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Old 8th Feb 2017, 17:06
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Transfer numbers

2011 CAA Passenger Survey Data for LHR

All airlines.

Transfer traffic (assume that means overnight stays, not just connecting 'on the day', but not sure).

A random sample:
Manchester: 79%
Los Angeles: 52%
Belfast: 48%
Chicago: 42%
Paris CDG 35%
NY JFK: 35%
Amsterdam: 20%
Dubai: 20%

You can request more up to date stats from CAA.
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Old 13th Mar 2017, 17:48
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China Southern goes double daily to CAN starting 1st June
China Southern increases London Heathrow service from June 2017 :: Routesonline

Anyone knows where those slots coming from?
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Old 13th Mar 2017, 22:44
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Quote:
You asked why I was quoting £10Bn+ and whether I was cherry-picking a number to suit my agenda. Well, the range quoted by TfL was £10Bn - £20Bn.
When exactly were those figures given out and what do they include for.

I prefer to work from the latest consultation which states

For both Heathrow schemes, there is no Government road spend directly linked
to expansion. The promoter would pay for changes to the M25, A4 and A3044
and any local roads. The Western and Southern Rail schemes are at different
levels of development and, based on current estimates, could cost between
£1.4 billion and £2.5 billion together. The Government would expect this cost to
be partly offset by airport contributions, which would be negotiated when the
schemes reach an appropriate level of development.
Was at the Department of Transport (DoT) consultation events. It turns out that Heathrow is paying for all the road diversions, tunnels, etc..

Heathrow will pay for part of the western and southern rail links. Only part because these will have other non airport-related pax as well.

The DoT will pay for the conversion to smart (sic) motorways on the M3/M4/M25 as this happens whether Heathrow expands or not. The M3 conversion has been underway for a year and is causing chaos.



China Southern goes double daily to CAN starting 1st June
China Southern increases London Heathrow service from June 2017 :: Routesonline

Anyone knows where those slots coming from?
The route is obviously doing well, maybe BA should have gotten on this route rather than CTU. Probably too late now.

Last edited by Fairdealfrank; 14th Mar 2017 at 20:58.
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Old 14th Mar 2017, 17:55
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I'm not sure that the route is doing that well, having just flown it. Light loads in economy coming back although the front end wasn't bad. Probably about 50% LF. Outward to CAN was maybe closer to 75 - 85%. So it's a bit mixed. I was connecting through to AKL. Fares are VERY low.
Service was excellent although food / inflight entertainment were pretty average. Connecting in CAN was very easy.
They fly the 787 but the seats are quite cramped. Not a problem at 50% though.
My impression was that CZ / CAN are very keen to grow their reputation for hubbing around Asia / Oceania and so are investing in capacity. I suspect that they are currently making very little money on the route.
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Old 16th Mar 2017, 12:47
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A question - which was last answered in 2002 on here

How much fuel does Heathrow use in a year?
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Old 16th Mar 2017, 14:13
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Originally Posted by Heathrow Harry
A question - which was last answered in 2002 on here

How much fuel does Heathrow use in a year?
Except that it wasn't actually answered then ...

How much fuel does Heathrow use each day ??

I've heard figures of 20 million litres per day quoted, which sounds in the right ballpark.
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Old 16th Mar 2017, 14:43
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thats a lot of oil........ according to the refiners industry body the UK used about 12 mm tonnes (15+ Bn litres) of JET fuel in 2014 (around 68 mm litres a day) of which only 4.8 was produced in the UK so it may be a higher at LHR
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Old 16th Mar 2017, 16:55
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It's how much is wasted - by people like me - in the four holding patterns every day for the past 5 decades that is a scandal. I tried some maths, based on my career mix of short and Longhaul, but ran out of zeros on the calculator. And that was using conservative estimates of usual inbound delays....
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Old 16th Mar 2017, 17:40
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You need to go to the current DfT roadshows, where they are telling everyone that airborne holding will be a thing of the past. Apparently it's a simple matter of adjusting your enroute speed so that you reach the STAR just in time for your arrival slot.

What could possibly go wrong ...
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Old 16th Mar 2017, 17:46
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Dave, weren't they telling us the same thing on Tomorrow's World when MLS was first being promoted? Complete with natty little diagrams showing aircraft arriving from all angles and all just swooping in the last minute approach.
I remember in Jeddah, inbound aircraft were often told to be at Point X by a specific time. I presumed at the time this was to smooth the flow. The truth was that frequently pilots of different airlines would talk to each other on the approach and arrange things sensibly!
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Old 16th Mar 2017, 23:41
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it's a simple matter of adjusting your enroute speed so that you reach the STAR
I took part in those trials - in 1996 ! The type was B737-436 and the route was Aldergrove to Heathrow. The reason was the Boeing FMC had an "extra" page titled RTA - Required Time of Arrival. Departure clearance from BFS contained a time over BNN which was entered as RTA/BNN which would automatically adjust the cruise Mach number. We found the problem from the outset as cruise speeds below or above normal limits were being demanded and thus the percentage of arrivals within the 4 minute window was low - binned by ATC fairly quickly.
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Old 17th Mar 2017, 20:17
  #4892 (permalink)  
 
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ETOPS

I was down at EOG in '96 so didn't partake in that trial, but was on the B737-436 from introduction until 1995 and remember using the RTA function for DANDI timings over the North Sea to/from Scandinavia. Worked well, but screwed other aircraft on the same routes who suddenly found a B737 flying anywhere between M0.68 and M0.76!

RTA's are a crude tool, at best.
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Old 26th Mar 2017, 20:42
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how did the first BE LHR service go? If fares are low, punters will lap it up, even if its slow, very little cabin baggage and bound to be delayed!
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Old 27th Mar 2017, 20:08
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Not sure but there is currently Dash 8 cruising at 24,000ft 390kts and a flight time to EDI of 1hr 20. Getting in 20 mins early.
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Old 27th Mar 2017, 21:13
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Originally Posted by Cloud1
Not sure but there is currently Dash 8 cruising at 24,000ft 390kts and a flight time to EDI of 1hr 20. Getting in 20 mins early.
That's what a 40 kt tailwind does for you.
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Old 27th Mar 2017, 21:50
  #4896 (permalink)  
 
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a flight time to EDI of 1hr 20
SOU to EDI on the Dash is regularly around this length, or a few mins less, so not that surprising. Plenty of padding for LHR holding (southbound) and queuing to depart (northbound) one would suspect.
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Old 28th Mar 2017, 22:57
  #4897 (permalink)  
 
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Scandinavian Airlines has sold two slot pairs at Heathrow for US$75m
Anyone know who the buyer is ?
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Old 29th Mar 2017, 07:42
  #4898 (permalink)  
 
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I know China southern are increasing flights, could they be one buyer?
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Old 29th Mar 2017, 16:13
  #4899 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ETOPS
I took part in those trials - in 1996 ! The type was B737-436 and the route was Aldergrove to Heathrow. The reason was the Boeing FMC had an "extra" page titled RTA - Required Time of Arrival. Departure clearance from BFS contained a time over BNN which was entered as RTA/BNN which would automatically adjust the cruise Mach number. We found the problem from the outset as cruise speeds below or above normal limits were being demanded
I understand the Lockheed Tristar had that feature from 25 years beforehand, although it could be set for all the limits to be complied with as well. It was apparently accurate for arrival time at a fix to the second. Designed, by the way, principally by someone from Hatfield who Burbank tempted away when Hawker Siddeley gave up developing the Trident further.

Not sure but there is currently Dash 8 cruising at 24,000ft 390kts and a flight time to EDI of 1hr 20. Getting in 20 mins early.
I once left Belfast City on consecutive runway departures with a colleague, he to Heathrow on a super-whizzy jet A320, me to London City on a trundling propeller Q400. I landed, exited, got in car, drove the short distance home, walked into house, phoned him up ... he was just waiting to disembark at LHR, after what sounded like n times round Bovingdon.
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Old 29th Mar 2017, 16:36
  #4900 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by davidjohnson6
Scandinavian Airlines has sold two slot pairs at Heathrow for US$75m
Anyone know who the buyer is ?
...it is agreed that SAS can continue to use these two slot-pairs for up to three years and maintain its present network.
http://www.sasgroup.net/en/sas-trans...ct-of-musd-75/

Last edited by Seljuk22; 29th Mar 2017 at 17:21.
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