commission has laid the legal groundwork to force Ryanair to sell some or all of its 25% stake in Aer Lingus if the EU turns down its takeover bid.
It quotes people familiar with the statement of objections as saying it concludes that Ryanair would lock up the Irish air market if it acquired its rival, leading to higher prices for travellers.
The commission will decide by 13 June whether Ryanair can take over Aer Lingus. Ryanair valued Aer Lingus at €1.48 billion in its original bid.
'It's fair to say that on the basis of its statement of objections, it looks like the EU is going to block the proposed merger,' Ryanair chief executive Michael O'Leary said this week, adding he intended to keep the minority stake anyway.
If it does block the merger, then Brussels would be poised to take the next step and order the sale of some or all of the shares.
The commission argues Aer Lingus and Ryanair are locked in a head-to-head combat, keeping each other in check but stopping attempts by other airlines to get a toehold in Dublin.
The two airlines have increased the routes on which they compete from eight to 37 over the past six years, driving down prices by up to 8%, the Commission says.
'Removing such competition would leave Irish customers particularly vulnerable to price increases,' it argues.
The commission argues that other airlines would be unlikely to enter the market, as Ireland is such a small market.
Commission prepares for Ryanair decision
Friday, 13 April 2007 13:43
A report from the Reuters news agency says the European Commission has laid the legal groundwork to force Ryanair to sell some or all of its 25% stake in Aer Lingus if the EU turns down its takeover bid.
It quotes people familiar with the statement of objections as saying it concludes that Ryanair would lock up the Irish air market if it acquired its rival, leading to higher prices for travellers.
The commission will decide by 13 June whether Ryanair can take over Aer Lingus. Ryanair valued Aer Lingus at €1.48 billion in its original bid.
'It's fair to say that on the basis of its statement of objections, it looks like the EU is going to block the proposed merger,' Ryanair chief executive Michael O'Leary said this week, adding he intended to keep the minority stake anyway.
If it does block the merger, then Brussels would be poised to take the next step and order the sale of some or all of the shares.
The commission argues Aer Lingus and Ryanair are locked in a head-to-head combat, keeping each other in check but stopping attempts by other airlines to get a toehold in Dublin.
The two airlines have increased the routes on which they compete from eight to 37 over the past six years, driving down prices by up to 8%, the Commission says.
'Removing such competition would leave Irish customers particularly vulnerable to price increases,' it argues.
The commission argues that other airlines would be unlikely to enter the market, as Ireland is such a small market.
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Europe
Posts: 2,175
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
@Camelhair
Interesting stuff. I do not quite understand what you mean with "airline side". In its presentations, Ryanair claims to have a profit margin of 18% on the "airline side" compared to LH, Easyjet etc. who allegedly only have 3%.
http://www.ryanair.com/site/about/in...rter2_2007.pdf (chart on page 10).
Could you elaborate a bit how you derive at your assumption that EZY, LHs etc. margins are actually better and Ryanair's worse than what MOL claims ?
Correct. Closer examination of the Fr numbers than micko would like reveals that the "airline" side of fr is, by the standards of easy, EI, BA, LH, etc, spectacularly unprofitable, with margins hovering around 7%. The rest is made up of the aircraft sales business. FR is now nothing more than a leasing and sales operation with an airline attached.
http://www.ryanair.com/site/about/in...rter2_2007.pdf (chart on page 10).
Could you elaborate a bit how you derive at your assumption that EZY, LHs etc. margins are actually better and Ryanair's worse than what MOL claims ?
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: EMA
Age: 38
Posts: 273
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Massive change in crewing
I thought I would share with you all a copy of an email i gor today regarding changes to ryanair cabin crew.
Ryanair have introduced a new joiners allowance. Basically this is a free bonus to new crew to help them set themselves setup at the start of their employment. The payment are as follows.
1st Months pay €300 / £250
2nd Months pay €300 / £250
6th Months pay €600 / £500
Please note it is a requirement to claim this bonuses, they will not be paid automatically. If you are based outside the UK the Euro figures apply. If you are based in the UK the Sterling figures apply. In addition if you leave before the first 12 months you will be expected to repay these amounts. Your employer will provide you with full details during the course.
As you might imagine this will be a huge benefit for crew and even if you decide to just put this money in a bank account to earn interest, you cannot lose on this deal!
Uniform Charge and Allowance
Ryanair have decided to stop charging crew for their uniform after 12 months of service. This means you will pay €30 / £25 for the first 12 months and then not pay any more monthly charges. Instead Ryanair will pay to crew an annual allowance of €325 / £250 towards replenishing uniform items at the uniform shop and as a contribution towards your ID or medicals or any other expense you might incur.
Again this is a major change to your terms and conditions of employment and will increase in real terms the salary that gets paid into your bank account each month.
Flight Pay
There is a significant change to the way crew salaries are calculated.
Crew will be now paid per ‘Scheduled Block Hour’ (SBH) instead of a flight allowance. This is a fairer system as in the past you were paid an allowance for either a short flight (less than 1 hr 45 mins) or a long flight (more than 1 hr 45 mins). What this meant is a crew member who flew a short flight might be paid the same as a crew member who operated a flight nearly twice as long.
So with immediate effect Crew are paid by the hour based on scheduled flying time.
25% Reduction in Hours!
From 1st April 2008, crew will work a maximum 900 hours (SBH’s) in a year (currently it is 1200 SBH). This means is you will be working 25% less. So you will have increased leisure time, less working time and have more energy to enjoy your increased time off. What is significant is there will NOT be any reduction in your flight pay. So basically you will work 25% less and earn the same. That can only be good news!
Ryanair have introduced a new joiners allowance. Basically this is a free bonus to new crew to help them set themselves setup at the start of their employment. The payment are as follows.
1st Months pay €300 / £250
2nd Months pay €300 / £250
6th Months pay €600 / £500
Please note it is a requirement to claim this bonuses, they will not be paid automatically. If you are based outside the UK the Euro figures apply. If you are based in the UK the Sterling figures apply. In addition if you leave before the first 12 months you will be expected to repay these amounts. Your employer will provide you with full details during the course.
As you might imagine this will be a huge benefit for crew and even if you decide to just put this money in a bank account to earn interest, you cannot lose on this deal!
Uniform Charge and Allowance
Ryanair have decided to stop charging crew for their uniform after 12 months of service. This means you will pay €30 / £25 for the first 12 months and then not pay any more monthly charges. Instead Ryanair will pay to crew an annual allowance of €325 / £250 towards replenishing uniform items at the uniform shop and as a contribution towards your ID or medicals or any other expense you might incur.
Again this is a major change to your terms and conditions of employment and will increase in real terms the salary that gets paid into your bank account each month.
Flight Pay
There is a significant change to the way crew salaries are calculated.
Crew will be now paid per ‘Scheduled Block Hour’ (SBH) instead of a flight allowance. This is a fairer system as in the past you were paid an allowance for either a short flight (less than 1 hr 45 mins) or a long flight (more than 1 hr 45 mins). What this meant is a crew member who flew a short flight might be paid the same as a crew member who operated a flight nearly twice as long.
So with immediate effect Crew are paid by the hour based on scheduled flying time.
25% Reduction in Hours!
From 1st April 2008, crew will work a maximum 900 hours (SBH’s) in a year (currently it is 1200 SBH). This means is you will be working 25% less. So you will have increased leisure time, less working time and have more energy to enjoy your increased time off. What is significant is there will NOT be any reduction in your flight pay. So basically you will work 25% less and earn the same. That can only be good news!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: STN
Posts: 258
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Posts: 1,879
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think Maxalt makes a lot of very good points above, but I would much rather that EI - don't particularly care about any other carrier! - proceeded on the basis that he was actually serious about this. Sure, there are a lot of holes one can pick in MOL's comments - as Maxalt has set out above, but clearly Long Haul Low Cost is something that is going to happen; someone is going to do it; Jetstar has done it, Zoom is expanding, so this is going to be a developing area.
With regard to the aircraft type, many UK charters use A330s and Airbus is talking about increasing production of this; it's certainly true that the aircraft he mentions won't be available at all in the timeframe he's talking about.
I'd much prefer to see EI develop the long haul low cost carrier, now that it has quite a lot of notice of what FR/MOL might do. With Irish airports now having pre-clearance for Customs and Immigration and freed of the stopover nonsense, there's a huge amount of untapped potential; if EI can develop this to the stage where other EU flag carriers like AZ, IB, SK etc. and their markets look much easier to attack, it would be much better outcome. EI's t/a costs are among the lowest in the industry. I think the big worry for EI now is that if the EU goes ahead and forces FR to sell its stake, there will be very little to stop it making life extremely unpleasant for EI; the current FR shareholding - to my mind - seems to work as an insurance policy for EI.
With regard to the aircraft type, many UK charters use A330s and Airbus is talking about increasing production of this; it's certainly true that the aircraft he mentions won't be available at all in the timeframe he's talking about.
I'd much prefer to see EI develop the long haul low cost carrier, now that it has quite a lot of notice of what FR/MOL might do. With Irish airports now having pre-clearance for Customs and Immigration and freed of the stopover nonsense, there's a huge amount of untapped potential; if EI can develop this to the stage where other EU flag carriers like AZ, IB, SK etc. and their markets look much easier to attack, it would be much better outcome. EI's t/a costs are among the lowest in the industry. I think the big worry for EI now is that if the EU goes ahead and forces FR to sell its stake, there will be very little to stop it making life extremely unpleasant for EI; the current FR shareholding - to my mind - seems to work as an insurance policy for EI.
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Timbuktu
Posts: 638
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Akerosid, its not that I don't think a LoCo Long Haul service can ever work (though I have grave reservations). What I do doubt - seriously - is that O'Leary could ever make it succesful, or indeed has any real intentions to ever even try.
This is all about spin.
Witness the hype about mixing a low cost service with 'premium' Biz Class etc. It is truly hilarious. If it were any other guy, the media - and most on this site - would be pouring scorn on such a muddled business plan.
Instead, just mention the MOL word, and some otherwise sane people seem to lose the run of themselves.
How in hells name do you imagine a man who thinks 'low cost' is all about telling the customer to 'get stuffed' if they don't like it - is simultaneously (on the same flight) going to make the quantum leap to a 'world beating business class service'? Better than Virgin or BA he says!
What a joke.
One other thing springs to mind. He claims to be going to fly into secondary airports where SouthWest are currently the biggest player. I have this recurring mental image of Herb Kelleher choking on his morning coffee when he read that.
After all he did for Micko!
This is all about spin.
Witness the hype about mixing a low cost service with 'premium' Biz Class etc. It is truly hilarious. If it were any other guy, the media - and most on this site - would be pouring scorn on such a muddled business plan.
Instead, just mention the MOL word, and some otherwise sane people seem to lose the run of themselves.
How in hells name do you imagine a man who thinks 'low cost' is all about telling the customer to 'get stuffed' if they don't like it - is simultaneously (on the same flight) going to make the quantum leap to a 'world beating business class service'? Better than Virgin or BA he says!
What a joke.
One other thing springs to mind. He claims to be going to fly into secondary airports where SouthWest are currently the biggest player. I have this recurring mental image of Herb Kelleher choking on his morning coffee when he read that.
After all he did for Micko!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: STN
Posts: 258
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Maxalt
Mixing a low cost service with 'premium' Biz Class etc. It is truly hilarious.
Have you not heard of Oasis and Flyglobespan ?
Your right though, If anyone elso other than MOL was talking
about such a venture I would be the same as you, but what I dont
understand is how many people on here dont see that MOL/Ryanair
has grown faster than any other airline in the world, Becoming one of the world 3rd largest airlines (pax), carring more pax than BA, announcing
new route after new route, new base after new base, buying new
aircraft after new aircraft, the way i see it is if anyone can do this
and make it work it is MOL, But we still knock him.
Dont forget he is not saying Ryanair will fly longhaul, It will be a new
Airline all together, just the price will be lower than flag carriers.
I dont see why people put the man down, after all he has done
to lower fares and bring low cost European travel to the people
on the street.
So I say hype or no hype lets wait and see, but dont knock the
fella after his first announcement about his plans, Its just rude.
Have you not heard of Oasis and Flyglobespan ?
Your right though, If anyone elso other than MOL was talking
about such a venture I would be the same as you, but what I dont
understand is how many people on here dont see that MOL/Ryanair
has grown faster than any other airline in the world, Becoming one of the world 3rd largest airlines (pax), carring more pax than BA, announcing
new route after new route, new base after new base, buying new
aircraft after new aircraft, the way i see it is if anyone can do this
and make it work it is MOL, But we still knock him.
Dont forget he is not saying Ryanair will fly longhaul, It will be a new
Airline all together, just the price will be lower than flag carriers.
I dont see why people put the man down, after all he has done
to lower fares and bring low cost European travel to the people
on the street.
So I say hype or no hype lets wait and see, but dont knock the
fella after his first announcement about his plans, Its just rude.