Cityjet

[Una Due Tfc]

So how long until the Sukhois have Shamrocks on the tail? ORK, BHD and SNN based, freeing up the EI 320s there for DUB...

[brian_dromey]

Originally Posted by Una Due Tfc

So how long until the Sukhois have Shamrocks on the tail? ORK, BHD and SNN based, freeing up the EI 320s there for DUB...

I don't think anything has been confirmed - or even reliably rumoured on the SSJ front. I think it's mainly "armchair CEO" dreams. I think it would be great, particularly for EU routes from ORK, Belfast and SNN and for thin routes from DUB as well as replacing ATRs. There's a lot the SSJs could do, but IAG and CItyjet need to agree.

[840]

There's no point putting the SSJ on London or sun routes from Cork. Even Amsterdam and Paris would be unwise, unless there was a frequency increase. It's really only the German routes where it would be sensible.

[Shamrock350]

Originally Posted by Una Due Tfc

So how long until the Sukhois have Shamrocks on the tail? ORK, BHD and SNN based, freeing up the EI 320s there for DUB...

I think if anything the SSJ would be DUB based operating for an expanded Aer Lingus Regional or even for mainline itself on thinner European routes.

The Aer Lingus Regional ATR operation has reached its peak in the UK with DSA, EMA and LPL all recent failures. The gaps Aer Lingus have now are in Europe, they have next to zero presence in central and eastern Europe, nothing in Scandinavia and there's still plenty of scope for additional frequencies on existing routes. Bases like ORK and BHD might see them eventually but bolstering the DUB/HUB will be a priority.

The SSJ presents an opportunity for Aer Lingus to expand its Regional arm with CityJet and it's a deal I think makes sense for both groups.

[VanBosh]

Originally Posted by Shamrock350

I think if anything the SSJ would be DUB based operating for an expanded Aer Lingus Regional or even for mainline itself on thinner European routes.

The Aer Lingus Regional ATR operation has reached its peak in the UK with DSA, EMA and LPL all recent failures. The gaps Aer Lingus have now are in Europe, they have next to zero presence in central and eastern Europe, nothing in Scandinavia and there's still plenty of scope for additional frequencies on existing routes. Bases like ORK and BHD might see them eventually but bolstering the DUB/HUB will be a priority.

The SSJ presents an opportunity for Aer Lingus to expand its Regional arm with CityJet and it's a deal I think makes sense for both groups.

What destinations in central / Eastern Europe would work do you think?

[Shamrock350]

Originally Posted by VanBosh

What destinations in central / Eastern Europe would work do you think?

Riga, additional frequency on Warsaw and possibly Vilnius have potential for SSJ service. Ryanair would be tough competition but the smaller aircraft and transatlantic feed if marketed properly could maintain these routes for Cityjet under the Aer Lingus brand.

Brexit (if it even happens) raises plenty of questions, while there's a number of economic worries, one question is how the Eastern European population at home and in the UK now view Ireland, it was already an attractive destination for them and may have seen its reputation boosted recently as the UK votes to leave. We could see demand for links between Ireland and Eastern Europe grow again in the near future.

In the immediate future, I still believe Riga/Vilnius and additional growth on Warsaw is possible. The bulk of any SSJ work would be Germany, France and Italy with existing EI routes and new ones.

[SWBKCB]

Are the economics of the SSJ that it can make money on routes unprofitable for, say. a 319?

Does the pattern of training flights give any clues as to future routes?

[s2art1e]

Would Cityjet need to factor in operational and maintainance capabilities for the SSJ on any routes it decides to use this aircraft on? Presumebly there is only a handful of airports in Europe that have this expertise ?

[Una Due Tfc]

Originally Posted by s2art1e

Would Cityjet need to factor in operational and maintainance capabilities for the SSJ on any routes it decides to use this aircraft on? Presumebly there is only a handful of airports in Europe that have this expertise ?

FR got around that by buring a pair of Embraer's to fly engineers out to remote airports if needed. Not many places would have Avro engineers either

[Wycombe]

It's Lear 45's (Manx Reg) that FR use as "flying spanners" transport, isn't it?

[SWBKCB]

I would imagine that CityJet, being the first customer in Western Europe, will be getting great support from Superjet.

If they can get a good network of scheduled services up and running with minimal technical issues it will improve the SSJ's credibility

[Una Due Tfc]

Originally Posted by Wycombe

It's Lear 45's (Manx Reg) that FR use as "flying spanners" transport, isn't it?

Ah, indeed you're right, it is Lear's. The little inverted V under the tail always gets me.

[s2art1e]

Originally Posted by Una Due Tfc

FR got around that by buring a pair of Embraer's to fly engineers out to remote airports if needed. Not many places would have Avro engineers either

With the Avro's and 146's a lot of the major European airlines operated this type - LH,LX,BA,AF, SN etc, so I presume there is a certain amount of expertise out there. City Jet are the only operator of this SSJ aircraft in Europe outside of Russia, so they
must have got something pretty spectacular in terms of support you would hope.

[Una Due Tfc]

Originally Posted by s2art1e

With the Avro's and 146's a lot of the major European airlines operated this type - LH,LX,BA,AF, SN etc, so I presume there is a certain amount of expertise out there. City Jet are the only operator of this SSJ aircraft in Europe outside of Russia, so they
must have got something pretty spectacular in terms of support you would hope.

Indeed, but the Avro is a rare aircraft nowadays, and engineer'a ratings need to remain current just like anyone else's

[El Bunto]

Are the economics of the SSJ that it can make money on routes unprofitable for, say. a 319?

I'm not privy to any industry data but the SSJ is said to slot between the E-190 and E-190E2 ( lower ) in terms of CASM. So cheaper to operate per seat than an A319 but if you can put a bigger aircraft on a route and fill it then you'll make more revenue, linearly.

[SWBKCB]

Thanks - I'd assumed that the larger aircraft would be cheaper per seat.

I was just wondering about the assumption that if a route was marginal with 100 pax on a 150 seater, then all you had to do was put a 100 seater on the route to make money.

My thinking was that the 100 seater would be cheaper overall, but more expensive per seat - so you'd need to charge more.

[Una Due Tfc]

Originally Posted by SWBKCB

Thanks - I'd assumed that the larger aircraft would be cheaper per seat.

I was just wondering about the assumption that if a route was marginal with 100 pax on a 150 seater, then all you had to do was put a 100 seater on the route to make money.

My thinking was that the 100 seater would be cheaper overall, but more expensive per seat - so you'd need to charge more.

It's even more complicated than most think. Different engines have different maintenance cycles and are more efficient in different stages of flight. A heavy being used on trans continental routes will have different engines fitted than one being used domestically in Japan for example.

An aircraft operating a route at the upper limit of it's range might actually cost more than a slightly larger one with greater endurance on the right engines with the same passenger load.

[Expressflight]

I see that Cityjet are currently recruiting SSJ flight deck crew for a Brussels base in addition to the proposed Southend base.

[flydog]

has anyone heard from them, I have applied 3 times this year and still no reply or interest and I have all the requirements, just wondering if there is actual recruitment or just advertising

[N707ZS]

Are the SSJs in service yet, curious as I have only seen them on training flights and one charter taking Middlesbrough FC to Spain?