UKIA
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The first few months in the life of a start-up airline are critical. It’s a time for budgeting and maximising return on yield – being lean and keen in anticipation of the more comfortable and prosperous times ahead. From what I’ve heard the owner has had the unfortunate experience of having made an unwise appointment that has led to substantial amounts of company money being wasted and interrupting the much needed flow of income versus outgoings. Had the owner made more careful enquiries about the reasons for a DFO from a high profile carrier suddenly becoming available to work as a DFO for a start-up airline at short notice, the company might not be in such an unhappy position now. A recent example is that said person chose to bring an entire crew back to the UK from Sharjah via another carrier at a cost of £25,000, rather than position on company aircraft (DFO plus one pilot and one member office staff in Business Class; Cabin Crew in Economy – CRM at its finest). You can take the boy out of BA, but you can’t take BA out of the boy 
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UKIA boys and girls
On a very serious note,
Those that have been paid in the past and have payslips, please read this.
I worked for a very reputable airline (for 9 and a bit years) that went bang after a management buy out (18 months later)
Turns out, NI contributions, may or not have been paid. Payslips to prove you were docked said contributions by the company is all it takes to get the 'feds' off your back and on to theirs instead. (I would suggest keep bank statements to prove BACS of take home pay as well).
If I have got things wrong, given the appauling conduct of this company toward its staff and biggest asset, I hope someone better educated than me steps in to advise.
Nothing more I can say, good luck.
Bored
Those that have been paid in the past and have payslips, please read this.
I worked for a very reputable airline (for 9 and a bit years) that went bang after a management buy out (18 months later)
Turns out, NI contributions, may or not have been paid. Payslips to prove you were docked said contributions by the company is all it takes to get the 'feds' off your back and on to theirs instead. (I would suggest keep bank statements to prove BACS of take home pay as well).
If I have got things wrong, given the appauling conduct of this company toward its staff and biggest asset, I hope someone better educated than me steps in to advise.
Nothing more I can say, good luck.
Bored
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miss muff flaps , i am sorry to say your info is all wrong or your sources are not telling the truth
the DFO is not to blame he is well respected and well known in the industry, he has been around and he knows this business inside out, the person we have to blame is the owner for his pig headedness and his stupidity to listen to people who dont know anything about aviation
he has made bad judgements the owner but he has to realise as he said the crew/FD are only a miniscule part of an airline
HOW WRONG IS HE
the DFO is not to blame he is well respected and well known in the industry, he has been around and he knows this business inside out, the person we have to blame is the owner for his pig headedness and his stupidity to listen to people who dont know anything about aviation
he has made bad judgements the owner but he has to realise as he said the crew/FD are only a miniscule part of an airline
HOW WRONG IS HE
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Miss Muff Flaps?!?
"A recent example is that said person chose to bring an entire crew back to the UK from Sharjah via another carrier at a cost of £25,000, rather than position on company aircraft (DFO plus one pilot and one member office staff in Business Class; Cabin Crew in Economy – CRM at its finest). You can take the boy out of BA, but you can’t take BA out of the boy "
Hmmm, Miss Muff Flaps... I don't know where you are getting your information from, but it is not a very reliable source. I happened to be on "said flight from Sharjah" with this DFO, and they definitely 100% did not sit in business class with any members of office staff?? Or I certainly hope not, as one DFO was sitting directly in front of me, and the member of office staff at the side of me....
The DFO in question, I have worked with for a good few years and I have never heard such ridiculous nonscence in my whole life.. at the time, the decision was THE only decision to make... Unless you were there then DO NOT pass comment. Oh and I very much doubt that it costs £25,000 to fly 9 crew from Dubai to Manchester.
"Hmmm, Miss Muff Flaps... I don't know where you are getting your information from, but it is not a very reliable source. I happened to be on "said flight from Sharjah" with this DFO, and they definitely 100% did not sit in business class with any members of office staff?? Or I certainly hope not, as one DFO was sitting directly in front of me, and the member of office staff at the side of me....
The DFO in question, I have worked with for a good few years and I have never heard such ridiculous nonscence in my whole life.. at the time, the decision was THE only decision to make... Unless you were there then DO NOT pass comment. Oh and I very much doubt that it costs £25,000 to fly 9 crew from Dubai to Manchester.
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Owners
Numbers of staffs are going to the court and are filing criminal case against the owner (Father and Son). I am sure he will be locked up for long time. Both father and son will get done.
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UKIA
Apologies for this - probably a stupid question.
But why are they filing 'criminal' cases? Or do you mean 'civil' cases in relation to salaries not getting paid et al?
People are alluding to a lot of different things here in relation to the operation.
But why are they filing 'criminal' cases? Or do you mean 'civil' cases in relation to salaries not getting paid et al?
People are alluding to a lot of different things here in relation to the operation.
Last edited by qwertyplop; 21st Jan 2008 at 11:31. Reason: error
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You cannot file for criminal proceedings. You have to make a complaint to the police and they decide.
It does seem a mess and it is clear that people are being hurt BUT........you have to be very careful what you post. There must be no libellous stuff and you must not name names, or abbreviate them. In both cases PPRuNe could be held to account and we will not allow that to happen.
Keep your posts factual and avoid dressing things up. Think before you post.
We mods are on 'ModCon2' alert.
We are watching carefully! 'ModCon1' is a closedown! 
AA&R Mods
It does seem a mess and it is clear that people are being hurt BUT........you have to be very careful what you post. There must be no libellous stuff and you must not name names, or abbreviate them. In both cases PPRuNe could be held to account and we will not allow that to happen.
Keep your posts factual and avoid dressing things up. Think before you post.
We mods are on 'ModCon2' alert.
We are watching carefully! 'ModCon1' is a closedown! AA&R Mods
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I agree that no one should dress it up. The reason for criminal case is due to Tax involvement. As lost of staff have contacted the Tax office and found out that PAYE tax was not payed to Inland Revenue, hence the case will turn to criminal case I have been told by one of the staff perusing the matter forward.
Let me know if we are not allowed to post such information. I will not do that if you advise so.
Let me know if we are not allowed to post such information. I will not do that if you advise so.
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If only.......................
............he had listened to the advice given to him, free of charge, in the first place when the embryonic UKIA was Air Tigra.
He was told that the 767 - 222 would never work: that the planned tech stop - originally Odessa was mooted as well as Istanbul - would never work. The original team, bar 1, bailed out because of the intransigence.
Perhaps it is a salutory lesson to anyone else with some money to burn to in an airline but with no experience of this business: you have to listen to the people who know what they are talking about.
He was told that the 767 - 222 would never work: that the planned tech stop - originally Odessa was mooted as well as Istanbul - would never work. The original team, bar 1, bailed out because of the intransigence.
Perhaps it is a salutory lesson to anyone else with some money to burn to in an airline but with no experience of this business: you have to listen to the people who know what they are talking about.
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This goes back years though - certainly to at least 2005 with Air Tigra - possibly before.
What I don't understand though is the complete and apparent lack of consideration for any number of the issues that are alleged on here both operational and non-operational.
Why, with all the trouble that goes with a start-up, would you do some of the stuff that is alleged in this thread.
Would EMA have them back if, by some miracle, they managed to get going again?
What I don't understand though is the complete and apparent lack of consideration for any number of the issues that are alleged on here both operational and non-operational.
Why, with all the trouble that goes with a start-up, would you do some of the stuff that is alleged in this thread.
Would EMA have them back if, by some miracle, they managed to get going again?
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Not that I would normally sanction such 'terms of endearment' but there is a thread on www.cabincrew.com that gives a new euphanism for UKIA - you should read it. Have a look on the rumours section...........
Richterscale
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UKIA
I have just read all the posts I think that everyone is getting carried away with personal feelings we are all proffessionals and such should behave like ones. First matter is UK Intnl is a LTD Company and the owners can walk away, why are they not walking away is the Million $ question
why not just take the easy way out?
One thing is for sure UKIA does not have loyal employees
The management are not good but one has to beg the question why?
Now no one here I believe is connected to the management and UKIA has not had smooth sailing, but come on lets look at it positively they could walk away anytime they want to but have not.......
Some of the Employees UKIA took on were not pro's in the Industry and had been forced from previous jobs and some even got sacked from pre jobs.
Well the only thing that is a plus is that at least some people got jobs and got paid till very recent. My last employer all the staff were not paid for 3 months!!!!!
No consulation to the position you guys find yourself in but come on this Industry is not for the faint hearted.
I realy believe there is no smoke without the fire, UKIA has not given any statements out yet so lets give them a chance, hey no one here as ever opened an Airline before the amount of work that goes into a start up is immense, UKIA did that so lets not be too critical if it was as easy as that many would have done it.
We as people in the Industry should be saying lets see what we can do, as our lives are connected to this industry or we could go for the easy way and go and work for Emirates or Etihad,.........
or ..........
Long haul travel UK originating pax are carried more by Foreign airlines that British Airlines, this is the real situation and the quicker we all can get to grasps with that the better, we need more British Airlines and we need to support them whether it be UKI or others because its our jobs at stake and ou future........so guys think again,,,,,,,,,,
We should all grow up.... and face British Aviation is becoming dead and buried slowly but surely,,,,,,,now can we do anything about it.....
why not just take the easy way out?
One thing is for sure UKIA does not have loyal employees
The management are not good but one has to beg the question why?
Now no one here I believe is connected to the management and UKIA has not had smooth sailing, but come on lets look at it positively they could walk away anytime they want to but have not.......
Some of the Employees UKIA took on were not pro's in the Industry and had been forced from previous jobs and some even got sacked from pre jobs.
Well the only thing that is a plus is that at least some people got jobs and got paid till very recent. My last employer all the staff were not paid for 3 months!!!!!
No consulation to the position you guys find yourself in but come on this Industry is not for the faint hearted.
I realy believe there is no smoke without the fire, UKIA has not given any statements out yet so lets give them a chance, hey no one here as ever opened an Airline before the amount of work that goes into a start up is immense, UKIA did that so lets not be too critical if it was as easy as that many would have done it.
We as people in the Industry should be saying lets see what we can do, as our lives are connected to this industry or we could go for the easy way and go and work for Emirates or Etihad,.........
or ..........Long haul travel UK originating pax are carried more by Foreign airlines that British Airlines, this is the real situation and the quicker we all can get to grasps with that the better, we need more British Airlines and we need to support them whether it be UKI or others because its our jobs at stake and ou future........so guys think again,,,,,,,,,,
We should all grow up.... and face British Aviation is becoming dead and buried slowly but surely,,,,,,,now can we do anything about it.....
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GInko
HI
Looks like you did not leave a good secure job to move with UKIA from my knowledge all the C.C. were all ex Flyjet and new boys and girls that had no experience, so looks like you really do need to pick up the phone and speak to the CEO and tell him what you think
Looks like you did not leave a good secure job to move with UKIA from my knowledge all the C.C. were all ex Flyjet and new boys and girls that had no experience, so looks like you really do need to pick up the phone and speak to the CEO and tell him what you think
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It is apparent from all your 13 posts before that either you are one of the owner or associate. Even if you are not then, if you haven’t been paid for last 3 months then I will not class you much of professional especially in Aviation industry. Further more there are no Millions to walk away with otherwise they would have done it.
As far as the post on this section is concerned they are true hence you have also posted here. UKIA is still there but there is nothing there to class it an airline. As some had posted it yesterday that they are buying time to liquidize the company. It is also apparent that the CEO reads all the post hence no need for a phone call.
As far as the post on this section is concerned they are true hence you have also posted here. UKIA is still there but there is nothing there to class it an airline. As some had posted it yesterday that they are buying time to liquidize the company. It is also apparent that the CEO reads all the post hence no need for a phone call.
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Hi Mike21 - the way that you approach this forum I'll say again that you seem like you have inside knowledge of UKIA.
I think that UKIA Directors have not walked as they are so dense that they have not understood the gravity of the situation and their now precarious reputation.......the CEO doesn't know what he is doing and his over inflated ego will not allow him to listen to good advice - from PROFESSIONALS !!
If some of the 'pro's' came from bad backgrounds - then why did UKIA take them on? Surely they have a screening process in place? I hear the HR Director has vast experience in large companies in Dubai.
Where on earth was your last employer for you not to receive pay? I am guessing not here in the UK ?
I have, in fact, been involved in several airline start ups and it IS hard work but when a management team is allowed to work as a team and not autonomously as UKIA's CEO preferred to do business it CAN work. None of the outfits I worked at were even close to the shambles and totally inappropriate business management as this lot. It helps to have the right person at the top to drive the business in the right direction - flitting about all over the place and trying to save money in all the wrong places just doesn't work!!
As for support - it is a two way street. A good Company looks after it's staff and the staff looks after the Company. UKIA was working in the Dark Ages with 3rd World ethics.
I DO have a word to say to the CEO.......pathetic!!!
I think that UKIA Directors have not walked as they are so dense that they have not understood the gravity of the situation and their now precarious reputation.......the CEO doesn't know what he is doing and his over inflated ego will not allow him to listen to good advice - from PROFESSIONALS !!
If some of the 'pro's' came from bad backgrounds - then why did UKIA take them on? Surely they have a screening process in place? I hear the HR Director has vast experience in large companies in Dubai.
Where on earth was your last employer for you not to receive pay? I am guessing not here in the UK ?
I have, in fact, been involved in several airline start ups and it IS hard work but when a management team is allowed to work as a team and not autonomously as UKIA's CEO preferred to do business it CAN work. None of the outfits I worked at were even close to the shambles and totally inappropriate business management as this lot. It helps to have the right person at the top to drive the business in the right direction - flitting about all over the place and trying to save money in all the wrong places just doesn't work!!
As for support - it is a two way street. A good Company looks after it's staff and the staff looks after the Company. UKIA was working in the Dark Ages with 3rd World ethics.
I DO have a word to say to the CEO.......pathetic!!!